identity crisis

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cbkoc

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sooo due in part to this website, coupled with the fact that i'm registering for my next semester's classes next week AND figuring out my summer plans, i've having a bit of a nervous breakdown:scared:

i started off thinking i would go the psyd route because i would be perfectly happy doing therapy with children.

then decided that a masters in clinical would be good enough for that.

then i began to consider the msw degree, because the idea of its job flexibility really appeals to me. who knows, i would perhaps enjoy working in a hospital or for some corporation. i don't need to be a millionaire, i just need room for monetary...progress :)

but then i remembered all of the horrible things i heard growing up...that social workers make next to nothing and have a high burn-out rate. KAY.

then i looked into joint-degree programs and something about the msw+mph really appeals to me. okay one problem...i'm a psych major/bio minor. as in, have taken absolutely no social work or public health classes to date. i'm pretty sure i can't either because i've declared my minor and those spots all seem to be on reserve.

all i want to do is child therapy (and ok the potential to do other things) but assuming i apply for an msw of sorts, how do i make myself competitive? all of my internships/experience/classes have been in psych. i have no idea what to do. all i know is i'd like to apply to the top programs so i'll be taking my GREs after this summer i think and work from there.

but as for internships...i have one lined up in child cognition. i've looked into these msw program requirements and apparently i need recommendations from professionals who can "attest to my desire to work in public health". yeah those don't exist for me. are they allowed to be psychologists...

i keep hearing the cons to all of these degrees and i'm freaking out :confused:

any advice whatsoever and i would be extremely grateful.

edit:i completely forgot........does anyone have any info on a masters in health psychology? is it new and up-and-coming? is it useful/is there room for progress? so now i'm considering like...3 different things. i know.

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Advice: Breathe....

There are no wrong turns on the journey. It is a process and everything is grist for the mill.

And I have to admit - there is a lot of grist for your mill! In fact a wealth of grist!

Let it rest a bit, get some sleep, come back with fresh eyes.

I wish you the best in whatever decisions you make.

VL
 
i started off thinking i would go the psyd route because i would be perfectly happy doing therapy with children.

Have you considered school counseling? or school psychologist?

Also look into AAPT - (play therapy) I have been to trainings with people from many different specialities.

VL
 
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The funny thing about ascending the mountain of doing-therapy is that there are many paths that reach the top. I know MSWs, LPCs, MFTs, and PhDs who all practice therapy with children in a variety of settings (MSW-school counselor, LPC-community mental health and private practice, MFT- contracted out with an alternative school, and PhD- community mental health and private practice). Part of the question is figuring out which type of training model would fit best for you. For me I am NOT of the general social work mindset so I chose LPC, which has variety as well (may not as much as MSW). Look at programs, their mission statements, websites, etc and try to get a feel. Also, email the training directors of the programs you like and ask for either 1)contacts for people in the program who can tell you what it is like, or 2) a campus visit (if you live close enough).

Lastly, one of the best things I ever did was contact clinicians/therapists who worked in my local area who did what I wanted to do and asked them about their experiences. Usually a friendly email explaining that you are looking to do what they do will suffice. Good luck!
 
Great response zensouth.

And I would add that as we ascend the mountain there are unexpected valleys and even a few swamps. In the swamp it is easy to get disoriented and lost. Even when the mountain is hidden in fog, or not visible from the depths, it is still there, beckoning to us.

VL
 
hm, i see. thanks for the responses, i'll be contacting people soon and hopefully gain some insight over the summer. i may even have an internship at our school's SW lab...i'll be sure to pick their brains haha

as far as the MSW--i was under the assumption that you can still practice therapy (although i'm not sure how this makes much sense...). is it just a different kind of therapy? and if so how does the pay compare? this website is throwing me off because i've just read so many positive things about the degree thus far (lol) and i'm not sure how that can all be in contradiction to what i've heard my whole life (social work is the worst paid, hardest work, etc.). i guess i'm concerned about satisfaction level as well.

i guess my biggest concerns are no room for doing different things or growth of any kind. i don't know if a commitment to psychology by means of an MA would be worth it, should i not be able to find a job in this one particular field :/
 
hm, i see. thanks for the responses, i'll be contacting people soon and hopefully gain some insight over the summer. i may even have an internship at our school's SW lab...i'll be sure to pick their brains haha

as far as the MSW--i was under the assumption that you can still practice therapy (although i'm not sure how this makes much sense...). is it just a different kind of therapy? and if so how does the pay compare? this website is throwing me off because i've just read so many positive things about the degree thus far (lol) and i'm not sure how that can all be in contradiction to what i've heard my whole life (social work is the worst paid, hardest work, etc.). i guess i'm concerned about satisfaction level as well.

i guess my biggest concerns are no room for doing different things or growth of any kind. i don't know if a commitment to psychology by means of an MA would be worth it, should i not be able to find a job in this one particular field :/

The confusion about MSW may be that bachelor level graduates also go by the term "social worker" and often work for less pay than an MSW. MSW is NOT my field so I know very little about it. It sounds like what you ultimately want to become is not just a run-of-the-mill MSW but rather an Licensed Clinical Social Worker (LCSW). I am not sure if MSW is the degree that leads up to that or not, you'll have to find that out for yourself.
 
The confusion about MSW may be that bachelor level graduates also go by the term "social worker" and often work for less pay than an MSW. MSW is NOT my field so I know very little about it. It sounds like what you ultimately want to become is not just a run-of-the-mill MSW but rather an Licensed Clinical Social Worker (LCSW). I am not sure if MSW is the degree that leads up to that or not, you'll have to find that out for yourself.

Yes, an MSW is the (only) degree that leads to an LCSW.

then i looked into joint-degree programs and something about the msw+mph really appeals to me. okay one problem...i'm a psych major/bio minor. as in, have taken absolutely no social work or public health classes to date. i'm pretty sure i can't either because i've declared my minor and those spots all seem to be on reserve.
It depends on the program, and I can't speak to the public health side of it, but many (most?) SW programs will accept students without social work backgrounds if you demonstrate extracurricular activities and/or jobs related to the field. (My B.A. is in English.) If you can show a certain level of academic ability, that'll also help.

I don't know if taking time off and working in the field is an option, but it would give you a stronger application and help you decide whether it's really for you.

I'd recommend letting your statement of purpose do some of the legwork for you in your application. That's the place to connect the dots for the admissions officer and explain how your coursework, extracurriculars, jobs, and internships shaped your goals, and how these relate to the program to which you're applying.
 
i see, this is all beginning to make sense to me now haha. thank you!
 
Yes, an MSW is the (only) degree that leads to an LCSW.

For almost all purposes you are right, but I have seen MEds (Masters in Education) out there who are LCSWs. They come from a variety of states (Kansas and Florida that I remember), so I don't know if any of those states still license MEds as LCSWs, but at some point in recent memory they have.

Here is a Google search showing practitioners from a bunch of places who are LCSWs with their MEds: http://www.google.com/search?q=Med+...s=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a
 
You sound a lot like me! I'm sorry to say :p

I have a BA in psychology and am considering a clinical PhD, PsyD, or MSW (eventual LCSW). I have no idea what to tell you. I interviewed a family friend who works as a psychiatrist, and he seems to think private practice psychology is the place to be (despite SDN saying otherwise). According to him, the PhDs & PsyDs who work at his hospital charge $400/hour in their PPs. Holy cow!

While money is one deciding factor (a huge one for me as well), my biggest concern is choosing the wrong degree to pursue - I don't want to be unfulfilled with my career if I can help it.

Good luck to you. What are you thinking of doing now that you have all of the great advice the other posters before me left for you?

Edit: I'm also considering nursing, but that's a whole other can of worms!
 
haha yeah once i nixed the phd idea, psychiatric nursing came into the mix for me as well :p

that's definitely the hardest part though--not knowing if you're pursuing the wrong degree. its so nerve-wracking how there are so many different degrees (many with lots of cons apparently lol)

right now i'm leaning towards the MSW+licence, i think. there are some good MPH dual programs as well that are only an extra year, so this path may give me some sense of added security. i'm going to take a couple of intro to PH classes next year and hopefully i like them : ) (i don't think there are any SW classes i can take...weird).

the only thing that is still bothering me is that there seems to be lots of licensing hoops to jump through for a move from one state to another. does the government just...not expect you to move, ever? i don't get it. hopefully it won't be as bad as i think once i dig deeper.

how about yourself?
 
If you are looking for financial growth then I would suggest that you take out social work out of the equation. If you are looking for both financial and professional growth then general clinical psychology is the best option for you and its a plus because you already have much knowledge in this regard.:)
 
OK I've been searching this thread/forum for quite some time and haven't found exactly my answer. I hope someone can help on this site and I am really sorry if this is been asked before maybe you can just copy and paste the link for me, but like I said I tried searching but the situations that people describe are different.

I am a recent graduate with a BA in Psychology. I'm taking a year off to pay off some debt and then I am applying to graduate school. I am really interested in I/O psychology and I think I want to get my PhD. BUT I don't want to be limited. Ideally, what I could see myself doing is being a professor at a university and holding a private practice in my home. I have always been interested in therapy BUT not to a degree that I want to devote my whole life to it.

Is an MSW right for me? For the longest time I have had this negative attitude toward social work. I was under the assumption that social workers only did work with people who were abused, in poverty, need social welfare support, etc. That did not interest me at all. I then became an RA at my local hospital and found out that one of the therapists had their MSW. I asked the psychologist what the difference was and she said really nothing, a good psychologist and a good social worker can do practically the same thing. I really don't understand. Why have separate degrees? For the longest time I wanted the prestige of having the title "Dr." but I'm starting to realize the extra time, money, stress, etc. may not be worth it especially if I only want to do therapy on the side.

Like I stated before I'm interested in I/O. I know that if I get my PhD in I/O I would be qualified to be more than an adjunct professor. Could I become a therapist with a PhD in I/O granted I get licensed and have supervised clinical training or is that not possible?

I'm so confused I do not want to be in school for the rest of my life and have THOUSANDS of dollars in debt, but I don't want to limit myself. This might sound silly but my outlook on life is that you only have a limited time I want to do everything I am interested in. I want to teach, provide therapy, and work with businesses to enrich the careers of their employees.

Should I get my MSW first, then go for my PhD? I also don't think I am qualified to get right into a PhD program (my understanding is they are very competitive) so I would need to get my MA in I/O first. Again adding another 2+ years.

Sorry it's so long -- if anyone can provide help I would appreciate it greatly appreciated.
 
In general, a Ph.D. in I/O isn't going to prepare you for clinical practice, and won't be a licensable degree, no. This is owing to the lack of appropriate academic coursework, lack of supervised clinical training, and lack of completion of a pre-doctoral internship (all of which are required to be a licensed psychologist in, I believe, all states). If you want to conduct therapy, then a degree in I/O isn't going to be what you want, as it won't train you for that.

Regarding the master's vs. doctorate question, that's a bit trickier. You can be licensed at the master's level to (independently in some cases) provide psychotherapy. If therapy is all you want to do, then the master's is generally a faster and cheaper way to get there than a doctorate. Some would argue that the average master's, whether it be in counseling or social work, doesn't prepare you as well for therapy as the average doctoral program; regardless of your thoughts on that matter, at the very least you're going to want to check into each master's program in which you're interested to be sure they're going to offer you the type of therapy coursework and supervised practice you'll need to be able to competently deliver those services.

I vehemently disagree that a "good psychologist and good social worker can do practically the same thing," though. Regarding therapy, this might very well be true (or true enough that I won't argue the point). Beyond that, there are quite a few differences, as social workers are more trained in aspects of social justice and advocacy, while doctoral-level psychologists receive more in-depth training in psychopathology (particularly regarding theory), research design/methods, statistics, and assessment (particularly psychometric theory and testing). I'd make the argument that if a psychologist is doing the exact same thing as a social worker, then either the psychologist isn't fully utilizing their degree (more likely), or the social worker could be overstepping their bounds of competency (less likely).

The other users on this forum will be able to give you a much, much better idea than me as to which MSW programs might be better choices if your plan is to solely practice psychotherapy. Then again, I don't know whether an MSW would necessarily be the best degree path if you don't plan on doing any social work at all; a master's in counseling might be a better choice. Although again, the users on this forum will be able to provide a more-informed response on this matter than can I.
 
thank you AcronymAllergy for your advice. I was told by a few professors to get my MSW I thought about MS in Counseling Psych but I heard it wasn't that marketable, and reimbursement isn't great, plus in some states licensure is difficult. I didn't want to invest all of that time and money into a Phd in Clinical Psych if I only wanted to see a few patients a week on the side.
 
thank you AcronymAllergy for your advice. I was told by a few professors to get my MSW I thought about MS in Counseling Psych but I heard it wasn't that marketable, and reimbursement isn't great, plus in some states licensure is difficult. I didn't want to invest all of that time and money into a Phd in Clinical Psych if I only wanted to see a few patients a week on the side.

Other than seeing "a few patients a week on the side," what would be your motivations for going the Ph.D. route? The answer to that question will likely help you decide whether an MSW or doctorate would better suit your needs.

You mention that you're interested in I/O, but then go on to focus exclusively on therapy as a practice/professional goal (in addition to academia). What is it about I/O that you like? With that type of degree, from my understanding, the most common route of practical application (outside of academia) is corporate consultation and/or participation in private industry research, as I/O folks tend to be pretty well-versed in some of the more advanced industry-applicable stats techniques.
 
A Ph.D. in I/O can look a lot more like a Ph.D. in Statistics and a lot less like an (Applied) Psych Ph.D....depending on the program. It is a far far different animal than even a research-heavy Clinical/Counseling Psychology Ph.D. The type of classes and thrust of the program will have a thread of psychology in it, but the learning and application of knowledge will be quite different.

In a typical I/O position you have business clients and not patients. Your work is much more about analyzing the type of jobs/employees a company utilizes, and not helping them through a divorce or substance abuse issue. I'd encourage you to talk to people in the I/O field because it is quite diverse, but there is very little, if any, overlap into Clinical/Counseling Psychology.
 
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