MPH Laptop for Epidemiology

[IntriguedStudent]

What is everybody's opinion on a good laptop to get for epidemiology coursework and modeling? I do not currently have a laptop, so I'm planning to buy one before classes begin in August. I'm looking for something that will be able to sufficiently handle programs such as SAS, GIS, etc. I don't have any particular preference for a "brand", but I do need it to be relatively cost effective. Any input would be greatly appreciated and hopefully this thread can be helpful to others in my situation!

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[Vespasian]

I was thinking about starting a similar thread the other day.

I'm interested to see what people suggest.

 

[oceanhue]

I have a MacBook Pro. You can easily switch over to Windows on here if need be. Thinking of buying an iMac... I'm bias though, since I prefer Apple products since I've always had nothing but problems with Windows.

 

[JaneOakmede]

I have a MacBook Pro too and I love it. I switched from PC to Mac during undergrad and it's been great. I have used C++, R, and Stata on it, and they have all been easy to work with.

 

[agh2415]

I have a MacBook Pro. You can easily switch over to Windows on here if need be. Thinking of buying an iMac... I'm bias though, since I prefer Apple products since I've always had nothing but problems with Windows.

FWIW, I've heard of people having issues with SAS when dual-booting. Apparently it can be very resource-intensive for large datasets.


For your question OP, I have a 2 year old laptop running a fairly standard Intel Core i5 3210M processor (for reference: http://www.notebookcheck.net/Mobile-Processors-Benchmarklist.2436.0.html) and 4GB memory. The only issue I've come across is lag with very large datasets (thousands of observations and dozens of variables). Most mid-range laptops today should be able to handle datasets you'll come across. The most important component will be the CPU, as you can always upgrade your memory or hard drive later. No need to

I don't have as much experience with GIS software, but I know ArcGIS is huge and very expensive. You would likely need to access that through your school's lab.

 

[Vespasian]

I've been considering a Macbook Pro 13" model- it seems to have a sufficient processor (2.5Ghz i5) and 4GB of memory, not the retina version. I've had Windows products my entire life and I'm just tired of it, tbh. I'm also tired of poor quality laptops that don't last even after dropping $800.

 

[oceanhue]

I've been considering a Macbook Pro 13" model- it seems to have a sufficient processor (2.5Ghz i5) and 4GB of memory, not the retina version. I've had Windows products my entire life and I'm just tired of it, tbh. I'm also tired of poor quality laptops that don't last even after dropping $800.

I've had my MBP since '12 and I haven't had a SINGLE problem with it. Only issues I've had is that it's occasionally laggy whenever it decides to update my system (before I turned off automatic updates).

Macs are expensive, but they're well worth the money. I'm never going to go back. If a program that I need for class doesn't work well on Mac, I'll just use the computer lab or something, I'm going to be chained to the library anyway!

 

[She-Hulk]

Great to hear that Macs, which I love, can do the job! While Apple is more expensive, at least they last the long haul, though I wish the memory could be easily upgraded in the MacBooks . . .

 

[powerage]

If you plan to install ArcGIS on your computer, I'd look for at least 8MB of RAM. It's a monster of a program and my laptop has a lot of trouble with it.

If you're looking to run huge analyses, I'd get a cheap laptop (for ~2-300) for paper writing etc and get a decently powerful desktop for bigger projects.

 

[WHOdriscoll91]

Do you guys think a laptop is essential over a desktop? I have a capable MacBook, but my desktop is the higher power of the two. think the coursework would be easily split between the two? Or think I really won't have the chance to bring m

If you plan to install ArcGIS on your computer, I'd look for at least 8MB of RAM. It's a monster of a program and my laptop has a lot of trouble with it.

If you're looking to run huge analyses, I'd get a cheap laptop (for ~2-300) for paper writing etc and get a decently powerful desktop for bigger projects.

That is what I have now. The desktop is a beast, but my laptop I use for exactly that paper writing and basic stat work. I def don't think it could handle ArcGIS.

 

[AoiSora]

Do most places use SAS?

 

[JewcyFruit]

It's a terrible sign if you only know what SAS is, right? I suppose Coursera is around for a reason!

 

[Vespasian]

Do most places use SAS?

I am probably completely off on this but I was under the impression SAS is really popular outside academia. Then there's R, an open source alternative, which is really popular in academia.

It's a terrible sign if you only know what SAS is, right? I suppose Coursera is around for a reason!

I don't think so. I'm not too familiar with SAS, I used SPSS and JMP in undergrad and as an RA. I'd like to learn the beginnings of R in the gap semester before grad school.

 

[powerage]

I am probably completely off on this but I was under the impression SAS is really popular outside academia. Then there's R, an open source alternative, which is really popular in academia.

I don't think so. I'm not too familiar with SAS, I used SPSS and JMP in undergrad and as an RA. I'd like to learn the beginnings of R in the gap semester before grad school.

SAS is also popular in academia. R is definitely becoming more and more popular due to its 1. cost (it's free), 2. relative ease (there is a steep-ish learning curve for sure, but once you get over the hump, it's somewhat intuitive) 3. huge (and very helpful) community.

Do you need to know how to use these pieces of software? I think it really depends on what you plan to do with your career. If you want to perform research then you're going to want to know how to use some statistical analysis program and/or programming language. SPSS is fine, but not very powerful and has a lot of difficulty working with larger datasets. However, I do think having a good foundation for statistics is crucial for everyone entering into public health. All intro to biostat courses will have a lab component where the prof will have you complete tasks in a particular language (often times they give you the option... SAS or R).

 

[Epi12345]

Hi all,

I'm finishing up my MPH in epi and I'm getting ready to start my PhD, so I figured I would chime in since I've been through this already.

I would say that SAS is by far the most widely used software in epi. Some people do use R, but not nearly as widely as SAS (for a variety of legitimate and not legitimate reasons which I won't go into here). Its fine if you don't know what SAS is, you will learn it during your courses. There are also tons of online resources available if you want to get started early, as well as a free edition that you can download.

SAS can run well on a Mac with virtualization software like Virtual Box or Parallels, so dual booting is not necessary. Any current model Mac, including a Macbook Air (which I use), is sufficient. I only recommend that you have a large enough hard drive to store all of your personal things along with SAS and Windows on your virtual machine. Because of how SAS handles data, it is actually the hard drive that will allow you to work with very large datasets, not the RAM, so if you are going to use big datasets (like genetic data or large surveillance datasets), upgrade the hard drive. If you are using R, however, your RAM will be the limiting factor.

GIS software is big and resource intensive (and expensive!). You will want to have a lot of RAM and processing power if you want to run it on a laptop, so most people just use school computers.

Hope this helps!

 

[oceanhue]

Hi all,

I'm finishing up my MPH in epi and I'm getting ready to start my PhD, so I figured I would chime in since I've been through this already.

I would say that SAS is by far the most widely used software in epi. Some people do use R, but not nearly as widely as SAS (for a variety of legitimate and not legitimate reasons which I won't go into here). Its fine if you don't know what SAS is, you will learn it during your courses. There are also tons of online resources available if you want to get started early, as well as a free edition that you can download.

SAS can run well on a Mac with virtualization software like Virtual Box or Parallels, so dual booting is not necessary. Any current model Mac, including a Macbook Air (which I use), is sufficient. I only recommend that you have a large enough hard drive to store all of your personal things along with SAS and Windows on your virtual machine. Because of how SAS handles data, it is actually the hard drive that will allow you to work with very large datasets, not the RAM, so if you are going to use big datasets (like genetic data or large surveillance datasets), upgrade the hard drive. If you are using R, however, your RAM will be the limiting factor.

GIS software is big and resource intensive (and expensive!). You will want to have a lot of RAM and processing power if you want to run it on a laptop, so most people just use school computers.

Hope this helps!

How big of a hard drive are we talking here? Would you recommend an external hard drive?

[Edit] I was just reading something about SAS Web Editor, has anyone here used it? Apparently it works on your browser or something and can be used on Macs, hm..

 

[She-Hulk]

Because of how SAS handles data, it is actually the hard drive that will allow you to work with very large datasets, not the RAM, so if you are going to use big datasets (like genetic data or large surveillance datasets), upgrade the hard drive. If you are using R, however, your RAM will be the limiting factor.

GIS software is big and resource intensive (and expensive!). You will want to have a lot of RAM and processing power if you want to run it on a laptop, so most people just use school computers.

Hope this helps!

Great info! About how much RAM would I need to run GIS and R on a laptop? 8gb? 16gb? Mac processors are usually pretty good. While I see why some folks would buy a desktop and a cheaper laptop/netbook, I think it makes sense for me to just get a good Macbook with a ton of RAM and not worry about having a desktop.

 

[powerage]

Great info! About how much RAM would I need to run GIS and R on a laptop? 8gb? 16gb? Mac processors are usually pretty good. While I see why some folks would buy a desktop and a cheaper laptop/netbook, I think it makes sense for me to just get a good Macbook with a ton of RAM and not worry about having a desktop.

It really depends on the dataset(s) you're working with. You def want at least 8MB of RAM in my opinion. ArcGIS isn't supported in Mac (or Linux), but you can run the program in a virtual machine. You can also use the open source version of ArcGIS, QGIS, but I'd imagine any GIS class would require ArcGIS.

 

[IntriguedStudent]

If you plan to install ArcGIS on your computer, I'd look for at least 8MB of RAM. It's a monster of a program and my laptop has a lot of trouble with it.

If you're looking to run huge analyses, I'd get a cheap laptop (for ~2-300) for paper writing etc and get a decently powerful desktop for bigger projects.

I've considered this option. I most likely will not be looking to install ArcGIS on a laptop, but I wanted to go ahead and get an idea of how possible it would be and what sort of options are out there.

It's a terrible sign if you only know what SAS is, right? I suppose Coursera is around for a reason!

Was this comment directed towards me?

Hi all,

I'm finishing up my MPH in epi and I'm getting ready to start my PhD, so I figured I would chime in since I've been through this already.

I would say that SAS is by far the most widely used software in epi. Some people do use R, but not nearly as widely as SAS (for a variety of legitimate and not legitimate reasons which I won't go into here). Its fine if you don't know what SAS is, you will learn it during your courses. There are also tons of online resources available if you want to get started early, as well as a free edition that you can download.

SAS can run well on a Mac with virtualization software like Virtual Box or Parallels, so dual booting is not necessary. Any current model Mac, including a Macbook Air (which I use), is sufficient. I only recommend that you have a large enough hard drive to store all of your personal things along with SAS and Windows on your virtual machine. Because of how SAS handles data, it is actually the hard drive that will allow you to work with very large datasets, not the RAM, so if you are going to use big datasets (like genetic data or large surveillance datasets), upgrade the hard drive. If you are using R, however, your RAM will be the limiting factor.

GIS software is big and resource intensive (and expensive!). You will want to have a lot of RAM and processing power if you want to run it on a laptop, so most people just use school computers.

Hope this helps!

This is very informative, thank you! What size hard drive do you recommend?

 

[JewcyFruit]

@IntriguedStudent Ahaha, no, not at all! I'm just sharing openly that I'm pretty screwed when it comes to biostats. Once, Oprah told me to live in my truth. I guess that's what I'm doing. I've really only ever seen it being used, and never done it myself. I've never heard of the other programs. This thread is just making me terrified and (almost) makes me want to not go.

 

[IntriguedStudent]

@IntriguedStudent Ahaha, no, not at all! I'm just sharing openly that I'm pretty screwed when it comes to biostats. Once, Oprah told me to live in my truth. I guess that's what I'm doing. I've really only ever seen it being used, and never done it myself. I've never heard of the other programs. This thread is just making me terrified and (almost) makes me want to not go.

Yeah, the closer it get's to actually starting, the more I begin to worry that I'm not prepared! I do not have a lot of experience in biostats and have had very minimal exposure to most of those programs, so I plan on taking a SAS/Epidemiological Computing course first semester. I'm just hoping that I won't fall behind due to my inexperience!

 

[powerage]

Yeah, the closer it get's to actually starting, the more I begin to worry that I'm not prepared! I do not have a lot of experience in biostats and have had very minimal exposure to most of those programs, so I plan on taking a SAS/Epidemiological Computing course first semester. I'm just hoping that I won't fall behind due to my inexperience!

I suspect this is the norm, honestly. People are afraid of this stuff. If you don't plan on doing research then I wouldn't worry about it. I'd make sure you pay attention when learning how to interpret this stuff though!

If you're looking to do research, then this stuff is important! I'd check out YouTube and learn a little R. It's free and there are sooooooooooo many resources out there! I'd guess most intro to SAS courses assume you don't know anything, so no need to worry.

 

[JewcyFruit]

I'm with you! I'm taking basic stats now just so I can start thinking in the right ways.

 

[AoiSora]

I come from a research background and learned SAS and R in grad school. In undergrad I only used SPSS. Don't be intimidated--most people are entering MPH programs with only undergraduate degrees so presumably the programs you are considering are designed to bring you up to speed.

I'm so relieved to hear that most places use SAS... I have STATA on my work computer but I never use it and I want to feel like all that work I did to learn SAS isn't wasted!

 

[IntriguedStudent]

I'm with you! I'm taking basic stats now just so I can start thinking in the right ways.

The last time I took basic stats was like...7 years ago. I'll probably try to review a bit before the semester starts and do some YouTube/Coursera briefings of SAS and R so that I don't completely feel like I'm drowning with all of the new information!

I come from a research background and learned SAS and R in grad school. In undergrad I only used SPSS. Don't be intimidated--most people are entering MPH programs with only undergraduate degrees so presumably the programs you are considering are designed to bring you up to speed.

I'm so relieved to hear that most places use SAS... I have STATA on my work computer but I never use it and I want to feel like all that work I did to learn SAS isn't wasted!

I'm definitely hoping that's the case. I'm intimidated, but very excited to learn it all! I'm leaning towards the research direction so I'd really love to get a good grasp of the data management/analysis aspects of it all.

 

[Epi12345]

This is very informative, thank you! What size hard drive do you recommend?

How big of a hard drive are we talking here? Would you recommend an external hard drive?

It really depends, but expect to need ~20 GB for just SAS and Windows. You will then want more for your usual files and programs, and then some more so SAS can use large datasets. If you don't have lots of movies, photos, or music, 128 GB is probably fine, otherwise consider going bigger. You could also get a small HD for your comp (128 GB) and then use an external for photos/videos/etc.

Great info! About how much RAM would I need to run GIS and R on a laptop? 8gb? 16gb? Mac processors are usually pretty good. While I see why some folks would buy a desktop and a cheaper laptop/netbook, I think it makes sense for me to just get a good Macbook with a ton of RAM and not worry about having a desktop.

I can't comment about GIS, but for R, it depends on what you are doing. R stores data in RAM as you use it, so if you are going to use very large datasets, and you insist on using R, you are going to need a ton of RAM. On the other hand, if you are using normal sized datasets, you would be fine with 4 to 8 GB of RAM (of course there are analyses that will require more).

 

[asseenontv]

I was thinking of getting the Surface Pro 3 with Windows 8.1...I've had a white Macbook since 2009 and it's time to retire it

 

[IntriguedStudent]

I was thinking of getting the Surface Pro 3 with Windows 8.1...I've had a white Macbook since 2009 and it's time to retire it

I looked at getting one of those too, but the sticker price is just so high. I really love the versatility of it, though.

 

[IntriguedStudent]

Anybody with experience using Lenovo laptops know anything about the G510 (http://shop.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/lenovo/g-series/g510/#tab-customize). It seems like a great laptop for a very reasonable price. I'm historically terrible at picking out laptops, though.

 

[Vespasian]

Anybody with experience using Lenovo laptops know anything about the G510 (http://shop.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/lenovo/g-series/g510/#tab-customize). It seems like a great laptop for a very reasonable price. I'm historically terrible at picking out laptops, though.

IMO it seems like a solid machine. Here's a pretty thorough review: http://www.notebookcheck.net/Lenovo-G510-Notebook-Review.117221.0.html

BTW, I just picked up a Macbook Air myself (13") and love the form factor, OS, and performance.

 

[Stories]

Honestly, every laptop is "powerful enough" these days. Just go for a computer that you'd be comfortable carrying around with you and has good enough battery life. Those I think are the two most important things for laptops these days.

If you don't mind spending a little more, something with 8gb of RAM (at least) and a SSD will make your life a lot better.

 

[asseenontv]

Ended up getting a Lenovo yoga 2 pro. Haven't installed any programs on it yet but as a former Apple user, I am in love!

 

[IntriguedStudent]

Ended up getting a Lenovo yoga 2 pro. Haven't installed any programs on it yet but as a former Apple user, I am in love!

I ended up going with a Lenovo (G510) as well. I haven't used it much yet, but it seems like it will do me well!