Lincoln Memorial - DeBusk (LMU-DCOM) Discussion Thread 2014 - 2015

[TheBoneDoctah]

Was wondering if I could get a student's feedback concerning my chances?

2014-2015 admissions cycle.
- sGPA 3.10
- cGPA 3.19
- MCAT 22 (6P/8V/8B)
- Took one graduate level class, Gross Anatomy at the John A. Burns SOM. Got a B.
- 2 MD shadow (Urologist and Pediatric Surgeon).
- 1 DO shadow (Family Medicine). This doctor works at Hawaii's CHC. She's a preceptor and teaches 2nd year OMM. She let me attend the class, the students were amazing. She has written a LOR for me.
- Have another DO LOR. Only a mentor, did not shadow (Retired).
- Publication. Illustrated a chapter in a college level textbook. The chapter was on the reproductive system.
- Publication. Psychological research concerning stress related illnesses seen in first responders. Findings presented at Utah Legislation Conference.
- Missionary for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.
- Volunteer: Emergency Room, Boy Scouts of America-Asst. Scout Master, Hurricane Katrina cleanup (slept in a tent with other individuals who were part of the cleanup team), homeless shelter, play ground construction, medical supplies drives, and Church involvements.
- Phlebotomist at plasma center.
- Research Tech. for pharmaceuticals company.
- URM Native American (Lumbee Tribe).
- First gen. High School grad.
- 29 years old. Married with one child. Perhaps it will show that I am mature; I don't know.

Thanks for the help.

Your ECs look solid for DO schools. However, both your science and cumulative GPAs are pretty low. With a 28+ Mcat score, I think the low GPAs may be overlooked. May want to retake that 22.

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[TheBoneDoctah]

In the professional experiences section, is this only for PAID work that they want? I did volunteer "work" in a research lab. I wasn't paid, but I was working. Should this go under professional experience or volunteer?

Also, for professional experience, is this just asking what jobs I've held? Would I need to list a job at the golf course?

Anyone?

 

[ALF85]

Anyone?

For professional experience, I put paid work including being a CRC as well as a job I held throughout college that wasn't related to medicine.

 

[TheBoneDoctah]

For professional experience, I put paid work including being a CRC as well as a job I held throughout college that wasn't related to medicine.

I wonder if the work I did in research would count

 

[Happy Student]

I wonder if the work I did in research would count

I cannot remember the exact format of the secondary application, is there a section for research?
If there is a section specifically that you can put research down then don't include it in "professional experience". If there is not a research experience section,
was it a professional research project? There is no reason why you cannot put it as a professional experience and specify that it was a non paid research opportunity.

 

[pfm121]

Probably a dumb question but when the supplemental asks for years involved or years employed are they asking for an amount of years or the range of years you were involved?

 

[Makati2008]

Was wondering if I could get a student's feedback concerning my chances?

2014-2015 admissions cycle.
- sGPA 3.10
- cGPA 3.19
- MCAT 22 (6P/8V/8B)
- Took one graduate level class, Gross Anatomy at the John A. Burns SOM. Got a B.
- 2 MD shadow (Urologist and Pediatric Surgeon).
- 1 DO shadow (Family Medicine). This doctor works at Hawaii's CHC. She's a preceptor and teaches 2nd year OMM. She let me attend the class, the students were amazing. She has written a LOR for me.
- Have another DO LOR. Only a mentor, did not shadow (Retired).
- Publication. Illustrated a chapter in a college level textbook. The chapter was on the reproductive system.
- Publication. Psychological research concerning stress related illnesses seen in first responders. Findings presented at Utah Legislation Conference.
- Missionary for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.
- Volunteer: Emergency Room, Boy Scouts of America-Asst. Scout Master, Hurricane Katrina cleanup (slept in a tent with other individuals who were part of the cleanup team), homeless shelter, play ground construction, medical supplies drives, and Church involvements.
- Phlebotomist at plasma center.
- Research Tech. for pharmaceuticals company.
- URM Native American (Lumbee Tribe).
- First gen. High School grad.
- 29 years old. Married with one child. Perhaps it will show that I am mature; I don't know.

Thanks for the help.

I think your being an URM(especially Native American) will be very beneficial to you. I would advise to apply to all the newer do schools and you would get in somewhere but I would say your best bet would be retaking the mcat if you can Improve on the 22

 

[Happy Student]

Probably a dumb question but when the supplemental asks for years involved or years employed are they asking for an amount of years or the range of years you were involved?

When I applied I did the range of years (2004 - 2006). If the application has changed and it doesn't allow you to put a range, then just but the years involved (2).

 

[Mehd School]

Was wondering if I could get a student's feedback concerning my chances?

2014-2015 admissions cycle.
- sGPA 3.10
- cGPA 3.19
- MCAT 22 (6P/8V/8B)

I'll try to give it to you as honestly as I can. I would rank your chances (at LMU-DCOM) as low to medium based on your numbers. Your numbers are a little below the threshold of what would be considered competitive. I understand you are 29, but if you could spend the year boosting your mcat score by at least three points and getting your GPA's (especially sGPA) in the range of a 3.3 I think you'd be solid. But again, this is my opinion, and I'm not the one who makes these decisions obviously. From beginning to end, I spent nearly $10k on last year's application cycle from suit and shoes, to primary and secondaries, flights, hotels, and matriculation deposits. Understand that this is a risk you are taking.

Good luck. If you have any specific questions feel free to PM me.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

I'll try to give it to you as honestly as I can. I would rank your chances (at LMU-DCOM) as low to medium based on your numbers. Your numbers are a little below the threshold of what would be considered competitive. I understand you are 29, but if you could spend the year boosting your mcat score by at least three points and getting your GPA's (especially sGPA) in the range of a 3.3 I think you'd be solid. But again, this is my opinion, and I'm not the one who makes these decisions obviously. From beginning to end, I spent nearly $10k on last year's application cycle from suit and shoes, to primary and secondaries, flights, hotels, and matriculation deposits. Understand that this is a risk you are taking.

Good luck. If you have any specific questions feel free to PM me.

What were the averages for accepted students this year?

 

[Mehd School]

What were the averages for accepted students this year?

I believe the averages were in the ballpark of 3.4/3.4/26.7ish.

That's what I was told by an admissions faculty member, but this was before the waitlist started moving to it is possible the averages may or may not move down.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

I believe the averages were in the ballpark of 3.4/3.4/26.7ish.

That's what I was told by an admissions faculty member, but this was before the waitlist started moving to it is possible the averages may or may not move down.

A 3.4/27? So they're saying their Mcat went up by 2 points....?

Edit post waitlist it'll probably be back to around 25.

 

[TheBoneDoctah]

Does anyone know how their match rates are and relationships with hospitals since they are a new school?

 

[Happy Student]

Does anyone know how their match rates are and relationships with hospitals since they are a new school?

Here is a link to the residency placement by location as well as a map. I wish I could give you a percentage of student that placed into a residency vs the class size, but I cannot. I just know that it is great. Truthfully, where you place and what you place in is your choice. If you put in the work, go the extra mile and stand out in your rotations, then you will go where you want to go. It doesn't matter if you go to an top notch school or not, do more than your part and you will get where you want to go.
I will say that residencies and hospitals are very pleased with the clinical skills that DCOM students poses when they go into rotations and residency. DCOM prepares their students well to hit the ground running when they are in rotations. This is key in placing where you want for residency because you will stand out to those who are evaluating you on your ability to do a physical and perform procedures.

 

[Mehd School]

A 3.4/27? So they're saying their Mcat went up by 2 points....?

Edit post waitlist it'll probably be back to around 25.

I can't speak for earlier classes, but I had a 27 and was told I was around the average. We were also told that they had way more applicants this year than they ever had and were turning down interviews to students that would likely been accepted in the past.

Anyway, I don't want to freak anyone out. It's no secret that LMU isn't a number hungry school by any means and just wants to add more students that fit the family.

 

[Happy Student]

Oops, forgot to add the think. Here is the link I mentioned earlier.

http://www.lmunet.edu/dcom/academics/postgraduate.shtml

 

[WesternRedCedar]

Do we wait to be invited for secondary before submitting it?

 

[ALF85]

Do we wait to be invited for secondary before submitting it?

No, you don't have to wait. I e-mailed admissions prior to receiving an invite, and was told to go ahead and fill it out. The email for the secondary even states to disregard it if you have already completed it.

 

[WesternRedCedar]

No, you don't have to wait. I e-mailed admissions prior to receiving an invite, and was told to go ahead and fill it out. The email for the secondary even states to disregard it if you have already completed it.

Thank you.

Any idea when LMU begins reviewing secondaries? and starts interviews?:

 

[ALF85]

Thank you.

Any idea when LMU begins reviewing secondaries? and starts interviews?:

I am not sure, but it looks like in last year's thread August was when the first wave of interviews went out.

 

[Promethean]

I learned to swim in the pool at LMU at a summer camp held there. I love the place, but I don't love TN. I'm a yankee by adoption, so if I can't get into a school in the northeast, I will consider this school, and just plan on staying on campus as much as possible for the duration.

 

[TheBoneDoctah]

I learned to swim in the pool at LMU at a summer camp held there. I love the place, but I don't love TN. I'm a yankee by adoption, so if I can't get into a school in the northeast, I will consider this school, and just plan on staying on campus as much as possible for the duration.

What's wrong with Tennessee? I'm from California and haven't lived anywhere else. I think I'm in for a big reality check.

 

[Promethean]

I grew up there and couldn't wait to get away. It was a very closed minded place. The people there are very kind, so very hospitable, as long as they think that you are just like them. If they get the sense that you are not, they will turn on you. Expect that 85% or more of your neighbors there are fundamentalist Christians of one flavor or another, many of whom believe that everyone who isn't a member of their specific denomination is going to Hell, and that it is their God-given DUTY to win as many souls for Christ as possible. That wouldn't be terrible, if they were civilized about it, but they are not. I actually had other guys jump me and try to beat me up because I was agnostic when I was in high school. I'm glad I didn't tell them that I was gay, or they literally might have killed me. American Taliban.

And the "town" of Harrogate is a wide place a little drive from a minor highway. Living in Knoxville or Nashville would be kinda tolerable. LMU is just about the most rural campus I can imagine. It took about 90 minutes to get there from where I grew up, and most of that was a lonely drive along empty country roads. Not a bastion of modernity, however nice the school itself may be.

 

[Happy Student]

I grew up there and couldn't wait to get away. It was a very closed minded place. The people there are very kind, so very hospitable, as long as they think that you are just like them. If they get the sense that you are not, they will turn on you. Expect that 85% or more of your neighbors there are fundamentalist Christians of one flavor or another, many of whom believe that everyone who isn't a member of their specific denomination is going to Hell, and that it is their God-given DUTY to win as many souls for Christ as possible. That wouldn't be terrible, if they were civilized about it, but they are not. I actually had other guys jump me and try to beat me up because I was agnostic when I was in high school. I'm glad I didn't tell them that I was gay, or they literally might have killed me. American Taliban.

And the "town" of Harrogate is a wide place a little drive from a minor highway. Living in Knoxville or Nashville would be kinda tolerable. LMU is just about the most rural campus I can imagine. It took about 90 minutes to get there from where I grew up, and most of that was a lonely drive along empty country roads. Not a bastion of modernity, however nice the school itself may be.

Slightly negative there don't you think? You wouldn't be coming here to become a Tennessee permanent resident. You would be coming here to study medicine and then take it to wherever you choose to live. However, with an opinion like the one expressed in your post, I would not recommend coming here for the shear fact that you would be miserable with your current outlook on the area. Yes, there is a high quantity of people who are Christian of some denomination or another (and maybe they may be as close minded as you experienced, but this can happen anywhere). However, I have seen no one attack or berate a student of DCOM who has a different faith, understanding, or orientation as them. Nor have I seen that anyone here has tried to convert, persuade or save someone of a different faith. Our class is made up of many different people from all walks of life. There are Asians, African American, Hispanic, Indians, Jewish, Mormon, Baptists, Catholics, Agnositics and GBLT's at our school and we all get along very nicely. In fact, I am pretty sure that the community is quite thankful for the diversity that DCOM brings to Harrogate and members of the town have been quite accommodating and friendly. This can be seen by those who come to the school and participate in the multiple charities, activities and service projects that various DCOM clubs host each semester (including the gender and orientation equality club). I apologize for how you were treated growing up in the area and the experience that you had, clearly you had an unfortunate run-in with real "winners" of this world, but it has been from my experience here that if you are of a different faith or belief (including one that the majority of Harrogate may not agree with) you will not be oppressed for your desire to come to Tennessee and gain a great education. Perhaps the difference between what I have seen (which does go beyond just my time in Harrogate and with DCOM) and what you experienced growing up is that you were born and raised here and I am here as a "visitor" in the eyes of those who live here.

What's wrong with Tennessee? I'm from California and haven't lived anywhere else. I think I'm in for a big reality check.

SynapticDoctah, Please don't base your opinion of such a great school off negativity from an unfortunate experience. I am from the West as well and my wife and I have enjoyed the different environment, culture, beliefs and terrain that this part of the US has to offer.

 

[Promethean]

Slightly negative there don't you think? You wouldn't be coming here to become a Tennessee permanent resident. You would be coming here to study medicine and then take it to wherever you choose to live. However, with an opinion like the one expressed in your post, I would not recommend coming here for the shear fact that you would be miserable with your current outlook on the area.........

I said that I love the place and that I would go to the school. I have very fond memories of the LMU campus, as it was essentially the only opportunity I had to spend time with people who weren't native East Tennesseeans. The time I spent there gave me hope that there were less hateful places in the world.

Debusk and LMU undergrad are both made up of people who have come there for school. However, the surrounding area and the state itself are hostile territory if you are visibly different. Wrong color, wrong religion, wrong identity? Most people will just whisper about you behind their hands and be perfectly pleasant to your face, but more than a few of them become violent when faced with diversity. Please don't discount my entire childhood and young adulthood as one bad experience.

I probably do attribute too much of it to their religion. It is also their provincialism, their racism, their homophobia, their smouldering hatred of Yankees left over from "The War of Northern Aggression." For me, those things are all tied in together. Mine is only one opinion, but I turned down a free ride at Vandy for a northeastern school, just to get up out of there. Make of that what you will.

EDIT: Also, in other threads, I've been told that I can't speak about certain things because I haven't experienced them yet. In this thread, I hear that my direct personal experience counts for nothing. SDN is quite a place, I tell ya.

 

[HopefulDoc12]

I am in no way trying to discredit your experience, but I feel like I should contribute to this conversation so others can have more than one experience to base their decision on whether to go to school here. I was born and raised in rural east TN, and although there have been isolated incidents that I am aware of that resemble what you had to endure, I also went to school with and had several friends of a different race and orientation who had no such experience. To be honest, I lived in a large northeastern city for the past couple of years, and I experienced more racism there than I saw growing up. Yes, again many are devout Christians, it is the bible belt, but I am not one, and 95% of the people who know that about me have in no way attempted to convert me. They may speak with me and offer a place in their church, but I have not been beaten or any such thing. Yes, there are that minority who is fanatical about one thing or another, but I have ran into the same amount of fanatics in TN as I have in the northeast, just about different things. On the other hand, I have no experience with LMU-DCOM, have never been there, but one of the reasons I am applying is so I can stay in the area.

 

[Promethean]

I am in no way trying to discredit your experience, but I feel like I should contribute to this conversation so others can have more than one experience to base their decision on whether to go to school here. I was born and raised in rural east TN, and although there have been isolated incidents that I am aware of that resemble what you had to endure, I also went to school with and had several friends of a different race and orientation who had no such experience. To be honest, I lived in a large northeastern city for the past couple of years, and I experienced more racism there than I saw growing up. Yes, again many are devout Christians, it is the bible belt, but I am not one, and 95% of the people who know that about me have in no way attempted to convert me. They may speak with me and offer a place in their church, but I have not been beaten or any such thing. Yes, there are that minority who is fanatical about one thing or another, but I have ran into the same amount of fanatics in TN as I have in the northeast, just about different things. On the other hand, I have no experience with LMU-DCOM, have never been there, but one of the reasons I am applying is so I can stay in the area.

Glad to hear you had a better experience.

I think the school itself is amazing. So awesome that I would consider going back to the area just to go to school there. (EDIT: If I can't get into a school in Philly, New York, or another major city.)

I'd just want to live on campus, or as near it as possible. It is not an exaggeration to say that most of my good memories from my childhood happened there, including logrolling down the high grassy hill that the med school sits on. I presume that the school is in the old sanitarium building? So it appeared from the photos I saw. The awesome ghost stories about that building! The springhouse! The tower! Hiking in the hills around the campus! I have so much nostalgia for LMU itself.

Just maybe not enough to overcome my fear of rural Tenneseeans.

 

[DODaze2017]

The first and second year buildings are both new buildings, so no such luck with any ghosts

 

[Promethean]

The first and second year buildings are both new buildings, so no such luck with any ghosts

Oh well. The whole campus is haunted, so the stories go. Civil war battle sites near by, the remains of the fanciest hotel of the 1890s, and a sanitarium that burned to the ground with people in it (rebuilt as Grant-Lee Hall). Lots of fodder for excellent ghost stories.

 

[ccantr10]

I am in no way trying to discredit your experience, but I feel like I should contribute to this conversation so others can have more than one experience to base their decision on whether to go to school here. I was born and raised in rural east TN, and although there have been isolated incidents that I am aware of that resemble what you had to endure, I also went to school with and had several friends of a different race and orientation who had no such experience. To be honest, I lived in a large northeastern city for the past couple of years, and I experienced more racism there than I saw growing up. Yes, again many are devout Christians, it is the bible belt, but I am not one, and 95% of the people who know that about me have in no way attempted to convert me. They may speak with me and offer a place in their church, but I have not been beaten or any such thing. Yes, there are that minority who is fanatical about one thing or another, but I have ran into the same amount of fanatics in TN as I have in the northeast, just about different things. On the other hand, I have no experience with LMU-DCOM, have never been there, but one of the reasons I am applying is so I can stay in the area.

Well put, but I'd like to chime in as well. I'm from a very small town in Middle Tennessee (pop. 500). I think it's the greatest place on Earth, but I've lived here all of my life (with the exception of my time in undergrad). One branch of my family has lived there for almost 200 years. From my experience, people in small towns are very friendly but can also be a little cliquey (I might have just made up a word there). And many cliques are based on the churches their members attend. You can survive if you aren't religious; service organizations and community boards are a great way to meet people here.

I do have a couple of pet peeves about people who move to my hometown from other parts of the country. I don't like to hear statements like, "It was so much better in Ohio (or California, or New York). Everything is so much worse here." Especially from people who more or less chose to move to my area. It's understandable if you don't like every little thing about a little town, but it would behoove you to not tell it to everybody. People in the South are different about how they complain. Take an outing to a restaurant for example. If a person from the North doesn't like the food, they'll complain to the waiter, send it back, and maybe come back to eat later. A Southerner is more likely to eat the food and tell the waiter it was great, but never come back. If you find something objectionable about your new community in the South and want it to change, I would suggest you lay low for a while, integrate yourself into the community, and find a diplomatic way to make a difference. That might prevent you from being called a "trouble-making Yankee outsider" or something like that.

If your identity (as a minority, LGBT, atheist) gives you qualms about moving to East Tennessee, you aren't wrong to be hesitant. People there are, on the whole, religious and conservative. But people, like in the rest of the country, are much more open and accepting than they used to be. Making out with your partner in town square or walking down Main Street in your Wicca vestments may get you some strange looks or insensitive comments, but that will probably be the worst thing that will happen. And I don't know how bad the police are about DWBs (Driving While being Black) in the South compared to other regions these days, but they happen.

So there you have it, one more opinion from a small town Southerner. I hope I made you more comfortable applying to places like LMU and not the opposite. There are some good schools out in the sticks, you know.

 

[Promethean]

Making out with your partner in town square or walking down Main Street in your Wicca vestments may get you some strange looks or insensitive comments, but that will probably be the worst thing that will happen.

....

And I don't know how bad the police are about DWBs (Driving While being Black) in the South compared to other regions these days, but they happen.

Don't want to give the impression that I was some "damned yankee" complaining about the small town. I was born within 50 yards of my great grandfather's homestead, and was related to easily half my county. (Another reason to move prior to mate selection!) You are dead right about the way small town Southerners handle many conflicts, though. They politely pretend to your face that everything is just fine, but then hold a grudge forever. Not Speaking is a particularly Southern team sport that is played in many churches, office buildings, and schools. One person will feel slighted and begin Not Speaking to another. Each side enlists friends and family into the feud. There were two rows of pews in the church I went to as a kid. One was Ms. So and So's side, and the other was Ms. Thus and Such's. You could tell who was scoring the most points in their decades long game of Not Speaking by watching where people chose to sit each Sunday.

Making out? Try just holding hands or standing too close to one another. And yes, mean comments are *probably* the worst thing that might happen, but the risk of physical assault is not negligible and is higher than in other places I have lived. Wicca vestments? A girl in my high school was attacked by other girls and had food thrown at her in the cafeteria by boys for wearing what the other kids thought was a pentagram. It was a Star of David pendant. They were too ignorant to know the difference. Admittedly, all the violence I experienced or saw was at the hands of young people... high school to college age. The older ones usually stick with Not Speaking or other social games.

As for Driving While Black... That, sadly, isn't just a small town southern thing. In my city, I've known a few black doctors who were harassed by police for driving nice cars. Still, race relations are much better here in the north than they were down there. There was still de facto segregation in my town, as the few black people that lived there were all in one neighborhood, all went to one church, etc. I wasn't allowed to go to the Burger King in our town when I was a kid, because that was where the black people ate. I was told that you had to wash fruits and vegetables you bought in the store, not because of germs or pesticides, but because a black person might have touched it. There were black kids who went to school with me, but I don't think I could tell you a single name, because they were all in a separate class. I am older than many other pre-meds, so maybe a lot has changed in 20 years... but I doubt it.

EDIT: Re-reading what I wrote about... maybe I am being too hard on East TN. I mean, those are all stereotypical primate social behaviors, dominance displays, shunning, etc. Yes, that kind of thing does go on everywhere. We are all a bunch of monkeys flinging poo at one another. I think that in the more crowded northeast, greater diversity and wider social circles blunt the effects of what I saw there. But if you divided any northern city into small villages and limited the people in them from interacting much outside them, you would soon get very similar cliquish behavior.

 

[ccantr10]

Oh, I didn't mean to knock you for living in a different region, Promethean. I was just adding my two cents to the topic. Yeah, I agree with you about the issues a high school student might have if they aren't a WASP in the South, but I don't want it to appear that everyone is that way. From what I could tell, my high school was a fairly accepting environment. At least it was big enough for everyone to find a group where they fit in. On the issue of race, my experience has been a little different from yours. Segregation is more of a preference (or a sad reminder of the socioeconomic gaps that still exist in society) than a policy these days, but it's a real thing. Interracial marriage is not as big as a taboo as it used to be, and people who say bigoted things in public are regarded as cranks (as they should be). If I was URM, I would have no issue applying to LMU.

I don't want to hijack the thread, so I think that's all I will say about the idiosyncrasies of East Tennessee.

 

[Makati2008]

Oh, I didn't mean to knock you for living in a different region, Promethean. I was just adding my two cents to the topic. Yeah, I agree with you about the issues a high school student might have if they aren't a WASP in the South, but I don't want it to appear that everyone is that way. From what I could tell, my high school was a fairly accepting environment. At least it was big enough for everyone to find a group where they fit in. On the issue of race, my experience has been a little different from yours. Segregation is more of a preference (or a sad reminder of the socioeconomic gaps that still exist in society) than a policy these days, but it's a real thing. Interracial marriage is not as big as a taboo as it used to be, and people who say bigoted things in public are regarded as cranks (as they should be). If I was URM, I would have no issue applying to LMU.

I don't want to hijack the thread, so I think that's all I will say about the idiosyncrasies of East Tennessee.

I'll speak as a URM that graduated from there. The school may have issues I mentioned but it has good minority relations IMHO.

Now the areas around campus I disagree. I was eating at waffle king at about 9pm when this local starts talking about the KKK....

I know another classmate get called a racially charged word outside one of our friends house.

I also know of a situation where some of the locals made it known to females they shouldn't be talking to minorities.

 

[Fedxup]

Don't want to give the impression that I was some "damned yankee" complaining about the small town. I was born within 50 yards of my great grandfather's homestead, and was related to easily half my..... the store, not because of germs or pesticides, but because a black person might have touched it. There were black kids who went to school with me, but I don't think I could tell you a single name, because they were all in a separate class. I am older than many other pre-meds, so maybe a lot has changed in 20 years... but I doubt it.

EDIT: Re-reading what I wrote about... maybe I am being too hard on East TN. I mean, those are all stereotypical primate social behaviors, dominance displays, shunning, etc. Yes, that kind of thing does go on everywhere. We are all a bunch of monkeys flinging poo at one another. I think that in the more crowded northeast, greater diversity and wider social circles blunt the effects of what I saw there. But if you divided any northern city into small villages and limited the people in them from interacting much outside them, you would soon get very similar cliquish behavior.

Wow.

 

[TheBoneDoctah]

SynapticDoctah, Please don't base your opinion of such a great school off negativity from an unfortunate experience. I am from the West as well and my wife and I have enjoyed the different environment, culture, beliefs and terrain that this part of the US has to offer.

Okay good thank you. Honestly, I can't wait to get out of California. That may sound weird, but I have lived here my entire life and am kinda over it. I wanna live somewhere else for a while. Id like to live in a more rural area, but not ACTUALLY living in a rural area, I don't know how much Id actually like it. Considering I am applying to many D.O. schools, I think my chances of ending up in a rural, small town setting is pretty high.

 

[Fedxup]

Okay good thank you. Honestly, I can't wait to get out of California. That may sound weird, but I have lived here my entire life and am kinda over it. I wanna live somewhere else for a while. Id like to live in a more rural area, but not ACTUALLY living in a rural area, I don't know how much Id actually like it. Considering I am applying to many D.O. schools, I think my chances of ending up in a rural, small town setting is pretty high.

I feel the same way! I am from NYC. I want to study and work in a rural area but I want to be in proximity to a small city at least.

 

[TheBoneDoctah]

I feel the same way! I am from NYC. I want to study and work in a rural area but I want to be in proximity to a small city at least.

Yup. NYC and San Diego are EXPENSIVE. I could rent a 4 bedroom home in Arizona for the same price I pay to rent a one bedroom apartment here. At ucla, I was paying $1000 a month for a small 2 bedroom apartment where I had to share a room!!!!! Oh and that didn't include parking...lol

 

[Happy Student]

I'll speak as a URM that graduated from there. The school may have issues I mentioned but it has good minority relations IMHO.

Now the areas around campus I disagree. I was eating at waffle king at about 9pm when this local starts talking about the KKK....

I know another classmate get called a racially charged word outside one of our friends house.

I also know of a situation where some of the locals made it known to females they shouldn't be talking to minorities.

You can get these kind of attitudes anywhere. And while there may or may not be a higher prevalence here, the best way to combat such behavior, is to flood it with people who disagree with bigotry. How do you make muddy water clear? Flush clear water in. This school is an excellent university that needs strong, excellent, and ambitious individuals to fill its seats. When I said that the community welcomes the diversity the school brings, this means those who understand that times have changed and it is no longer acceptable to segregate, berate, or tolerate ignorant and bigot behavior. By bringing students in who are looking for a career in leadership, it helps to change attitudes and weed out the back country ignorance that is still present. You are all looking to be doctors. As such comes a responsibility to stand as an example, that includes both health and behavior.

Okay good thank you. Honestly, I can't wait to get out of California. That may sound weird, but I have lived here my entire life and am kinda over it. I wanna live somewhere else for a while. Id like to live in a more rural area, but not ACTUALLY living in a rural area, I don't know how much Id actually like it. Considering I am applying to many D.O. schools, I think my chances of ending up in a rural, small town setting is pretty high.

I feel the same way! I am from NYC. I want to study and work in a rural area but I want to be in proximity to a small city at least.

Yup. NYC and San Diego are EXPENSIVE. I could rent a 4 bedroom home in Arizona for the same price I pay to rent a one bedroom apartment here. At ucla, I was paying $1000 a month for a small 2 bedroom apartment where I had to share a room!!!!! Oh and that didn't include parking...lol

Yes, Harrogate is Rural. It could be worse though, the population of Harrogate and Middlesboro is around 16,000, which is not horrible. Morristown is about a 40 minute drive from here and has a larger population and store selection than the neighboring town of middlesboro, and Knoxville is about an hour away. My wife and I use Middlesboro for most everything except the big stuff like Costco runs, cars and most clothes shopping (although the "mall" in middlesboro had a killer deal on nice jeans the other day). We will take a trip into Knoxville about once a month for date night and other things. We have really enjoyed our time here and love the environment. The peace of a rural area is unprecedented from that of a city. The scenery is refreshing during those long hard study days and the housing is cheap; we rent a four bedroom three bathroom home three miles from campus for $900 a month. Utilities range from $40-$100 a month. If you do come here, you could take comfort in the fact that it is only for a short time as you will move for years 3 and 4 for rotations(and of course go where ever you want for residency), thus giving you the opportunity to experience a smaller area for a while and not being stuck in rural for the rest of your life, if you so choose. Of course, you need to choose a school that you will be happy with in both academics and location. Placing those factors on the weight scale is a must when you come to visit for an interview and decide what school to attend.

 

[Makati2008]

You can get these kind of attitudes anywhere. And while there may or may not be a higher prevalence here, the best way to combat such behavior, is to flood it with people who disagree with bigotry. How do you make muddy water clear? Flush clear water in. This school is an excellent university that needs strong, excellent, and ambitious individuals to fill its seats. When I said that the community welcomes the diversity the school brings, this means those who understand that times have changed and it is no longer acceptable to segregate, berate, or tolerate ignorant and bigot behavior. By bringing students in who are looking for a career in leadership, it helps to change attitudes and weed out the back country ignorance that is still present. You are all looking to be doctors. As such comes a responsibility to stand as an example, that includes both health and behavior.







Yes, Harrogate is Rural. It could be worse though, the population of Harrogate and Middlesboro is around 16,000, which is not horrible. Morristown is about a 40 minute drive from here and has a larger population and store selection than the neighboring town of middlesboro, and Knoxville is about an hour away. My wife and I use Middlesboro for most everything except the big stuff like Costco runs, cars and most clothes shopping (although the "mall" in middlesboro had a killer deal on nice jeans the other day). We will take a trip into Knoxville about once a month for date night and other things. We have really enjoyed our time here and love the environment. The peace of a rural area is unprecedented from that of a city. The scenery is refreshing during those long hard study days and the housing is cheap; we rent a four bedroom three bathroom home three miles from campus for $900 a month. Utilities range from $40-$100 a month. If you do come here, you could take comfort in the fact that it is only for a short time as you will move for years 3 and 4 for rotations(and of course go where ever you want for residency), thus giving you the opportunity to experience a smaller area for a while and not being stuck in rural for the rest of your life, if you so choose. Of course, you need to choose a school that you will be happy with in both academics and location. Placing those factors on the weight scale is a must when you come to visit for an interview and decide what school to attend.

I don't disagree with you but let's just put everything out there for applicants to know. Medical school is the time for many folks to focus on the skill of becoming a Physician and not becoming activist due to circumstances that could be avoided in the first place. I know that sounds selfish but $200,000 of debt is a lot and lmu has a moderately high attrition rate so if it was me I would avoid those distractions if I could not handle them. We have our whole careers to focus on changing such behaviors in our patients and for many it's so ingrained it won't change.

I'll say my undergrad was in a town the size of middlesboro and I never experienced these types of things and neither did my friends(which I have tons more then lmu). My professional degree was in large southern city but I never experienced the things I experienced there.
Like I said LMU is a good school for under represented applicants that has only gotten better from the time I was an Oms 1.

 

[Osteopath999]

.

 

[schwasted589]

What's wrong with Tennessee? I'm from California and haven't lived anywhere else. I think I'm in for a big reality check.

I'm from CA too and , though Harrogate was DIFFERENT, I haven't had problems adjusting. In fact, at times I miss it when I'm stuck in traffic / people are too busy/rude to help me with something etc. It'll grow on ya!

I grew up there and couldn't wait to get away. It was a very closed minded place. The people there are very kind, so very hospitable, as long as they think that you are just like them. If they get the sense that you are not, they will turn on you. Expect that 85% or more of your neighbors there are fundamentalist Christians of one flavor or another, many of whom believe that everyone who isn't a member of their specific denomination is going to Hell, and that it is their God-given DUTY to win as many souls for Christ as possible. That wouldn't be terrible, if they were civilized about it, but they are not. I actually had other guys jump me and try to beat me up because I was agnostic when I was in high school. I'm glad I didn't tell them that I was gay, or they literally might have killed me. American Taliban.

And the "town" of Harrogate is a wide place a little drive from a minor highway. Living in Knoxville or Nashville would be kinda tolerable. LMU is just about the most rural campus I can imagine. It took about 90 minutes to get there from where I grew up, and most of that was a lonely drive along empty country roads. Not a bastion of modernity, however nice the school itself may be.

Like I said above, I'm from CA and a minority...and a female. I've been here for more than a year at this point and have had zero problems. Yeah, people look at you kinda weird when you go to Walmart, but I've felt pretty safe everywhere I've gone. My BF is very OBVIOUSLY a minority and we often go out together and have had no problems with people being rude to us or threatening us or anything like that. Yeah, it's different and not as diverse of an area but most locals are aware that LMU-DCOM has transplanted students so they usually aren't surprised. in fact, when they find out you're a med student, they're the sweetest people ever. I'm not a Christian and it's very obvious that I'm not. Again, there have been on problems. There's a Muslim Student Association on campus and the faculty has been very receptive/respectful and encouraging about it from what I've heard from friends who are in it. You definitely have people that the poster above mentioned but it's not as dramatic as people make it out to be. No one's asked me to go to church, no one's told me I'm going to hell, heck--people have asked me about my religious beliefs/culture. If you're nice and pleasant you'll have very little problems. And like I said, the population of the school is fairly diverse. We have a LOT of indians/pakistanis, jews, muslims, and a fairly large open LGBT population. You're kind of in your own little bubble because of school anyways but when you do venture out into middlesboro to go shopping and whatnot, it's not scary at all.

Just different. Come in with an open mind and you'll be okay. If all else fails, just realize you're only going to be there for 2 years.

 

[Promethean]

I just want to say that I appreciate how polite the conversation has been in this thread, even when we have been in disagreement. In pre-allo, this would have already turned into a 200+ post flame war. This is why I am actively choosing DO. Most of the gunners have self-selected to go the MD route.

I haven't been to the LMU area in 20 years, and while I do have some very bad memories of growing up around East TN, I accept that times may have changed. I could certainly handle two years on that beautiful campus, and I have heard so many positive things about the school. I am still aiming for specific northern schools, but it would be nice to have this as an option. So, back to discussion of the school itself...

Just two years? Where do you go for rotations? Okay, I can look that up myself. Bigger question, attrition rate? I hear people tossing that statistic around, but have no idea where to find it. Clue me in?

 

[Makati2008]

I just want to say that I appreciate how polite the conversation has been in this thread, even when we have been in disagreement. In pre-allo, this would have already turned into a 200+ post flame war. This is why I am actively choosing DO. Most of the gunners have self-selected to go the MD route.

I haven't been to the LMU area in 20 years, and while I do have some very bad memories of growing up around East TN, I accept that times may have changed. I could certainly handle two years on that beautiful campus, and I have heard so many positive things about the school. I am still aiming for specific northern schools, but it would be nice to have this as an option. So, back to discussion of the school itself...

Just two years? Where do you go for rotations? Okay, I can look that up myself. Bigger question, attrition rate? I hear people tossing that statistic around, but have no idea where to find it. Clue me in?

Attrition rate for my class including repeaters was >20. But I assume some were folks that lmu took a chance on, others just couldn't handle it, a few quit and didn't come back.

 

[GypsyHummus]

Attrition rate for my class including repeaters was >20. But I assume some were folks that lmu took a chance on, others just couldn't handle it, a few quit and didn't come back.

Do you know the failure/repeat policy?

 

[DODaze2017]

Do you know the failure/repeat policy?

The general rule is:

Fail one class=repeat during summer
Fail two classes=repeat year
Fail three classes=dismissal

All students failing any classes are required to meet with the Student Progress Committee. Their recommendation is passed to the Dean who makes the final decision (which is 9.9/10 whatever they recommended).

 

[Happy Student]

I just want to say that I appreciate how polite the conversation has been in this thread, even when we have been in disagreement. In pre-allo, this would have already turned into a 200+ post flame war. This is why I am actively choosing DO. Most of the gunners have self-selected to go the MD route.

I haven't been to the LMU area in 20 years, and while I do have some very bad memories of growing up around East TN, I accept that times may have changed. I could certainly handle two years on that beautiful campus, and I have heard so many positive things about the school. I am still aiming for specific northern schools, but it would be nice to have this as an option. So, back to discussion of the school itself...

Just two years? Where do you go for rotations? Okay, I can look that up myself. Bigger question, attrition rate? I hear people tossing that statistic around, but have no idea where to find it. Clue me in?

Here is a link to the rotation sites. You will move to one of these for years 3 and 4 and do your core rotations there (Family, OBGYN, Emergency, Peds etc). They do fluctuate from year to year.

http://www.lmunet.edu/dcom/academics/sites.shtml

I can't tell you exactly attrition rate stats or where to exactly find them, sorry.

 

[schwasted589]

Attrition rate for my class including repeaters was >20. But I assume some were folks that lmu took a chance on, others just couldn't handle it, a few quit and didn't come back.

I forgot what year Makati is or if he/she graduated but for the first year class this year, I'd say the number was around 20 or so. There were people that left the first week of school because they couldn't handle dealing with cadavers, others decided med school wasn't for them, and others just problems studying. N=2 but the two people I know that were dismissed failed classes because they didn't study. I'm not saying they hold your hand, but med school tests were VASTLY different from my undergrad exams in that if I tried/put in the effort, I would pass (at the very least). They're not out to trick you for the most part.

Don't freak out. I was so caught up with the "what is the failure rate/policy with failing classes" that I drove myself insane the first few tests. Just breathe. Keep up with the material and you'll be fine, for the most part.

The general rule is:

Fail one class=repeat during summer
Fail two classes=repeat year
Fail three classes=dismissal

All students failing any classes are required to meet with the Student Progress Committee. Their recommendation is passed to the Dean who makes the final decision (which is 9.9/10 whatever they recommended).

There's obviously some exceptions given extenuating circumstances, but yep that's what I've heard/noticed/seen.

 

[EarthToDoc]

Promethean, I apologize for going back to ur post about east tn but I am smiling at the coincidence. Some of the disadvantages you mentioned are actually why I want to go to LMU (rural rotations) and in the broader sense a rural area. Simply, I am Asian and if I let my beard grow for 2 weeks heads start turning. I am not a medical student yet nor have any idea about what medicine is like, but I feel that tough areas that might have a few people like these will make me a great doctor. My biggest fear as a pre-med going to be a doctor is that I won't be able to connect with my patient positively leading to screw ups. I plan on going back to my birth country for a while after residency and am freaked out at how I will be able to take care of patients there. There are religious,ethnic, language, social, economic barriers that I have to somehow overcome. Anyways, I am kind of hoping for those kind of patients/people so that I can become a better doctor.

 

[Promethean]

Promethean, I apologize for going back to ur post about east tn but I am smiling at the coincidence. Some of the disadvantages you mentioned are actually why I want to go to LMU (rural rotations) and in the broader sense a rural area. Simply, I am Asian and if I let my beard grow for 2 weeks heads start turning. I am not a medical student yet nor have any idea about what medicine is like, but I feel that tough areas that might have a few people like these will make me a great doctor. My biggest fear as a pre-med going to be a doctor is that I won't be able to connect with my patient positively leading to screw ups. I plan on going back to my birth country for a while after residency and am freaked out at how I will be able to take care of patients there. There are religious,ethnic, language, social, economic barriers that I have to somehow overcome. Anyways, I am kind of hoping for those kind of patients/people so that I can become a better doctor.

Right on. Way to make a positive out of a negative. If you are looking to be an auslander on purpose, to gain something from it, then I think you could find that experience around there. My grandfather's generation fought in WWII and Korea, and some of them are still pretty sore about it. Some of the ethnic slurs that I learned as a child to refer to people from various Asian regions were so specific that I actually thought they were the proper terms for people from those areas. And I wasn't corrected by any of the adults around me until, hmm, middle school?

If you let your authentic humanity into your practice, open and curious, compassionate and accepting, you will have all the tools you need to build bridges across even the widest cultural divides. The fact that you think about the issue in this way suggests to me that you will be a great doctor.

 

[ManOfDiligence]

Secondary application submitted.