Discussion in 'Osteopathic' started by DocEspana, 03.16.12.
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"Attendings" in the DO system make bank with our help.
There's an attending in my hospital who used to sport an 80-100 patient census and didn't bother to teach **** to the three residents and two medical students he didn't have to pay to track them all.
Imagine rounding on them all, getting a succinct summary from a resident and orders already placed. Sure its a twelve hour day, but the money has become exponentially better and you don't have to give any of it to the team helping you.
I know NYCOM matched very well this year, with two who got Albert Einstein, other matches were at CHOP, someone got Med-Peds at Stony Brook.
I'll post more when I have a more detailed list.
No match list yet.
From what I've heard:
-8 ortho matches
-Match at a Stanford afilliated hospital
-Match at Hopkins
-EM at a CA allo program
Actual Hopkins or Hopkins affiliate? and any clue on the field?
We should have the PCOM list next week. The dean showed it to us yesterday, but scrolled too quickly.
Based on name alone and not knowing the quality of the programs, I saw a match to ACGME Duke FM and ACGME Anes at The Brigham.
I'll post the list as soon as I get it
SOMA matchlist is out. Notable MD matches (from my quick scan of the list)
Mayo (Mn): Pathology
Mayo (Mn): Psych
Saint Louis University: Med/Peds
U of A: Pathology
U of M: Psych
U Wisconsin: Psych
Harbor UCLA: EM
U of Ill-Chicago: IM
U of Texas-Galveston: Anesthesia
Which one are you, bala?
anyone have NYCOMs match list?
and also how tough is it to get into an AOA Optho program?
NYCOM's match list doesnt usually come out until July. i have heard of some pretty spectacular matches from NYCOM.
Seriously? Harbor UCLA EM? I've been stalking those forums for a while and it was said many times Harbor doesn't take DO's. Glad to see it be done.
I know right? Guy probably had some serious connections up there. Still here's to hoping that this will crack the door open for future Osteopathic Grads.
Let's just say I'm NOT the one who matched at Columbia.....
I worked at UCLA ER for a year and, talking to the residents, it seemed to be really anti-DO (most of them guffawed when I told them I was applying DO and told me I was crazy). However, there WAS 1 DO from Western. Probably one of the best residents there, too.
yea we usually get some good ones, sucks that we gotta wait for so long to get the list though
Surg at mt sinai
it's a prelim surgery spot though, which means that he/she would have to re-apply for a categorical (PGY2-6) spot next year
Ohh okay, wasn't sure what prelim meant. So basically after intern year they have to apply again?
Yeah...usually prelim is if someone didn't match and had to scramble into a prelim spot, so they have to reapply again for residency. Surgery prelim tend to be the least competitive
Or it is someone going into Anes., Rads, Ophtho, Derm, Etc. that needed a first year.
I've attached a partial UMDNJ list, it's a de-identified version of our self-reported list and includes 60% of the class until anything official comes out.
Yes and No. Its not that common to see it that way because most people *dont* use prelim surg to bridge to any of those fields. I do say this entirely out of anecdote, but I do somewhat assume my anecdotes come from a more rich sample that spreads across the US than most peoples. Hopefully someone can find stats to back me up. Prelim surg is simply not that common of a bridge to anything for a few reasons.
derm, rads, and ophtho are all traditionally associated with prelim medicine, not prelim surgery. I would venture say they are almost exclusively prelim medicine.
Anesthesia (and for that matter derm and ophtho) is often integrated. In that you are given a spot formally within an IM or surgery program and its not called prelim, its simply two people who disappear off of the surgery roster after PGY2 and appear on the anesthesia department as PGY3's or whatever the speciifcs may be. This I'm sure has exceptions, but given that my example is pretty common, I think it helps to limit the amount of prelim surgery spots that we'd associate with anesthesia residents.
Most DO's tend to go AOA TRI (if they can) when the program requires you to have an intern year done and doesnt just give you the intern year. I list this one last as maybe that could be changing with the "one-track" policies that havent been shot down yet, and my sample size of DOs is (amusingly) much smaller than my pool of MD residents and graduating 4th years that I've discussed this with. So perhaps this one has sampling bias.
Still, my sparknotes point is this: Assuming a significant amount of prelim surgery residents have anything lined up for PGY2 would appear to be an incorrect assumption, though I'm sure that there are some who do. Additionally prelim surgery is probably even less of a "sure thing" than prelim medicine.
From what I know you are pretty much on the ball DocEspana
Some who go into these fields (esp rads I think) fill some of those prelim surgery spots because they like the field of surgery or whatever other reason.
I could be wrong, but I think there are a healthy number of people that do preliminary surgery end up getting a categorical spot eventually..but they are the ones who work their nuts off, meet/impress the right people and are at the right place at the right time. I have no clue how common it is, and I think it might be difficult to find #'s on it. It's a dead end for many, and a very treacherous path for a DO to take. You might just end up as free work for a year then left out to dry...I know someone that happened to.
what happens if you do a prelim surg yr or prelim med year and then dont match with a categorical?
I don't want to be mean or b*tchy, but you're not correct, and as someone who just went through the match, I feel like I have a little more authority here.
There are are a significant number of people that get their 2nd year program, but don't match a tied-in intern year - probably somewhere on the order of 50%. Transitional years in the ACGME world are hard to come by, so people either do medicine or surgery prelim years - again, the good ones can be tough to get. People this year have been afraid of doing AOA TR years because of the whole internship/fellowship thing that may or may not happen, so they take a prelim *something* ACGME to keep that possibility open and not get screwed. Additionally, there are a number of Anesthesia spots that require a surgery prelim year - not a lot but enough. There is a good chance that this person just took a surg prelim year because they want to do surg, but there's also a good chance they have a PGY2 spot lined up, and had to scramble to find an intern year spot in the ACGME world because they're scared of not having the opportunity to do a fellowship. If someone really wanted to do surgery, an AOA TR year somewhere with a surgery program would be a much better option.
then I will respond in equally mature manner and hopefully it will be read as such.
you most definitely do you have more authority then I do. but I am basing my comments on the consensus of probably around 50 rising graduates from various medical schools in america, are overwhelmingly in the field of dermatology anesthesiology and radiology. they're commentary on prelim spots could not be more different than yours. to be fair you give me about 45 allopathic students and only 5 osteo pathic students . I did not have any of them attempt to create a percentile who have to find their own spot.
but they almost all made it very clear that the number that are not integrated or given a transitional year is very low. they generally view prelim surgery as an uncommon way in or an actual last resort, while still admitting it is a way in for a decent percent of people. my data source, again, can be biased as it tends to be the cream of the crop of american students, who may feel more entitled than the average osteopathic student would.
I do not saying this to undermine you, simply to point out what I meant when I said my data source was rich
is there a LECOM - Erie match list for 2012?
My understanding aligns much closer to TheBlueBlazer's post...
The match list for 2011 was published on our portal around September. So I wouldn't expect anything for a few months
Yeah there is a match list that has ~1/4 of the 2012 matches, it's a google document. Its a decent list, but very much incomplete. Hopefully it will be sent to the rest of the class so they can respond and report their spot. Admin usually takes their sweet time compiling the list.
As for the above argument concerning pre-lim years, I would say The Blue Blazer has a better grasp on the match process and having just matched ACGME gas, I can attest to the fact that those spots, wether medicine or surgery are filled by those who did not get their Transitional year but matched at an advanced position as a PGY-2. There are many programs, at least in the anesthesia world that are advanced only and you have to find a year for internship (prelim med, surgery, or TY). Those people typically scramble into whatever they can get as it is just one year, and medicine spots fill much quicker than surgery. There is a ton of competition for these years. As for derm spots, and according to the 2012 NRMP match statistics, there were 23 categorical and 340 advanced. Rads there were 135 categorical and 935 advanced spots. For Optho I am unsure as they are separate along with Urology. Now there are only 1861 Pre lim medicine spots total and just taking anesthesia, rads, and derm you could fill all those spots, but you also have advanced neuro, child neuro, PM&R, Radiation oncology, preventive med and a few others. So then take into account all those that are really decent applicants that didn't match categorical and had to scramble to fill 900 of the 1200 prelim surgery years. Maybe a last resort but not uncommon to say the least.
yeah I've seen many good candidates for fields like Anes, optho do crappy designated prelim spots just to stay in NYC. People are generally not as choosy when picking designated prelim vs residency. People who are doing residency in NYC often don't want to move twice. Its only a year and as long as you dont get fired the pain will end.
As for undesignated prelim: out of 1,108 categorical surgical residents approx 15-20% leave after 1 yr for various reasons. So that leaves a max of 221 PGY2 spots open. There are also about 1,000 surg undesignated prelim spots. That means only 20% of undesignated surg prelims will get categorical programs.
NSUCOM/Largo Medical Center, Fl
Louisiana State University Health Science Center, LA
Wake Forest Baptist Medical Center, NC
Sinai Grace Hospital/Detroit Medical Center, MI
Hershey Medical Center, PA
University at Buffalo SOM, NY
Martin Army Community Hospital, GA
NSUSOM/Floyd Medical Center, GA
AnMed Health, SC
Mcleod Regional Hospital, SC
NSUCOM/St. Vincent's Medical Center, FL
Memorial Hermann Hospital, TX
Family Medicine/Emergency Medicine
Pontiac Osteopathic Hospital
Family Medicine/Integrated Medicine
NYCOM/Southampton Hospital, NY
PCOM/Philadelphia Consortium, PA
Travis Air Force Base/Grant Medical, CA
Mercy St. Vincent Medical Center, OH
University of South Alabama Hospitals, AL
UMDNJSOM/Kennedy/Lady of Lourdes, NJ
OUCOM/Doctors Hospital, OH
EW Sparrow Hospital, MI
University of South Alabama Hospitals, AL
Tripler Army Medical Center, HI
NSUCOM/Largo Medical Center, FL
Henry Ford Health Care System, MI
St. James Hospital & Health System, IL
Danville Regional Medical Center, PA
NSUCOM/Palmetto General Hospital, FL
University of Massachusetts Medical School, MA
Palmetto Health, SC
LECOM/Sacred Heart Health System, FL
Norton Community Hospital, Inc, VA
Greenville Hospital System/University of South Carolina, SC
UMDNJSOM/Kennedy/Lady of Lourdes, NJ
Riverside Methodist Hospital, OH
Oregon Health & Science University, OR
University of Alabama Medical Center
University of Arizona Affiliated Hospitals, AZ
Einstein/Beth Israel Medical Center, NY
SIU SOM & Affiliated Hospitals, IL
Advocate Illinois Masonic Medical Center, IL
Naval Medical Center Portsmouth, VA
FSU-Sacred Heart Hospital, FL
St. Francis Hospital, IL
OUCOM/Grandview Hospital & Medical Center, OH
Georgia Health Sciences University, GA
Tripler Army Medical Center
NSUCOM/Miami Children's Hospital, FL
Walter Reed Army Medical Center, DC
Crozer-Chester Medical Center, PA
Jackson Memorial Hospital, FL
Tripler Army Medical Center, HI
Palmetto Health, SC
Peconic Bay Medical Center, NY
National Capital Consortium (Naval Hospital), MD
MWU-CCOM/Swedish Covenant Hospital, IL
VCOM/Lewis Gale Hospital, VA
St. Petersburg General Hospital, FL
St. John's Providence Health System, MI
NYCOM/Newark Beth Israel/St. Barnabas, NJ
Northside Hospital and Heart Institute, FL
OUCOM/O'Bleness Memorial Hospital, OH
MSUCOM/Detroit Metro Consortium, MI
The April 27th gif was me this morning.
Like Bleeker said, dont' expect to see this for a few more months. LECOM will want to make sure everyone has matched/scrambled to make themselves look as attractive as possible, the last thing they'd want to do is post a non-match/scramble student that got a position in early July
What about PCOM Philadelphia?
We were told it'd be up 2 weeks ago...you tell me.
Here it is.
I really like how your school assembled their match list, fun and informative, kudos.
Agreed. I like the extra information, like "took USMLE?", "First Choice?", "Rotate There?", and "Advice".
Answer me this: How can someone not take the USMLE yet match "1st choice" at Univ of Maryland Gen-Surg without rotating there?
GET IT, PCOM!!!! Yeahhhhh!
anyone see the guy who matched hopkins gas? look at the response under "first choice?"
Every now and then there will be an exceptional student who's qualification cant be judged just by his/her score. Ex: someone from my school few yrs back was the coauthor of a chapter of a surgery textbook. She went onto a very good residency in surgery. But for majority of students, your grades, board scores, # papers are a good representation of who you are.
How does not being published affect your admissions? Does it depend on whether the program is research heavy or not?
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