MD applicants with GPA<3.5: How many schools did you apply to?

[beachside]

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/explaining-bad-grades-chances.1115518/#post-16066641

Those are my stats. I still have yet to take the MCAT. But I hope to score in the top 5 percentile. I know it may sound naive but I'm doing everything I can to make that a reality. I will keep taking practice tests until I can achieve that score. I won't really give up until I do. Lululoves me I read that you got a 37 on the MCAT, that's absolutely amazing. Congratulations. Can I PM you for some advice?

I will have about 4-5 months before I apply so I intend on finishing the majority of my secondaries then. When I get the actual secondaries, I'll be doing a lot of tweaking to and making it unique to each respective school.

@LuluLovesMe @beachside @ProudMD

If you haven't even taken the MCAT yet, you're getting way too far ahead of yourself. Take the MCAT and you'll know which schools to apply to and how many.

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[justadream]

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/explaining-bad-grades-chances.1115518/#post-16066641

Those are my stats. I still have yet to take the MCAT. But I hope to score in the top 5 percentile. I know it may sound naive but I'm doing everything I can to make that a reality. I will keep taking practice tests until I can achieve that score. I won't really give up until I do. Lululoves me I read that you got a 37 on the MCAT, that's absolutely amazing. Congratulations. Can I PM you for some advice?

I will have about 4-5 months before I apply so I intend on finishing the majority of my secondaries then. When I get the actual secondaries, I'll be doing a lot of tweaking to and making it unique to each respective school.

@LuluLovesMe @beachside @ProudMD

How do you plan on studying for MCAT and working on secondaries?

Your motivation and ambition is good and all but you need to be realistic. It's not simply that more applications = greater chance of acceptance.

You might hit a point (and 100 apps is probably past that point) in which the more applications you do, the less your chance of being admitted anywhere (since your essay quality as a whole diminishes, you feel so stressed trying to keep up, etc.

 

[senzen]

@hoihaie what were your stats and where were you admitted if you don’t mind sharing?


@ProudMD haha I’m still dead set on this idea. But thank you for your kind words of encouragement. I don’t recall ever posting about my ECs. They aren’t that extraordinary.


@LuluLovesMe I will PM you this weekend! And it’s just medical schools are such a crapshoot. So I’d rather not take my chances. The higher the MCAT, the better so that’s what I’m aiming for. “Shoot for the moon. Even if you miss, you’ll land among the stars.” Like let’s say I aim for a 40, I would still be pretty ecstatic if I scored in the 36-39 range. I’m taking the new MCAT anyway but I just used the old MCAT numbers as an example.


@justadream I’m focusing on my MCAT which I’m not taking till early next year. And then after I will work on secondaries from that point on.

Just the idea of not getting into any medical school sickens me so I'm willing to sacrifice money and time and everything until I do get in because I know it will be worth it at the end. I'm not really keen on reapplying. I want to put my everything into one application cycle.

 

[beachside]

I’m focusing on my MCAT which I’m not taking till early next year. And then after I will work on secondaries from that point on..

You're not even taking the MCAT for a year? Come back in a year. This far out, you might as well be a high schooler talking about how many med schools you're going to apply to.

 

[senzen]

I'm taking a year to prepare… I've already started studying. There aren't many 2015 MCAT books out there though. @beachside

I'm applying next cycle (2016-2017). I'd rather be over prepared for what's to come than underprepared. I can't imagine what a mess I'd be if I had to make these decisions a few months before I was applying!

I'd appreciate if you weren't so patronizing! @beachside

 

[ProudMD]

I'm taking a year to prepare… I've already started studying. There aren't many 2015 MCAT books out there though. @beachside

I'm applying next cycle (2016-2017). I'd rather be over prepared for what's to come than underprepared. I can't imagine what a mess I'd be if I had to make these decisions a few months before I was applying!

I'd appreciate if you weren't so patronizing! @beachside

So you still have plenty of time to prepare. The top priority for you right now is to study hard for the new MCAT and score well. If you can score an equivalent of a 35 on the new MCAT, then the gates of MD schools will be swung open, allowing forth welcoming embraces...

Also, by the time you send in your application, you'll realize how ludicrous (and unnecessary in your case) it is to apply to 100 schools.

 

[beachside]

I'm taking a year to prepare… I've already started studying. There aren't many 2015 MCAT books out there though. @beachside

I'm applying next cycle (2016-2017). I'd rather be over prepared for what's to come than underprepared. I can't imagine what a mess I'd be if I had to make these decisions a few months before I was applying!

I'd appreciate if you weren't so patronizing! @beachside

I'd appreciate it if you didn't require me to be so patronizing, @senzen. Worry about studying for your MCAT, not how many school you're going to apply to. Trying to decide on application methods before you even know how competitive you'll be is putting the cart before the horse. Get a 36 or something and you can eliminate all DO schools from your list, for example.

 

[hoihaie]

@hoihaie what were your stats and where were you admitted if you don’t mind sharing?


@ProudMD haha I’m still dead set on this idea. But thank you for your kind words of encouragement. I don’t recall ever posting about my ECs. They aren’t that extraordinary.


@LuluLovesMe I will PM you this weekend! And it’s just medical schools are such a crapshoot. So I’d rather not take my chances. The higher the MCAT, the better so that’s what I’m aiming for. “Shoot for the moon. Even if you miss, you’ll land among the stars.” Like let’s say I aim for a 40, I would still be pretty ecstatic if I scored in the 36-39 range. I’m taking the new MCAT anyway but I just used the old MCAT numbers as an example.


@justadream I’m focusing on my MCAT which I’m not taking till early next year. And then after I will work on secondaries from that point on.

Just the idea of not getting into any medical school sickens me so I'm willing to sacrifice money and time and everything until I do get in because I know it will be worth it at the end. I'm not really keen on reapplying. I want to put my everything into one application cycle.

I'll pm you

 

[ridethecliche]

@senzen that's wicked overkill. You could do with half those schools if you score well on MCAT. 3.6 is fine.

Nothing really special. 2+ years inpatient psych, 2+ years inpatient med/surg as an aide, 2 years of mixed neuro and social psych research, and 2 years of CT surgery research. My state school is VERY friendly for IS applicants as well.

That's actually very good for clinical experiences. You're selling yourself short.

 

[prdv]

Exactly 3.5 gpa, 30mcat, non-urm. Not to mention, I'm a CA resident.
I applied to 22 MD programs, and 1 DO program. So far 5 MD IIs, 1 DO II.
Accepted to the DO program, 2 MD WLs, waiting to hear back from the other 3. -___-

One with a 3.5 gpa/below does not simply get into medical school. It's a loong waiting game and it looks like I'll be waiting until after May 15th. It makes sense that borderline apps would make it to the WL. You guys with acceptances already amaze me...congrats!

I don't know how the heck you guys can write 30+ secondaries (more so, the money and time for it all), but hey you just need one acceptance.

 

[ProudMD]

Exactly 3.5 gpa, 30mcat, non-urm. Not to mention, I'm a CA resident.
I applied to 22 MD programs, and 1 DO program. So far 5 MD IIs, 1 DO II.
Accepted to the DO program, 2 MD WLs, waiting to hear back from the other 3. -___-

One with a 3.5 gpa/below does not simply get into medical school. It's a loong waiting game and it looks like I'll be waiting until after May 15th. It makes sense that borderline apps would make it to the WL. You guys with acceptances already amaze me...congrats!

I don't know how the heck you guys can write 30+ secondaries (more so, the money and time for it all), but hey you just need one acceptance.

Hang in there brother (or sister)...

Congrats on your DO acceptance! You're going to be a doctor, and that's the most important thing!

 

[MedSchoolBarbie]

I applied to 15 because that's all the FAP would cover. Got two interviews so far and one acceptance as well as one waitlist was the outcome.

 

[beachside]

One with a 3.5 gpa/below does not simply get into medical school.

I did, with a 3.3. I was quite exceptional in some other ways, however. I wish I could be more specific, but it would make me immediately identifiable. Schools also take the difficulty of your academic program into consideration. A 3.9 in bullsh*t from Bullsh*t University is not going to carry as much weight as the 3.5 in Biomedical Engineering or whatever from MIT.

 

[ridethecliche]

I applied to 15 because that's all the FAP would cover. Got two interviews so far and one acceptance as well as one waitlist was the outcome.

I was on fap too. Most schools waive secondary fees for fap applicants. I just saved a bunch of money up and used it for the rest of the primaries. It sucked, but getting in before the holidays was so worth it.

 

[premed_noob]

ORM, both sGPA and cGPA 3.3-3.5, MCAT 33-35, solid ECs, traditional applicant.
applied to ~32 allopathic schools, zero II starting to lose hope

I'm in the same situation. my sGPA and cGPA are between 3.45-3.5 and MCAT 32, solid EC's as well. non-traditional

also applied to ~30 MD schools, and zero II. also losing hope. I finished most of my secondaries in mid to late August, and some in early September. Perhaps I was too late? Or perhaps there is a red flag that I am not aware of?

 

[beachside]

I'm in the same situation. my sGPA and cGPA are between 3.45-3.5 and MCAT 32, solid EC's as well. non-traditional

also applied to ~30 MD schools, and zero II. also losing hope. I finished most of my secondaries in mid to late August, and some in early September. Perhaps I was too late? Or perhaps there is a red flag that I am not aware of?

I finished most of mine in October, so I think you did alright. There must have been something they didn't like about your app. Did you apply to low-tier schools as well? Maybe your personal statement was off-putting? Your stats look slightly below average as well.

 

[lightblueelephant]

I'm either applying next year or the year after. I am so bummed right now that Colorado has ONE MD school. Thinking I need to move to Florida lol plus the sunshine sounds nice at the moment.

 

[Levrone]

I'm either applying next year or the year after. I am so bummed right now that Colorado has ONE MD school. Thinking I need to move to Florida lol plus the sunshine sounds nice at the moment.

recently I've been hearing FL isn't too nice to their IS applicants .. I think a lot of FL schools have 50% OOS students.. at least UM does

 

[premed_noob]

I finished most of mine in October, so I think you did alright. There must have been something they didn't like about your app. Did you apply to low-tier schools as well? Maybe your personal statement was off-putting? Your stats look slightly below average as well.

yeah I applied to low-tier schools as well. ORM, and from a top 5 undergrad. my stats are slightly below average, but I applied to some schools with average MCATs 32 or below (like the DC schools). I don't think my personal statement was off-putting, it was pretty pleasant. I am not sure what they didn't like about my app, but it must be that?
I've gotten a few rejections, and a few hold status's but nothing more than that.

 

[beachside]

yeah I applied to low-tier schools as well. ORM, and from a top 5 undergrad. my stats are slightly below average, but I applied to some schools with average MCATs 32 or below (like the DC schools). I don't think my personal statement was off-putting, it was pretty pleasant. I am not sure what they didn't like about my app, but it must be that?
I've gotten a few rejections, and a few hold status's but nothing more than that.

I don't know, man, it's tough to say. Did you shadow a few doctors? Did you have good letters of recommendation? Perhaps one of your recommenders gave you a lukewarm recommendation? That can sometimes be a kiss of death. How about clinical experience? Were your secondary essays well written and well thought-out?

If you haven't sent update letters yet, I would get right on that if I were you. Interview offers are still going out.

 

[occams_razor]

yeah I applied to low-tier schools as well. ORM, and from a top 5 undergrad. my stats are slightly below average, but I applied to some schools with average MCATs 32 or below (like the DC schools). I don't think my personal statement was off-putting, it was pretty pleasant. I am not sure what they didn't like about my app, but it must be that?
I've gotten a few rejections, and a few hold status's but nothing more than that.

agree with beachside that you might have a red flag. perhaps a not so great LOR.

also, what do you mean by non-trad? did you do a post-bacc program? if you were not pre-med in college and do not have enough clinical experience, even with a post-bacc that can be an issue. an example is someone I know who was a non-trad and had a high GPA and decent MCAT (29), but she didn't have much clinical experience so she ended up not being successful the first time around (she did get into a mid tier MD school this cycle, after gaining more clinical experience)

 

[premed_noob]

agree with beachside that you might have a red flag. perhaps a not so great LOR.

also, what do you mean by non-trad? did you do a post-bacc program? if you were not pre-med in college and do not have enough clinical experience, even with a post-bacc that can be an issue. an example is someone I know who was a non-trad and had a high GPA and decent MCAT (29), but she didn't have much clinical experience so she ended up not being successful the first time around (she did get into a mid tier MD school this cycle, after gaining more clinical experience)

yeah, by non-trad i mean i took a year after graduation and did an informal post-bacc at my undergraduate institution by taking extra science courses. i was premed in college and have certain experiences that went on for ~3 years. So I don't think I'm lacking in clinical experience either. I knew all of my professors who wrote me a letter and can't get myself to believe that one of them may have written a negative or not so positive letter of rec. I'm not really sure what to do at this point.

 

[LiBot007]

yeah, by non-trad i mean i took a year after graduation and did an informal post-bacc at my undergraduate institution by taking extra science courses. i was premed in college and have certain experiences that went on for ~3 years. So I don't think I'm lacking in clinical experience either. I knew all of my professors who wrote me a letter and can't get myself to believe that one of them may have written a negative or not so positive letter of rec. I'm not really sure what to do at this point.

You should try contacting the schools that rejected you, perhaps they will give you the best insight as to what you could improve on. Stay positive

 

[GameTheory29]

maybe 12-15 schools first cycle, got II at 4 schools

~10-12 schools this cycle (mostly because I had my primary verified super early but lagged so hard on secondaries which is just terrible as a reapplicant - would not recommend this ever!! seriously please dont do this!!!). I still did not find an extensive list (ie 25+) that I felt I could apply for without feeling like it was marginal gains.

Got 4 IIs this cycle, some of which are similar to last year. But I got the one acceptance you need which is all it takes. But of course I don't know how things would have been different if I aplied to 25-40 schools, nor do I know my thoughts if I had not received an acceptance. There may have been regrets in not finishing secondaries on time and quickly.



Edit: I don't know if reading this makes me come across as lazy (not my intent), I worked hard at my job which is what took away time from the applications. I also spent far more time writing individual secondaries than ever before, I'm just thankful it worked out despite the small number of schools. Also edited to take out some details trying to maintain some degree of anonymity

 

[llamasarefuzzy]

3.3 cGPA, 3.2 sGPA, 3.8 grad GPA, 31 MCAT. Applied to 19 schools, 7 interviews (6 MD and 1 DO) interviewed at 6, accepted at 2 (1 MD and 1 DO), deferred at 3, waitlisted at 1.

 

[brootas14]

3.4 cGPA, 3.2 sGPA, 32 MCAT. Applied to 29 schools (22 MD, 7DO), 7 interviews (4 MD, 3 DO), interviewed at 6, accepted at 4 (2MD, 2DO, 1 future interview), deferred at 1

 

[songl4a]

.

 

[Starbucko]

3.3 science undergrad (top 10 school)
<30 MCAT
Applied to 26 MD. 8 DO. Only 4 reach schools.
3 II/acceptance DO. (Withdrew all apps after MD acceptance)
6 II MD. 1 acceptance. 3 Waitlists. 1 yet to interview at. 1 withdrew.

Reapplicant (1 waitlist). Improved all aspects of my application.

 

[MrLogan13]

I plan on applying to every single DO school in the country and maybe 50-60 MD schools.

I know that may be overkill but I feel it's better to be safe than sorry. It will be worth it whenever I obtain that first acceptance.

I do intend on pre-writing secondaries so that I'm not under a time constraint and can submit quality writing in a timely manner whenever secondaries do happen to be released.

Dude, my undergrad cGPA is lower than yours. It's ~3.2, and my MCAT is ~mid-30s. I applied to 31 MD schools, received 27 secondaries, and filled out 24-25. I've received 3 II's and have 1 acceptance as of right now; two of those II's came from reach schools (with my stats, pretty much every school was a reach for me...lol). I am an ORM. Applying to 50-60 MD schools is not only overkill but a waste of time and resources. You'd be much better off applying to a smaller number of well targeted schools rather than doing a spray and pray.

 

[deleted577188]

3.3 science undergrad (top 10 school)
<30 MCAT
Applied to 26 MD. 8 DO. Only 4 reach schools.
3 II/acceptance DO. (Withdrew all apps after MD acceptance)
6 II MD. 1 acceptance. 3 Waitlists. 1 yet to interview at. 1 withdrew.

Reapplicant (1 waitlist). Improved all aspects of my application.

Wondering why you highlighted the fact that you were from a top 10 school and got a below standard GPA given that your apparent MCAT of <30 doesn't "compensate for the GPA? You URM?

Anyhow, congratulations on the acceptances!

 

[songl4a]

.

 

[Starbucko]

Wondering why you highlighted the fact that you were from a top 10 school and got a below standard GPA given that your apparent MCAT of <30 doesn't "compensate for the GPA? You URM?

Anyhow, congratulations on the acceptances!

Thank you!

In response to why I put "top ten." As beachside stated above "
Schools also take the difficulty of your academic program into consideration. A 3.9 in bullsh*t from Bullsh*t University isnot going to carry as much weight as the 3.5 in Biomedical Engineering or whatever from MIT."

Wasn't trying to brag, but just to put my stats w/ some context.

As for the lower than acceptable MCAT for md matriculants, I'm just a terrible standardized test taker. Has nothing to do with anxiety, just how it's always been. Got into my top ten school because of my good looks and high school credentials

I'm not an URM, but I am 2+ races and have other disadvantages (1st gen college, economical, etc).

I have been told that my ECs are the best part of my application. No, I didn't go to Africa or shadow a notable surgeon.

3 years research w/ publication & high media attention
3 years chief scribe
Worked 1-2 jobs since I was 15.
Devoted a lot of my time (volunteer & work) to underserved communities here and abroad.
Helped develop and organize a new nonprofit organization that worked with inner city public schools

 

[deleted577188]

Thank you!

In response to why I put "top ten." As beachside stated above "
Schools also take the difficulty of your academic program into consideration. A 3.9 in bullsh*t from Bullsh*t University isnot going to carry as much weight as the 3.5 in Biomedical Engineering or whatever from MIT."

Wasn't trying to brag, but just to put my stats w/ some context.

As for the lower than acceptable MCAT for md matriculants, I'm just a terrible standardized test taker. Has nothing to do with anxiety, just how it's always been. Got into my top ten school because of my good looks and high school credentials

I'm not an URM, but I am 2+ races and have other disadvantages (1st gen college, economical, etc).

I have been told that my ECs are the best part of my application. No, I didn't go to Africa or shadow a notable surgeon.

3 years research w/ publication & high media attention
3 years chief scribe
Worked 1-2 jobs since I was 15. .
Devoted a lot of my time (volunteer & work) to underserved communities here and abroad.
Helped develop and organize a new nonprofit organization that worked with inner city public schools
.

All sound like crazy cool experiences, good work and good luck!!!!

 

[Pedsmdplease]

Ca res, ORM, non trad, cGPA and sGPA 3.5 (sophomore slump, then upward trend through informal post bacc). Mcat 30

Applied to 44 MD schools (YEP - I was determined to only have to apply once). Received 42 secondaries, submitted 39.

July to mid august were the worst 6 weeks ever - I work full time and writing essays before and after work was torture. I turned almost all around within 2 weeks and spent time making sure my answers were coherent and sincere.

5 II, 3 acceptances, haven't heard from two post interview.

I'm broke as f$@*% but it was totally worth it to apply broadly, as I would never have expected interviews or acceptances from those 5 schools/they wouldn't have been included on a smaller list!

Edit: applied super duper early

 

[brootas14]

ECs? URM status?

Definitely not a URM (white as the undriven snow)

ECs? Some volunteering and leadership in college (mainly Greek), worked during graduate school, 200 hrs of shadowing, 3 years of work experience. Nothing that blows anybody out of the water.

 

[ridethecliche]

recently I've been hearing FL isn't too nice to their IS applicants .. I think a lot of FL schools have 50% OOS students.. at least UM does

Miami is a private school.

yeah, by non-trad i mean i took a year after graduation and did an informal post-bacc at my undergraduate institution by taking extra science courses. i was premed in college and have certain experiences that went on for ~3 years. So I don't think I'm lacking in clinical experience either. I knew all of my professors who wrote me a letter and can't get myself to believe that one of them may have written a negative or not so positive letter of rec. I'm not really sure what to do at this point.

You're not really non trad.

 

[JoyKim456]

Kind of a naive question but what is an II? I thought it meant secondary but I guess i'm wrong

 

[RedPhys]

Kind of a naive question but what is an II? I thought it meant secondary but I guess i'm wrong

Interview Invite

 

[Chasing Never Land]

I finished most of mine in October, so I think you did alright. There must have been something they didn't like about your app. Did you apply to low-tier schools as well? Maybe your personal statement was off-putting? Your stats look slightly below average as well.

Maybe it's because you submitted your secondaries so late?? I am already pre-writing for this upcoming cycle and plan to return each one to the school within 2 weeks MAX of receiving it.

Also: OP....... if you're that willing to put money into being a successful applicant, you're better off taking money from schools that are unecessary for you to apply to and put it towards a private med school admissions counselor. Some of them really know their stuff! But honestly, just relax, get an MSAR, and select 10/10/10 reach/fit/safety schools.

Quality > quantity

 

[Gandyy]

Man I only have a 29 on the MCAT. It absolutely kills me when people say you need a 30+ for MD. I bet missed a few algebra questions in some insanely hard physics passages on the Jan 23rd, 2015 MCAT and I dont have a 30 because of that.... Its so lame. A 9 in PS. I was making anywhere from 28 to 32 on practice tests.

The PS on the real MCAT HAS to be so much harder than the practice tests.... hopefully they look at my 10 in Verbal more...

Tbh I got out of the test feeling like I literally made a 22 though so there is that.

 

[ProudMD]

Man I only have a 29 on the MCAT. It absolutely kills me when people say you need a 30+ for MD. I bet missed a few algebra questions in some insanely hard physics passages on the Jan 23rd, 2015 MCAT and I dont have a 30 because of that.... Its so lame. A 9 in PS. I was making anywhere from 28 to 32 on practice tests.

The PS on the real MCAT HAS to be so much harder than the practice tests.... hopefully they look at my 10 in Verbal more...

Tbh I got out of the test feeling like I literally made a 22 though so there is that.

A 29 on the MCAT will by no means keep you out of a MD school if your GPAs/ECs/Essays/Letters are strong.

 

[ChillDawg]

I was on fap too. Most schools waive secondary fees for fap applicants. I just saved a bunch of money up and used it for the rest of the primaries. It sucked, but getting in before the holidays was so worth it.

Are you saying that schools will waive secondary fees for fap applicants beyond the 15? If yes, is that automatic?
How many schools did you apply to, and what was the total cost?

 

[ridethecliche]

Are you saying that schools will waive secondary fees for fap applicants beyond the 15? If yes, is that automatic?
How many schools did you apply to, and what was the total cost?

Most waive it or offer a reduced secondary fee for FAP applicants. I applied to 45 schools. Don't remember total cost.

 

[Gandyy]

A 29 on the MCAT will by no means keep you out of a MD school if your GPAs/ECs/Essays/Letters are strong.

I sure hope you are right.

 

[ProudMD]

And another piece of vital advice: apply early and BROADLY. 20+ schools is ideal.

 

[Axes]

3.5ish GPA, <27 MCAT, applied to 14 schools (per FAP), 3 interviews, accepted to my first choice. Although my stats weren't the best, my ECs and LORs were top notch. To all the low stat-ers, stay positive and you'll get there

Wow are you URM?

 

[hoihaie]

Are you saying that schools will waive secondary fees for fap applicants beyond the 15? If yes, is that automatic?
How many schools did you apply to, and what was the total cost?

almost all will. Of the 43 I applied to, only 1 school didn't completely waive it (they reduced the fee 50%).

 

[ChillDawg]

almost all will. Of the 43 I applied to, only 1 school didn't completely waive it (they reduced the fee 50%).

And this is automatic?

 

[hoihaie]

And this is automatic?

I think it was loma linda where I had to send in request, but otherwise the rest of the schools were automatic