Med School & Raising a Family Advice

[mrs3084]

Hi. This is my second post on here, considering applying to med school & wanted advice from any women out there who may have gone back to school at an older age while raising a family. I'll be 31 when/if I started school. I have no children yet, but I do want children eventually. I'm not sure if it would make more sense to wait to have children until everything is complete, or just once school is complete (during residency) or any combination therein. How to manage having a family as a nontraditional med student is one of my biggest concerns. Any thoughts, advice, please, I am all ears!

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[Goro]

I've had students who had 1 and even 2 children while in med school; I've had single moms as students, moms who lived with kids while hubby lived an hour away, or a continent away; and moms who lived here while family was over there yonder.

It can be done.

Hi. This is my second post on here, considering applying to med school & wanted advice from any women out there who may have gone back to school at an older age while raising a family. I'll be 31 when/if I started school. I have no children yet, but I do want children eventually. I'm not sure if it would make more sense to wait to have children until everything is complete, or just once school is complete (during residency) or any combination therein. How to manage having a family as a nontraditional med student is one of my biggest concerns. Any thoughts, advice, please, I am all ears!

 

[oingoboingo]

I started medical school at 31 as well, but I had my babies before school started so we're in different situations there. So far, it's been very manageable but I worry about being gone more during clinical years. As for being pregnant/having babies during medical school, a few classmates got pregnant beginning of first year and delivered in May so they had all summer to be home with baby. Seemed to work out nicely for them.
Overall, having a supportive partner is probably the most important factor. If you've got that, go for it!

 

[mrs3084]

Have you encountered any students that became pregnant and gave birth during med school/ residency? I am curious how that is handled by schools...

I've had students who had 1 and even 2 children while in med school; I've had single moms as students, moms who lived with kids while hubby lived an hour away, or a continent away; and moms who lived here while family was over there yonder.

It can be done.

 

[Goro]

Perhaps I should have been more specific. I've had plenty of female students who became new moms while in med school; a few even had two. Generally, they take a year off and graduate a year later than their classmates. I think one managed to time her pregnancy to deliver after fall finals, and was back in class on Jan 3rd!

Have you encountered any students that became pregnant and gave birth during med school/ residency? I am curious how that is handled by schools...

 

[CW 2010]

Have you encountered any students that became pregnant and gave birth during med school/ residency? I am curious how that is handled by schools...

I know somebody who got pregnant with twins (!) during the first year of residency. At first she panicked and thought about abortion. Then later she found out that she was having twins and decided to keep them. She gave birth to two girls at the end of her internship. This was years ago. She finished her residency successfully. Now she and her husband are both doctors and have two adorable daughters

 

[cabinbuilder]

Hi. This is my second post on here, considering applying to med school & wanted advice from any women out there who may have gone back to school at an older age while raising a family. I'll be 31 when/if I started school. I have no children yet, but I do want children eventually. I'm not sure if it would make more sense to wait to have children until everything is complete, or just once school is complete (during residency) or any combination therein. How to manage having a family as a nontraditional med student is one of my biggest concerns. Any thoughts, advice, please, I am all ears!

When I started medical school I had a 2 yr old and a 5 yr old. For me trying to have children during school would have been impossible. I am one of those who had every complication you could have and I spent almost a year recovering from having the second child. I don't remember much of that year from all the drugs I was on. I started med school at age 32 and I could not have done it had my husband been Mr. mom who did all the household chores and a majority of the child rearing. I think you are in a very hard spot at 31 where you need to think about children now given the age factor. True that women have children in medical school all the time but you have to determine whether you will be mentally ready to deal with any possible complications that may come your way. Bed rest, early labor, emergency C-sections, the extreme fatigue and morning sickness the first trimester, the pregnancy memory loss, etc. Do you want to deal with med school and pregnancy the same time? I personally can not imagine. Some do it. It comes down to personal preference and body chemistry. So if you apply to medical school and get pregnant in the process, I would defer school for a year, sleep, enjoy the baby, and start school when you are into the groove of being a mom and not so exhausted.

 

[futuremddo]

I'm still several years out from this process, but it's something that's been nagging at me as well. I have an incredibly supportive family so I know it would theoretically be possible. But we're constantly told how much time med school takes. There are two things I'm 100% sure of in life: I want to be a doctor, and I want kids. As a non-trad, the timing gets really messy. I don't want to only see the kid for an hour before bed, and hour in the morning, and weekends when I'm not studying; personally I'd rather not have the kid that do it that way. (I know people come to different assessments here and I am totally not judging anyone else.) So I feel as though I'm hurtling towards this collision course...

And although I'm not in med school, I am currently working in biomedical research which requires similar (or longer?) hours of its post-docs, at least in the lab I work in. One post-doc who had a kid was seriously thinking of not coming back after maternity leave, decided to just come back and finish her post-doc, and is currently one of the most miserable people on the planet. You just can't parent a 1-year-old when you're in the lab at 7am and leave at 10pm every day, and then put in "only" 8 hours a day on weekends. I'm really scared that is how it would be in med school and residency.

 

[mrs3084]

Well, not having children, and never having gone to med school, I can say I know it would be hard, although I cannot imagine exactly how hard it would be for me never having done either... Yes there are positives and negatives... It is not an easy decision to make.

 

[Ophelia72]

I'm still several years out from this process, but it's something that's been nagging at me as well. I have an incredibly supportive family so I know it would theoretically be possible. But we're constantly told how much time med school takes. There are two things I'm 100% sure of in life: I want to be a doctor, and I want kids. As a non-trad, the timing gets really messy. I don't want to only see the kid for an hour before bed, and hour in the morning, and weekends when I'm not studying; personally I'd rather not have the kid that do it that way. (I know people come to different assessments here and I am totally not judging anyone else.) So I feel as though I'm hurtling towards this collision course...

And although I'm not in med school, I am currently working in biomedical research which requires similar (or longer?) hours of its post-docs, at least in the lab I work in. One post-doc who had a kid was seriously thinking of not coming back after maternity leave, decided to just come back and finish her post-doc, and is currently one of the most miserable people on the planet. You just can't parent a 1-year-old when you're in the lab at 7am and leave at 10pm every day, and then put in "only" 8 hours a day on weekends. I'm really scared that is how it would be in med school and residency.

I remember the lab days... I worked as tech for about 13 years before getting out and taking a sci admin job at a grant funding agency. I was an indentured servant for about the last 5 of those years and always joked that I was chained to my bench. Never took leave so when I finally had a baby, I used 12 weeks of leave and still had some left over! When I came back from maternity leave, I decided to get out because I was tired of the PI's games. I never went for my PhD because of how the postdocs suffered and stopped with my MS and I had to do that on the sly. That was 6 years ago and I just had baby no.2 2 months ago. I've also just started on a DIY prereq fixing mission so I can apply to DO schools for a hopeful 2017 start. I recently turned 41 and I'm not giving up on the med school dream yet! I have a supportive husband who's on board so we will make it all work somehow, one day at a time!

 

[Postictal Raiden]

Last night, my wife and I were discussing having another child before or during my first year in med school. We already have a five-year old boy and would like to have one more and that's it. However, we were worried that having another baby may get in the way of medical education. Also, my wife is totally against the idea of having a kid in her 30's (she's 27 now). Therefore, waiting until I graduate is not an option.

I chatted with a good friend of mine, a forth year medical student whose wife delivered two babies while he was in school. His medical education has been successful and his step scores are well above average.

I realize being a student father is much easier than being a student mom, but reading different SDN threads and interacting with nontraditional med students, I learned that with mutual cooperation and good time management skills everything is possible.

 

[stolen_biscuit]

I am a 37-y/o MS1 with 3 kids (youngest is 5). I waited until all were in school, just to make it easier on myself, mentally/emotionally and financially. (I stayed home with them, working and volunteering nights/weekends.)

My key = supportive spouse! I cannot stress that enough. We recently had our first exam, and I left at 7am and came home at midnight the few nights leading up to it. Most days, however, I come home for a couple of hours around dinner time. I do expect my schedule to lighten in a few weeks as this block requires a lot of class time. If my husband wasn't doing kid-care, cooking, cleaning, and managing household stuff, all while working full-time, I would be completely stressed out. As is, I only need to worry about school, so it hasn't been too bad.

My class has a high amount of non-trads. Several people have babies under 1, and they are managing also. They probably get a bit less sleep than me. Many MS2s here had babies at the end of 1st year, so they had the break to stay home. As others have mentioned, some people I know took a year off in the middle somewhere.

I think it will all work out, no matter what you choose, provided you have at least 1 person who's got your back!

 

[pietachok]

We've had many women and men in my class become new moms/dads during the course of medical school. All of the planned ones (to my knowledge) were during clinical years, and seemed to work out ok. There's some flexibility with time off / research rotations / self study rotations, and you can carefully plan less demanding rotations like psychiatry when you're late in your pregnancy and may not be able to tolerate a day in the OR (but people do that pregnant, too).

The only case that I saw turn out blatantly sub-optimal was one in which my classmate's wife had pretty bad post-partum depression for several months. We were in didactic years and so when a large proportion of the child care fell on him, he couldn't keep up with material and failed a course.

I think you might also want to consider your possible residency plans before planning to have a baby in medical school. If you're going to go into a surgical field and have a baby in 3rd year, that kid could be 6, 7, 8 years old when you finish residency -- at that point, they'd remember a lot of years in which you were relatively absent. I don't know what to do with that information, but I think it's important to consider their psychological/emotional health (especially if the other parent is also very busy).

 

[rick235]

I had 2 kids while in med school. My wife worked part time and was able to take care of them while I was busy a lot of the time. Not going to lie, its pretty hard to balance everything but it can be done. You need to have a very supportive spouse and/or family. And you simply won't have time to do some of the extra things that your single classmates with no kids will have time for, e.g., research, volunteering, [insert specialty] interest group.

Example day for me- wake up at 5am, go to hospital all day, get home at 6pm, help my wife feed and put kids to bed by 7:30 pm, clean up house/do dishes/laundry until 8:30pm, then study/spend time with wife/relax for a couple of hours. If I'm lucky, I get to exercise a couple of times a week.

I'm applying for a surgical sub-specialty residency now, so we'll see how programs view my responsibilities to my family and if I'll be penalized for not doing as much "extra stuff" as my classmates/competitors around the country.

Also, once you have kids, your priorities change (at least mine did). Maybe think about PA school or something where you won't have such a strenuous commitment but where you can still be involved in health care.

 

[mrs3084]

I definitely would not want to prolong school any longer (i.e. have children, wait, then apply). I also do not want to wait until I am done with school (I'd be 35) or residency (38+) to start my family. It's either attempt both simultaneously, or go to PA school instead & have the education completed then starting a family. It's frustrating. I believe I'd be satisfied as far as patient care in either career, but I worry I'll feel I didn't live up to my potential if I did not go the doctor route. Both career & family are important to me. If I actually already had children, it's possible I'd weigh the relative importance of family much higher than career but at this point I am not sure. I do have a supportive soon-to-be-husband and both of our families are ready & willing to provide help. I am afraid of sacrificing family time for school time and regretting that in the future. Ugh! I've been back and forth between the med school and PA school decision for several months now & I just cannot seem to make up my mind.

 

[sazerac]

Sounds like you want to be a doctor, and produce / raise children. So do that. Every year you can come up with excuses not to have children yet. That will never stop.

Just don't produce a child during second year of medical school, and it will all work itself out.

 

[eablackwell]

Coming from someone who did have a child in 2nd year of medical school, it's doable. It takes a lot of work, but doable. I actually planned for my son to be born in 2nd year, because having a baby during 3rd year would have been a tragedy for me (although a friend of mine did it and matched into her 1st choice gen surg residency).

4th year is BY FAR the best year for babies, and it's when I plan on trying for #2, so I don't have to worry about babies in residency.

If you're passionate about being a doctor, don't let it stop you from having a family, and don't let your age stop you. I worried about starting at 28 for a LONG time, and almost didn't pursue medicine because of it. I'm SO glad I did. Medicine isn't for everyone, but the first time I had a real clinical experience in med school, I knew I had made the right choice. And many of my colleagues were in their early to mid 30s as M1s.

Good luck with whatever you choose.

 

[mrs3084]

Coming from someone who did have a child in 2nd year of medical school, it's doable. It takes a lot of work, but doable. I actually planned for my son to be born in 2nd year, because having a baby during 3rd year would have been a tragedy for me (although a friend of mine did it and matched into her 1st choice gen surg residency).

4th year is BY FAR the best year for babies, and it's when I plan on trying for #2, so I don't have to worry about babies in residency.

If you're passionate about being a doctor, don't let it stop you from having a family, and don't let your age stop you. I worried about starting at 28 for a LONG time, and almost didn't pursue medicine because of it. I'm SO glad I did. Medicine isn't for everyone, but the first time I had a real clinical experience in med school, I knew I had made the right choice. And many of my colleagues were in their early to mid 30s as M1s.

Good luck with whatever you choose.

Thank you for your reply...
A follow up question. I hear you saying it's doable, but I am concerned I will have to sacrifice TOO much for medical school for the sake of my family. What do you think about that being in the position of med school student & mother?

 

[eablackwell]

Thank you for your reply...
A follow up question. I hear you saying it's doable, but I am concerned I will have to sacrifice TOO much for medical school for the sake of my family. What do you think about that being in the position of med school student & mother?

I think you need a very good support system to manage it. Without my husband being so supportive it wouldn't be possible. He is one of the lead managers where he works, and so he can move his schedule around a lot depending on my schedule. We do have my son in daycare, but he's probably only there a total of 2-3 full days per week.

I had a c-section at 38 weeks and was back to school 2 weeks later, but that was only possible because my husband took a month off work. After that I had family members rotate in 1 week shifts until he was 3 months old and started daycare (somewhere in there I had a 2 week spring break). During psych, family med, and about half of neuro, I had plenty of time to spend with my son when I came home. OBGYN was 14 hour shifts, so I got home in time to give him a bottle and tuck him in at night.

I saw him turn over for the first time, sit for the first time, and crawl for the first time. I have become very good at time management because it is necessary if I want to spend time with my family. I study every moment I get during the week, and I take my day off as a family day, no schoolwork. I'm halfway through 3rd year and have done very well in all my clerkships, so it hasn't affected my grades.

Sure, it would be nice to spend even more time with my family, but I don't feel like I'm depriving my son of his mother...yet. Ask me again in residency.

 

[PinknGreenMD]

One of my mentors had a 3yr old child when she started med school, she hired her cousin to be a live in nanny so she didnt have to worry about anything. she finished MS1 w/ honors

beginning her second year (MS2) she was pregerrs with her second child.. she had the baby, took maternity leave for a month.. during that time studied for STEP 1. Took Step 1 and went back to school that next month and finished with honors.

MS3- she got a scholarship for having the highest marks in her class and was president of one of the medical school clubs. finished with honors. and honored on the step 2.

Beginning of MS4 she got married (her husband just finished his MD residency) moved, let her husband go and hired an Au Pair to take care of her children and to live in their home. finished again with honors. honored on step 3.

so yes its doable.

 

[shnooks952]

I like this forum, I am almost 26 and thinking of med school or pa school. Currently I'm shooting for pa school because of the cost, student loans, and debt. Also because in our near future, it looks as though docs are taking a hit financially, being taxed dramatically (but who isn't who makes decent money!), and the malpractice costs. Also because residency programs are cutting funds big time it looks like.

I'm trying to be reasonable and responsible in that although I may have the passion for med school, realistically, is it the correct career to pursue best for me, my future family, and my future bank account? Having passion and saying I'll deal with the loans later isn't going to be a smart move, especially with the outlook for physicians is.

My question is, what are your thoughts on all this? Pushing the passion and dream aside, and displaying mature and honest advice. Does this career make sense to pursue, no matter how much you may love it, if your financial future will probably look very dismal?

Thanks so much for any responses, this has been eating me alive

 

[Darth Doc]

My question is, what are your thoughts on all this? Pushing the passion and dream aside, and displaying mature and honest advice. Does this career make sense to pursue, no matter how much you may love it, if your financial future will probably look very dismal?

Thanks so much for any responses, this has been eating me alive

I'm a physician assistant, and I'm going to make the plunge into med school. However, I have nothing against the profession I'm in.

As a PA, the pay is good. There's a lot of flexibility as far as switching between specialities. There's always that physician backup if something is out of your range of knowledge, which is important to keep in mind for many reasons. Insurance costs are way lower than for MDs.

The negative is that you can only do what your supervising physician is comfortable with you doing. If your supervising physician isn't comfortable doing joint injections himself, chances are he won't delegate the ability to do it to you. How can he delegate something he can't honestly feel good about doing himself?

As far as the future of MDs vs PAs, why would you think PAs would make the same money they do now if MDs income decreases? I make good money now, but if reimbursement decreases for MDs and the reimbursement for PAs is 85% of what it is for MDs (this is the case for medicare reimbursement but varies between insurance companies), then PA income will also decrease.

My advice to you is to pick the one you see yourself preferring long term. Otherwise you may do the school thing twice, like me. I've found that I'm not satisfied with what I know, and I would prefer to be the boss. Also, I would like to travel to third world countries when events like the earthquake in Haiti occur.

 

[runlearnplay]

I am a 37-y/o MS1 with 3 kids (youngest is 5). I waited until all were in school, just to make it easier on myself, mentally/emotionally and financially. (I stayed home with them, working and volunteering nights/weekends.)

My key = supportive spouse! I cannot stress that enough. We recently had our first exam, and I left at 7am and came home at midnight the few nights leading up to it. Most days, however, I come home for a couple of hours around dinner time. I do expect my schedule to lighten in a few weeks as this block requires a lot of class time. If my husband wasn't doing kid-care, cooking, cleaning, and managing household stuff, all while working full-time, I would be completely stressed out. As is, I only need to worry about school, so it hasn't been too bad.

My class has a high amount of non-trads. Several people have babies under 1, and they are managing also. They probably get a bit less sleep than me. Many MS2s here had babies at the end of 1st year, so they had the break to stay home. As others have mentioned, some people I know took a year off in the middle somewhere.

I think it will all work out, no matter what you choose, provided you have at least 1 person who's got your back!

What does a normal daily schedule look like for you? Up at 5 and home early in the evening? I'll be in the same boat, my youngest will be 5/6 when I matriculate.

 

[stolen_biscuit]

What does a normal daily schedule look like for you? Up at 5 and home early in the evening? I'll be in the same boat, my youngest will be 5/6 when I matriculate.

Admittedly, right now, it is bad. We are on a block schedule, and anatomy is over this week. I get up at 6, with the rest of my family, and I get to school between 7 and 8 (if I stay at home a little longer, I can drive a kid to school, which is nice). For the last few days (yes, Saturday and Sunday too), I haven't been home until 11pm or so. BUT that's because we have our second of only 2 site-based exams tomorrow and our board exam Friday.

When it's not test week, I try to be home at 6pm for dinner, but at least twice a week, that doesn't happen. That is more due to the massive times required to be in lab than the need to study. On the weekends, I usually put either 2 half days or a full day in at the library. This block has been 10 weeks, so it's temporary.

Starting next week, I will have class 3-4 hrs/day (compared to a typical anatomy day, which is double that). Word on the street is that study time necessary is comparable, so you suddenly have several hours free time on your hands due to less class time. I'm sure test week will be heavy, of course.

Basically, it's doable. It's just school...on steroids. My (older) friends and I were just speaking last night about how it's not nearly as scary or difficult as we imagined. The hard part is that in theory, you should know everything. That's obviously not possible, so toning down the studying can be difficult. Also, letting go of the desire to be at the top is though, but it's pretty much a necessity for balance. (P=MD!)

TLDR: It's not bad, and when it is, it's temporary. I've heard 3rd year is toughest and 4th is a breeze. You will do fine.

 

[DR MOM]

I'll be starting school with a nine year old, so I've been putting points toward schools with family housing and more flexible schedules. I'd like to be home in the evening as often as I can and then leave to study if I need to after bedtime. I've met lots of parents during interview season and it can definitely be done! Most schools will even expand your cost of attendance to include child care.

 

[shenellica]

If you've never had children you don't know what type of pregnancy you will have. I had HG when I was pregnant and basically couldn't do anything. I couldn't eat or even drink water without throwing up. I couldn't imagine studying while going through that. My plan is to have a 2nd child before I start school. If I wait I feel I will be too old and I also will have loans to worry about.

 

[jakeislove]

One of my mentors had a 3yr old child when she started med school, she hired her cousin to be a live in nanny so she didnt have to worry about anything. she finished MS1 w/ honors

beginning her second year (MS2) she was pregerrs with her second child.. she had the baby, took maternity leave for a month.. during that time studied for STEP 1. Took Step 1 and went back to school that next month and finished with honors.

MS3- she got a scholarship for having the highest marks in her class and was president of one of the medical school clubs. finished with honors. and honored on the step 2.

Beginning of MS4 she got married (her husband just finished his MD residency) moved, let her husband go and hired an Au Pair to take care of her children and to live in their home. finished again with honors. honored on step 3.

so yes its doable.

How many people are strong enough students and positioned to do that? Not saying "It's an unrealistic example" simply an observation based upon my experience. I've met people with semi-retired parents able to take their kids full-time while they did school.

My kids are older. It's very hard and not looking to any get easier for years.

 

[futuremddo]

I like this forum, I am almost 26 and thinking of med school or pa school. Currently I'm shooting for pa school because of the cost, student loans, and debt. Also because in our near future, it looks as though docs are taking a hit financially, being taxed dramatically (but who isn't who makes decent money!), and the malpractice costs. Also because residency programs are cutting funds big time it looks like.

My question is, what are your thoughts on all this? Pushing the passion and dream aside, and displaying mature and honest advice. Does this career make sense to pursue, no matter how much you may love it, if your financial future will probably look very dismal?

Thanks so much for any responses, this has been eating me alive

Since you asked for a reaction, I'll give you mine: as a doctor, even with a slightly lower income than doctors currently have, you would be making WAY more money than average. Doctors currently make WAY WAY more money than other similarly-educated, smart people who work similar hours (which is fine, it's just how it is), so the situation you'd be considering would be going from making WAY WAY more money than average to "just" WAY more money than average.

For example, the average starting salary of a post-doc (has a PhD) is 40ish k, and they will never go above 45ish k until they become a PI, and even PIs don't typically make as much as your average PCP. And, they're working just as long hours as doctors (or longer, in the case of our PCP). Typically in at around 7 or 8, and out at 11pm or midnight. For 45k/year.

So that's the science route. But compare it to just about any other profession (except for finance and sometimes law, if you play your cards right) and the doctor will come on top financially.

So I think the PA schedule is something to consider both in terms of a practicing PA's schedule and only two years of school until you're ready to practice vs. 4 years + residency, but I would take the idea that being a doctor isn't a good idea financially out of it. But that's just my perspective, since you asked for our advice

 

[shnooks952]

Since you asked for a reaction, I'll give you mine: as a doctor, even with a slightly lower income than doctors currently have, you would be making WAY more money than average. Doctors currently make WAY WAY more money than other similarly-educated, smart people who work similar hours (which is fine, it's just how it is), so the situation you'd be considering would be going from making WAY WAY more money than average to "just" WAY more money than average.

For example, the average starting salary of a post-doc (has a PhD) is 40ish k, and they will never go above 45ish k until they become a PI, and even PIs don't typically make as much as your average PCP. And, they're working just as long hours as doctors (or longer, in the case of our PCP). Typically in at around 7 or 8, and out at 11pm or midnight. For 45k/year.

So that's the science route. But compare it to just about any other profession (except for finance and sometimes law, if you play your cards right) and the doctor will come on top financially.

So I think the PA schedule is something to consider both in terms of a practicing PA's schedule and only two years of school until you're ready to practice vs. 4 years + residency, but I would take the idea that being a doctor isn't a good idea financially out of it. But that's just my perspective, since you asked for our advice

Thanks so much for the advice, it definitely helps since this is an issue that's been waying heavily on my mind