Med Students on Psych Meds

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
5

534455

So there's a guy in my class who traffics in amphetamines (Adderall). He is very popular.
I do not buy from him. I get them from my physician (kidding!) This guy has a father who is a physician, gets them from outside sources, and his son passes out the candies for the people who feel they need them. It's illegal of course but Adderall use is rampant in graduate schools all over the world.

Many MD Students in my class remark on who is on Adderall. I tell them I can spot an amphetamine user 25 paces away from me. Cocaine, Crack, Crystal Methylamphetamine / Tina / Crystal, etc are all amphetamines. A friend of mine back at home suffers from ADHD and Bipolar disorder. She and her partner are crazy as heck but I love them. She's a wonderful woman and does so much good for her family and friends. A person on amphetamines (e.g. Adderall) has the classic signs of loss of weight, disruptive, fidgety, draws alot of attention to themselves, very labile, very fluid, sometimes unbearable. There's quite a few kids in my class on Adderall and when the subject was broached, they admitted it. But they tell me things all the time because I'm the older guy, more like a father figure, and I just listen. I tell them to get their drugs from a physician who can monitor them and let it go.

What percentage of the students in your class are on psychiatric meds, be it Anxiety Agents, Antidepressants, Sleep agents, Amphetamines or Strattera (also for ADHD but not an amphetamine)?

Medical Students have a much higher rate of depression than the average US population.
People judge others for being on psychiatric meds or being depressed, being addicts, being anxiety ridden, having had suicidal ideations (with or without a plan), sleep disorders, eating disorders, etc. I say....

Everyone has had problems of some sort, and while most people in medical school are very young, they'll have problems come their way and understand this post. For now, I am counseling a few people into medical school as non-trad Pre-Meds who have families, who have had a life, who have a history of personal problems and I tell them, "so what? Who doesn't have a history?" But they fell scared in someone at the Medical School Admissions Committee finding out. I tell them the members of the Committee are all probably on SSRIs and/or sleep agents!

Which brings me to this post.

Yes I realize no one may post to this thread b/c it might reveal something personal about them. However, I say that the more people talk about these things, that they have struggled with ADHD as adults (licit Rx of Adderall and Strattera), Depression, Anxiety, Suicidal Ideations, the more accepting society will be of people who self-disclose.

How many in your class are on psych-meds?

This could be a very lively, fun thread actually.

Members don't see this ad.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
I don't see why people are hating on this. I think the OP brings up a serious topic that needs more addressing in our community. There is still a stigma, especially in medicine and it hinders people from getting the help they need. Maybe if we talked about it more people that needed help would actually go out and get it instead of either being miserable, self-treating with alcohol, or worse yet taking their own lives.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
I don't see why people are hating on this. I think the OP brings up a serious topic that needs more addressing in our community. There is still a stigma, especially in medicine and it hinders people from getting the help they need. Maybe if we talked about it more people that needed help would actually go out and get it instead of either being miserable, self-treating with alcohol, or worse yet taking their own lives.

And maybe a third year shouldn't advertise themselves as a "resident".
 
And maybe a third year shouldn't advertise themselves as a "resident".

Oh no! It is so relevant to the thread, anyways not sure why or when I changed it to "Resident" so its back to med student.
 
I just finally started Effexor after several years of dysthymia (that no one else knows about except my psychiatrist) and let me just say: no one is finding out about this, not even my family. I don't want anyone knowing I'm not a normal person (psych health-wise).
 
I just finally started Effexor after several years of dysthymia (that no one else knows about except my psychiatrist) and let me just say: no one is finding out about this, not even my family. I don't want anyone knowing I'm not a normal person (psych health-wise).

And no one needs to know

It takes a mature audience to address this and this forum may not be the best. But if medical students can't talk about this, then it just proves more of the same: immaturity in the population.

there was a time when the news media ranked the top 10 Rx in the USA, and this was years ago. Prozac, Zoloft, Paxil were also in the top 10, even though they are all SSRIs. Other psych meds were sleep agents (Lunesta / Ambien types) and anti-anxiety meds.

Someone posted on another thread a very touching post about their troubled past, how they got their act together, and are now applying to medical school. Sadly, typical of SDN jerks and kids, they ripped on this person for not being qualified to be a doctor because of their past. As if.....

The top 10 agents Rx in the USA get used by Americans all over including physicians. And since depression is higher in medical students than in the average USA population, it follows that medical students are on anti-depressants, but we also know amphetamines.

Hence the thread.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
I just finally started Effexor after several years of dysthymia (that no one else knows about except my psychiatrist) and let me just say: no one is finding out about this, not even my family. I don't want anyone knowing I'm not a normal person (psych health-wise).

Obviously this is your choice and everyone has different situations, but this I find that this is exactly the problem. No one feels like they can tell other people and I don't necessarily blame you, but there are two arms to treatment. Meds and therapy, and having people you can talk to could probably be included in the therapy portion.
 
Oh no! It is so relevant to the thread, anyways not sure why or when I changed it to "Resident" so its back to med student.

It is a very relevant thread considering we will be seeing patients on these meds in large numbers . And if we can address this topic intelligently with compassion, and if our own have words of wisdom, then the far better physicians we will be. So thanks for addressing it.


I recently learned about Strattera . I had no idea there was a medication that was for ADHD but did not involve amphetamines. Strattera was invented by Eli Lilly to act as an anti-depressant but it failed in clinical trials. But instead, by coincidence, they noticed it improved concentration. The Mechanism of Action is fascinating. Look it up and learn something. I have wanted to ask my Neuro Professor in class about Strattera and what implications it may have as to adverse events. But you know people in class have got to be on it so I waffle on even addressing it.

Very interesting stuff.

As for your Identity being Medical Student vs Resident, who cares. Anyone who rips on another SDN member deserves one thing and only one thing:

placed on an Ignore List.

My Ignore List is growing: two punks are on it and I don't even see their posts anymore. I'm on SDN to learn, educate, share and encourage frustrated older Pre-Meds to apply to medical school, learn from other MD students, and add a different perspective to MD students training. I love where I am in my educational process, and anyone who does not add to it but substracts from it, is chaff in my book. If they should need my help on a hospital rotation or save their butts from an angry Attending, Professor, Resident, etc, I'll just sit back and watch them hang in the wind. I won't even lift a finger for them. When you burn bridges this is what happens. Learn it now before you burn those bridges guys/gals. Because I have seen many people flail alone b/c they were ass******s to other people, just like SDN infantile haters

as******s abound where ever you go.The sooner you accept this, the easier life will be for you.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Obviously this is your choice and everyone has different situations, but this I find that this is exactly the problem. No one feels like they can tell other people and I don't necessarily blame you, but there are two arms to treatment. Meds and therapy, and having people you can talk to could probably be included in the therapy portion.

For me, part of it is shame and guilt. I readily admit that I have a lot going for me: a father with whom I have a good relationship, lots of med school acquaintances, 1 or 2 good friends, and a good job and comfortable living waiting for me. I have no right to feel like **** when there are people out there living in cramped 2 bedroom apartments and surviving on food stamps, or people that have lost much more than I've lost. But I do, and it really eats at me.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
Which is exactly why I don't blame you for not wanting to say anything. But we need to start realizing that it is a DISEASE with a definite genetic link and environmental aspect.

Another not well known non amphetamine drug used for ADHD is Guanfacine. I think the brand names are Intuniv and Tenex.
 
There is still a stigma, especially in medicine and it hinders people from getting the help they need. Maybe if we talked about it more people that needed help would actually go out and get it instead of either being miserable, self-treating with alcohol, or worse yet taking their own lives.
This is an interesting topic and this is an interesting point. I have friends who are clearly depressed, but they refuse to get treatment because they believe that the risk...the mere risk of their depression/therapy becoming public and destroying their career (due to the stigma) is not worth it. It is sad, but I understand where they are coming from. Why should they come forward first and suffer the consequences of this pervasive stigma? There must be a middle path.
 
I am completely against the use of amphetamines during medical school unless the student plans to continue "treatment" throughout their career. Adderall use will only put them in a position of dependence where they cannot perform their task without taking the drug. Unless these students taking the medication plan on continuing in practice, they are acting in a detrimental fashion towards themselves and, more importantly, their patients.
 
I am completely against the use of amphetamines during medical school unless the student plans to continue "treatment" throughout their career. Adderall use will only put them in a position of dependence where they cannot perform their task without taking the drug. Unless these students taking the medication plan on continuing in practice, they are acting in a detrimental fashion towards themselves and, more importantly, their patients.

What? So it's ok only if it's continued through their career? I dun get it.
 
Cocaine, Crack, Crystal Methylamphetamine / Tina / Crystal, etc are all amphetamines.
For now, I am counseling a few people into medical school as non-trad Pre....
I tell them the members of the Committee are all probably on SSRIs and/or sleep agents!

Cocaine and crack are not amphetamines.
'Sleep agents' have pharmacological names.
Please stop counseling anyone, NOW.
Following your posts across a number of threads, it is amply clear that you have nothing to do with medicine. Please leave.
 
What? So it's ok only if it's continued through their career? I dun get it.

Yeah, that makes absolutely no sense...


A person on amphetamines (e.g. Adderall) has the classic signs of loss of weight, disruptive, fidgety, draws alot of attention to themselves, very labile, very fluid, sometimes unbearable.

Then you might want to widen your gaze because that is not what I see. Especially in a medical environment. People on stimulants tend to be "in the zone". They're focused, attentive and interested. Weight loss? Yes. But when I'm around those taking amphetamines, it's like I'm sitting next to a machine. :laugh:

Yes, people take them in my class. But I don't care... It helps.
 
Cocaine and crack are not amphetamines.
'Sleep agents' have pharmacological names.
Please stop counseling anyone, NOW.
Following your posts across a number of threads, it is amply clear that you have nothing to do with medicine. Please leave.

HAHAHA I didn't even notice those gems.

Dude it's time to retake pharm.
 
What? So it's ok only if it's continued through their career? I dun get it.

Yes. They are only capable of understanding the concepts of medicine, performing procedures, and passing certification while under the influence of some medication. Like I said before, they are putting themselves in a position of dependence on the drug. It was because of the adderall that a certain student was able to focus and get a demanding residency and to then go off of the drug would be harmful to the patients.

Those that I have seen trying to come off of frequent adderall use while in medical school lose most self-confidence and are not able to focus-- leading them to taking the substance again.
 
Yes. They are only capable of understanding the concepts of medicine, performing procedures, and passing certification while under the influence of some medication. Like I said before, they are putting themselves in a position of dependence on the drug. It was because of the adderall that a certain student was able to focus and get a demanding residency and to then go off of the drug would be harmful to the patients.

Those that I have seen trying to come off of frequent adderall use while in medical school lose most self-confidence and are not able to focus-- leading them to taking the substance again.


If they truly have ADHD then ok....they need the meds in all settings and probably can't function in pt care w/o it.

But if they were just 'taking' adderall to study I disagree with your statement. Not being able to focusing in a quiet library for 11 hours straight for 6 days a week does not mean you will have problems being able to focus in a very interactive social clinical environment.

Whether adderall should be prescribed essentially off label for a non-DSM diagnosis to help students study is between the prescriber and the patient.

But the idea that adderall permanently affects your brain is as crazy as saying caffeine permanently affects it. You develop tolerance from prolonged use but with discontinuing the drug and plenty of time you will go back to how you were before. Which is likely being ADHD for long studying sessions and perfectly ok in clinical situations.
 
This is an interesting topic and this is an interesting point. I have friends who are clearly depressed, but they refuse to get treatment because they believe that the risk...the mere risk of their depression/therapy becoming public and destroying their career (due to the stigma) is not worth it. It is sad, but I understand where they are coming from. Why should they come forward first and suffer the consequences of this pervasive stigma? There must be a middle path.

Yet ironically it's the fear of the stigma that gets you in the end. It's kind of hard to function in medical school when you can't even get out of bed. Sad.
 
Yes. They are only capable of understanding the concepts of medicine, performing procedures, and passing certification while under the influence of some medication. Like I said before, they are putting themselves in a position of dependence on the drug. It was because of the adderall that a certain student was able to focus and get a demanding residency and to then go off of the drug would be harmful to the patients.

Those that I have seen trying to come off of frequent adderall use while in medical school lose most self-confidence and are not able to focus-- leading them to taking the substance again.

But, of course, for some reason your reasoning would not apply to antidepressants, antipsychotics, pain meds, etc?
 
Yes. They are only capable of understanding the concepts of medicine, performing procedures, and passing certification while under the influence of some medication. Like I said before, they are putting themselves in a position of dependence on the drug. It was because of the adderall that a certain student was able to focus and get a demanding residency and to then go off of the drug would be harmful to the patients.

Those that I have seen trying to come off of frequent adderall use while in medical school lose most self-confidence and are not able to focus-- leading them to taking the substance again.

Now wait a second - we're talking about a setting where you're under the constant pressure of educating/teaching yourself for hours on end. Having to constantly focus for hours on end in a library with a book in front of you....
 
Regardless what the OP's reputation is or what he posted about I do think this topic is an important one for us as medical students. I know I was scared to death to mention anything to friends, family, or my classmates when I went through some rough times. Instead of getting better on my own I continued to get worse. I am mostly getting into the depression aspect and not focusing on the adderall usage. We as future medical providers are supposed to counsel and treat patients with depression, but we are afraid to come to grips with ourselves and I think that is a problem.
 
I don't get this reasoning either...basically because you've become so dependent on it at that point you shouldn't stop taking it?

You provided your answer in your question. If a student is DEPENDENT on the medication to perform tasks (as most are with frequent adderall use) then the only way that they can perform per their credentials is to take the medication. Would you want your surgeon, who decided to go throughout training using adderall, to decide the week before your surgery that he was going to give it a try to stop using stimulants? Would you trust the confidence in his ability and his natural focus, which he didn't trust in himself throughout training?

And to the poster with the asinine remark of continuing antipsychotics throughout a medical career, is that a joke? Do they teach you any reasoning at your school? If a man is actively schizophrenic and is dependent on antipsychotics to function then of course they would also be advised to take the medication if they continue practicing.
 
You provided your answer in your question. If a student is DEPENDENT on the medication to perform tasks (as most are with frequent adderall use) then the only way that they can perform per their credentials is to take the medication. Would you want your surgeon, who decided to go throughout training using adderall, to decide the week before your surgery that he was going to give it a try to stop using stimulants? Would you trust the confidence in his ability and his natural focus, which he didn't trust in himself throughout training?

And to the poster with the asinine remark of continuing antipsychotics throughout a medical career, is that a joke? Do they teach you any reasoning at your school? If a man is actively schizophrenic and is dependent on antipsychotics to function then of course they would also be advised to take the medication if they continue practicing.

I think the metaphor went way over your head.

Why don't you try again with antidepressants.
 
I think the metaphor went way over your head.

Why don't you try again with antidepressants.

How about you support your argument rather than asking questions that a high school student would be ashamed of asking
 
How about you support your argument rather than asking questions that a high school student would be ashamed of asking

Your argument is nonsensical. As I understand it you are essentially saying that because you were credentialed while using some kind of substance you must continue to use that substance to perform the duties you were credentialed for. Is that right? Because if so, that's stupid. I won't fault you if you've never ingested alcohol or any kind of drug before, but if you have, then should clearly see that your argument makes no sense based on your own personal experience.

Sent from my Nexus 7
 
You provided your answer in your question. If a student is DEPENDENT on the medication to perform tasks (as most are with frequent adderall use) then the only way that they can perform per their credentials is to take the medication. Would you want your surgeon, who decided to go throughout training using adderall, to decide the week before your surgery that he was going to give it a try to stop using stimulants? Would you trust the confidence in his ability and his natural focus, which he didn't trust in himself throughout training?

And to the poster with the asinine remark of continuing antipsychotics throughout a medical career, is that a joke? Do they teach you any reasoning at your school? If a man is actively schizophrenic and is dependent on antipsychotics to function then of course they would also be advised to take the medication if they continue practicing.

Have you ever taken adderall? It's not that deep people. Seriously. It's not that deep
 
How about you support your argument rather than asking questions that a high school student would be ashamed of asking

I'll try to dumb it down for you:

Need adderall in med school -> Have to keep using it to "perform at x level"

Need antidepressants in med school -> Have to keep using it to perform at x level

Need anxiolytics in med school -> Have to keep using it to perform at x level.

Please state the difference.
 
You provided your answer in your question. If a student is DEPENDENT on the medication to perform tasks (as most are with frequent adderall use) then the only way that they can perform per their credentials is to take the medication. Would you want your surgeon, who decided to go throughout training using adderall, to decide the week before your surgery that he was going to give it a try to stop using stimulants? Would you trust the confidence in his ability and his natural focus, which he didn't trust in himself throughout training?
.

Apply this argument to someone taking Adderall for its indicated usage under the supervision of a physician. Should they be denied from practicing? Should they be prohibited from tapering down their dosage due to possible hits in their performance?

Now someone self-medicating/ acquiring Adderall illegally doesn't have someone telling them how to taper down their dosage. But most people using Adderall in that fashion aren't using it even close to every day (no one's THAT rich) so the risks of dependence are much lower.
 
I'll try to dumb it down for you:

Need adderall in med school -> Have to keep using it to "perform at x level"

Need antidepressants in med school -> Have to keep using it to perform at x level

Need anxiolytics in med school -> Have to keep using it to perform at x level.

Please state the difference.

No one is taking antidepressants in order to focus more to get a competitive specialty. There are a lot of students taking adderall so that they can perform at a level more than they are capable of to get a competitive spot-- if you can't understand that maybe you should apply to nursing school or take some adderall and re-read my posts.

I really have no beef with people who use adderall, I just recognize that they are not capable of performing at a given level and that they lack will power. I would not want them to be on my team, since they are dependent on a drug to perform and if I became aware that my physician was using adderall I would drop him.

You can take all of the schizophrenics, depressed, and ADHD doctors on your team and see how that practice goes.
 
Apply this argument to someone taking Adderall for its indicated usage under the supervision of a physician. Should they be denied from practicing? Should they be prohibited from tapering down their dosage due to possible hits in their performance?

Now someone self-medicating/ acquiring Adderall illegally doesn't have someone telling them how to taper down their dosage. But most people using Adderall in that fashion aren't using it even close to every day (no one's THAT rich) so the risks of dependence are much lower.

I'm not talking about those students who are being supervised. Although I also know students who are supervised and tried to quit and could not be off of medication while in school-- they just can't focus on the material. It is the student who thinks that he is just taking medication during MS1 and MS2 and that later down the road the path is easier and he won't need the meds.

Those students are in for a real rude awakening and are most likely to remain dependent on the drug or sacrifice their practice.
 
No one is taking antidepressants in order to focus more to get a competitive specialty. There are a lot of students taking adderall so that they can perform at a level more than they are capable of to get a competitive spot-- if you can't understand that maybe you should apply to nursing school or take some adderall and re-read my posts.

I really have no beef with people who use adderall, I just recognize that they are not capable of performing at a given level and that they lack will power. I would not want them to be on my team, since they are dependent on a drug to perform and if I became aware that my physician was using adderall I would drop him.

You can take all of the schizophrenics, depressed, and ADHD doctors on your team and see how that practice goes.

So your only objection is the ends, not the means? That's what your post suggests. As long as someone isn't taking it to get into a competitive specialty, it's okay?

Otherwise, I still fail to see a difference. Inability to focus is one of the depression criteria, so if they're taking meds so they can be a better student and get into a more competitive spot, what is the difference between that and adderall?

I dont really have a horse in this race - I haven't taken adderall in medical school nor do I care if anyone else does - I just find your set of "morals" contradictory and bewildering.
 
No one is taking antidepressants in order to focus more to get a competitive specialty. There are a lot of students taking adderall so that they can perform at a level more than they are capable of to get a competitive spot-- if you can't understand that maybe you should apply to nursing school or take some adderall and re-read my posts.

I really have no beef with people who use adderall, I just recognize that they are not capable of performing at a given level and that they lack will power. I would not want them to be on my team, since they are dependent on a drug to perform and if I became aware that my physician was using adderall I would drop him.

You can take all of the schizophrenics, depressed, and ADHD doctors on your team and see how that practice goes.

Adult ADHD? Even if he performs perfectly on the job?
 
No one is taking antidepressants in order to focus more to get a competitive specialty. There are a lot of students taking adderall so that they can perform at a level more than they are capable of to get a competitive spot-- if you can't understand that maybe you should apply to nursing school or take some adderall and re-read my posts.

I think you overestimate adderall
 
No one is taking antidepressants in order to focus more to get a competitive specialty. There are a lot of students taking adderall so that they can perform at a level more than they are capable of to get a competitive spot-- if you can't understand that maybe you should apply to nursing school or take some adderall and re-read my posts.

I really have no beef with people who use adderall, I just recognize that they are not capable of performing at a given level and that they lack will power. I would not want them to be on my team, since they are dependent on a drug to perform and if I became aware that my physician was using adderall I would drop him.

You can take all of the schizophrenics, depressed, and ADHD doctors on your team and see how that practice goes.

Also, to break down your post by paragraphs:

1. If I am incapable of understanding you, I should go to nursing school.
2. You have no beef with adderall users, but would drop doctors and will not work with them.
3. Doctors with psych disorders cannot have a successful medical practice.

Maybe if you re-read your posts you'll understand why nothing you say makes any sense.
 
So your only objection is the ends, not the means? That's what your post suggests. As long as someone isn't taking it to get into a competitive specialty, it's okay?

Otherwise, I still fail to see a difference. Inability to focus is one of the depression criteria, so if they're taking meds so they can be a better student and get into a more competitive spot, what is the difference between that and adderall?

I dont really have a horse in this race - I haven't taken adderall in medical school nor do I care if anyone else does - I just find your set of "morals" contradictory and bewildering.

I also find taking antidepressants during medical school to be detrimental to the student. If he is depressed, he is depressed for a reason-- maybe medical school is not right for him. Taking antidepressants temporarily relieves that depression while the student continues to go through medical education and into more loans. When he tries to get off the meds (whether it be anti-depressants or adderall) he is in for a big wake up call that may ruin his life and/or his career.
 
Also, to break down your post by paragraphs:

1. If I am incapable of understanding you, I should go to nursing school.
2. You have no beef with adderall users, but would drop doctors and will not work with them.
3. Doctors with psych disorders cannot have a successful medical practice.

Maybe if you re-read your posts you'll understand why nothing you say makes any sense.

You lack some common sense, bud. You go ahead and practice with the physicians that have active psychotic disorders and are no longer taking medication-- it will suit you.
 
I also find taking antidepressants during medical school to be detrimental to the student. If he is depressed, he is depressed for a reason-- maybe medical school is not right for him. Taking antidepressants temporarily relieves that depression while the student continues to go through medical education and into more loans. When he tries to get off the meds (whether it be anti-depressants or adderall) he is in for a big wake up call that may ruin his life and/or his career.

Well, i think this pretty much sums it up for everybody. I have no rebuttal to this.
 
3rd year psych rotation should open eyes for people ;)
 
It is a hard concept to come to grasps with but some people are not as capable as others-- whether it be in focusing or stability of emotions.

Those who take adderall do so in order to increase their focus to a level that they are not naturally capable of. There's nothing wrong with that but people need to accept their limitations or they put themselves into positions of dependence.

Just try to enlist in the Military while on medication or a previous history of mental illness. Medical school should be the same way, sorry to break that fragile heart of yours.
 
Downward does this thread move.

tumblr_l9v8vywZQK1qcj8pdo1_500.jpg
 
If that was the case(in terms of depression), 1/4 of your classmates will never, ever become physicians...
 
Top