MS4 in a pickle - no FM at med school. no elective.

[caraswank]

Hello.
I am a MS4, stretching Ms4 into two year, thus not applying this year.
The situation is I go to a fancy fancy med school, where exactly 1 person goes into FM every year. Our school does not have a FM department, and literally 3 people employed at the entire hospital is FM board certified. People turn there nose up, etc. Pretty lame. There is no FM rotation either. No FM department, etc - you get the drift

Additionally, I am having a baby in late June, and don't think I can realistically perform sufficiently until Sep for an elective, by then it is too late to get a letter for ERAS. So I am trying to do my electives in the spring, before popping the baby out. After attempting the line up any FM elective for Feb, March, April, May - every program is full for these month. I know this is ridiculously late to ask anyone for a spot a month before the start date (The pregnancy succeeded a little bit earlier than planned) I emailed all the California programs (parents), and a lot of the northeast programs (currently live here/school)

So, I am not sure what else I can try - I need a letter from a FM person - there are a few in the ER at one of our affiliated hospitals but there is no real rotation - otherwise, there is no FM person at all at this med school. And it feels like my own med school is the only way I can get an elective for spring since it seems nobody else has any spots.

Any suggestions?
Thanks

Best

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[mabinante]

Do or md?

 

[caraswank]

MD - a fancy place where almost every single person had decided on their fellowship before they even graduated, but we all actually possess very poor clinical skills.

 

[NurWollen]

Do or md?

It would be beyond strange if there is a DO school our there that doesn't have an FM rotation. At my school we do eight weeks of FM during third year.

 

[NurWollen]

It would be beyond strange if there is a DO school our there that doesn't have an FM rotation. At my school we do eight weeks of FM during third year.

OP could you try applying to something through VSAS?

 

[W19]

What? I thought those core rotations were mandated by LCME...

 

[Mirp]

Last I checked there are at least 400 FM residencies in the US. Not sure how many private clinics with residency or university affiliation. Somebody will take you for a couple weeks. Keep looking

Sent from my XT830C using Tapatalk

 

[caraswank]

What? I thought those core rotations were mandated by LCME...

We have a primary care rotation, but it's pretty much not a real thing - you just shadow some random doctors around, but not a single person involved is FM. Everyone is internal medicine, peds, or ob.

 

[Oo Cipher oO]

Hello.
I am a MS4, stretching Ms4 into two year, thus not applying this year.
The situation is I go to a fancy fancy med school, where exactly 1 person goes into FM every year. Our school does not have a FM department, and literally 3 people employed at the entire hospital is FM board certified. People turn there nose up, etc. Pretty lame. There is no FM rotation either. No FM department, etc - you get the drift

Additionally, I am having a baby in late June, and don't think I can realistically perform sufficiently until Sep for an elective, by then it is too late to get a letter for ERAS. So I am trying to do my electives in the spring, before popping the baby out. After attempting the line up any FM elective for Feb, March, April, May - every program is full for these month. I know this is ridiculously late to ask anyone for a spot a month before the start date (The pregnancy succeeded a little bit earlier than planned) I emailed all the California programs (parents), and a lot of the northeast programs (currently live here/school)

So, I am not sure what else I can try - I need a letter from a FM person - there are a few in the ER at one of our affiliated hospitals but there is no real rotation - otherwise, there is no FM person at all at this med school. And it feels like my own med school is the only way I can get an elective for spring since it seems nobody else has any spots.

Any suggestions?
Thanks

Best

If you just need some FM experience and someone to write you a letter then you can look into private preceptors in your area. If you would like to see the full spectrum of FM then you should look into contacting some community hospitals that have unopposed family medicine residencies (meaning no other residents fromm other specialties). Some may not be listed on VSAS.

 

[playingfrombehind]

Hello.
I am a MS4, stretching Ms4 into two year, thus not applying this year.
The situation is I go to a fancy fancy med school, where exactly 1 person goes into FM every year. Our school does not have a FM department, and literally 3 people employed at the entire hospital is FM board certified. People turn there nose up, etc. Pretty lame. There is no FM rotation either. No FM department, etc - you get the drift

Additionally, I am having a baby in late June, and don't think I can realistically perform sufficiently until Sep for an elective, by then it is too late to get a letter for ERAS. So I am trying to do my electives in the spring, before popping the baby out. After attempting the line up any FM elective for Feb, March, April, May - every program is full for these month. I know this is ridiculously late to ask anyone for a spot a month before the start date (The pregnancy succeeded a little bit earlier than planned) I emailed all the California programs (parents), and a lot of the northeast programs (currently live here/school)

So, I am not sure what else I can try - I need a letter from a FM person - there are a few in the ER at one of our affiliated hospitals but there is no real rotation - otherwise, there is no FM person at all at this med school. And it feels like my own med school is the only way I can get an elective for spring since it seems nobody else has any spots.

Any suggestions?
Thanks

Best

I would suggest talking to your school / dean's office - they should be more familiar with what to do - given they know about your school's resources.
How about for your FM core rotation - can you talk to that preceptor?'
Worse comes to worse you could ask for a "chair letter" which is very generic in nature and not helpful to whoever reads it - I don't recommend getting a chair letter from someone you never worked with. But then again you said you didn't have a FM department so getting a chair letter might be difficult.

 

[Oo Cipher oO]

I would suggest talking to your school / dean's office - they should be more familiar with what to do - given they know about your school's resources.
How about for your FM core rotation - can you talk to that preceptor?'
Worse comes to worse you could ask for a "chair letter" which is very generic in nature and not helpful to whoever reads it - I don't recommend getting a chair letter from someone you never worked with. But then again you said you didn't have a FM department so getting a chair letter might be difficult.

Not every medical school has a required FM core rotation. It sounds like OPs school does not even have an FM department so I would say this is likely the case here.

OP, I found this resource of the AAFP website for a clerkship preceptor database. I have never used it so I can't say how useful it is but I'll post it so you can check it out. http://www.aafp.org/medical-school-residency/medical-school/rotations.html

 

[SLC]

Harvard, Yale, Cornell?

The rest of the schools in the Northeast that I'm aware of have FM departments and residency programs.

PM me, I can tell you about my program (in the NE) and see if you've already contacted us. We're a good one, and I've seen a lot of visiting students come through lately.

I also have ideas about a few others in the west you should look at.

 

[hallowmann]

Last I checked there are at least 400 FM residencies in the US. Not sure how many private clinics with residency or university affiliation. Somebody will take you for a couple weeks. Keep looking

Sent from my XT830C using Tapatalk

470 or so ACGME programs last I checked.

OP, you need to do some more contacting. There are plenty of places that would take you for electives, so if you can manage a few of those, then you'll be set for auditions and possibly a good letter if you do well on them.

 

[linguistafeliz]

Hi there, I was in the same boat -- my school doesn't have an FM department, or elective, or anything.

You have plenty of time! I also didn't start planning electives until about December of the year that I applied. I promise, be persistent. If you can't find programs in California or the Northeast, you can also research getting an Away at good programs in other parts of the country, since at this point you kind of just want exposure to the field / a letter or two. Definitely go through VSAS and see if you can find programs that way. I would just email a ton of programs in the area you're interested asking if they have any openings during those months. I am sure you will be able to find one. You can PM me if you want more details on programs in California or the Northeast since I just applied and I researched them all a ton.

I did one away at a not-so-famous program just to get exposure to the field, and it was still really helpful.

 

[space3223]

MD - a fancy place where almost every single person had decided on their fellowship before they even graduated, but we all actually possess very poor clinical skills.

Hmmm...do we go to the same school? This sounds exactly like here I am...

I know I am a little late to the thread, but I thought I'd offer some info for the OP and anyone else who might come along in a similar situation.

As for the FM LOR, I was in a similar situation. We have no FM department, and as far as I known no FM MDs actually at the institution, etc. I was told that when students here need an FM letter but cannot get one for whatever reason, the head of our Primary Care Clerkship (If you are where I am, its Dr. D) can write a letter that has been accepted as a substitute FM letter (but I was told this only holds for students at one of the 10 schools with no FM department). We have matched people to Ventura, etc. so it does work for students from here.

Also, as for talking to your dean, may be helpful, may not be. My dean didn't understand that there is a difference between FM and IM-Primary Care (didn't know what "unopposed" was, thought the best FM programs are all at Ivys, etc. this person is very well intentioned but less helpful than people here on StudentDoc...) I ended up speaking informally with our doctor at Student Health Services who is an FM boarded doc (and is familiar with lots of programs in the northeast and had some info about programs in Cali) and THAT was VERY helpful, far more helpful than anyone else I spoke with here.

Good luck.

 

[NurWollen]

Hi there, I was in the same boat -- my school doesn't have an FM department, or elective, or anything.

You have plenty of time! I also didn't start planning electives until about December of the year that I applied. I promise, be persistent. If you can't find programs in California or the Northeast, you can also research getting an Away at good programs in other parts of the country, since at this point you kind of just want exposure to the field / a letter or two. Definitely go through VSAS and see if you can find programs that way. I would just email a ton of programs in the area you're interested asking if they have any openings during those months. I am sure you will be able to find one. You can PM me if you want more details on programs in California or the Northeast since I just applied and I researched them all a ton.

I did one away at a not-so-famous program just to get exposure to the field, and it was still really helpful.

You act like the Northeast and California are the only places someone could possibly want I live lol.

Sent from my SM-N910V using SDN mobile

 

[NurWollen]

Hmmm...do we go to the same school? This sounds exactly like here I am...

I know I am a little late to the thread, but I thought I'd offer some info for the OP and anyone else who might come along in a similar situation.

As for the FM LOR, I was in a similar situation. We have no FM department, and as far as I known no FM MDs actually at the institution, etc. I was told that when students here need an FM letter but cannot get one for whatever reason, the head of our Primary Care Clerkship (If you are where I am, its Dr. D) can write a letter that has been accepted as a substitute FM letter (but I was told this only holds for students at one of the 10 schools with no FM department). We have matched people to Ventura, etc. so it does work for students from here.

Also, as for talking to your dean, may be helpful, may not be. My dean didn't understand that there is a difference between FM and IM-Primary Care (didn't know what "unopposed" was, thought the best FM programs are all at Ivys, etc. this person is very well intentioned but less helpful than people here on StudentDoc...) I ended up speaking informally with our doctor at Student Health Services who is an FM boarded doc (and is familiar with lots of programs in the northeast and had some info about programs in Cali) and THAT was VERY helpful, far more helpful than anyone else I spoke with here.

Good luck.

The Dean didn't know the difference between FM and IM? Wow, that's pretty bad.

Sent from my SM-N910V using SDN mobile

 

[witzelsucht]

how hard can it be to contact some community hospital and ask to rotate? i'd imagine they'd want all the fancy pants ivy league MD students they can get

 

[space3223]

The Dean didn't know the difference between FM and IM? Wow, that's pretty bad.

Sent from my SM-N910V using SDN mobile

Yup...Dean is/was a psych - former PD for that program. oh and about half of the psych faculty here literally are certified psychoanalysts - even got a pix of Freud on the certification and everything LOL. So much for evidence-based mental health care... I once heard the head of the inpatient unit refer to his multiple round (at least 4 rounds) ECT-refractory depression patient as "having a Peter Pan complex." *SIGH* I won't get myself started on this place...

 

[Mad Jack]

Try contacting family medicine physicians in your area and see if one would be willing to precept for four weeks. You're going to be well above and beyond your rotation requirements, so a four week stint with a private preceptor will fit nicely into your extended schedule.

 

[Mosonik]

Hello.
I am a MS4, stretching Ms4 into two year, thus not applying this year.
The situation is I go to a fancy fancy med school, where exactly 1 person goes into FM every year. Our school does not have a FM department, and literally 3 people employed at the entire hospital is FM board certified. People turn there nose up, etc. Pretty lame. There is no FM rotation either. No FM department, etc - you get the drift

Additionally, I am having a baby in late June, and don't think I can realistically perform sufficiently until Sep for an elective, by then it is too late to get a letter for ERAS. So I am trying to do my electives in the spring, before popping the baby out. After attempting the line up any FM elective for Feb, March, April, May - every program is full for these month. I know this is ridiculously late to ask anyone for a spot a month before the start date (The pregnancy succeeded a little bit earlier than planned) I emailed all the California programs (parents), and a lot of the northeast programs (currently live here/school)

So, I am not sure what else I can try - I need a letter from a FM person - there are a few in the ER at one of our affiliated hospitals but there is no real rotation - otherwise, there is no FM person at all at this med school. And it feels like my own med school is the only way I can get an elective for spring since it seems nobody else has any spots.

Any suggestions?
Thanks

Best

OP,

It sounds like you found a lot of support and advise on here. A lot of my year has been spent at an Ivey league institution and I commend you for even dipping your toe in FM given the prevailing attitudes and arrogance. I hope you find a place that will support you with the kind of formation you are looking for. Prestige is an empty promise to run after in medicine after all..

 

[TableMD]

Good luck and let us know how it goes.

Dont worry about the "hidden curriculum", do what makes YOU happy. Even in the NE there are plenty of options for excellent training.

 

[W19]

It's kind of shocking to see that med meds and even physicians are so prestige-driven... If you are not not a surgeon or a big time specialist, no one takes you seriously in these teaching hospitals. It's very strange seeing physicians disparaging their colleagues so openly...