Official 2016-2017 Cardiology Fellowship Application Cycle

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What do you guys think about UAB vs U Colorado? Which one has a better name?
They both are comparable. Interventional outcomes research and clinical work may be better in Colorado, and its in a 'cooler' city. UAB's EP and heart failure programs are better. On the national scene, UAB cardiology division may have better reputation (and more NIH etc funding). I think that UAB would have more patients and CVD pathology because of its location in the south! They both are like top 25 cardiology fellowship programs. One may have a better 'reputation' and another better location.
So would go by 'fit' and what you want to do in the big picture. Personally I don't like snow, so have never seriously looked at Denver. Do you want to practice in Denver? Then go to UC Denver!

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Requesting again, if someone can give me an input on the following programs or how i should rank them. Much appreciated!

Morristown
Grand rapids
AGH
Tulane
ETSU
UMKC/St Luke
St John detroit
 
Requesting again, if someone can give me an input on the following programs or how i should rank them. Much appreciated!

Morristown
Grand rapids
AGH
Tulane
ETSU
UMKC/St Luke
St John detroit

5-Morristown
7-Grand Rapids
2- AGH
1- Tulane
4-ETSU
3- UMKC/St Luke
6-St John detroit
 
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@NewYork2016 - thank you so much, this will be helpful. are you able to put a few words also on how you arrived at this ranking
 
All the best to all of you in this exhausting process......
 
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Can anybody provide me insight about Baylor University Medical Center in Dallas. How is their program, is it largely driven by private attendings or do they have a strong teaching program?
I am certainly going to rank UTSW higher than this but I have to stay in Dallas for my wife, is this program good from academics standpoint?
 
if there's something significant to update programs about, ex: new publication, national award etc - what is the best way to go about doing this?
 
if there's something significant to update programs about, ex: new publication, national award etc - what is the best way to go about doing this?

If you received the invitation there, you can talk to them about it during your interview. If you already interviewed, then send an email notifying them. Good luck!
 
Out of curiosity, what are people's thoughts on when programs ask you where else you've been / how many other places you're interviewing at? Is honesty really always the best policy? It's come up a few times and I never know if I should stick to naming just the middle-tier programs or the similar-location programs or to tell all.
 
I had same experience in Michigan, didn't like that question and not comfortable responding. I wish I said few names but interviewer asked to disclose all the names in my case

Not sure what they are trying to find out from this question, how strong their candidate pool also isn't any kind of violation nrmp?! Definitely violates my code

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UTSW rejection

AMG

7/19 - Baylor College of Medicine, Houston
7/21 - UMass
7/21 - WVU
7/21 - Stony Brook
7/21 - Yale University/Yale-New Haven
7/25, 8/3 - U of Kentucky
7/25 - Atlantic Health System (Morristown)
7/25, 8/15 - U at Buffalo
7/26 - Albany Medical College
7/27 - OHSU
7/28 - Hawaii
7/29 - Cedars-Sinai
7/ ? - Kaiser SF
8/1 - GW
8/1 - Duke
8/1 - University of Utah
8/1, 8/3 - University of Nebraska
8/1, 8/10 - Baylor Dallas
8/2, 8/4 - UVA
8/2 - Brown
8/2 - Loyola
8/2 - Rochester
8/3 - MCW
8/3 - UCSF
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4, 8/19, 8/22 - UPMC
8/4 - WashU/B-JH/SLCH
8/4 - Columbia-NYP
8/4, 8/16 - U of Maryland
8/4 - U of Arizona-Phoenix Banner
8/5 - Henry Ford
8/5 - Hopkins
8/5, 8/12, 9/2? - Michigan
8/5 - UT Southwestern
8/8 - BWH
8/8, 8/25 - UTHSC-Memphis
8/8 - Indiana U
8/8, 8/15 - UF Jacksonville
8/8 - VA Tech (Carilion)
8/8, 8/18 - Scripps
8/9, 8/11, 8/17 - Cleveland Clinic Ohio
8/9 - Case Western Reserve University/University Hospitals
8/9 - Georgetown
8/9 - University of Miami/JFK Palm Beach
8/9 - Mayo Clinic - Rochester
8/9 - Penn State
8/10, 8/22 - UCSD
8/11 - University of North Carolina - Chapel Hill
8/12 - University of Vermont
8/12 - Dartmouth
8/12 - Cornell
8/12 - Hennepin County/Abbott Northwestern - Minneapolis
8/13 - Winthrop
8/15 - UTHSC - San Antonio
8/15 - Emory
8/15 - RWJMS
8/15 - Virginia Commonwealth University
8/16 - Tufts
8/16, 8/18 - University of Tennessee - Chattanooga
8/16 - University of Minnesota
8/16 - University of Oklahoma
8/16, 8/18 - University of Arizona
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/16 - NYU
8/16 - BCM/Texas Heart/St. Luke's
8/16 - Hofstra
8/17 - BMC
8/17, 8/18 - SLU
8/17, 8/19 - BIDMC
8/17 - Thomas Jefferson
8/17 - Texas A&M (Scott & White)
8/17 - University of Mississippi
8/17 - Colorado/UC Denver
8/18 - California Pacific Medical Center, San Francisco
8/18 - University of Florida (Gainesville)
8/19 - Palmetto Health/University of South Carolina
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19, 8/26 - Ohio State University
8/19 - MGH
8/19 - Montefiore
8/19 - Mt. Sinai NY (Academic Track)
8/19 - University of Louisville
8/19 - Creighton University
8/22 - St. Vincent's Indianapolis
8/22 - Albany Medical Center
8/22 (internal), 8/24 - U Chicago
8/22, 8/31 - UCLA
8/22 - Ochsner
8/22 - USF
8/22 - Aurora Health Care
8/22 - Wake Forest
8/23 - UCincinnati
8/23 - UToledo
8/24 - Mercy St. Vincent
8/24 - Metro Health (Case)
8/24 - Stanford
8/25, 8/26 - Vanderbilt
8/25 - Cooper University
8/25 - UC Irvine
8/26 - UC Davis
8/26, 9/2 - Jackson Memorial - Miami
8/26 - Beaumont
8/29 - MUSC
8/31 - Kansas
8/31, 9/1 - Northwestern
9/1 - UIC
9/1 - U South Carolina (Palmetto)
9/1 - Tulane
9/2 - UPenn
9/6 - UAB
9/6 - Rush
9/7 - Marshall University
9/7 - Cristiana Care
9/8 - Rutgers University
9/9 - Mizzou - Columbia
9/9 - Temple
9/14 - Uni of TN - Knoxville
9/15 - UTMB
? - Kaiser LA

DO
8/1 - Nassau University Medical Center
8/8 - UF Jacksonville
8/16 - Hofstra
8/18 - Broward General Hospital
8/22 - Coney Island Hospital

IMG w/o visa required
7/18 - OHSU
7/19 - Yale
7/25 - University of Buffalo
7/28 - Atlantic Health System (Morristown)
/7/29 - Geisinger
8/2 - Loyola
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4 - Texas Tech El Paso
8/5 - Henry Ford
8/9 - University of Wisconsin
8/12 - NYMC
8/12 - University of Tennessee
8/12 - University of Nebraska
8/15 - University of Chicago (Northshore)
8/16 - Summa Health Ohio
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/17 - University of Arizona
8/17 - Boston University/BMC
8/18 - St. John Hospital, Detroit
8/22 - Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai (Academic Track)
8/23 - Cleveland Clinic Florida
8/23 - LSU New Orleans
8/23 - Medical College of Georgia
8/25 - University of Illinois at Peoria
8/26 - Albany Medical College
8/26 - Stony Brook University
8/29 - University of Louisville
8/29 - Lenox Hill Hospital
8/30 - University of Cincinnati
8/30 - UAMS
8/30, 9/15 - University of Texas Medical Branch at Galveston
8/30 - UTHSC-Memphis (only one date 9/16)
8/31 - University of Kansas (KUMC)
9/2 - University of Missouri - Columbia
9/2 - University of Miami/Jackson Memorial Hospital
9/6 - UAB
9/9 - Henry Ford
9/9 - University of Missouri - Kansas City/MAHI
9/9 - Temple University
9/12 - Lehigh Valley
9/14 - University of Tennessee Knoxville
9/16 - Beth Israel, Newark, NJ
9/19 - SUNY Upstate
9/20 - Mt. Sinai (FL)
9/20 - University of Miami/ JFK Regional

IMG requiring visa
7/25 - U at Buffalo
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4 - UPMC
8/4 - Geisinger
8/9 - Georgetown/WHC
8/10 - Mayo Clinic - Rochester
8/11 - University of Kentucky
8/11 - University of Nebraska
8/12 - University of Utah
8/15 - Virginia Commonwealth University
8/15 - University of Connecticut
8/16 - University of Minnesota
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/17 - University of Colorado, Denver
8/18 - St. John Hospital, Detroit
8/18 - University of Rochester
8/19 - Creighton University
8/19 - Saint Louis University
8/19 - Mount Sinai Icahn School of Medicine
8/19 - Ohio State University
8/19 - New York Medical College / Westchester Medical Center
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19 - Loma Linda University
8/22 - Allegheny General Hospital
8/23 - Cleveland Clinic Florida
8/25 - UTHSC-Memphis
8/26 - Mayo Clinic, Arizona
8/31 - University of Kansas (KUMC)
9/2 - Cook County
9/2 - Detroit Medical Center /Wayne State University
9/6 - Mayo Clinic, Florida
9/6 - Rush University Medical Center
9/6 - Hartford
9/6 - Montefiore
09/12-St Elizabeth Boston

Waitlisted
8/19 - U of Maryland (AMG, external)

Rejections
7/19, 8/9 - WashU/B-JH/SLCH
8/4 - Columbia-NYP
8/5, 8/18, 9/2 - Michigan
8/9 - Georgetown
8/10 - Duke
8/15 - Mayo Rochester
8/17 - Brown
8/18 - Colorado/UC Denver
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19 - University of Maryland
8/19 - UCSD
8/19 - University of Massachusetts
8/19 - Saint Louis University
8/19 - New York Medical College
8/21 - U of New Mexico
8/22, 8/24 - UChicago
8/23 - Indiana University
8/23 - University of Florida (Gainesville)
8/23, 9/6 - MGH
8/23 - Hopkins
8/23 - UTSW
8/24 - Thomas Jefferson
8/25 - Cooper University
8/25,09/20 - University of Connecticut
8/29 - William Beaumont Hospital
8/29 - University of Utah
8/29 - Boston University
8/29 - Creighton University
8/30 - University of South Florida
8/31 - Texas A&M College of Medicine-Scott and White
8/31 - University of Arkansas
8/31 - Ohio State
8/31 - UCLA
9/1 - Vanderbilt
9/1 - University of Minnesota
9/1, 9/2 - University of Illinois Chicago
9/2 - Hennepin County
9/2 - Kansas University Medical Center
9/2, 9/6 - University of Kentucky
9/3 - BIDMC
9/4 - Palmetto Health/University of South Carolina School of Medicine
9/6 - Cook County
9/6 - Scripps
9/9 - Geisinger
9/10 - Mayo Clinic - Arizona
9/12 - Emory
9/16 - Univ of Wisconsin
9/16 - Vidant, NC,
9/16 - LSU, New Orleans
9/16 - Tulane
9/19 - Cook County
9/19 - Kettering Health,Ohio
9/19 - NY Methodist
9/20 - Cleveland Clinic
9/20 - Univ of Louisville
9/26 - UTSW
 
oops, didn't see it listed before.

AMG
7/19 - Baylor College of Medicine, Houston
7/21 - UMass
7/21 - WVU
7/21 - Stony Brook
7/21 - Yale University/Yale-New Haven
7/25, 8/3 - U of Kentucky
7/25 - Atlantic Health System (Morristown)
7/25, 8/15 - U at Buffalo
7/26 - Albany Medical College
7/27 - OHSU
7/28 - Hawaii
7/29 - Cedars-Sinai
7/ ? - Kaiser SF
8/1 - GW
8/1 - Duke
8/1 - University of Utah
8/1, 8/3 - University of Nebraska
8/1, 8/10 - Baylor Dallas
8/2, 8/4 - UVA
8/2 - Brown
8/2 - Loyola
8/2 - Rochester
8/3 - MCW
8/3 - UCSF
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4, 8/19, 8/22 - UPMC
8/4 - WashU/B-JH/SLCH
8/4 - Columbia-NYP
8/4, 8/16 - U of Maryland
8/4 - U of Arizona-Phoenix Banner
8/5 - Henry Ford
8/5 - Hopkins
8/5, 8/12, 9/2? - Michigan
8/5 - UT Southwestern
8/8 - BWH
8/8, 8/25 - UTHSC-Memphis
8/8 - Indiana U
8/8, 8/15 - UF Jacksonville
8/8 - VA Tech (Carilion)
8/8, 8/18 - Scripps
8/9, 8/11, 8/17 - Cleveland Clinic Ohio
8/9 - Case Western Reserve University/University Hospitals
8/9 - Georgetown
8/9 - University of Miami/JFK Palm Beach
8/9 - Mayo Clinic - Rochester
8/9 - Penn State
8/10, 8/22 - UCSD
8/11 - University of North Carolina - Chapel Hill
8/12 - University of Vermont
8/12 - Dartmouth
8/12 - Cornell
8/12 - Hennepin County/Abbott Northwestern - Minneapolis
8/13 - Winthrop
8/15 - UTHSC - San Antonio
8/15 - Emory
8/15 - RWJMS
8/15 - Virginia Commonwealth University
8/16 - Tufts
8/16, 8/18 - University of Tennessee - Chattanooga
8/16 - University of Minnesota
8/16 - University of Oklahoma
8/16, 8/18 - University of Arizona
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/16 - NYU
8/16 - BCM/Texas Heart/St. Luke's
8/16 - Hofstra
8/17 - BMC
8/17, 8/18 - SLU
8/17, 8/19 - BIDMC
8/17 - Thomas Jefferson
8/17 - Texas A&M (Scott & White)
8/17 - University of Mississippi
8/17 - Colorado/UC Denver
8/18 - California Pacific Medical Center, San Francisco
8/18 - University of Florida (Gainesville)
8/19 - Palmetto Health/University of South Carolina
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19, 8/26 - Ohio State University
8/19 - MGH
8/19 - Montefiore
8/19 - Mt. Sinai NY (Academic Track)
8/19 - University of Louisville
8/19 - Creighton University
8/22 - St. Vincent's Indianapolis
8/22 - Albany Medical Center
8/22 (internal), 8/24 - U Chicago
8/22, 8/31 - UCLA
8/22 - Ochsner
8/22 - USF
8/22 - Aurora Health Care
8/22 - Wake Forest
8/23 - UCincinnati
8/23 - UToledo
8/24 - Mercy St. Vincent
8/24 - Metro Health (Case)
8/24 - Stanford
8/25, 8/26 - Vanderbilt
8/25 - Cooper University
8/25 - UC Irvine
8/26 - UC Davis
8/26, 9/2 - Jackson Memorial - Miami
8/26 - Beaumont
8/29 - MUSC
8/31 - Kansas
8/31, 9/1 - Northwestern
9/1 - UIC
9/1 - U South Carolina (Palmetto)
9/1 - Tulane
9/2 - UPenn
9/6 - UAB
9/6 - Rush
9/7 - Marshall University
9/7 - Cristiana Care
9/8 - Rutgers University
9/9 - Mizzou - Columbia
9/9 - Temple
9/14 - Uni of TN - Knoxville
9/15 - UTMB
? - Kaiser LA

DO
8/1 - Nassau University Medical Center
8/8 - UF Jacksonville
8/16 - Hofstra
8/18 - Broward General Hospital
8/22 - Coney Island Hospital

IMG w/o visa required
7/18 - OHSU
7/19 - Yale
7/25 - University of Buffalo
7/28 - Atlantic Health System (Morristown)
/7/29 - Geisinger
8/2 - Loyola
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4 - Texas Tech El Paso
8/5 - Henry Ford
8/9 - University of Wisconsin
8/12 - NYMC
8/12 - University of Tennessee
8/12 - University of Nebraska
8/15 - University of Chicago (Northshore)
8/16 - Summa Health Ohio
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/17 - University of Arizona
8/17 - Boston University/BMC
8/18 - St. John Hospital, Detroit
8/22 - Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai (Academic Track)
8/23 - Cleveland Clinic Florida
8/23 - LSU New Orleans
8/23 - Medical College of Georgia
8/25 - University of Illinois at Peoria
8/26 - Albany Medical College
8/26 - Stony Brook University
8/29 - University of Louisville
8/29 - Lenox Hill Hospital
8/30 - University of Cincinnati
8/30 - UAMS
8/30, 9/15 - University of Texas Medical Branch at Galveston
8/30 - UTHSC-Memphis (only one date 9/16)
8/31 - University of Kansas (KUMC)
9/2 - University of Missouri - Columbia
9/2 - University of Miami/Jackson Memorial Hospital
9/6 - UAB
9/9 - Henry Ford
9/9 - University of Missouri - Kansas City/MAHI
9/9 - Temple University
9/12 - Lehigh Valley
9/14 - University of Tennessee Knoxville
9/16 - Beth Israel, Newark, NJ
9/19 - SUNY Upstate
9/20 - Mt. Sinai (FL)
9/20 - University of Miami/ JFK Regional

IMG requiring visa
7/25 - U at Buffalo
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4 - UPMC
8/4 - Geisinger
8/9 - Georgetown/WHC
8/10 - Mayo Clinic - Rochester
8/11 - University of Kentucky
8/11 - University of Nebraska
8/12 - University of Utah
8/15 - Virginia Commonwealth University
8/15 - University of Connecticut
8/16 - University of Minnesota
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/17 - University of Colorado, Denver
8/18 - St. John Hospital, Detroit
8/18 - University of Rochester
8/19 - Creighton University
8/19 - Saint Louis University
8/19 - Mount Sinai Icahn School of Medicine
8/19 - Ohio State University
8/19 - New York Medical College / Westchester Medical Center
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19 - Loma Linda University
8/22 - Allegheny General Hospital
8/23 - Cleveland Clinic Florida
8/25 - UTHSC-Memphis
8/26 - Mayo Clinic, Arizona
8/31 - University of Kansas (KUMC)
9/2 - Cook County
9/2 - Detroit Medical Center /Wayne State University
9/6 - Mayo Clinic, Florida
9/6 - Rush University Medical Center
9/6 - Hartford
9/6 - Montefiore
09/12-St Elizabeth Boston

Waitlisted
8/19 - U of Maryland (AMG, external)

Rejections
7/19, 8/9 - WashU/B-JH/SLCH
8/4 - Columbia-NYP
8/5, 8/18, 9/2 - Michigan
8/9 - Georgetown
8/10 - Duke
8/15 - Mayo Rochester
8/17 - Brown
8/18 - Colorado/UC Denver
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19 - University of Maryland
8/19 - UCSD
8/19 - University of Massachusetts
8/19 - Saint Louis University
8/19 - New York Medical College
8/21 - U of New Mexico
8/22, 8/24 - UChicago
8/23 - Indiana University
8/23 - University of Florida (Gainesville)
8/23, 9/6 - MGH
8/23 - Hopkins
8/23, 9/26 - UTSW
8/24 - Thomas Jefferson
8/25 - Cooper University
8/25,09/20 - University of Connecticut
8/29 - William Beaumont Hospital
8/29 - University of Utah
8/29 - Boston University
8/29 - Creighton University
8/30 - University of South Florida
8/31 - Texas A&M College of Medicine-Scott and White
8/31 - University of Arkansas
8/31 - Ohio State
8/31 - UCLA
9/1 - Vanderbilt
9/1 - University of Minnesota
9/1, 9/2 - University of Illinois Chicago
9/2 - Hennepin County
9/2 - Kansas University Medical Center
9/2, 9/6 - University of Kentucky
9/3 - BIDMC
9/4 - Palmetto Health/University of South Carolina School of Medicine
9/6 - Cook County
9/6 - Scripps
9/9 - Geisinger
9/10 - Mayo Clinic - Arizona
9/12 - Emory
9/16 - Univ of Wisconsin
9/16 - Vidant, NC,
9/16 - LSU, New Orleans
9/16 - Tulane
9/19 - Cook County
9/19 - Kettering Health,Ohio
9/19 - NY Methodist
9/20 - Cleveland Clinic
9/20 - Univ of Louisville
 
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I had same experience in Michigan, didn't like that question and not comfortable responding. I wish I said few names but interviewer asked to disclose all the names in my case. Not sure what they are trying to find out from this question, how strong their candidate pool also isn't any kind of violation nrmp?! Definitely violates my code

I'm pretty sure it's technically a violation (given that Rush's supplement asked similar questions and they got in trouble for it). I just can't figure out what the "right" answer is (if there is one). Does being able to list many "good" programs make you more or less desirable? I tend to think that it makes you look less likely to come to their program (which is presumably the answer they're trying to get from you) but I've heard the argument that more programs listed means you're a "stronger" candidate and therefore more desirable. :shrug:
 
I'm pretty sure it's technically a violation (given that Rush's supplement asked similar questions and they got in trouble for it). I just can't figure out what the "right" answer is (if there is one). Does being able to list many "good" programs make you more or less desirable? I tend to think that it makes you look less likely to come to their program (which is presumably the answer they're trying to get from you) but I've heard the argument that more programs listed means you're a "stronger" candidate and therefore more desirable. :shrug:

I too have been asked this question at multiple interviews and feel very uncomfortable with it. I've answered with at least two different answers. Firstly, many of my interviews are location specific to try and stay close to family. In these instances, I've answered vaguely that I'm interviewing at programs in the southeast coast to stay close to family. At one of the more academic institutions, I was asked the same question and I limited my answer to "I've interviewed or will interview at similar programs" and then redirect with an immediate question. It is off-putting and uncomfortable and hopefully when we match, we can have input and suggest to the programs to avoid these questions.

I should add that I was pimped at a program too, that was a lot worse than being asked if and where I've interviewed. I answered all the questions, and well, but it was weird.
 
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Out of curiosity, what are people's thoughts on when programs ask you where else you've been / how many other places you're interviewing at? Is honesty really always the best policy? It's come up a few times and I never know if I should stick to naming just the middle-tier programs or the similar-location programs or to tell all.

I had same experience in Michigan, didn't like that question and not comfortable responding. I wish I said few names but interviewer asked to disclose all the names in my case

Not sure what they are trying to find out from this question, how strong their candidate pool also isn't any kind of violation nrmp?! Definitely violates my code
You're way over-thinking this...and I can't believe you never got asked it during residency interviews.

It's mostly a point of conversation as well as to try and gauge where you think you are in the competitive hierarchy of the specialty. At least, that's what I used it for as an interviewer. In general, it started conversations about what various programs (where I too had interviewed, or had friends who had been fellows/faculty) were like in comparison to my program.

Don't get hung up on it. It's not "illegal" (either under NRMP or EEOC). Relax.
 
One of the interviewers responded to my thank you note that everybody on my interview thought quite highly of me. I know that other candidates are highly qualified as well. Can I trust those favorable words or should I still have my mentor call on my behalf to support my application? Thank you
 
amg, external - University of Nevada, Las Vegas

AMG
7/19 - Baylor College of Medicine, Houston
7/21 - UMass
7/21 - WVU
7/21 - Stony Brook
7/21 - Yale University/Yale-New Haven
7/25, 8/3 - U of Kentucky
7/25 - Atlantic Health System (Morristown)
7/25, 8/15 - U at Buffalo
7/26 - Albany Medical College
7/27 - OHSU
7/28 - Hawaii
7/29 - Cedars-Sinai
7/ ? - Kaiser SF
8/1 - GW
8/1 - Duke
8/1 - University of Utah
8/1, 8/3 - University of Nebraska
8/1, 8/10 - Baylor Dallas
8/2, 8/4 - UVA
8/2 - Brown
8/2 - Loyola
8/2 - Rochester
8/3 - MCW
8/3 - UCSF
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4, 8/19, 8/22 - UPMC
8/4 - WashU/B-JH/SLCH
8/4 - Columbia-NYP
8/4, 8/16 - U of Maryland
8/4 - U of Arizona-Phoenix Banner
8/5 - Henry Ford
8/5 - Hopkins
8/5, 8/12, 9/2? - Michigan
8/5 - UT Southwestern
8/8 - BWH
8/8, 8/25 - UTHSC-Memphis
8/8 - Indiana U
8/8, 8/15 - UF Jacksonville
8/8 - VA Tech (Carilion)
8/8, 8/18 - Scripps
8/9, 8/11, 8/17 - Cleveland Clinic Ohio
8/9 - Case Western Reserve University/University Hospitals
8/9 - Georgetown
8/9 - University of Miami/JFK Palm Beach
8/9 - Mayo Clinic - Rochester
8/9 - Penn State
8/10, 8/22 - UCSD
8/11 - University of North Carolina - Chapel Hill
8/12 - University of Vermont
8/12 - Dartmouth
8/12 - Cornell
8/12 - Hennepin County/Abbott Northwestern - Minneapolis
8/13 - Winthrop
8/15 - UTHSC - San Antonio
8/15 - Emory
8/15 - RWJMS
8/15 - Virginia Commonwealth University
8/16 - Tufts
8/16, 8/18 - University of Tennessee - Chattanooga
8/16 - University of Minnesota
8/16 - University of Oklahoma
8/16, 8/18 - University of Arizona
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/16 - NYU
8/16 - BCM/Texas Heart/St. Luke's
8/16 - Hofstra
8/17 - BMC
8/17, 8/18 - SLU
8/17, 8/19 - BIDMC
8/17 - Thomas Jefferson
8/17 - Texas A&M (Scott & White)
8/17 - University of Mississippi
8/17 - Colorado/UC Denver
8/18 - California Pacific Medical Center, San Francisco
8/18 - University of Florida (Gainesville)
8/19 - Palmetto Health/University of South Carolina
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19, 8/26 - Ohio State University
8/19 - MGH
8/19 - Montefiore
8/19 - Mt. Sinai NY (Academic Track)
8/19 - University of Louisville
8/19 - Creighton University
8/22 - St. Vincent's Indianapolis
8/22 - Albany Medical Center
8/22 (internal), 8/24 - U Chicago
8/22, 8/31 - UCLA
8/22 - Ochsner
8/22 - USF
8/22 - Aurora Health Care
8/22 - Wake Forest
8/23 - UCincinnati
8/23 - UToledo
8/24 - Mercy St. Vincent
8/24 - Metro Health (Case)
8/24 - Stanford
8/25, 8/26 - Vanderbilt
8/25 - Cooper University
8/25 - UC Irvine
8/26 - UC Davis
8/26, 9/2 - Jackson Memorial - Miami
8/26 - Beaumont
8/29 - MUSC
8/31 - Kansas
8/31, 9/1 - Northwestern
9/1 - UIC
9/1 - U South Carolina (Palmetto)
9/1 - Tulane
9/2 - UPenn
9/6 - UAB
9/6 - Rush
9/7 - Marshall University
9/7 - Cristiana Care
9/8 - Rutgers University
9/9 - Mizzou - Columbia
9/9 - Temple
9/14 - Uni of TN - Knoxville
9/15 - UTMB
9/27 - University of Nevada, Las Vegas
? - Kaiser LA

DO
8/1 - Nassau University Medical Center
8/8 - UF Jacksonville
8/16 - Hofstra
8/18 - Broward General Hospital
8/22 - Coney Island Hospital

IMG w/o visa required
7/18 - OHSU
7/19 - Yale
7/25 - University of Buffalo
7/28 - Atlantic Health System (Morristown)
/7/29 - Geisinger
8/2 - Loyola
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4 - Texas Tech El Paso
8/5 - Henry Ford
8/9 - University of Wisconsin
8/12 - NYMC
8/12 - University of Tennessee
8/12 - University of Nebraska
8/15 - University of Chicago (Northshore)
8/16 - Summa Health Ohio
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/17 - University of Arizona
8/17 - Boston University/BMC
8/18 - St. John Hospital, Detroit
8/22 - Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai (Academic Track)
8/23 - Cleveland Clinic Florida
8/23 - LSU New Orleans
8/23 - Medical College of Georgia
8/25 - University of Illinois at Peoria
8/26 - Albany Medical College
8/26 - Stony Brook University
8/29 - University of Louisville
8/29 - Lenox Hill Hospital
8/30 - University of Cincinnati
8/30 - UAMS
8/30, 9/15 - University of Texas Medical Branch at Galveston
8/30 - UTHSC-Memphis (only one date 9/16)
8/31 - University of Kansas (KUMC)
9/2 - University of Missouri - Columbia
9/2 - University of Miami/Jackson Memorial Hospital
9/6 - UAB
9/9 - Henry Ford
9/9 - University of Missouri - Kansas City/MAHI
9/9 - Temple University
9/12 - Lehigh Valley
9/14 - University of Tennessee Knoxville
9/16 - Beth Israel, Newark, NJ
9/19 - SUNY Upstate
9/20 - Mt. Sinai (FL)
9/20 - University of Miami/ JFK Regional

IMG requiring visa
7/25 - U at Buffalo
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4 - UPMC
8/4 - Geisinger
8/9 - Georgetown/WHC
8/10 - Mayo Clinic - Rochester
8/11 - University of Kentucky
8/11 - University of Nebraska
8/12 - University of Utah
8/15 - Virginia Commonwealth University
8/15 - University of Connecticut
8/16 - University of Minnesota
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/17 - University of Colorado, Denver
8/18 - St. John Hospital, Detroit
8/18 - University of Rochester
8/19 - Creighton University
8/19 - Saint Louis University
8/19 - Mount Sinai Icahn School of Medicine
8/19 - Ohio State University
8/19 - New York Medical College / Westchester Medical Center
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19 - Loma Linda University
8/22 - Allegheny General Hospital
8/23 - Cleveland Clinic Florida
8/25 - UTHSC-Memphis
8/26 - Mayo Clinic, Arizona
8/31 - University of Kansas (KUMC)
9/2 - Cook County
9/2 - Detroit Medical Center /Wayne State University
9/6 - Mayo Clinic, Florida
9/6 - Rush University Medical Center
9/6 - Hartford
9/6 - Montefiore
09/12-St Elizabeth Boston

Waitlisted
8/19 - U of Maryland (AMG, external)

Rejections
7/19, 8/9 - WashU/B-JH/SLCH
8/4 - Columbia-NYP
8/5, 8/18, 9/2 - Michigan
8/9 - Georgetown
8/10 - Duke
8/15 - Mayo Rochester
8/17 - Brown
8/18 - Colorado/UC Denver
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19 - University of Maryland
8/19 - UCSD
8/19 - University of Massachusetts
8/19 - Saint Louis University
8/19 - New York Medical College
8/21 - U of New Mexico
8/22, 8/24 - UChicago
8/23 - Indiana University
8/23 - University of Florida (Gainesville)
8/23, 9/6 - MGH
8/23 - Hopkins
8/23, 9/26 - UTSW
8/24 - Thomas Jefferson
8/25 - Cooper University
8/25,09/20 - University of Connecticut
8/29 - William Beaumont Hospital
8/29 - University of Utah
8/29 - Boston University
8/29 - Creighton University
8/30 - University of South Florida
8/31 - Texas A&M College of Medicine-Scott and White
8/31 - University of Arkansas
8/31 - Ohio State
8/31 - UCLA
9/1 - Vanderbilt
9/1 - University of Minnesota
9/1, 9/2 - University of Illinois Chicago
9/2 - Hennepin County
9/2 - Kansas University Medical Center
9/2, 9/6 - University of Kentucky
9/3 - BIDMC
9/4 - Palmetto Health/University of South Carolina School of Medicine
9/6 - Cook County
9/6 - Scripps
9/9 - Geisinger
9/10 - Mayo Clinic - Arizona
9/12 - Emory
9/16 - Univ of Wisconsin
9/16 - Vidant, NC,
9/16 - LSU, New Orleans
9/16 - Tulane
9/19 - Cook County
9/19 - Kettering Health,Ohio
9/19 - NY Methodist
9/20 - Cleveland Clinic
9/20 - Univ of Louisville
 
One of the interviewers responded to my thank you note that everybody on my interview thought quite highly of me. I know that other candidates are highly qualified as well. Can I trust those favorable words or should I still have my mentor call on my behalf to support my application? Thank you
if u have reasonable idea when the rank order meeting in that program is, ask your mentor to call for you couple days before that. If you dont know, just have him call for you sooner.

Regardless, make phone calls. It is solicitation. If they are already impressed well and good. u want to stamp the authority and reinforce that u are the best fit for the spot.

Here is the catch. U have to be honest with your mentor about where u are ranking that program. If u say to him u are ranking number 1, u ideally SHOULD rank it at number 1. More than you, your mentor's pride is at stake. Lying that you are ranking program X as number 1 and instead ranking Y and matching in program Y. Program X will know that u lied if they ranked u in top 2. Your mentor's name and reputation will be affected. So make up your mind about rank order and proceed about requesting mentors to make calls.
 
You're way over-thinking this...and I can't believe you never got asked it during residency interviews.

It's mostly a point of conversation as well as to try and gauge where you think you are in the competitive hierarchy of the specialty. At least, that's what I used it for as an interviewer. In general, it started conversations about what various programs (where I too had interviewed, or had friends who had been fellows/faculty) were like in comparison to my program.

Don't get hung up on it. It's not "illegal" (either under NRMP or EEOC). Relax.

OK I would like to clear this up once and for all because this is starting to piss me off.

Based on my experience, No it is not as chill for the applicants as you are trying to portray it. And NO this question is NOT "innocently" asked by the great majority of interviewers. It is usually asked by people who feel insecure about their program and are worried that they won't be ranked high enough and won't fill. If an applicant discloses how competitive he/she is, most likely it will affect him negatively.

Now let me make this clear: IT IS AN NRMP VIOLATION TO ASK THIS QUESTION !!!!

This is copied directly from the NRMP's document entitled

Professionalism and The Match: Important Considerations

Under:

Consequences of Engaging in Unprofessional Behavior Failure to comply with all the terms and conditions of the Agreement, whether intentionally or not, may result in an investigation and the imposition of penalties.the violations most commonly reported to the NRMP include:


"..... 2. A program director asks an applicant where else the applicant has applied or interviewed. Although applicants may volunteer information about their other applications and interviews, it is a violation of the Agreement if a program director requests that information. Similarly, applicants and program directors may volunteer how they intend to rank each other, but it is a violation of the Agreement for either party to request that information .... "

This is the link to the full document http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Policies.Statement-on-Professionalism.docx.pdf


I honestly feel that my rights as an applicant are violated when I'm asked this question, and honestly I would encourage reporting violations because this F'ed up practice needs to end. It still occurs because they are getting away with it. It is none of their business where we are interviewing, they already have the upper hand in the interview but they want more control by asking this question.
 
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Has anyone interviewed at UTMB, Galveston? Would like to know how long does the interview day last ? ( what time do they start and what time does it get over usually )
 
IMG w/o Visa
9/15- St. Vincent (Worcester, MA)
9/27- Drexel

AMG

7/19 - Baylor College of Medicine, Houston
7/21 - UMass
7/21 - WVU
7/21 - Stony Brook
7/21 - Yale University/Yale-New Haven
7/25, 8/3 - U of Kentucky
7/25 - Atlantic Health System (Morristown)
7/25, 8/15 - U at Buffalo
7/26 - Albany Medical College
7/27 - OHSU
7/28 - Hawaii
7/29 - Cedars-Sinai
7/ ? - Kaiser SF
8/1 - GW
8/1 - Duke
8/1 - University of Utah
8/1, 8/3 - University of Nebraska
8/1, 8/10 - Baylor Dallas
8/2, 8/4 - UVA
8/2 - Brown
8/2 - Loyola
8/2 - Rochester
8/3 - MCW
8/3 - UCSF
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4, 8/19, 8/22 - UPMC
8/4 - WashU/B-JH/SLCH
8/4 - Columbia-NYP
8/4, 8/16 - U of Maryland
8/4 - U of Arizona-Phoenix Banner
8/5 - Henry Ford
8/5 - Hopkins
8/5, 8/12, 9/2? - Michigan
8/5 - UT Southwestern
8/8 - BWH
8/8, 8/25 - UTHSC-Memphis
8/8 - Indiana U
8/8, 8/15 - UF Jacksonville
8/8 - VA Tech (Carilion)
8/8, 8/18 - Scripps
8/9, 8/11, 8/17 - Cleveland Clinic Ohio
8/9 - Case Western Reserve University/University Hospitals
8/9 - Georgetown
8/9 - University of Miami/JFK Palm Beach
8/9 - Mayo Clinic - Rochester
8/9 - Penn State
8/10, 8/22 - UCSD
8/11 - University of North Carolina - Chapel Hill
8/12 - University of Vermont
8/12 - Dartmouth
8/12 - Cornell
8/12 - Hennepin County/Abbott Northwestern - Minneapolis
8/13 - Winthrop
8/15 - UTHSC - San Antonio
8/15 - Emory
8/15 - RWJMS
8/15 - Virginia Commonwealth University
8/16 - Tufts
8/16, 8/18 - University of Tennessee - Chattanooga
8/16 - University of Minnesota
8/16 - University of Oklahoma
8/16, 8/18 - University of Arizona
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/16 - NYU
8/16 - BCM/Texas Heart/St. Luke's
8/16 - Hofstra
8/17 - BMC
8/17, 8/18 - SLU
8/17, 8/19 - BIDMC
8/17 - Thomas Jefferson
8/17 - Texas A&M (Scott & White)
8/17 - University of Mississippi
8/17 - Colorado/UC Denver
8/18 - California Pacific Medical Center, San Francisco
8/18 - University of Florida (Gainesville)
8/19 - Palmetto Health/University of South Carolina
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19, 8/26 - Ohio State University
8/19 - MGH
8/19 - Montefiore
8/19 - Mt. Sinai NY (Academic Track)
8/19 - University of Louisville
8/19 - Creighton University
8/22 - St. Vincent's Indianapolis
8/22 - Albany Medical Center
8/22 (internal), 8/24 - U Chicago
8/22, 8/31 - UCLA
8/22 - Ochsner
8/22 - USF
8/22 - Aurora Health Care
8/22 - Wake Forest
8/23 - UCincinnati
8/23 - UToledo
8/24 - Mercy St. Vincent
8/24 - Metro Health (Case)
8/24 - Stanford
8/25, 8/26 - Vanderbilt
8/25 - Cooper University
8/25 - UC Irvine
8/26 - UC Davis
8/26, 9/2 - Jackson Memorial - Miami
8/26 - Beaumont
8/29 - MUSC
8/31 - Kansas
8/31, 9/1 - Northwestern
9/1 - UIC
9/1 - U South Carolina (Palmetto)
9/1 - Tulane
9/2 - UPenn
9/6 - UAB
9/6 - Rush
9/7 - Marshall University
9/7 - Cristiana Care
9/8 - Rutgers University
9/9 - Mizzou - Columbia
9/9 - Temple
9/14 - Uni of TN - Knoxville
9/15 - UTMB
9/27 - University of Nevada, Las Vegas
? - Kaiser LA

DO
8/1 - Nassau University Medical Center
8/8 - UF Jacksonville
8/16 - Hofstra
8/18 - Broward General Hospital
8/22 - Coney Island Hospital

IMG w/o visa required
7/18 - OHSU
7/19 - Yale
7/25 - University of Buffalo
7/28 - Atlantic Health System (Morristown)
/7/29 - Geisinger
8/2 - Loyola
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4 - Texas Tech El Paso
8/5 - Henry Ford
8/9 - University of Wisconsin
8/12 - NYMC
8/12 - University of Tennessee
8/12 - University of Nebraska
8/15 - University of Chicago (Northshore)
8/16 - Summa Health Ohio
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/17 - University of Arizona
8/17 - Boston University/BMC
8/18 - St. John Hospital, Detroit
8/22 - Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai (Academic Track)
8/23 - Cleveland Clinic Florida
8/23 - LSU New Orleans
8/23 - Medical College of Georgia
8/25 - University of Illinois at Peoria
8/26 - Albany Medical College
8/26 - Stony Brook University
8/29 - University of Louisville
8/29 - Lenox Hill Hospital
8/30 - University of Cincinnati
8/30 - UAMS
8/30, 9/15 - University of Texas Medical Branch at Galveston
8/30 - UTHSC-Memphis (only one date 9/16)
8/31 - University of Kansas (KUMC)
9/2 - University of Missouri - Columbia
9/2 - University of Miami/Jackson Memorial Hospital
9/6 - UAB
9/9 - Henry Ford
9/9 - University of Missouri - Kansas City/MAHI
9/9 - Temple University
9/12 - Lehigh Valley
9/14 - University of Tennessee Knoxville
9/15 - St. Vincent (Worcester, MA)
9/16 - Beth Israel, Newark, NJ
9/19 - SUNY Upstate
9/20 - Mt. Sinai (FL)
9/20 - University of Miami/ JFK Regional
9/27 - Drexel

IMG requiring visa
7/25 - U at Buffalo
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4 - UPMC
8/4 - Geisinger
8/9 - Georgetown/WHC
8/10 - Mayo Clinic - Rochester
8/11 - University of Kentucky
8/11 - University of Nebraska
8/12 - University of Utah
8/15 - Virginia Commonwealth University
8/15 - University of Connecticut
8/16 - University of Minnesota
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/17 - University of Colorado, Denver
8/18 - St. John Hospital, Detroit
8/18 - University of Rochester
8/19 - Creighton University
8/19 - Saint Louis University
8/19 - Mount Sinai Icahn School of Medicine
8/19 - Ohio State University
8/19 - New York Medical College / Westchester Medical Center
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19 - Loma Linda University
8/22 - Allegheny General Hospital
8/23 - Cleveland Clinic Florida
8/25 - UTHSC-Memphis
8/26 - Mayo Clinic, Arizona
8/31 - University of Kansas (KUMC)
9/2 - Cook County
9/2 - Detroit Medical Center /Wayne State University
9/6 - Mayo Clinic, Florida
9/6 - Rush University Medical Center
9/6 - Hartford
9/6 - Montefiore
09/12-St Elizabeth Boston

Waitlisted
8/19 - U of Maryland (AMG, external)

Rejections
7/19, 8/9 - WashU/B-JH/SLCH
8/4 - Columbia-NYP
8/5, 8/18, 9/2 - Michigan
8/9 - Georgetown
8/10 - Duke
8/15 - Mayo Rochester
8/17 - Brown
8/18 - Colorado/UC Denver
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19 - University of Maryland
8/19 - UCSD
8/19 - University of Massachusetts
8/19 - Saint Louis University
8/19 - New York Medical College
8/21 - U of New Mexico
8/22, 8/24 - UChicago
8/23 - Indiana University
8/23 - University of Florida (Gainesville)
8/23, 9/6 - MGH
8/23 - Hopkins
8/23, 9/26 - UTSW
8/24 - Thomas Jefferson
8/25 - Cooper University
8/25,09/20 - University of Connecticut
8/29 - William Beaumont Hospital
8/29 - University of Utah
8/29 - Boston University
8/29 - Creighton University
8/30 - University of South Florida
8/31 - Texas A&M College of Medicine-Scott and White
8/31 - University of Arkansas
8/31 - Ohio State
8/31 - UCLA
9/1 - Vanderbilt
9/1 - University of Minnesota
9/1, 9/2 - University of Illinois Chicago
9/2 - Hennepin County
9/2 - Kansas University Medical Center
9/2, 9/6 - University of Kentucky
9/3 - BIDMC
9/4 - Palmetto Health/University of South Carolina School of Medicine
9/6 - Cook County
9/6 - Scripps
9/9 - Geisinger
9/10 - Mayo Clinic - Arizona
9/12 - Emory
9/16 - Univ of Wisconsin
9/16 - Vidant, NC,
9/16 - LSU, New Orleans
9/16 - Tulane
9/19 - Cook County
9/19 - Kettering Health,Ohio
9/19 - NY Methodist
9/20 - Cleveland Clinic
9/20 - Univ of Louisville
 
OK I would like to clear this up once and for all because this is starting to piss me off.

Now let me make this clear: IT IS AN NRMP VIOLATION TO ASK THIS QUESTION !!!!

Rice ... This is only advice ... This is fellowship ... cardiology fellowship ... No longer a med student or resident. Everyone is an adult including yourself now. The people you meet are your future colleagues and who you may be asking for jobs long term ... Who you will be asking to fill out forms for hospital privileges. Asking where your interviewing is probably the least unjust thing that will happen to you IF you match ... Fine go up and point out the letter of the nrmp agreement or complain if you work 81 hours or see 30, 40 or 50 patients ... I doubt it will get you very far in cards no matter what your scores or research .... That was residency ... All I'm saying is Be cautious not to be labeled as a "problem."

Cardiology isn't for everyone and has a distinct culture of hard work ... there won't be any nrmp agreement when you look for jobs and that employer is going to call your PD. Everyone knows everyone for the most part ... Especially locally. In the long run getting along is very important.

I would advise anyone applying to cards fellowship treat this differently than residency ... Because relationships have significant long term consequences.​
 
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OK I would like to clear this up once and for all because this is starting to piss me off.

Based on my experience, No it is not as chill for the applicants as you are trying to portray it. And NO this question is NOT "innocently" asked by the great majority of interviewers. It is usually asked by people who feel insecure about their program and are worried that they won't be ranked high enough and won't fill. If an applicant discloses how competitive he/she is, most likely it will affect him negatively.

Now let me make this clear: IT IS AN NRMP VIOLATION TO ASK THIS QUESTION !!!!

This is copied directly from the NRMP's document entitled

Professionalism and The Match: Important Considerations

Under:

Consequences of Engaging in Unprofessional Behavior Failure to comply with all the terms and conditions of the Agreement, whether intentionally or not, may result in an investigation and the imposition of penalties.the violations most commonly reported to the NRMP include:


"..... 2. A program director asks an applicant where else the applicant has applied or interviewed. Although applicants may volunteer information about their other applications and interviews, it is a violation of the Agreement if a program director requests that information. Similarly, applicants and program directors may volunteer how they intend to rank each other, but it is a violation of the Agreement for either party to request that information .... "

This is the link to the full document http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Policies.Statement-on-Professionalism.docx.pdf


I honestly feel that my rights as an applicant are violated when I'm asked this question, and honestly I would encourage reporting violations because this F'ed up practice needs to end. It still occurs because they are getting away with it. It is none of their business where we are interviewing, they already have the upper hand in the interview but they want more control by asking this question.

Truth! Even news reporters know not to ask a question more than thrice if the person is not responding. If you give a vague answer to these folks they are tenacious until they get the answer they want.
 
Hi all,
Thanks in advance for your help. Does anyone have any input on the following programs:
-OHSU
-UT Southwestern
How would you rank them and why? Thanks again!
 
baystate

AMG

7/19 - Baylor College of Medicine, Houston
7/21 - UMass
7/21 - WVU
7/21 - Stony Brook
7/21 - Yale University/Yale-New Haven
7/25, 8/3 - U of Kentucky
7/25 - Atlantic Health System (Morristown)
7/25, 8/15 - U at Buffalo
7/26 - Albany Medical College
7/27 - OHSU
7/28 - Hawaii
7/29 - Cedars-Sinai
7/ ? - Kaiser SF
8/1 - GW
8/1 - Duke
8/1 - University of Utah
8/1, 8/3 - University of Nebraska
8/1, 8/10 - Baylor Dallas
8/2, 8/4 - UVA
8/2 - Brown
8/2 - Loyola
8/2 - Rochester
8/3 - MCW
8/3 - UCSF
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4, 8/19, 8/22 - UPMC
8/4 - WashU/B-JH/SLCH
8/4 - Columbia-NYP
8/4, 8/16 - U of Maryland
8/4 - U of Arizona-Phoenix Banner
8/5 - Henry Ford
8/5 - Hopkins
8/5, 8/12, 9/2? - Michigan
8/5 - UT Southwestern
8/8 - BWH
8/8, 8/25 - UTHSC-Memphis
8/8 - Indiana U
8/8, 8/15 - UF Jacksonville
8/8 - VA Tech (Carilion)
8/8, 8/18 - Scripps
8/9, 8/11, 8/17 - Cleveland Clinic Ohio
8/9 - Case Western Reserve University/University Hospitals
8/9 - Georgetown
8/9 - University of Miami/JFK Palm Beach
8/9 - Mayo Clinic - Rochester
8/9 - Penn State
8/10, 8/22 - UCSD
8/11 - University of North Carolina - Chapel Hill
8/12 - University of Vermont
8/12 - Dartmouth
8/12 - Cornell
8/12 - Hennepin County/Abbott Northwestern - Minneapolis
8/13 - Winthrop
8/15 - UTHSC - San Antonio
8/15 - Emory
8/15 - RWJMS
8/15 - Virginia Commonwealth University
8/16 - Tufts
8/16, 8/18 - University of Tennessee - Chattanooga
8/16 - University of Minnesota
8/16 - University of Oklahoma
8/16, 8/18 - University of Arizona
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/16 - NYU
8/16 - BCM/Texas Heart/St. Luke's
8/16 - Hofstra
8/17 - BMC
8/17, 8/18 - SLU
8/17, 8/19 - BIDMC
8/17 - Thomas Jefferson
8/17 - Texas A&M (Scott & White)
8/17 - University of Mississippi
8/17 - Colorado/UC Denver
8/18 - California Pacific Medical Center, San Francisco
8/18 - University of Florida (Gainesville)
8/19 - Palmetto Health/University of South Carolina
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19, 8/26 - Ohio State University
8/19 - MGH
8/19 - Montefiore
8/19 - Mt. Sinai NY (Academic Track)
8/19 - University of Louisville
8/19 - Creighton University
8/22 - St. Vincent's Indianapolis
8/22 - Albany Medical Center
8/22 (internal), 8/24 - U Chicago
8/22, 8/31 - UCLA
8/22 - Ochsner
8/22 - USF
8/22 - Aurora Health Care
8/22 - Wake Forest
8/23 - UCincinnati
8/23 - UToledo
8/24 - Mercy St. Vincent
8/24 - Metro Health (Case)
8/24 - Stanford
8/25, 8/26 - Vanderbilt
8/25 - Cooper University
8/25 - UC Irvine
8/26 - UC Davis
8/26, 9/2 - Jackson Memorial - Miami
8/26 - Beaumont
8/29 - MUSC
8/31 - Kansas
8/31, 9/1 - Northwestern
9/1 - UIC
9/1 - U South Carolina (Palmetto)
9/1 - Tulane
9/2 - UPenn
9/6 - UAB
9/6 - Rush
9/7 - Marshall University
9/7 - Cristiana Care
9/8 - Rutgers University
9/9 - Mizzou - Columbia
9/9 - Temple
9/14 - Uni of TN - Knoxville
9/15 - UTMB
9/27 - University of Nevada, Las Vegas
? - Kaiser LA

DO
8/1 - Nassau University Medical Center
8/8 - UF Jacksonville
8/16 - Hofstra
8/18 - Broward General Hospital
8/22 - Coney Island Hospital

IMG w/o visa required
7/18 - OHSU
7/19 - Yale
7/25 - University of Buffalo
7/28 - Atlantic Health System (Morristown)
/7/29 - Geisinger
8/2 - Loyola
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4 - Texas Tech El Paso
8/5 - Henry Ford
8/9 - University of Wisconsin
8/12 - NYMC
8/12 - University of Tennessee
8/12 - University of Nebraska
8/15 - University of Chicago (Northshore)
8/16 - Summa Health Ohio
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/17 - University of Arizona
8/17 - Boston University/BMC
8/18 - St. John Hospital, Detroit
8/22 - Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai (Academic Track)
8/23 - Cleveland Clinic Florida
8/23 - LSU New Orleans
8/23 - Medical College of Georgia
8/25 - University of Illinois at Peoria
8/26 - Albany Medical College
8/26 - Stony Brook University
8/29 - University of Louisville
8/29 - Lenox Hill Hospital
8/30 - University of Cincinnati
8/30 - UAMS
8/30, 9/15 - University of Texas Medical Branch at Galveston
8/30 - UTHSC-Memphis (only one date 9/16)
8/31 - University of Kansas (KUMC)
9/2 - University of Missouri - Columbia
9/2 - University of Miami/Jackson Memorial Hospital
9/6 - UAB
9/9 - Henry Ford
9/9 - University of Missouri - Kansas City/MAHI
9/9 - Temple University
9/12 - Lehigh Valley
9/14 - University of Tennessee Knoxville
9/15 - St. Vincent (Worcester, MA)
9/16 - Beth Israel, Newark, NJ
9/19 - SUNY Upstate
9/20 - Mt. Sinai (FL)
9/20 - University of Miami/ JFK Regional
9/27 - Drexel
9/28 - Baystate

IMG requiring visa
7/25 - U at Buffalo
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4 - UPMC
8/4 - Geisinger
8/9 - Georgetown/WHC
8/10 - Mayo Clinic - Rochester
8/11 - University of Kentucky
8/11 - University of Nebraska
8/12 - University of Utah
8/15 - Virginia Commonwealth University
8/15 - University of Connecticut
8/16 - University of Minnesota
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/17 - University of Colorado, Denver
8/18 - St. John Hospital, Detroit
8/18 - University of Rochester
8/19 - Creighton University
8/19 - Saint Louis University
8/19 - Mount Sinai Icahn School of Medicine
8/19 - Ohio State University
8/19 - New York Medical College / Westchester Medical Center
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19 - Loma Linda University
8/22 - Allegheny General Hospital
8/23 - Cleveland Clinic Florida
8/25 - UTHSC-Memphis
8/26 - Mayo Clinic, Arizona
8/31 - University of Kansas (KUMC)
9/2 - Cook County
9/2 - Detroit Medical Center /Wayne State University
9/6 - Mayo Clinic, Florida
9/6 - Rush University Medical Center
9/6 - Hartford
9/6 - Montefiore
09/12-St Elizabeth Boston

Waitlisted
8/19 - U of Maryland (AMG, external)

Rejections
7/19, 8/9 - WashU/B-JH/SLCH
8/4 - Columbia-NYP
8/5, 8/18, 9/2 - Michigan
8/9 - Georgetown
8/10 - Duke
8/15 - Mayo Rochester
8/17 - Brown
8/18 - Colorado/UC Denver
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19 - University of Maryland
8/19 - UCSD
8/19 - University of Massachusetts
8/19 - Saint Louis University
8/19 - New York Medical College
8/21 - U of New Mexico
8/22, 8/24 - UChicago
8/23 - Indiana University
8/23 - University of Florida (Gainesville)
8/23, 9/6 - MGH
8/23 - Hopkins
8/23, 9/26 - UTSW
8/24 - Thomas Jefferson
8/25 - Cooper University
8/25,09/20 - University of Connecticut
8/29 - William Beaumont Hospital
8/29 - University of Utah
8/29 - Boston University
8/29 - Creighton University
8/30 - University of South Florida
8/31 - Texas A&M College of Medicine-Scott and White
8/31 - University of Arkansas
8/31 - Ohio State
8/31 - UCLA
9/1 - Vanderbilt
9/1 - University of Minnesota
9/1, 9/2 - University of Illinois Chicago
9/2 - Hennepin County
9/2 - Kansas University Medical Center
9/2, 9/6 - University of Kentucky
9/3 - BIDMC
9/4 - Palmetto Health/University of South Carolina School of Medicine
9/6 - Cook County
9/6 - Scripps
9/9 - Geisinger
9/10 - Mayo Clinic - Arizona
9/12 - Emory
9/16 - Univ of Wisconsin
9/16 - Vidant, NC,
9/16 - LSU, New Orleans
9/16 - Tulane
9/19 - Cook County
9/19 - Kettering Health,Ohio
9/19 - NY Methodist
9/20 - Cleveland Clinic
9/20 - Univ of Louisville
 
I just interviewed at a program and the guy mentioned these three things that concerned me as unprofessional

1. Are you married? Do you have any kids?

2. What other programs are you interviewing at?

3. I am going to be honest, I have not read your application!!!!

I think he needs some feedback on appropriate interview manners!
 
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Unfortunately, Doctors in general are poor interviewers! They have no skill or training in that aspect, some program do faculty development and teach them but which cardiologist have time to go for it and learn them no one told me honestly like your case, but I noticed many reading my cv during or just prior to interview and the worst group don't even care to read our cv


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
 
Unfortunately, Doctors in general are poor interviewers! They have no skill or training in that aspect, some program do faculty development and teach them but which cardiologist have time to go for it and learn them no one told me honestly like your case, but I noticed many reading my cv during or just prior to interview and the worst group don't even care to read our cv


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
Well, it varies from one program to another. I know for sure that asking a woman about her being married or having kids during an interview is inappropriate. I really wanted to tell the guy that but I just told him that I have the flexibility to be anywhere in the country. I hope NRMP would give us ways to give feedback on such matters.
 
Interview: St. Elizabeth (Boston) 9/28

AMG
7/19 - Baylor College of Medicine, Houston
7/21 - UMass
7/21 - WVU
7/21 - Stony Brook
7/21 - Yale University/Yale-New Haven
7/25, 8/3 - U of Kentucky
7/25 - Atlantic Health System (Morristown)
7/25, 8/15 - U at Buffalo
7/26 - Albany Medical College
7/27 - OHSU
7/28 - Hawaii
7/29 - Cedars-Sinai
7/ ? - Kaiser SF
8/1 - GW
8/1 - Duke
8/1 - University of Utah
8/1, 8/3 - University of Nebraska
8/1, 8/10 - Baylor Dallas
8/2, 8/4 - UVA
8/2 - Brown
8/2 - Loyola
8/2 - Rochester
8/3 - MCW
8/3 - UCSF
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4, 8/19, 8/22 - UPMC
8/4 - WashU/B-JH/SLCH
8/4 - Columbia-NYP
8/4, 8/16 - U of Maryland
8/4 - U of Arizona-Phoenix Banner
8/5 - Henry Ford
8/5 - Hopkins
8/5, 8/12, 9/2? - Michigan
8/5 - UT Southwestern
8/8 - BWH
8/8, 8/25 - UTHSC-Memphis
8/8 - Indiana U
8/8, 8/15 - UF Jacksonville
8/8 - VA Tech (Carilion)
8/8, 8/18 - Scripps
8/9, 8/11, 8/17 - Cleveland Clinic Ohio
8/9 - Case Western Reserve University/University Hospitals
8/9 - Georgetown
8/9 - University of Miami/JFK Palm Beach
8/9 - Mayo Clinic - Rochester
8/9 - Penn State
8/10, 8/22 - UCSD
8/11 - University of North Carolina - Chapel Hill
8/12 - University of Vermont
8/12 - Dartmouth
8/12 - Cornell
8/12 - Hennepin County/Abbott Northwestern - Minneapolis
8/13 - Winthrop
8/15 - UTHSC - San Antonio
8/15 - Emory
8/15 - RWJMS
8/15 - Virginia Commonwealth University
8/16 - Tufts
8/16, 8/18 - University of Tennessee - Chattanooga
8/16 - University of Minnesota
8/16 - University of Oklahoma
8/16, 8/18 - University of Arizona
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/16 - NYU
8/16 - BCM/Texas Heart/St. Luke's
8/16 - Hofstra
8/17 - BMC
8/17, 8/18 - SLU
8/17, 8/19 - BIDMC
8/17 - Thomas Jefferson
8/17 - Texas A&M (Scott & White)
8/17 - University of Mississippi
8/17 - Colorado/UC Denver
8/18 - California Pacific Medical Center, San Francisco
8/18 - University of Florida (Gainesville)
8/19 - Palmetto Health/University of South Carolina
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19, 8/26 - Ohio State University
8/19 - MGH
8/19 - Montefiore
8/19 - Mt. Sinai NY (Academic Track)
8/19 - University of Louisville
8/19 - Creighton University
8/22 - St. Vincent's Indianapolis
8/22 - Albany Medical Center
8/22 (internal), 8/24 - U Chicago
8/22, 8/31 - UCLA
8/22 - Ochsner
8/22 - USF
8/22 - Aurora Health Care
8/22 - Wake Forest
8/23 - UCincinnati
8/23 - UToledo
8/24 - Mercy St. Vincent
8/24 - Metro Health (Case)
8/24 - Stanford
8/25, 8/26 - Vanderbilt
8/25 - Cooper University
8/25 - UC Irvine
8/26 - UC Davis
8/26, 9/2 - Jackson Memorial - Miami
8/26 - Beaumont
8/29 - MUSC
8/31 - Kansas
8/31, 9/1 - Northwestern
9/1 - UIC
9/1 - U South Carolina (Palmetto)
9/1 - Tulane
9/2 - UPenn
9/6 - UAB
9/6 - Rush
9/7 - Marshall University
9/7 - Cristiana Care
9/8 - Rutgers University
9/9 - Mizzou - Columbia
9/9 - Temple
9/14 - Uni of TN - Knoxville
9/15 - UTMB
9/27 - University of Nevada, Las Vegas
? - Kaiser LA

DO
8/1 - Nassau University Medical Center
8/8 - UF Jacksonville
8/16 - Hofstra
8/18 - Broward General Hospital
8/22 - Coney Island Hospital

IMG w/o visa required
7/18 - OHSU
7/19 - Yale
7/25 - University of Buffalo
7/28 - Atlantic Health System (Morristown)
/7/29 - Geisinger
8/2 - Loyola
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4 - Texas Tech El Paso
8/5 - Henry Ford
8/9 - University of Wisconsin
8/12 - NYMC
8/12 - University of Tennessee
8/12 - University of Nebraska
8/15 - University of Chicago (Northshore)
8/16 - Summa Health Ohio
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/17 - University of Arizona
8/17 - Boston University/BMC
8/18 - St. John Hospital, Detroit
8/22 - Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai (Academic Track)
8/23 - Cleveland Clinic Florida
8/23 - LSU New Orleans
8/23 - Medical College of Georgia
8/25 - University of Illinois at Peoria
8/26 - Albany Medical College
8/26 - Stony Brook University
8/29 - University of Louisville
8/29 - Lenox Hill Hospital
8/30 - University of Cincinnati
8/30 - UAMS
8/30, 9/15 - University of Texas Medical Branch at Galveston
8/30 - UTHSC-Memphis (only one date 9/16)
8/31 - University of Kansas (KUMC)
9/2 - University of Missouri - Columbia
9/2 - University of Miami/Jackson Memorial Hospital
9/6 - UAB
9/9 - Henry Ford
9/9 - University of Missouri - Kansas City/MAHI
9/9 - Temple University
9/12 - Lehigh Valley
9/14 - University of Tennessee Knoxville
9/15 - St. Vincent (Worcester, MA)
9/16 - Beth Israel, Newark, NJ
9/19 - SUNY Upstate
9/20 - Mt. Sinai (FL)
9/20 - University of Miami/ JFK Regional
9/27 - Drexel
9/28 - Baystate
9/28 - St. Elizabeth (Boston)

IMG requiring visa

7/25 - U at Buffalo
8/3 - Grand Rapids
8/4 - UPMC
8/4 - Geisinger
8/9 - Georgetown/WHC
8/10 - Mayo Clinic - Rochester
8/11 - University of Kentucky
8/11 - University of Nebraska
8/12 - University of Utah
8/15 - Virginia Commonwealth University
8/15 - University of Connecticut
8/16 - University of Minnesota
8/16 - University of Iowa
8/17 - University of Colorado, Denver
8/18 - St. John Hospital, Detroit
8/18 - University of Rochester
8/19 - Creighton University
8/19 - Saint Louis University
8/19 - Mount Sinai Icahn School of Medicine
8/19 - Ohio State University
8/19 - New York Medical College / Westchester Medical Center
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19 - Loma Linda University
8/22 - Allegheny General Hospital
8/23 - Cleveland Clinic Florida
8/25 - UTHSC-Memphis
8/26 - Mayo Clinic, Arizona
8/31 - University of Kansas (KUMC)
9/2 - Cook County
9/2 - Detroit Medical Center /Wayne State University
9/6 - Mayo Clinic, Florida
9/6 - Rush University Medical Center
9/6 - Hartford
9/6 - Montefiore
09/12-St Elizabeth Boston

Waitlisted
8/19 - U of Maryland (AMG, external)

Rejections
7/19, 8/9 - WashU/B-JH/SLCH
8/4 - Columbia-NYP
8/5, 8/18, 9/2 - Michigan
8/9 - Georgetown
8/10 - Duke
8/15 - Mayo Rochester
8/17 - Brown
8/18 - Colorado/UC Denver
8/19 - University of Washington
8/19 - University of Maryland
8/19 - UCSD
8/19 - University of Massachusetts
8/19 - Saint Louis University
8/19 - New York Medical College
8/21 - U of New Mexico
8/22, 8/24 - UChicago
8/23 - Indiana University
8/23 - University of Florida (Gainesville)
8/23, 9/6 - MGH
8/23 - Hopkins
8/23, 9/26 - UTSW
8/24 - Thomas Jefferson
8/25 - Cooper University
8/25,09/20 - University of Connecticut
8/29 - William Beaumont Hospital
8/29 - University of Utah
8/29 - Boston University
8/29 - Creighton University
8/30 - University of South Florida
8/31 - Texas A&M College of Medicine-Scott and White
8/31 - University of Arkansas
8/31 - Ohio State
8/31 - UCLA
9/1 - Vanderbilt
9/1 - University of Minnesota
9/1, 9/2 - University of Illinois Chicago
9/2 - Hennepin County
9/2 - Kansas University Medical Center
9/2, 9/6 - University of Kentucky
9/3 - BIDMC
9/4 - Palmetto Health/University of South Carolina School of Medicine
9/6 - Cook County
9/6 - Scripps
9/9 - Geisinger
9/10 - Mayo Clinic - Arizona
9/12 - Emory
9/16 - Univ of Wisconsin
9/16 - Vidant, NC,
9/16 - LSU, New Orleans
9/16 - Tulane
9/19 - Cook County
9/19 - Kettering Health,Ohio
9/19 - NY Methodist
9/20 - Cleveland Clinic
9/20 - Univ of Louisville
 
Hi all,
Thanks in advance for your help. Does anyone have any input on the following programs:
-OHSU
-UT Southwestern
How would you rank them and why? Thanks again!
 
Today 3 (of 8) applicants didn't show up to the interview that I went to in Miami .. if you don't want to show up, please cancel your interview!
 
definition of a gunner- "i don't feel like going to this interview but because i'm a jerk i'll just not show up and not give others the opportunity either"

and i doubt all 3 had something unexpected happen...
 
I just interviewed at a program and the guy mentioned these three things that concerned me as unprofessional

1. Are you married? Do you have any kids?

2. What other programs are you interviewing at?

3. I am going to be honest, I have not read your application!!!!

I think he needs some feedback on appropriate interview manners!

Per my PD, NRMP sent an email to all PD's for fellowship matches which are active now to refrain from asking questions like you mentioned above and as well not to ask programs applied to in addition to rank order preferences. The communication went out to all PD's yesterday! I saw the communication and it quoted " Section 6.0 of the Match Participation Agreement".
I hope this will change the attitude and will see during the other half of my interviews. Hope this brings the closure!


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
 
I actually got asked the "what other programs are you interviewing at?" At almost half my interviews
 
Hello everyone, can some one let me know how should I rank these programs:

1. NYU
2. Boston University
3. Univ of Chicago
4. UPMC
5. Mayo Clinic
6. UMKC
7. WVU
8. Univ of Buffalo

Thanks so much.
 
definition of a gunner- "i don't feel like going to this interview but because i'm a jerk i'll just not show up and not give others the opportunity either"

and i doubt all 3 had something unexpected happen...

I don't know if people actually actively try to screw others over in that regard lol. But
Hello everyone, can some one let me know how should I rank these programs:

1. NYU
2. Boston University
3. Univ of Chicago
4. UPMC
5. Mayo Clinic
6. UMKC
7. WVU
8. Univ of Buffalo

Thanks so much.

Depends on lots of questions. Academic or clinical career focus? Location preference? Etc etc. you can PM if more questions and don't want to announce
 
I don't know if people actually actively try to screw others over in that regard lol. But


Depends on lots of questions. Academic or clinical career focus? Location preference? Etc etc. you can PM if more questions and don't want to announce

Mostly on research and academic reputation. Thanks so much.
 
Hello everyone, can some one let me know how should I rank these programs:

1. NYU
2. Boston University
3. Univ of Chicago
4. UPMC
5. Mayo Clinic
6. UMKC
7. WVU
8. Univ of Buffalo

Thanks so much.

I think you should rank Mayo and NYU as top 2 depending on personal and professional interests. U Chicago 3, UPMC 4, BU 5. The rest looks fine.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
 
Per my PD, NRMP sent an email to all PD's for fellowship matches which are active now to refrain from asking questions like you mentioned above and as well not to ask programs applied to in addition to rank order preferences. The communication went out to all PD's yesterday! I saw the communication and it quoted " Section 6.0 of the Match Participation Agreement".
I hope this will change the attitude and will see during the other half of my interviews. Hope this brings the closure!


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile
That is great to hear! I wonder what prompted them to do that. In fact I did call NRMP right after that interview on Wednesday and told them about this. They gave me their email address so that I put this into writing...I have not emailed them yet...
 
The issue was raised by many applicants who returned to their home base and reported to their faculty and IM PD's. Those PD's raised issue with NRMP president/CEO Mona M Signer and they received multiple emails from PD's all over the country. As mentioned above, email was sent to PD's of active fellowship programs now, but how much of that gets read or distributed to other interviewing faculty is unknown and still will be asked in future. Better be prepared to answer those questions without revealing much!


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Last edited:
Which one would you rank first and why?
St. Louis university vs Creighton university. I had SLU interview on 09/29 and Creighton on 09/30.
 
Hello everyone, can some one let me know how should I rank these programs:

1. NYU
2. Boston University
3. Univ of Chicago
4. UPMC
5. Mayo Clinic
6. UMKC
7. WVU
8. Univ of Buffalo

Thanks so much.

If interested in academics/imaging Mayo Roch, Univ of Chicago (Lang etc) and UPMC (Gorscan etc) are the best of the group.
For EP Mayo is the best of the group.
For interventional Mayo may not be that great as autonomy may be lacking. Wd look in to NYU, UPMC, and BU.
Overall the very strong programs on your list are Mayo, Univ of Chicago (ppl claim it is more academic that Northwestern, don't know about volumes, big underserved population, have lost faculty to other institutions), UPMC (high volume, UPMC is a monster, not sure how academic the program is) and NYU (has come up in a big way on the national scene in the last few years, would look in to how academic it is, Judith Hochman is there- wd see if she is still mentoring fellows in outcomes research if that is what you like).
BU is very strong in epidemiology with access to Framingham; overall should be a strong fellowship with big underserved population and good clinicians. On the national scene gets overshadowed by the big boston programs..

By UMKC do you mean Mid America?

overall you have quite a few top 30-35 programs on your list. Congratulations!
 
How would you guys recommend ranking the following programs? My goal is to become a strong clinical cardiologist by the end of fellowship.

Hofstra NS-LIJ
USF
NYMC
Drexel
UMass
UF Jacksonville
 
Anyone received inviation from:
SUNY Health Science Center at Brooklyn Program
Main Line Health System/Lankenau Medical Center Program
Wright Center for Graduate Medical Education Program
 
If interested in academics/imaging Mayo Roch, Univ of Chicago (Lang etc) and UPMC (Gorscan etc) are the best of the group.
For EP Mayo is the best of the group.
For interventional Mayo may not be that great as autonomy may be lacking. Wd look in to NYU, UPMC, and BU.
Overall the very strong programs on your list are Mayo, Univ of Chicago (ppl claim it is more academic that Northwestern, don't know about volumes, big underserved population, have lost faculty to other institutions), UPMC (high volume, UPMC is a monster, not sure how academic the program is) and NYU (has come up in a big way on the national scene in the last few years, would look in to how academic it is, Judith Hochman is there- wd see if she is still mentoring fellows in outcomes research if that is what you like).
BU is very strong in epidemiology with access to Framingham; overall should be a strong fellowship with big underserved population and good clinicians. On the national scene gets overshadowed by the big boston programs..

By UMKC do you mean Mid America?

overall you have quite a few top 30-35 programs on your list. Congratulations!

Thanks so much for your reply. Yes UMKC is St Luke's Mid America Heart Institute.
 
mid america is solid.. very strong cath training.. good clinical training.. the only downside is that it is in the midwest.. hence coastal blue bloods may not move there. May argue that clinical exposure would be stronger than academic powerhouses like Univ Chicago etc.
 
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