Osteopathic DO friendly Psychiatry Residency Programs

[kassy]

There are quite a few programs out there. Whatcha gonna do if you're a DO?
COMLEX? USMLE? USMLE-preferred? Well, hopefully this list will address all those issues.
--Last updated 9/21/2013--

Dual Boarded,

• JPS Hospital, Fort Worth, TX, 4/5 of their 1st year are DOs, MD match only
• Henry Ford Hospital, Detroit, MI, MD match only
• Michigan State University, both matches
• Nassau, NY - DOs can only go through the DO match
• Pine Rest Christian Mental Health Service --uncertain if they go through both matches

DO Match programs

• Michigan State University, both matches
• Larkin - also takes through MD match for separate positions
• PCGME, Palm Beach, FL
• Samaritan in Corvallis, OR
• UMDNJ-stratford in progress of dual boarding and of changing to NJ OPTI of some sort
• Largo

COMLEX-accepting
North-East

• UMDNJ-Piscataway
• Baystate Health
• NYMC-Westhester
• Berkshire Medical Center - DO "embracing"
• SUNY-upstate
• Hershey
• Vermont
• Beth Israel - 3 DOs
• SLR - 4 DOs, 2 in class of 2013, 2 in 2016
• Maimonides - 1 in the class of 2015 (first one known in a long while!!!)
• Maine Medical Center, Maine (Tufts associated community program)

South

• USC-Palmetto
• Univ of South FL
• Univ of FL-Jacksonville
• East Carolina University
• Medical College of Georgia
• U Kentucky - a couple
• U of Louisville - several
• Vanderbilt
• Wake Forest, North Carolina - several DOs
• UVA
• VCU
• East Tennessee
• Carillion
• WVU-Charleston
• Baylor

West

• Univ of Hawaii - several
• UCSF-Fresno
• University of Washington
• New Mexico
• OHSU, OR
• UCSD - couple DOs in PGY-1s

Mid-West

• KU-Wichita, several, many IMGs
• U of South Dakota, Sioux Falls, SD - several
• Advocate Lutheran General, Chicago, IL - several
• OUTHC, Oklahoma City, OK
• KU-Kansas City - heck yeah DO friendly
• U of Oklahoma, Tulsa, OK
• U of Louisville, KY
• Univ of South Alabama, Mobile, AL - several
• U of Indiana
• St. Mary Mercy, Detroit, MI, a DO in both their classes
• Univ of Illinois, Peoria, a DO in their first class
• Iowa - several
• Univ of Missouri-Columbia, MO
• Western Michigan
• Ohio State
• Mayo - several
• Southern Illinois University - a DO in med-psych
• Wayne State/DMC - several

COMLEX-with known minimum score

• Hennepin-Regions: 80 / 500, currently 3 residents are DOs
• Loyola, Chicago, IL: 210 or higher within 2 attempts on USMLE, several DOs (?)

Possibly DO friendly. Uncertain if they take Comlex. (that just means that they have taken a D.O. before)

• Medical College of Wisconsin
• University of Rochester
• Cincinnati
• Duke - USMLE mandatory
• Loma Linda - USMLE mandatory
• UCLA-SVF - USMLE mandatory
• Temple university hospital in Philly, a couple D.O. graduates
• NYU - one in at least the past 10 years
• Oregon - a few
• Bergen, NJ

no DO interviews nor matches known

• Columbia, NY - has taken D.O.s for fellowship positions
• Einstein, NY
• Mt Sinai, NY
• Cornell, NY

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Daedra22]

Did you want people to keep an updated list like the one they do in the interview invites thread?

OHSU and University of Washington both accept the COMLEX. I emailed UW about it specifically, and they said that they have no problem with students who take only the COMLEX (for whatever that's worth).

 

[kassy]

The good part of the interview invites thread is that whichever post is last should be the most reliable. The annoying thing is when people have the posts show up in the tree format instead of the linear, and then additions get lost.
For now, I would rather just have people post what they know and then I'll just update the top post. There's a limit to how many programs there are and variables, so I think it's feasible for now... =)


**updated

 

[digitlnoize]

The list of programs that accept COMLEX only, is extensive and includes almost every program out there. Ones I know for sure:

USF
MCG
USC-Palmetto
MUSC
ECU
Wake Forest
UVA
VCU
Carillion
WVU
Iowa
Indiana
SUNY-upstate
Mizzou
Vanderbilt
Vermont
Hershey
New Mexico
U Kentucky

And many, many others. That should be enough to get started. Literally, almost every program takes COMLEX in lieu of USMLE.

Also, do yourself a favor and organize it by State. Thanks. Great idea for an eventual sticky though, IMO.

 

[kassy]

thx *updated

 

[st2205]

USC Palmetto is actually east coast (South Carolina). Now if they'd just send me an interview invite.

 

[kassy]

thanks =) I had thought that it stood for Univ of Southern Cali.

 

[dlm13cwru]

Loyola University in Chicago is DO friendly. I'm a DO and was chief resident

 

[kassy]

do they take the comlex instead of the usmle?
any idea what would be a "210 or higher within 2 attempts on USMLE"?

 

[Daedra22]

OHSU is in Oregon, should be in the west. Speaking of Oregon, Samaritan in Corvallis, Oregon is a D.O. program that you can add to the AOA list.

 

[kassy]

thx. =) *updated

 

[OldPsychDoc]

I'm thinking kassy is a football fan.

 

[kassy]

Pac-10! well, i guess it's 12 now.

 

[OldPsychDoc]

Pac-10! well, i guess it's 12 now.

Big Ten can't count either.

 

[rgerwin]

BMC in the Berkshires definitely doesn't care if you have the USMLE, and we have enough DO's to translate your score. In total, I believe there are 4 of us out 16 or 17 residents. And I would like to think they are more than just DO-friendly or tolerant, but embracing.

 

[peppy]

Back when I was applying, Henry Ford only took DOs through the DO match even though they are dually accredited.
I don't know about the COMLEX in particular since I applied with teh USMLE, but I would definitely say Medical College of Wisconsin, University of Rochester, and Cincy are DO-friendly based on the number of DOs they accept (in fact I believe that the program director at Cincy is a DO!)

 

[Dharma]

Nowhere close to any of this actually being a concern for myself, but bumping out of interest.

Any programs just completely out of reach for a DO grad? I've heard NYC is a tough place to break through, at the larger institutions at least.

Good luck to all you folks on the interview trail!

 

[kassy]

I believe that Henry Ford as well as JPS are only going through the MD match now. JPS lost eliminated their DO match spot due to funding issues, so they are down to 4 residents in the MD match.

 

[Candida]

I'm sure this is a pretty dumb question but I find myself wondering this...

With a failed USMLE Step I and a Low COMLEX I .. should one even bother wasting the money to apply to ACGME programs?
(Assuming a significantly better/above average COMLEX II and no USMLE Step II)

 

[StressedMedStud]

What about programs such as nyu, columia, einstein, mt. sinai, cornell ?? they dont seem like they accept DO's or comlex.

Any opinions??

 

[kassy]

I think they prefer it?

 

[deleted452516]

What about programs such as nyu, columia, einstein, mt. sinai, cornell ?? they dont seem like they accept DO's or comlex.

I know of DOs who only took COMLEX and were interviewed at Beth Israel, SLR and Maimonides, but none that matched there.

 

[Dharma]

What about programs such as nyu, columia, einstein, mt. sinai, cornell ?? they dont seem like they accept DO's or comlex.

Any opinions??

I don't know much about this, but from what I've read, there is little to no chance landing a residency as a DO at these places (fellowships, different story). That said, if there's any chance, I'm assuming a USMLE would be in order.

 

[Darkskies]

I don't know much about this, but from what I've read, there is little to no chance landing a residency as a DO at these places (fellowships, different story). That said, if there's any chance, I'm assuming a USMLE would be in order.

I thought Mount Sinai and Einstein take DOs.. I might be wrong though..

 

[Dharma]

I thought Mount Sinai and Einstein take DOs.. I might be wrong though..

Mount Sinai looks like they haven't had since at least 2003, in fact most of their residents come from some pretty darn good med schools. I can't seem to find much info about Einstein-Montefiore, but the Bronx-Lebanon program at least mentions DOs, although there are none currently in the program. (Then again, I have seen DOs listed as MDs on a few different residency lists here and there). They may "consider" DOs but it sure doesn't look like any have broke through recently.

 

[kassy]

updated! thanks folks!

 

[kassy]

thanks to anonymous people out there for the updates!

 

[Psychiatrized]

I'm sure this is a pretty dumb question but I find myself wondering this...

With a failed USMLE Step I and a Low COMLEX I .. should one even bother wasting the money to apply to ACGME programs?
(Assuming a significantly better/above average COMLEX II and no USMLE Step II)

Many ACGME programs don't have a good grasp of the COMLEX scores so the improved COMLEX II probably won't count in your favor very much if at all. The fact that you took the USMLE and failed and didn't retake and pass won't look so good. I would retake the USMLE and pass if you want to get into an ACGME program. Then since you started the USMLE series it would look even better if you took Step II and passed (not as big of a deal if you hadn't failed the Step I once). A fail with no retake would be a red flag for me.

 

[vistaril]

Many ACGME programs don't have a good grasp of the COMLEX scores so the improved COMLEX II probably won't count in your favor very much if at all. The fact that you took the USMLE and failed and didn't retake and pass won't look so good. I would retake the USMLE and pass if you want to get into an ACGME program. Then since you started the USMLE series it would look even better if you took Step II and passed (not as big of a deal if you hadn't failed the Step I once). A fail with no retake would be a red flag for me.

I vehemently disagree with this....

seeing as how this person already failed step 1 once, they probably arent shooting for UCSF/Columbia/etc.

If the person is a strong DO applicant outside of the failed usmle, they are still in a decent position for most psychiatry residencies. If they apply broadly enough to mid-tier programs(I wouldnt apply to bad programs unless there are other red flags), they are still in great shape.

starting the usmle series is a big deal....that's a big money, time, and hassle expense. The person is already in good shape going forward with Comlex.

The main theme is that psych residencies are in need of american grads who speak good english and don't have felonies, and show some interest in psych. A USMLE fail, while not ideal, isn't a deal breaker for the non-elite programs.

 

[Psychiatrized]

I vehemently disagree with this....

seeing as how this person already failed step 1 once, they probably arent shooting for UCSF/Columbia/etc.

If the person is a strong DO applicant outside of the failed usmle, they are still in a decent position for most psychiatry residencies. If they apply broadly enough to mid-tier programs(I wouldnt apply to bad programs unless there are other red flags), they are still in great shape.

starting the usmle series is a big deal....that's a big money, time, and hassle expense. The person is already in good shape going forward with Comlex.

The main theme is that psych residencies are in need of american grads who speak good english and don't have felonies, and show some interest in psych. A USMLE fail, while not ideal, isn't a deal breaker for the non-elite programs.

Thanks for your viewpoint. I'm speaking from my experience interviewing candidates this year.

 

[vistaril]

Thanks for your viewpoint. I'm speaking from my experience interviewing candidates this year.

Excellent, I've also looked through applicants files, been on the interview committee, etc.....I'm speaking from reality, not some ideal.

 

[kassy]

Essentially to summarize [+ add] the replies,

1. Yes, you should try applying to plenty of ACGME programs.
2. That with the understanding that the fail doesn't look good and having no retake could be a red flag to some programs while other programs might not care. Also, you do not have to send your USMLE transcript to the programs you apply to, though you still have to pay for ERAS for the transcript [and they may be able to see that you have a USMLE transcript though they won't see what is on the transcript???] Note also that some programs require you to have no fails and other give you a max number of tries to pass a Step.
3. For programs that do not realize the obvious superiority of a DO degree and have no clue what to do with a COMLEX score, the improvement of score in part 2 may or may not be noticed. If you were to perform stupendously on USMLE step 2, it would probably impress the pants off of them.
4. If despite the low step/part 1 scores you are a decent applicant (which apparently is alive and breathing, English speaking, not a druggie, not a felon, and no visa issues), then you should be fine applying to plenty of ACGME programs. [Supposedly,] A DO school out there recommends their students to apply to 50 places. That seems to be on the excessive side from what I'm hearing from my buddies/classmates/competitors/nemesis. But hey, it can't hurt to apply to both the AOA and the ACGME places, then cancelling later when interviews roll in.
5. Apply to realistic places. None of that only applying to only the top 20 schools.
6. Summary of a summary: You may have shot yourself in the foot, but we really don't need feet in psychiatry...just ears.

 

[C O M 2014]

5. Apply to realistic places. None of that only applying to only the top 20 schools.

How do you determine what's top 20? What are the "mid-tiered" programs that we should be looking at?

 

[VMSmith]

"Top 20" refers to the most desired/competitive programs, not necessarily quality of training. In general, university programs in major cities in the Northeast and on the West Coast are considered "top 20 programs." These are name brand programs in "glamorous" locales.

So, "mid-tiered" would be either non-university programs in major cities in those locations, or university programs in non-major cities or major cities not in those locations.

 

[FLpk1girl86]

How do you determine what's top 20? What are the "mid-tiered" programs that we should be looking at?

is there a list or ranking somewhere that is recent

 

[FLpk1girl86]

I don't know much about this, but from what I've read, there is little to no chance landing a residency as a DO at these places (fellowships, different story). That said, if there's any chance, I'm assuming a USMLE would be in order.

this isn't true, there are many excellent DO candidates with high USMLE step scores who are landing interviews at those types of places. DO vs MS doesn't matter as much as scores, honors, academic achievements. how great a candidate is has little to do with what letters are behind their names and yes maybe not all PDs agree, yet.

 

[digitlnoize]

I don't know much about this, but from what I've read, there is little to no chance landing a residency as a DO at these places (fellowships, different story). That said, if there's any chance, I'm assuming a USMLE would be in order.

I don't have any psych buddies there, but I have a few DO friends in other fields at those places, especially IM.

 

[Dharma]

this isn't true, there are many excellent DO candidates with high USMLE step scores who are landing interviews at those types of places. DO vs MS doesn't matter as much as scores, honors, academic achievements. how great a candidate is has little to do with what letters are behind their names and yes maybe not all PDs agree, yet.

cool! glad to be wrong about this one!

 

[Rickettsia]

Does anyone know what the minimum or average comlex scores would be at any of these places? Also, if anyone has information on any of the osteopathic programs, it would be really helpful.

 

[kassy]

Re: How important are COMLEX scores?
I'm going to just copy and edit from the FAQ for IMG post

Your Step 1 USMLE or Level 1 COMLEX score is the most important part of your application. For many programs a good way of filtering down the 300-1200 applications they get is to have an arbitrary cut off. Do not expect to get (m)any interviews with a Step 1 Score less than 200 or Level 1 less than 400.

It is usually mid-tier places that care about score more than the top programs, although at places like MGH, Columbia, Cornell you really do need to have scored >240 unless you have connections and a significant publication record.

However all is not lost. I scored below average for psychiatry applicants on Step 1 and still managed to get interviews at top places. However, I was also filtered out of places that I should have otherwise got interviews from.

Passing step 2 CS first time is very important. It is a big red flag if you don't but again the willingness to overlook failure varies from program to program. It takes a couple months for the COMLEX CS to get back.

Take Level 1, 2 ck, and 2cs and have results back before Sep 15th (i.e. take all exams no later than early August of the year of application). However if you are still waiting for results do not wait to submit your application. If you take it after that initial submission and do not have an invite from your desired programs, you may want to send an e-mail to the program telling them of your updated score as they may have filtered you out initially.

 

[Dharma]

Got a bit bored studying earlier, needed a break and starting looking through a few residency web pages.

Looks like UCSD has a few PGY1 DO's and the program also accepts COMLEX. (My apologies if this has already been mentioned).

 

[kassy]

updated! Thanks!

 

[Dharma]

Saw that Loma Linda and UCLA-SVF have a few D.O.s. Both require USMLE though.

 

[kassy]

updated thanks

 

[clement]

What about programs such as nyu, columia, einstein, mt. sinai, cornell ?? they dont seem like they accept DO's or comlex.

Any opinions??

Anything is possible. At the moment,
"big name" west coast programs are notably less elitist when it comes to considering DO's.
More recently, if I'm not mistaken, UCSF is one such progressive example.
NYU has had at least one DO in the last 10 years. Columbia does accept
DO's for fellowships. In general, the name and location of the programs you inquire
about make them DO-unfriendly in an "old boys club," east coast kind of way. There's no rhyme or reason to it. I suspect as younger PD's move in and the total number of DO's increase, minds will open up. Many DO's have little access to research in school and that sets them back a bit at these places too.

 

[futuredo32]

Wayne State/DMC in Mi takes DOs with COMLEX.

 

[digitlnoize]

Anything is possible. At the moment,
"big name" west coast programs are notably less elitist when it comes to considering DO's.
More recently, if I'm not mistaken, UCSF is one such progressive example.
NYU has had at least one DO in the last 10 years. Columbia does accept
DO's for fellowships. In general, the name and location of the programs you inquire
about make them DO-unfriendly in an "old boys club," east coast kind of way. There's no rhyme or reason to it. I suspect as younger PD's move in and the total number of DO's increase, minds will open up. Many DO's have little access to research in school and that sets them back a bit at these places too.

Also, please keep in mind that many (most?) DO's have very different career goals in mind from many MD students. Most DO's I went to school with had ZERO interest in the high powered academic life, and just wanted a solid residency in a nice town where they could eventually set up shop. I don't know anyone that wanted to be a department chair, or save the world with their baby cancer research.

Maybe 1/2 the reason we don't see many DO's at these places is because most of us don't want to go to those places. I, for one, didn't apply anywhere in NYC, Boston, or California, simply because I think they're horrendous places to live. Nice to visit. Terrible to live in. For me.

 

[st2205]

Also, please keep in mind that many (most?) DO's have very different career goals in mind from many MD students. Most DO's I went to school with had ZERO interest in the high powered academic life, and just wanted a solid residency in a nice town where they could eventually set up shop. I don't know anyone that wanted to be a department chair, or save the world with their baby cancer research.

Maybe 1/2 the reason we don't see many DO's at these places is because most of us don't want to go to those places. I, for one, didn't apply anywhere in NYC, Boston, or California, simply because I think they're horrendous places to live. Nice to visit. Terrible to live in. For me.

I tend to agree with this. I think, as a general rule, DOs are much more comfortable with the "less prestigious" route, hence the fact they went DO. Those more focused on reputation are much less likely to consider DO. This is another confounding factor when people say DOs trend toward primary care, which is true, but not for the reasons most say it is.

 

[Dharma]

I just checked out Bergen's page after seeing a question regarding the program in another thread and noticed that they have a DO in this year's graduating class.

http://www.bergenregional.com/PsychiatryTraining/index.html

 

[Suspencer83]

they have 1 DO in this year's graduating class.

Sent from my S3