Pc q&a

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ladoctor said:
Hi PC - Do programs typically rank all the candidates they interview? (with obvious exceptions for redflag candidates or weird things happening on interview day) Meaning that if a program is interviewing 20 for 2 spots or 30 for 3 spots, they'll probably rank close to 20 or 30 candidates?
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Just to add to what PC said, my (not cards) program ranks virtually everyone they interview. Last year we didn't rank 2 out of 35 interviewees. One for lying on his application (which we discovered after talking to his IM PD) and the other for being an intolerable douchebag.
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gutonc said:
Just to add to what PC said, my (not cards) program ranks virtually everyone they interview. Last year we didn't rank 2 out of 35 interviewees. One for lying on his application (which we discovered after talking to his IM PD) and the other for being an intolerable douchebag.
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Wow! What did he lie about? Was it something minor or major?
 
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nope80 said:
Hi, do you think it is too late at this point to add programs?
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maybe...but some have sent emails saying they will consider till deadline 8/31; 8/28. ETC...check website before you spend the money.
 
PC, I have a question pertaining to an upcoming interview. I have an interview next weekbut I do not have information about the interview day, hotels nearby or address on where to meet the day of the interview. Last week, when I confirmed the interview with the coordinator I was told that more detail information would follow. In an effort to not be too pushy I waited until the week before the interview before I started inquiring about the information. However, I have not heard from the PC. I have both emailed and called (no answer, left a voicemail). I am little uneasy because I am going to a unfamiliar location and I really do not have any guidance on what I should do. I have considered cancelling but since its less than one week away I don't want to get a bad rep. This is a program I am interested in but like I said I am a little uneasy going to an unfamiliar location.
 
Endocrinology14 said:
PC, I have a question pertaining to an upcoming interview. I have an interview next weekbut I do not have information about the interview day, hotels nearby or address on where to meet the day of the interview. Last week, when I confirmed the interview with the coordinator I was told that more detail information would follow. In an effort to not be too pushy I waited until the week before the interview before I started inquiring about the information. However, I have not heard from the PC. I have both emailed and called (no answer, left a voicemail). I am little uneasy because I am going to a unfamiliar location and I really do not have any guidance on what I should do. I have considered cancelling but since its less than one week away I don't want to get a bad rep. This is a program I am interested in but like I said I am a little uneasy going to an unfamiliar location.
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I understand your anxiety and suggest a search based on their office location (Google, Hotels.com, Trivago, Expedia, et al.). Although some programs may have several clinical locations, they typically have a central academic/administrative one.

I'm sure they will follow through on their promise to send more info. My guess is that they will send before the weekend. Usually when they're late getting the info out, it's because they're scrambling to get interviewers together.
 
Endocrinology14 said:
PC, I have a question pertaining to an upcoming interview. I have an interview next weekbut I do not have information about the interview day, hotels nearby or address on where to meet the day of the interview. Last week, when I confirmed the interview with the coordinator I was told that more detail information would follow. In an effort to not be too pushy I waited until the week before the interview before I started inquiring about the information. However, I have not heard from the PC. I have both emailed and called (no answer, left a voicemail). I am little uneasy because I am going to a unfamiliar location and I really do not have any guidance on what I should do. I have considered cancelling but since its less than one week away I don't want to get a bad rep. This is a program I am interested in but like I said I am a little uneasy going to an unfamiliar location.
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This happened to me. I received it snail mail.
 
Thanks for responding. Actually the PC was out of town and forgot to send the information out before leaving for vacation. I emailed the PD directly and she was very helpful.
 
Hey PC, thanks so much for all your help! My SO will find out where they are going to be this fall which will dictate what programs I will ultimately rank/where I am willing to end up. So far I've been taking interviews at most places due to not knowing where my SO will be. I was wondering what is proper etiquette when cancelling interviews for programs? How much notice before hand is considered enough?
 
purkinje284 said:
Hey PC, thanks so much for all your help! My SO will find out where they are going to be this fall which will dictate what programs I will ultimately rank/where I am willing to end up. So far I've been taking interviews at most places due to not knowing where my SO will be. I was wondering what is proper etiquette when cancelling interviews for programs? How much notice before hand is considered enough?
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It happens. Cancel as soon as possible. Waiting until the day before the interview totally sucks, so please don't do that if you can help it.

You needn't call. A nice, brief email will suffice.
 
ProgCoordinator said:
It happens. Cancel as soon as possible. Waiting until the day before the interview totally sucks, so please don't do that if you can help it.

You needn't call. A nice, brief email will suffice.
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Hi PC,

In a related question, is it okay and not impolite to decline interviews just as you receive them,

Thanks.
 
letDdiceflyhigh said:
Hi PC,

In a related question, is it okay and not impolite to decline interviews just as you receive them,

Thanks.
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It's okay Find a way to finesse it when you decline to make sure that you won't burn any bridges for the future. Toss in a comment that your dance card is full budget-wise or something. Or perhaps your cup is unexpectedly running over so you've had to limit yourself regionally.
 
Seems as though invitations to interview are almost all out? Applying to GI rcvd 9 but have not heard from any more programs. Rejections have been steady however.
 
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Enteroid said:
Seems as though invitations to interview are almost all out? Applying to GI rcvd 9 but have not heard from any more programs. Rejections have been steady however.
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The flood of invites has pretty much died down, but that doesn't mean that you're completely S.O.L. with the ones that you haven't yet heard from. There may be another one to come. I can't speak with complete confidence as to how all other programs conduct their business. Some may be holding your app as an alternate without alerting you. Some may not send regrets.

Good on you for snagging the 9, though. You're in good shape.
 
Hi programcoordinator,
When do programs put together their rank list? When is everything solidified? If we are going to have our own program call to express interest when should this be and when is it too late?
 
nope80 said:
Hi programcoordinator,
When do programs put together their rank list? When is everything solidified? If we are going to have our own program call to express interest when should this be and when is it too late?
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Rank lists are in flux up to the deadline. Definitely wait to have anyone reach out to PD's until after you've completed all of your interviews. That's a solid rule. You may be surprised by your #1 after you've visited all your programs.

When would it be too late? November 12th will definitely be too late. Get the calls and emails in by early November.
 
ProgCoordinator said:
Rank lists are in flux up to the deadline. Definitely wait to have anyone reach out to PD's until after you've completed all of your interviews. That's a solid rule. You may be surprised by your #1 after you've visited all your programs.

When would it be too late? November 12th will definitely be too late. Get the calls and emails in by early November.
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Hi PC does it matter if I go to my tentative top choice in early November/ their last interview date
 
So what are the no-no's in interview attire? I know the standard blue shirt stuff. Is there anything someone can wear or not wear to standout from the pack? Maybe a blue/red plaid shirt? Gray suit instead of navy? Anything?

Suggestions...
 
Spoilme2025 said:
So what are the no-no's in interview attire? I know the standard blue shirt stuff. Is there anything someone can wear or not wear to standout from the pack? Maybe a blue/red plaid shirt? Gray suit instead of navy? Anything?

Suggestions...
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Doesn't matter in the long run. Obviously suits are de rigueur for men. In the first moments of meeting we may appreciate a cool tie or a suit that isn't blue or black, but it probably won't be committed to memory and definitely won't make a meaningful impact on the rank list.
 
Hi PC I received IVs from my top 3 programs. All my invites came from PCs. I replied to all of them and thanked them and showed my interest in coming. Do you think it would look good if I emailed the PD and thank them as well for interview? Or it's unusual and I should wait until after the interview?
 
Mr Pancreas said:
Hi PC I received IVs from my top 3 programs. All my invites came from PCs. I replied to all of them and thanked them and showed my interest in coming. Do you think it would look good if I emailed the PD and thank them as well for interview? Or it's unusual and I should wait until after the interview?
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Thank you to PD's after the interviews and cc the PC's.
 
is step 3 score important to get into a competitive fellowship like cardiology?
 
johnsmith130077 said:
is step 3 score important to get into a competitive fellowship like cardiology?
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If you've taken it and the program has asked for scores then they will consider it. Nowadays many have already taken step 3 by the time they are submitting for fellowship consideration, so the score is available to us as part of the USMLE transcript. I can tell you that we consider it (competitive university-based program).
 
ProgCoordinator said:
If you've taken it and the program has asked for scores then they will consider it. Nowadays many have already taken step 3 by the time they are submitting for fellowship consideration, so the score is available to us as part of the USMLE transcript. I can tell you that we consider it (competitive university-based program).
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Hi PC. I know it varies by program, but does your program have cutoffs for each of the step scores? If so, do you mind sharing what they are? If someone doesn't meet it for one of them does the app just get filtered out and no one looks at it? Thanks!
 
runningheart said:
Hi PC. I know it varies by program, but does your program have cutoffs for each of the step scores? If so, do you mind sharing what they are? If someone doesn't meet it for one of them does the app just get filtered out and no one looks at it? Thanks!
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Many programs state a minimum of 200. Utilizing the ERAS filters we can set to anything and change that baseline at will.

We typically focus on 220+ to start. Eventually I will double back after we've picked through all of the submissions that cleared that initial filter. Personally I like to review every single applicant prior to invitations in order to make certain that (A) everyone gets a fair shake, (B) we don't miss out on anyone with potential, and (C) we have solid, specific answers when the inevitable calls/emails start rolling in objecting to any candidate's regret/alternate classification.
 
I am guessing that USMLEs play more of a role in IMG applicants. No?
 
Hey PC, I have a couple of questions regarding post-interview letters.

1. You had mentioned in another thread we should let our #1 program know our preference only at the end of the interview trail. I had planned to send out thank you letters shortly after interviews (so it's fresh in my and the faculty's memory), but if I plan to let them know I will rank them #1, are you suggesting I wait until the end of all my interviews to send out thank you letters or send out two separate letters.

2. At which point in our rank list, should we simply say "I will rank you highly"? I'm not sure how excited a program will be to hear it is in my top 10. top 5 or 3?

thank you.
 
Militarydoc1 said:
Hey PC, I have a couple of questions regarding post-interview letters.

1. You had mentioned in another thread we should let our #1 program know our preference only at the end of the interview trail. I had planned to send out thank you letters shortly after interviews (so it's fresh in my and the faculty's memory), but if I plan to let them know I will rank them #1, are you suggesting I wait until the end of all my interviews to send out thank you letters or send out two separate letters.

2. At which point in our rank list, should we simply say "I will rank you highly"? I'm not sure how excited a program will be to hear it is in my top 10. top 5 or 3?

thank you.
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Totally send thank you's right after each of your interviews. It's up to you whether to straight up disclose to any one program that it's your favorite. No problem at all if you do. My point is that you may finish your second interview appointment thinking that that day's program will be your first choice, but then -- after visiting all programs and having done some soul searching -- you may be surprised to find that you are leaning more toward another (perhaps the fourth program you'd visited or the last).

It's smart to be a little more vague in your immediate thank you letters/emails. For example: "Yours is an outstanding program in which I'm certain to receive strong training within a supportively challenging environment and I anticipate ranking it highly/among my top 3/at the top of my list/fill-in-the-blank." Then, after you've gone on all of your interviews, you can follow-up with your top 2 or 3 programs to reiterate your interest. This is the time where, if you so choose to be completely transparent (up to you), you can tell your #1 that they are your #1.

I do not recommend total disclosure with your #2, #3, etc. programs. No one wants to hear they're your #2. It's reality, but...no one really wants to hear it. For those follow-ups just say something like, "I am impressed by your program and will rank you highly/very highly/among the top/strongly/fill-in-the-blank."
 
PC just wanted to say THANK YOU for helping us all out! Your input is always helpful.

I was wondering if my place of lets call it origin (which has been plastered all over the news in a negative way) is detrimental to my application? That is literally the only thing about my application that I can say is not up to par. Insight....Do program really want to have a FMG candidate who graduated from a country in turmoil? EVEN though he is now established here and so on a so forth?
 
Spoilme2025 said:
PC just wanted to say THANK YOU for helping us all out! Your input is always helpful.

I was wondering if my place of lets call it origin (which has been plastered all over the news in a negative way) is detrimental to my application? That is literally the only thing about my application that I can say is not up to par. Insight....Do program really want to have a FMG candidate who graduated from a country in turmoil? EVEN though he is now established here and so on a so forth?
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I completely appreciate all of the positive feedback from you guys. It's my pleasure to help.

It's the US-based track record that will really matter. In all my years, I can't remember a candidate's country of origin being a discussion topic when ranking.
 
ProgCoordinator said:
Many programs state a minimum of 200. Utilizing the ERAS filters we can set to anything and change that baseline at will.

We typically focus on 220+ to start.
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Hi PC, I am sorry to say with that criteria you won't have the privilege to meet with me.:)

Just kidding, I am applying next year and hopefully you would be able to pick me during your second search....especially when I will have ACC and Circ pubs in my hand!

Is there anything I could do when I don't meet any specific program's criteria on USMLE scores but have otherwise strong application? As always thank you for everything.
 
cardiology1979 said:
Hi PC, I am sorry to say with that criteria you won't have the privilege to meet with me.:)

Just kidding, I am applying next year and hopefully you would be able to pick me during your second search....especially when I will have ACC and Circ pubs in my hand!

Is there anything I could do when I don't meet any specific program's criteria on USMLE scores but have otherwise strong application? As always thank you for everything.
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First...keep working hard. Possible counter balance points for lower board scores can be very strong pubs/research, residency program, outstanding LORs, and/or chief resident year. Scores that hover around 200 for all steps will be hard to overcome for consideration at a highly competitive program. A failed step prior to passing will knock just about anyone out of contention for the most competitive programs.

Bear in mind that there's a broad scope of programs out there. My perspective is mostly focused on the competitive, academic-based programs. It's what I know best, but should not be taken as absolute gospel for every fellowship out there. As many have pointed out, there are plenty of programs that don't even ask for scores.
 
Got a good PM question that I have permission to answer publicly so long as I don't reveal the identity of our fine friend:

"...on a scale of 0-10 how strong this wording is as an email from a PD/chair for chances of matching at this institution. 'Please know that we find you to be an outstanding candidate for training in cardiology at (redacted), and we would be delighted to have you as a Fellow in our program. We intend to rank you where, historically, we would expect that you have a very good chance of matching with us, should you choose to do so.'"

This is a good love letter from a PD. The chance for matching here depends a lot upon how highly the candidate ranks this program. Along with how highly the candidates ranked above this candidate on that program's list ranked the program.

Let's say that I typically rank ~60 candidates every year and we typically meet our match quota within the top 20 of our rank list...I can honestly send love letters to this year's 20 top-ranked candidates and tell them that they are ranked within historical matching range. As far as the 0-10 scale...if you rank this program #1 it's my opinion that your chance to match with them will be 7 or better. Total opinion. Total gut call. I'm not a statistician. :-/

Should you get a love letter telling you right out that you are ranked to match...then you've probably been ranked directly within the absolute quota range (i.e. we're matching for 5 slots and I've ranked you 1-5).
 
I have a question on a different note, after my first interview, both chair and other faculty kept asking me this same question: planning to settle in US or home country? and another one : how many IV so far, what all programs you are looking at?
 
Lasso said:
I have a question on a different note, after my first interview, both chair and other faculty kept asking me this same question: planning to settle in US or home country? and another one : how many IV so far, what all programs you are looking at?
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US or Home? -- May be due to simple curiosity. Maybe just wanting to know whether you'd be interested in joining their Division after fellowship if they are hiring at that time. Maybe wanting to figure out the visa/permanent resident/citizenship situation down the road.

How many interviews? Which programs are you visiting? -- Sort of simple curiosity as well as a way to gauge both your competitiveness as well as their own.
 
Yeah I thought the same, and I think u might be correct. Just dint feel comfortable, because I am generally honest with my answers, and honestly I have not made decisions yet regarding that. I told my priority is to get trained in best place, and personally feel obliged to give back my talent to my people at home country!! Not sure how they took this.
 
Lasso said:
Yeah I thought the same, and I think u might be correct. Just dint feel comfortable, because I am generally honest with my answers, and honestly I have not made decisions yet regarding that. I told my priority is to get trained in best place, and personally feel obliged to give back my talent to my people at home country!! Not sure how they took this.
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You did the right thing. In the long run, honesty is the best policy for everyone involved.
 
Hi PC, thanks again for all your help.
I have a question. Does the match usually go in the applicants programs favor? Meaning for instance, an applicant liked a certain program and decided to rank them first. The program liked the applicant but not enough to rank him within their quota (let's say they ranked him 8 and their quota is 3). If the 7 other applicants that the program ranked higher all ranked this program 2nd, third and fourth. Who would match? Is it the applicant that ranked them first but wasn't ranked high by the program or the applicants who were ranked high but didn't rank the program high?
Sorry if it sounds like a non-well organized question?

Best.
 
Mr Pancreas said:
Hi PC, thanks again for all your help.
I have a question. Does the match usually go in the applicants programs favor? Meaning for instance, an applicant liked a certain program and decided to rank them first. The program liked the applicant but not enough to rank him within their quota (let's say they ranked him 8 and their quota is 3). If the 7 other applicants that the program ranked higher all ranked this program 2nd, third and fourth. Who would match? Is it the applicant that ranked them first but wasn't ranked high by the program or the applicants who were ranked high but didn't rank the program high?
Sorry if it sounds like a non-well organized question?

Best.
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*Applicants OR programs
 
Mr Pancreas said:
Hi PC, thanks again for all your help.
I have a question. Does the match usually go in the applicants programs favor? Meaning for instance, an applicant liked a certain program and decided to rank them first. The program liked the applicant but not enough to rank him within their quota (let's say they ranked him 8 and their quota is 3). If the 7 other applicants that the program ranked higher all ranked this program 2nd, third and fourth. Who would match? Is it the applicant that ranked them first but wasn't ranked high by the program or the applicants who were ranked high but didn't rank the program high?
Sorry if it sounds like a non-well organized question?

Best.
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The match algorithm fits applicants in their highest ranked program that still has room for them. It favors you. aPD and others have discussed this ad nauseum in the ERAS forum.

In the scenario that you outline, if 2 or fewer of those other 7 applicants match at programs they ranked higher than this one, you'll match there. Otherwise you won't.
 
gutonc said:
The match algorithm fits applicants in their highest ranked program that still has room for them. It favors you. aPD and others have discussed this ad nauseum in the ERAS forum.

In the scenario that you outline, if 2 or fewer of those other 7 applicants match at programs they ranked higher than this one, you'll match there. Otherwise you won't.
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Thanks Gutonc. I think many applicants will be happy knowing this.
 
PC, this question might have been asked before but I'll ask anyways. In your experience, how deep in the rank list do programs go on average? I understand that this is variable, but for competitive academic programs what would be your best guess? Thanks.
 
TeNa said:
PC, this question might have been asked before but I'll ask anyways. In your experience, how deep in the rank list do programs go on average? I understand that this is variable, but for competitive academic programs what would be your best guess? Thanks.
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good question. i was wondering that myself. i just came back from IV yesterday that said they IV 40 for 5 slots. I was wondering how far they go down there list as well.
 
TeNa said:
PC, this question might have been asked before but I'll ask anyways. In your experience, how deep in the rank list do programs go on average? I understand that this is variable, but for competitive academic programs what would be your best guess? Thanks.
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Totally variable, but I'll take a stab at it like this...considering the last 15 years for our program, the range in which we typically match is the top 25-35% of our rank list.
 
Quick question regarding Step 3. I have not taken it yet but my scores for I and II are both stellar. Would this reasonably hurt my chances of matching at my top program? I would think that my previous track records should suffice. What do you think?
 
superhero16 said:
Quick question regarding Step 3. I have not taken it yet but my scores for I and II are both stellar. Would this reasonably hurt my chances of matching at my top program? I would think that my previous track records should suffice. What do you think?
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Yeah, you'll be fine. Just take step 3 ASAP after match.
 
PC, do you know whether places don't send you a response at all? I find myself with still quite a few places that I applied to, most of which have sent out invites and rejections per our forum, but have yet to send me anything.
 
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