People gaming URM status

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kaizera12

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kaizera12 said:
Hey all, so one of my friend's brother has started a MD program at a top 20 school. He is Egyptian, born in the U.S., and honestly does not look anything like an AA. He showed me his application he used for the last cycle, and all he literally had was 2 quarters of research, 100 hours of hospital volunteering, and being in the Egyptian club at his school. 3 activities listed total. He had a 3.7 GPA and <30 MCAT. He got into all of the HBCU's. He told me he marked African in his ethnicity, and I have no doubt that it gave him a huge advantage as he said that interviewers asked him about his AA heritage and culture and how he had to make things up for these questions. I don't understand how people get away with these things...? Can anyone explain? Just ticks me off a little that affirmative action isn't working the way its supposed to be for these cases.
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This is an example of why the current model of affirmative action in medical school admissions is not the most effective one. Plenty of applicants game the system and get away with it. Tons of upper middle class and rich black and hispanic applicants get into US MD programs with terrible stats and ECs. These applicants usually have no experience with poverty or with working/living with underserved communities. After they finish their residency, usually they don't take care of underserved URM populations.

The fact that he had to make up stuff and lie in his interview and now he's attending a top 20 MD school....makes me very sad.
 
It's unfair to assume that the only reason he got in was because he marked he was African on his application. I'm sure there are a number of URM applicants who apply to Top 20 schools with similar stats and don't get in...
 
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kaizera12 said:
Hey all, so one of my friend's brother has started a MD program at a top 20 school. He is Egyptian, born in the U.S., and honestly does not look anything like an AA. He showed me his application he used for the last cycle, and all he literally had was 2 quarters of research, 100 hours of hospital volunteering, and being in the Egyptian club at his school. 3 activities listed total. He had a 3.7 GPA and <30 MCAT. He got into all of the HBCU's. He told me he marked African in his ethnicity, and I have no doubt that it gave him a huge advantage as he said that interviewers asked him about his AA heritage and culture and how he had to make things up for these questions. I don't understand how people get away with these things...? Can anyone explain? Just ticks me off a little that affirmative action isn't working the way its supposed to be for these cases.
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Egypt is in Africa. He was born in America. Hence he is African-American. He was correct in marking African as his ethnicity.
 
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Im sure they saw him at the interviews for the HBCU, wish I went to an HBCU but I couldn't afford it :(
 
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Surprised no one questioned if the OP's story is BS or not
 
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Interesting. I have a friend whose parents are Egyptian and she does not look nor consider herself African. When I visited Egypt, I didn't think that anyone thought of themselves as African there: it's either Arabian or Egyptian.
 
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aegistitan said:
Lol. He's technically white as defined by the US census. Idk how he got away with that. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Africans_in_the_United_States

Does this mean affirmative action does not abide by the US census requirements for ethnicity? Is this one of those you identify as whatever you want cases?
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It is based on each school's definition. But that isn't the point. It is trivial to start another URM debate. Lets just be happy for everyone who has worked for an acceptance. URM or not they wouldn't be accepted without being qualified first.
 
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People of origins from North Africa, Middle East, and Europe are considered White....

But I guess it does depend on the schools take of the definition of AA.
 
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Honestly, though; if he wants to claim URM status, he's not being dishonest. Egypt is a part of the continent of Africa. He's not outright lying for the advantage. Blurring the line is something you could argue, but even if we did, that's not going to change anything.

Still, I'm not sure what consumes you about it. Or if this story is even legitimate. But n=1.
 
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EMDO2018 said:
Im sure they saw him at the interviews for the HBCU, wish I went to an HBCU but I couldn't afford it :(
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HBCUs are ridiculously overpriced for what they give back. Count yourself lucky.
 
miszfifi820 said:
@SkipJunior I think we need to remember that URM means underREPRESENTED .. not underrepresented/under the poverty line thats why there are separate questions for underserved and disadvantaged.

he is african american, just because he doesn't know much about his culture does not take away from his right to claim african. And he doesn't look AA? ...what does that even mean?
Im just trying to understand what he allegedly got away with ..?
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URM is meant to help a specific type of African American, not someone who was born into affluent circumstances. It's essentially unintended consequences.
http://magazine.good.is/articles/ivy-league-fooled-how-america-s-top-colleges-avoid-real-diversity
 
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The US Census doesn't not consider Arabs to be African-Americans, or rather, persons of African heritage. The person the OP is referring to is very likely to get a rejection. I hope OP will let us know how this turns out.

DermViser said:
Egypt is in Africa. He was born in America. Hence he is African-American. He was correct in marking African as his ethnicity.
Click to expand...
 
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Goro said:
The US Census doesn't not consider Arabs to be African-Americans, or rather, persons of African heritage. The person the OP is referring to is very likely to get a rejection. I hope OP will let us know how this turns out.
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OP says the person has started at a top 20.
 
Goro said:
The US Census doesn't not consider Arabs to be African-Americans, or rather, persons of African heritage. The person the OP is referring to is very likely to get a rejection. I hope OP will let us know how this turns out.
Click to expand...
 
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miszfifi820 said:
oh i am familiar with that article... very well ... i have many arguments against that article but that discussion is for another thread;)

and since we're using Wiki as a credible source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirmative_action

things like affirmative action and URM are "intended to favor those who tend to suffer from discrimination, especially in employment or education..."
Affluent african americans or other races suffer from discrimination also ... ask Oprah..
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I'm sure you have many "arguments" against it. I truly hope you're joking with the bolded...
 
how about white Africans? Also the British and other European powers brought over Indians and Chinese people (Hong Kong) centuries ago to Africa. The British Raj brought over Indians to work on construction projects and railroads. The descendants of these Indian and Chinese people don't consider themselves to be Indian or Chinese, they consider themselves to be African and can speak African languages etc. Should they mark themselves as African Americans on their AMCAS application if they migrate to the US or if their children apply to medical school in the US?
 
I swear, SDN operates on a lunar calendar.

Right now, instead of the nearing of the end of the Harvest Moon, we are instead in the mere beginning of the "Gripe-and-Groan-about-Circumstances Moon".
 
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SkipJunior said:
I find your reaction to be insulting. What's wrong with having a large family or if a husband and wife have an active sex life?
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Well I don't like to think about sperm with teeth while having sex. That's a pretty big turn off for me.
 
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touchpause13 said:
Well I don't like to think about sperm with teeth while having sex. That's a pretty big turn off for me.
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Okay, fair enough. For me though, the union of male and female is the most beautiful thing in the world. I don't feel complete unless I'm with a female. Also, though that sperm seems nasty to you, I'm sure you realize you need sperm to create males AND females.

Here try this out if you don't believe me. Put a whole bunch of females in a room. You will notice with time that the number of females are decreasing, not increasing. 2 females can't make another female. You need a male aka sperm and a female to create another female. You're half sperm yourself!
 
SkipJunior said:
Okay, fair enough. For me though, the union of male and female is the most beautiful thing in the world. I don't feel complete unless I'm with a female. Also, though that sperm seems nasty to you, I'm sure you realize you need sperm to create males AND females.

Here try this out if you don't believe me. Put a whole bunch of females in a room. You will notice with time that the number of females are decreasing, not increasing. 2 females can't make another female. You need a male aka sperm and a female to create another female. You're half sperm yourself!
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OMFG

@O Grady @Mad Jack

1. Sperm is not nasty to me. I have done things with sperm you can't even imagine
2. I understand the function of sperm
3. 2 females can't make another, but that's never stopped us from trying
 
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SkipJunior said:
Okay, fair enough. For me though, the union of male and female is the most beautiful thing in the world. I don't feel complete unless I'm with a female. Also, though that sperm seems nasty to you, I'm sure you realize you need sperm to create males AND females.

Here try this out if you don't believe me. Put a whole bunch of females in a room. You will notice with time that the number of females are decreasing, not increasing. 2 females can't make another female. You need a male aka sperm and a female to create another female. You're half sperm yourself!
Click to expand...

Good lord, what are you talking about?? I'm sure that was hardly the reason the above poster "puked".
 
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SkipJunior said:
I have to admit, as a red blooded bull male, that statement by TP did make me feel good.
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Like something is right in the world. Bravo, TP.
 
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O Grady said:
Oh for sure. That's why we need to move this gravy train over there so the real fun can begin
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I feel like skippy would get a WOH
 
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touchpause13 said:
OMFG

@O Grady @Mad Jack

1. Sperm is not nasty to me. I have done things with sperm you can't even imagine
2. I understand the function of sperm
3. 2 females can't make another, but that's never stopped us from trying
Click to expand...
I can't even tonight. I just got home after a four hour drive and this is what welcomes me? A world gone mad, full of adults that don't even know how babby is formed and how penis goes where? This is why we need good sex education in this country, so this **** doesn't happen. Let me crack open some Sailor Jerry and get to the replies.
nice-things-cat-300x242.jpg
 
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