PhD/PsyD Practicum Placement

[drquinnpsyd]

I am a second year Clinical Psych PsyD Student in southern California/ inland empire/ riverside area. my MA is in forensic psych and cannot seem to find a practicum placement that would allow me to serve the forensic/ incarcerated population. the majority of my research has dealt with violent male sex offenders and i would like to find a practicum placement dealing with a similar population. every non-profit or private agency i have called is not willing to assist me. I am willing to work an average of 20 hrs a week for no pay. does anyone have any connections?

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[deleted343839]

I don't know how your program is structured but a trainee, especially a second year student, should not be cold calling agencies to seek out a practicum placement. What is your training director doing? They should be vetting practicum sites and supervisors and making those opportunities available to you. Does your program have forensic training opportunities in other areas?

 

[psy234]

Patton? Also agree with MamaPhD though, your school should have pre-existing relationships with any site at which you are placed.

 

[erg923]

I am a second year Clinical Psych PsyD Student in southern California/ inland empire/ riverside area. my MA is in forensic psych and cannot seem to find a practicum placement that would allow me to serve the forensic/ incarcerated population. the majority of my research has dealt with violent male sex offenders and i would like to find a practicum placement dealing with a similar population. every non-profit or private agency i have called is not willing to assist me. I am willing to work an average of 20 hrs a week for no pay. does anyone have any connections?

This is your DCTs job, not yours.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Agreed that this is something your program/DCT should be handling, or at least assisting you with. You'll also need your program to "sign off" on the placement for the hours to count as "program-sanctioned" when applying for internship; this can be tough to do in a pinch if your program doesn't have a pre-existing relationship with the training site (assuming the program is doing their job and vetting such sites, of course).

Unfortunately, beyond that, I don't have any specific recommendations for sites in that area.

 

[erg923]

A quick search reveals Patton State Hospital is in that area. But again, practicum sites need to be approved/sanctioned by your program to "count."

 

[BuckeyeLove]

1. agree with everyone. this should be the job of your DCT.
2. Patton. They have a top notch clerkship (I think that's what they call practicum) and the supervisors are excellent. I have friends that have externed there and it has served them well. I was about a second away from accepting a forensic fellowship position there as well, but the move was going to be too far.

 

[drquinnpsyd]

Hi All,

thank you for the responses. I agree that this is the tasks of the programs DCT ..however he is more than inept. The program attempts to provide students with a tool to apply for sites but not all sites on the school approved list are open to all students and even then most sites are at least 2 hours away from my current location. i have been encouraged/ as have most of my cohort to figure it out for myself.. i will look into Patton, any other sources are more than appreciated, thanks again

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

That's the kind of setup that should be reported to the APA acred folks. It seems....insufficient, at best.

 

[WisNeuro]

That's the kind of setup that should be reported to the APA acred folks. It seems....insufficient, at best.

Depends, did the parent organization "donate" money to APA in the last few years?

 

[erg923]

The program attempts to provide students with a tool to apply for sites but not all sites on the school approved list are open to all students and even then most sites are at least 2 hours away from my current location. i have been encouraged/ as have most of my cohort to figure it out for myself.. i will look into Patton, any other sources are more than appreciated, thanks again

What would you think if you enrolled in a medical school and then they said, "well we'll help you look for clerkships out in the community, but we cant make any guarantees, mostly you should figure out how to get all that medical doctory-type training on you own." Would this be acceptable to you?

I have no idea how this could be viewed as even remotely acceptable by an accrediting body, much less by student who was subjected to it.

What on earth drew you to such a program?

 

[deleted343839]

Hi All,

thank you for the responses. I agree that this is the tasks of the programs DCT ..however he is more than inept. The program attempts to provide students with a tool to apply for sites but not all sites on the school approved list are open to all students and even then most sites are at least 2 hours away from my current location. i have been encouraged/ as have most of my cohort to figure it out for myself.. i will look into Patton, any other sources are more than appreciated, thanks again

OK. Right now your main priority should be to get the best general training you can get. Seek opportunities to train at sites that have a good reputation in terms of supervision, working conditions, and so forth. I understand your desire to jump right into more specialized populations, but if you want a shot at a decent internship and future forensic training opportunities it's in your best interest to train broadly at known, reputable sites where you can get plenty of supervision and exposure to a variety of populations. This is how you make the most of a weak training program.

From a supervisor's perspective, most people will not want to take on the time commitment and liability to supervise a student from program with which they have no established relationship. For example, where I trained all of the external site directors/supervisors received adjunct faculty appointments at my institution and had a relationship with our DCT. Everyone was invested to some degree, and there were incentives for all parties. That is not to discourage you from trying but to help you understand why unaffiliated sites are unlikely to enter into these informal arrangements.

 

[erg923]

OK. Right now your main priority should be to get the best general training you can get. Seek opportunities to train at sites that have a good reputation in terms of supervision, working conditions, and so forth. I understand your desire to jump right into more specialized populations, but if you want a shot at a decent internship and future forensic training opportunities it's in your best interest to train broadly at known, reputable sites where you can get plenty of supervision and exposure to a variety of populations. This is how you make the most of a weak training program.

From a supervisor's perspective, most people will not want to take on the time commitment and liability to supervise a student from program with which they have no established relationship. For example, where I trained all of the external site directors/supervisors received adjunct faculty appointments at my institution and had a relationship with our DCT. Everyone was invested to some degree, and there were incentives for all parties. That is not to discourage you from trying but to help you understand why unaffiliated sites are unlikely to enter into these informal arrangements.

I recently declined to accept a student in my clinic because of impending space changes, for example (and I already have an intern coming to the clinic in later summer).

Keep in mind, sites need to have a certain amount of existing training infrastructure to be "willing to assist you." This is not just something they can say yes to because they are interested or because they feel like helping. There are business obligations to meet on their end, and their are ethical obligation that needs to be met on the training end.

 

[boomshakalaka]

Hi All,

thank you for the responses. I agree that this is the tasks of the programs DCT ..however he is more than inept. The program attempts to provide students with a tool to apply for sites but not all sites on the school approved list are open to all students and even then most sites are at least 2 hours away from my current location. i have been encouraged/ as have most of my cohort to figure it out for myself.. i will look into Patton, any other sources are more than appreciated, thanks again

You are definitely in a tough position, however I would advise you to try and remedy this with your DCT. Sites like Patton are going to be adhering to SCAPTP guidelines (http://www.scaptp.org/#!about/c1et) and typically only take students from a handful of schools with whom they have pre-existing relationships. I am almost certain they would not respond to a "cold-call" for a practicum placement there. You also mentioned some sites are not open to all students, many schools do this to ensure that you have a solid clinical foundation prior to providing services in more advanced settings. While frustrating, this is to preserve relationships with sites and make sure students don't get in over their heads.

OK. Right now your main priority should be to get the best general training you can get. Seek opportunities to train at sites that have a good reputation in terms of supervision, working conditions, and so forth. I understand your desire to jump right into more specialized populations, but if you want a shot at a decent internship and future forensic training opportunities it's in your best interest to train broadly at known, reputable sites where you can get plenty of supervision and exposure to a variety of populations. This is how you make the most of a weak training program.

From a supervisor's perspective, most people will not want to take on the time commitment and liability to supervise a student from program with which they have no established relationship. For example, where I trained all of the external site directors/supervisors received adjunct faculty appointments at my institution and had a relationship with our DCT. Everyone was invested to some degree, and there were incentives for all parties. That is not to discourage you from trying but to help you understand why unaffiliated sites are unlikely to enter into these informal arrangements.

This, this, and this.

 

[erg923]

You are definitely in a tough position, however I would advise you to try and remedy this with your DCT. Sites like Patton are going to be adhering to SCAPTP guidelines (http://www.scaptp.org/#!about/c1et) and typically only take students from a handful of schools with whom they have pre-existing relationships. I am almost certain they would not respond to a "cold-call" for a practicum placement there. You also mentioned some sites are not open to all students, many schools do this to ensure that you have a solid clinical foundation prior to providing services in more advanced settings. While frustrating, this is to preserve relationships with sites and make sure students don't get in over their heads.



This, this, and this.

Good post from this guy right here. Reminds me of:

 

[ClinicalABA]

Hi All,

thank you for the responses. I agree that this is the tasks of the programs DCT ..however he is more than inept. The program attempts to provide students with a tool to apply for sites but not all sites on the school approved list are open to all students and even then most sites are at least 2 hours away from my current location. i have been encouraged/ as have most of my cohort to figure it out for myself.. i will look into Patton, any other sources are more than appreciated, thanks again

You are in a tough situation, obviously. I have some not directly helpful questions that I ask out of curiosity-

Is your program APA accredited?
How did they represent the practicum requirement and process to you when you were applying to the school?
How many student in your cohort/entering class, and are they all looking for placements at the same time?​

 

[ClinicalABA]

An APA accredited program has some responsibilities to its students (as a criteria for securing and maintaining accreditation. From the Guidelines and Principles for Accreditation of Programs in Professional Psychology (published by the APA Office of Program Consultation and Accreditation:

"4. Additionally, the program requires that its students receive adequate and appropriate practicum experiences. To this end the program should:

(a) Place students in settings that: are clearly committed to training; supervise students using an adequate number of appropriate professionals; and provide a wide range of training and educational experiences through applications of empirically supported intervention procedures;
(b) Integrate the practicum component of the students’ education and training with the other elements of the program and provide adequate forums for the discussion of the practicum experience;
(c) Ensure that the sequencing, duration, nature, and content of these experiences are both appropriate for and consistent with the program’s immediate and long-term training goals and objectives; and
(d) Describe and justify the sufficiency of practicum experiences required of students in preparation for an internship."
​

Seems to me that just saying "fend for yourself," even if combined with them giving out a fancy application, does not meet this standard.

 

[boomshakalaka]

Good post from this guy right here. Reminds me of:

Great catch on the combo Dumb and Dumber/NBA Jam reference!

 

[drquinnpsyd]

Hi All,

thank you again for your words and clarification. From a business standpoint, I can see now how some factors may make more sense. The program is not APA accredited, which for for a handful of reasons was not vital for me. However as an APA member myself, I would have thought i would have some leeway in terms of placement. There are roughly 20 students in the cohort seeking to confirm a placement to meet a 800 hour supervision. This degree requirement was expressed upfront upon applying for the program, but it was also expressed that we would have more assistance in confirming placement. The school provided students access to roughly 50 sites, to which the DCT then approved or denied students for on an individual basis. The next step would be to secure an interview. A recent interview last week revealed over 100 canidetes were being interviewed for the same placement within the agency which eliminates any potential thoughts relating to sites being less competitive in terms of how the program manages the initial process. I was lucky in that i was able to find 2 school supported sites located within an hour from my current location. most of the cohort would have to drive 3-4 hours to get to a school supported site. But naturally, the sites near me are dealing with populations that i question if i have the capacity and patience to work with but agree with a previous post in that i need to remain open...thank you all again!

 

[erg923]

Hi All,

thank you again for your words and clarification. From a business standpoint, I can see now how some factors may make more sense. The program is not APA accredited, which for for a handful of reasons was not vital for me.

Well, its "vital" for pretty much every employer and internship training program in this country.

However as an APA member myself, I would have thought i would have some leeway in terms of placement.

Why would your individual membership in APA have anything to do/impact on practica training within your program?

There are roughly 20 students in the cohort seeking to confirm a placement to meet a 800 hour supervision. This degree requirement was expressed upfront upon applying for the program, but it was also expressed that we would have more assistance in confirming placement. The school provided students access to roughly 50 sites, to which the DCT then approved or denied students for on an individual basis. The next step would be to secure an interview. A recent interview last week revealed over 100 canidetes were being interviewed for the same placement within the agency which eliminates any potential thoughts relating to sites being less competitive in terms of how the program manages the initial process. I was lucky in that i was able to find 2 school supported sites located within an hour from my current location. most of the cohort would have to drive 3-4 hours to get to a school supported site. But naturally, the sites near me are dealing with populations that i question if i have the capacity and patience to work with but agree with a previous post in that i need to remain open...thank you all again!

Your school does not appear to posess adequate resources, support, or infrastructure to support a doctoral-level clinical training program. I think you are going to be set-up for a lot of disappointment in the coming years.

 

[boomshakalaka]

Hi All,

thank you again for your words and clarification. From a business standpoint, I can see now how some factors may make more sense. The program is not APA accredited, which for for a handful of reasons was not vital for me. However as an APA member myself, I would have thought i would have some leeway in terms of placement. There are roughly 20 students in the cohort seeking to confirm a placement to meet a 800 hour supervision. This degree requirement was expressed upfront upon applying for the program, but it was also expressed that we would have more assistance in confirming placement. The school provided students access to roughly 50 sites, to which the DCT then approved or denied students for on an individual basis. The next step would be to secure an interview. A recent interview last week revealed over 100 canidetes were being interviewed for the same placement within the agency which eliminates any potential thoughts relating to sites being less competitive in terms of how the program manages the initial process. I was lucky in that i was able to find 2 school supported sites located within an hour from my current location. most of the cohort would have to drive 3-4 hours to get to a school supported site. But naturally, the sites near me are dealing with populations that i question if i have the capacity and patience to work with but agree with a previous post in that i need to remain open...thank you all again!

Just for future reference, being an APA student affiliate will not provide you with any benefits when it comes to internship or practicum placement. Being a student "member" usually means that you paid your $60 bucks and have access to APA journals. It is entirely unrelated to APA accreditation. I would also caution you to be a bit more judicious in disclosing personal information (e.g. avatar picture, program location, calling DCT inept). This forum is frequented by students and TDs alike, so it's best to maintain some degree of anonymity.

 

[erg923]

Just for future reference, being an APA student affiliate will not provide you with any benefits when it comes to internship or practicum placement. Being a student "member" usually means that you paid your $60 bucks and have access to APA journals. It is entirely unrelated to APA accreditation. I would also caution you to be a bit more judicious in disclosing personal information (e.g. avatar picture, program location, calling DCT inept). This forum is frequented by students and TDs alike, so it's best to maintain some degree of anonymity.

Well, as a VA assistant TD, I actually want to know what program this. Its sounds like a mess....

Judicious use of name calling of superiors when one is still a student is of course recommended, however.

 

[deleted343839]

I know this is moving away from your original question, @drquinnpsyd , but what you are experiencing are huge red flags. Some of the reactions you're getting here are due to the fact that what you've described is far beneath the standards that are expected of psychology training programs. I can only speculate about the quality of the in-house training you're getting. I suggest that you do some soul searching because it sounds like you are being exploited for tuition money.

 

[ClinicalABA]

Hi All,

thank you again for your words and clarification. From a business standpoint, I can see now how some factors may make more sense. The program is not APA accredited, which for for a handful of reasons was not vital for me. However as an APA member myself, I would have thought i would have some leeway in terms of placement. There are roughly 20 students in the cohort seeking to confirm a placement to meet a 800 hour supervision. This degree requirement was expressed upfront upon applying for the program, but it was also expressed that we would have more assistance in confirming placement. The school provided students access to roughly 50 sites, to which the DCT then approved or denied students for on an individual basis. The next step would be to secure an interview. A recent interview last week revealed over 100 canidetes were being interviewed for the same placement within the agency which eliminates any potential thoughts relating to sites being less competitive in terms of how the program manages the initial process. I was lucky in that i was able to find 2 school supported sites located within an hour from my current location. most of the cohort would have to drive 3-4 hours to get to a school supported site. But naturally, the sites near me are dealing with populations that i question if i have the capacity and patience to work with but agree with a previous post in that i need to remain open...thank you all again!

I'm sorry that you may not have gotten the advice and type of help you were looking for with you initial post. My guess is that you've invested substantial resources (financial, time, etc.) into your studies, and are frustrated with this hurdle you are expected to overcome without any help from your program. I'd encourage you to take heed of a lot of the concerns that have been expressed in the previous posts. While we don't know you or any specifics about your programs (or even if you are real), the information you have presented suggests a strong possibility that you are enrolled in an program that has very little chance of preparing you for your chosen career in professional psychology. (including meeting minimum requirements for credentialing). Given the lack of APA accreditation, as well as the absence of effective support from your program in securing a REQUIRED component of your training, in thinks its safe to say that many of of assume that the difficulties you are experiencing in finding a practicum are likely to follow you as you progress to finding internships, post-docs, licensure, and jobs. Further, it's likely that many of the posters here think that you are being exploited/swindled/robbed, by a program that will cash your tuition checks with the knowledge that they are not really delivering on their promise of at least a minimum quality doctoral education. Hopefully, we are all wrong and this is just a problem with finding a practicum. Investigate, look at program data regarding internship rates, EPPP pass rates, licensure and occupational status of recent graduates, etc. If you don't know how to interpret that data, post it here and you'll get some good (and bad and ugly) advice on what it means. You're only in your second year- maybe there are resources within your program that you don't know about. Maybe- as many of us suspect- there are not adequate resources and you'd be best to cut your losses.

 

[boomshakalaka]

Well, as a VA assistant TD, I actually want to know what program this. Its sounds like a mess....

Judicious use of name calling of superiors when one is still a student is of course recommended, however.

At least limit it to around the water cooler, ya know!?

 

[erg923]

water cooler talk...

 

[smalltownpsych]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-chicago-school-of-psychology-accreditation-20140723-story.html
This could be a helpful story to read about a very similar school.