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Residency in Germany or Sweden

Discussion in 'Europe' started by socrat, Jul 18, 2008.

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  1. socrat

    socrat Medical Student

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    hi i am a Lebanese medical student finishing my bachelor this year from a university in lebanon , and i was thinking of doing my speciality training in germany or sweden, but the information i gathered were very vague in relation to my case.

    im more thinking about germany coz i can learn german before i go there but if anyone can give me info about sweden it would help .

    im not sure i understood everything so if u can tell me more i will appreciate it . so far i only got some info here is what i got.

    there are two state exams : do i have to do these and are they in german or can i do it in english. and there is the dr title thing what do i have to do specifically. and for my residency can i apply to the hospital directly or do i have the choice of taking a course or two at some university for some requirements that might be needed. do i get paid in residency cause i read somewhere that international students dont get paid in residency. i am considering to lose one year minimum if i had to do state exams , and i heard about the internship [ pre-residency] program can i do that while im preparing to take the tests. is it sufficient to do the 2nd state exam only coz the first seems to be irrelevant mostly and some subjects like physics i havent took since highschool.

    i can get a turkish citizenship easily, or a french but it might be harder will that help me in something.

    im thinking about studyin internal medicine , do i have to choose my subspeciality ahead before applying and how much does it take is it true it takes 6 years without the subspeciality and can i get a post in internal medicine easily in germany or is it highly competitive and feel free to offer me more information or suggestions about it.

    and if anyone knows how much i get paid in residency and internship it would help too coz i have to think abt how much ill spend there.
  2. GOMER

    GOMER another couple of months.

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    I can't tell you much, but a few things I can say:

    1.) If you can get get a french citizienship that will definitely help you, because all citizens of EU countries are treated the same, so at the same level of qualification it doesn't matter for an employer whether the applicant is German, French, Italian, Spanish, etc.

    2.) I don't know if you have to take exams, but if you do, they'll definitely be in German.

    3.) I say you'll get paid for your residency, there's a high demand for residents in Germany in allmost all specialties, nowadays there's no chance that German hospitals find an idiot who's willing to do that work for free.

    4.) Usually the so called "Regierungspräsidien" are responsible for issuing the "ärztliche Approbation" (license to practise medicine). I think you should contact them first, to find out if and which exams you'll have to take before they'll issue your "Approbation".

    5.) Being fluent in German is a must, especially in internal medicine. Most patients won't speak a single word of English (or any other foreign language) and all the paperwork will be in German.

    6.) Internal medicine isn't competitive at all, it shoulnd't be any problem to find a residency. Regaring the specialty: until a few years ago you started with a general residency in internal medicine and finished your residency after six years as a specialist for internal medicine ("Facharzt für Innere Medizin"), after that you could start your special training which took 2 years but they changed that (I think in 2005) to a system where you first do 3 years in "general" internal medicine and afterwards you do 3 years in your chosen specialty, that means you don't have to decide which specialty you want to do on your first day.
  3. GOMER

    GOMER another couple of months.

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    I just checked: As a non-EU citizien you won't get a "Approbation", but a permission to exercise medicine ("Berufserlaubnis"), this is sufficient for starting a residency. But anyways as you didn't finish your degree in the EU you'll have to contact a "Regierungspräsidium" for an individual assesment of your paperwork.
  4. GOMER

    GOMER another couple of months.

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    I forgot about the Dr. title: It isn't needed any more in Germany, at least not for residency.
  5. socrat

    socrat Medical Student

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    thanks gomer but does it mean that i dont have to do the state exams

    and if anyone else please more info

    thanks
  6. MaxMoonMD

    MaxMoonMD

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    I´m not very familiar with Residency Application for Non-EU Citizens, but I heard from a friend of mine that an acquintance of his from Kovoso applied for Urology in Germany and did not have to take the german exams.

    But I guess it is only possible in areas / hospitals where they are in desperate need for new Residents and can proof that they did not find a german or EU-Citizen for the job.

    Nevertheless, you should contact the proper officials.

    P.S.: I don´t know how the demand for Physicians is in Sweden right now, or if getting a Residency would be easier for you there, but last time I checked it was very popular amongst german physicians.

    Edit:
    If they would make you take the "Deutsches Staatsexamen" than I have my doubts that you could skip the first one, which admittedly "sucks".
    The small topics like Physics, Chemistry and Biology each only take 12-15 questions, but the whole exam is very theory-heavy (as we Germans "like" it).

    Regarding the payment. Some time ago I read that the average german Resident in his first year earn around 2000 Euros per month after taxes.
    It might be more or less depending if you are working in West or the old East-Germany, and how much night hours etc. you do.
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2008
  7. shreypete

    shreypete

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    Sweden is definitely in demand of physicians but there is a language requirement. Once you prove a good command of Swedish, then you will also have to take a medical competency exam. If you already have a post-graduate degree (fellowship), then you can directly enter into the probation program. Sweden also has very good working conditions and good financial benefits but it's also a bit hard to get into the system; but nevertheless possible (as many are following that path).

    If not, then you have to take the medical competency exam and then go through a probation work period for a certain amount of time (with a minimum of 6 months). This service is done in hospitals.
  8. GOMER

    GOMER another couple of months.

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    As I wrote, you'll have to contact one of the "Regierungspräsidien". This is info is also given on their homepages, non-EU graduates need to contact them in person for an individual consultation.

    And again, there is a high demand for residents all over the country, even in university hospitals. I'm sure they would also hire a non-EU-citizen, as long as you speak German and your degree is acepted, but as stated, if you really have the opportunity to become a French citizen this would increase your prospects a lot.
  9. aia

    aia

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    Hello! I also have a question or two regarding Sweden: what is the AT exam? Is it the equivalent of a medical residency exam in Sweden? And do u get paid while you are doing this internship, or is it just like being in school? Please, i have nowhere to turn for this answer...Can someone help me find out?
  10. rox

    rox ossified

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    Is there any European country that allow their "competency exam" to be waived by other exams like USMLE?

    Australia can exempt you from AMC's if you have passed all USMLE's plus did at least 2 years residency in the states.
  11. shreypete

    shreypete

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    I don't think any of the European countries accept the USMLEs (at least not that I know of). They all have their own exams for their apprenticeship/residency programs.
  12. rox

    rox ossified

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    I see. Thanks.
  13. koustubha

    koustubha

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    HELLO..
    Dear shreypete, and a all rest people
    My name is koustubha, finishing my MD in june 2009 from russia, iam a indian citizen. Willing to persue my residancy in some really worthful places in EU, (in sence of earning while doing residancy, and to have it more of in english), though i know al countrys have there own language thing, but though i was here in russia almost for 6 yeasr and have good comand in russian in all terms. Stil here are many doctors those are good enough in eng- language when it comes to some debate and to learn some thing important by there experience..!
    dear friend can you be more clear about the Scandinavin places??
    I fell sorry being not so known about this iam sorry if you would face any trouble while answering my questions, but i would be very very greatful if you could find some time and answer them..!
    No matters what but im look forward to get in EU as it have its own importance, to me..! After reading about sweden iam more interested in it..!
    Languge is not a big problim for me, i can learn it as is i will land up that place.
    So the core point is if its the Sweden of finland or some other place in EU which i should preffer more, as i have cleared you my side, please suggest me..))
    And if its possible to have chat with you by voip of any messenger i would be rather happy as i have only 8 months left to finish my 'UG' here in russia.
    And also if the residency is paid i meanif we are suppose to pay for our education i can afford to pay around 5000 euro per year.
    May be you must be finding it funny to see those little figures but its all wht i can.
    thanking you very much

    koustubh. bagul
    "[email protected]"
  14. AAA424

    AAA424

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    I'm final year medical student and I wondering if I can take my residency
    at sweden but I have some quetions. What is the AT exam?
    and other should I have before I apply for residency program.


    Thank you :D
  15. medsweden

    medsweden

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    Hi im a swedish medical student..the AT is a compulsory internship (18-24m long) here in sweden after you finish medical school which ends with a written AT-exam; if you pass, you are eligible for a swedish medical license..afterwards most will apply to ST (which is residency, i.e. specialization)..i would advise any foreign graduate who is interested to apply to sweden; in terms of language official courses are provided for newly arrived immigrants as these courses are essential for practice as a doctor in sweden (understandably so of course)..
    the swedish medical system is very friendly to foreign applicants as there is a huge shortage of doctors (for the past few years the majority of newly issued medical licenses, 60%, have been to foreign graduates!!), also the pay relative to work hours is highly attractive (a specialist earns 5000euros for a 40hr week), this is why we have had such a huge influx of german doctors who have much worse work benefits..

    good luck to you
  16. medsweden

    medsweden

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    oh yes, this is the official website for the swedish medical board which assesses applications from foreign graduates..www.socialstyrelsen.se..there is a section in english for those interested.
  17. navdoc007

    navdoc007

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    Hi medsweden
    this is very nice of you to try to help all confused IMGs.your post was quite informative but i still have few questions.I have heard to get a st post you have to do some vikarierat.can you explain me what this vikarierat stuff is and how do you apply for these posts ?Also can you tell me some places or university where i can learn swedish ?
    thanx in advance
  18. Marsupilami

    Marsupilami New Member

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    Hi medsweden,

    how are chances for foreign MDs to get into ST-läkare spots in bigger cities (Lund, Malmö, Uppsala and upwards ) ? Are there specialties which are harder to get into than others ?

    Hälsninger fran Tyskland,
    Mars
  19. depression66

    depression66

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    hi Gomer,
    i am new to this forum, i thought if i can really get any help....i am a non-EU grad, from UAE and i would like to do my residency / PG in Germany. So what do i have to do??....do i need to do the internship again??.....do i have to pay them for the whole years of residency??....as i heard they shall be paying me for my work??...please can YOU HELP ME.....

    please please
    kind regards:( help me
  20. mcbferreira

    mcbferreira

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    Hello everyone, I'm a junior doctor from Portugal attending the 1st year of Orthopaedics Residency. I'd like to change specialty and go abroad.

    I'd prefer nordic countries but it's impossible to learn the language in Portugal. German is much easier for me to have classes, so I'd like some info about residencies in German (although info about nordic countries is welcome too):
    - is it difficult to get a residency position in ORL/dermato/Ophtalmology?
    - are there language profiency tests (or any other kind of tests for an EU junior doctor)?
    - I was told there are some parts of Germany where foreigners are not welcome... do you know anything about this?

    Thank you very much for your time, I really appreciate this...
    Best regards
  21. BabiK

    BabiK

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    Hi;

    I wanted to know is there any chance for non-EU physicians to get into neurosurgery residency program in Germany? If yes, is it very competitive or requires special prerequisitions?

    Thanks in advance.
  22. Mera

    Mera

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    hey guys.. i am a med graduate from Cairo,Egypt.. i will start my Ped. residency here in few days and i was wondering what are the chances that i can do it in Belgium/Germany.. is it easy to get a spot in there.. i will start my language courses pretty soon.. i already know that to apply for a residency in Germany i'll need to take a language test.. but what about Belgium? any other requierments for that?

    thanks for your help:D
  23. GOMER

    GOMER another couple of months.

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    nothing is competitive in Germany, but you have to be fluent in German.

    German is a very difficult language, you'll need at least 9 month of full time training to be fluent.

    EU graduates don't need to fullfill any special requirements (except for the language), non-EU grads need to contact the "Regierungspräsidium" in the state (Bundesland) that they want to do their residency in. If you really want to go to Germany, start learning German as fast and as good as possible, afterwards contact the hospitals that offer your specialty and find out if they have vacancies, if they're interessted in you they help you with the requirements that you have to fullfill, there isn't a general answer to the question "What do I need, do I have to do exams, where can I go, blablabla".
  24. Bagueera

    Bagueera Bagueera

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    i'm a med student from Peru and i still have 3 1/2 years to finish the career. I'm really interested on doing a residency in Germany and i've already visited the regierungspräsidium for Baden-Würtemberg, but i don't know where to begin with all the papers and where to apply. I know it's still soon, but i want to know in advance what are the steps i have to take in order to get my license to practice Medicine and make my residency there.

    I had a couple of other questions too... my dad isn't very excited about me wanting to go to Germany (he's very pro USA), and he wants me to do rotations in an american hospital, in hopes of making my residency there. I don't want to do my residency there, but i was thinking, will making those stages help me get accepted on a german residency program or that just would work for USA? And, what are the chances i can get a job in a german hospital after i finish my residency there, being a foreign student?

    thanks for all the comments above, they really helped! and it would help me even more to get the answer to my own questions ;)
  25. Lini007

    Lini007

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    @
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2009
  26. HussainAliAhmad

    HussainAliAhmad

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    Hi i am a medical student from Saudi Arabia studying in my last year in Comenius University in Bratislava ( Slovakia ) .. i finish actually my study within on month .. and then my plan is to complete with resedency programe in Dermatology in Gerrmany .. so i am asking about the conditions of that .. and what are the next steps i should do to get that .. with they recognise my diploma directly or i have to make some exams for that ? i will have my diploma from EU but i am not EU citizen ..

    Best Wishes

    Hussain
  27. drsamarora

    drsamarora

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    hey buddy @hussain
    hows education in slovakia
    could you plz tell me something about fee structure
    mode of admission and procedure for an indian national stududying bachelor od medicine in ukraine'
    i want to do masters in surgery
    i have in first faculty of medcine prague
    masters is taught in english.
    and could you plz tell me living expenses
    as well as chances of doing some part time job/earnings
    or do i get some stipend while doing masters
    i shall be highly greatful to u.tnx in advance
  28. pattycakesMD

    pattycakesMD

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    Hi! I was wondering if anyone has an idea on getting into a residency program for radiology in Germany? How competitive is it? I'm from the Philippines. I underwent 4 years of medical school and 1 year internship. Is that compatible with the medical education system in Germany? Thanks!
  29. natushkaaa

    natushkaaa

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    hello I am From Georgia Republic. 25 year old medical student. I am first year student of residency in plastic surgery. I want to continue my study in Sweden and have some questions about this. Firstly how can i apply ? what exams i have to pass? what are the requirements ? Is my medical license ( which i gained in my country) valid in Sweden? and if not what are the steps and requirements to apply in residency ?
  30. Amitkumar

    Amitkumar

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    Hey friends, I m new to this forum,
    My name is Amit, I am in 2nd year of Medicine in Ukraine, Odessa National Medical University, I am Indian citizen.
    Guys, I really need a perfect and complete advice about procedure & qualification required to get admission in any of German medical schools for Post-graduate and residency programms in Neuro-surgery.
    I dont have any idea about is it possible to get admission in german medical schools for non-EU citizen.
    Which is best university to study, what is the fees structure..etc
    Please any one, please please do reply me soon
    Thanks..:)
  31. angel58

    angel58

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    hi i am dr.sadaf iqbal.i recently graduated from KING EDWARD MEDICAL UNIVERSITY LAHORE PAKISTAN.now i want residency in medicine in germany.can you guide me what is the procedure of enrollment in germany?what exams do i need to take for that?and what are the other requirements for a non-EU student?
  32. Seanxavier

    Seanxavier

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    lol im going for mbbs n Romania this year and for you if Germany your in trouble reply to this message fist

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