Rosalind Franklin

[CerseiLannister]

Is anyone else a bit bothered by the pervasive use of the nickname "Rosy" when referring to Rosalind Franklin on these forums? I did not apply to that school, but I am still annoyed when I see it used.

Records show that she was widely treated unfairly by her chauvinistic peers. Rosalind was called "Rosy", a name she despised, typically behind her back when male colleagues were referred to by their proper names.

Why are we continuing that ugly legacy?

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[TXMED_1695]

Funny to see this, because I just took my genetics final.

Browsing the internet to become offended?

 

[cke11]

I really wish our generation wasn't so sensitive about every aspect of society, but alas.

I understand that it can be annoying, but I had no idea that "Rosy" was a name that Rosalind despised. I also think a lot of people saying "Rosy" had no idea either. I will stop saying it in your honor!

 

[CerseiLannister]

I really wish our generation wasn't so sensitive about every aspect of society, but alas.

I understand that it can be annoying, but I had no idea that "Rosy" was a name that Rosalind despised. I also think a lot of people saying "Rosy" had no idea either. I will stop saying it in your honor!

Exactly, many people do not know. Fair enough. That is why I made a post.

 

[Wolfpack93]

I really wish our generation wasn't so sensitive about every aspect of society, but alas.

I understand that it can be annoying, but I had no idea that "Rosy" was a name that Rosalind despised. I also think a lot of people saying "Rosy" had no idea either. I will stop saying it in your honor!

It's Cersei, she gets offended over everything. Also Rosy is four characters while Rosalind Franklin is 16 so I think its more of a saving time thing than a disrespectful thing. I actually prefer to call it RF for maximum efficiency

 

[TXMED_1695]

It seems abnormal that someone with the board name "CerseiLannister", is offended over the usage of a name. Makes sense, wait, what?

 

[Goro]

Because it's simply a word, I don't feel like writing Rosalind, the real Rosalind Franklin is dead, and no one from the school has ever complained about it.


And since it also annoys a thin-skinned SJW, I'll go with that too.

Is anyone else a bit bothered by the pervasive use of the nickname "Rosy" when referring to Rosalind Franklin on these forums? I did not apply to that school, but I am still annoyed when I see it used.

Records show that she was widely treated unfairly by her chauvinistic peers. Rosalind was called "Rosy", a name she despised, typically behind her back when male colleagues were referred to by their proper names.

Why are we continuing that ugly legacy?

 

[CerseiLannister]

Because it's simply a word, I don't feel like writing Rosalind, the real Rosalind Franklin is dead, and no one from the school has ever complained about it.


And since it also annoys a thin-skinned SJW, I'll go with that too.

With all due respect, don't words matter in medicine?

As to the fact she is not alive, I don't think that mitgates anything. A lot of her mysoginistic defamation came posthumously after all.

 

[TXMED_1695]

Cersei Lanniser - defender of women, expect women with the last name, "Stark."

With all due respect, don't words matter in medicine?

As to the fact she is not alive, I don't think that mitgates anything. A lot of her mysoginistic defamation came posthumously after all.

 

[Goro]

Don't even think of going to med school or doing a residency in NYC.

She's still dead. She won't care. Your attitude is just as dangerous to liberty as Der Trumpenfuhrer's.

With all due respect, don't words matter in medicine?

As to the fact she is not alive, I don't think that mitgates anything. A lot of her mysoginistic defamation came posthumously after all.

 

[Wolfpack93]

With all due respect, don't words matter in medicine?

As to the fact she is not alive, I don't think that mitgates anything. A lot of her mysoginistic defamation came posthumously after all.

As did all of her recognition.

 

[TJ15]

Because it's simply a word, I don't feel like writing Rosalind, the real Rosalind Franklin is dead, and no one from the school has ever complained about it.


And since it also annoys a thin-skinned SJW, I'll go with that too.

I often hear people say "what a sensitive SJW" when they make racist/gay slurs, or say stuff about women that would fly 10-20 years ago, but are now considered rude and offensive.

 

[Goro]

Please stop the straw man arguments. We're NOT discussing the "N-word" or similar. We talking about using a shorthand for a medical school named after a dead scientist, and someone who isn't even a student at the school has her knickers in a knot about it.

Where's @sb247? He ought to get a kick out of this.

I often hear people say "what a sensitive SJW" when they make racist/gay slurs, or say stuff about women that would fly 10-20 years ago, but are now considered rude and offensive.

 

[TJ15]

Please stop the straw man arguments. We're NOT discussing the "N-word" or similar. We talking about using a shorthand for a medical school named after a dead scientist, and someone who isn't even a student at the school has her knickers in a knot about it.

Where's @sb247? He ought to get a kick out of this.

Never said you were. Just pointing out a phrase.

 

[TXMED_1695]

it went from insensitive, to misogynistic, to racist/gay in 12 posts! Record?

I often hear people say "what a sensitive SJW" when they make racist/gay slurs, or say stuff about women that would fly 10-20 years ago, but are now considered rude and offensive.

 

[Goro]

Expecting Burnett's Law to be involved in about another 15 posts.

it went from insensitive, to misogynistic, to racist/gay in 12 posts! Record?

 

[TJ15]

it went from insensitive, to misogynistic, to racist/gay in 12 posts! Record?

Lol

 

[CerseiLannister]

I used "mysoginistic" because the initial use of "Rosy" was clearly mysoginistic, along with the repeated complaints by her peers that she didn't pretty herself up/ wear lipstick to lab.

I am not accusing anyone of mysoginism, but we are continuing a legacy of mysoginism perpetrated against female science faculty, aware or not.

How come we don't see a deragatory nickname used against Einstein (I either see "Einstein" or AECOM)? Mainly because there is no legacy of male descrimination. If someone can name me one cute nickname for any of the many medical schools named after a man, then I would happily concede you have a good point.

 

[ndafife]

How come we don't see a deragatory nickname used against Einstein (I either see "Einstein" or AECOM)? Mainly because there is no legacy of male descrimination. If someone can name me one cute nickname for any of the many medical schools named after a man, then I would happily concede you have a good point.

If there were an easier way to say Einstein I'm sure people would use it.

But if you want to start throwing around some anti-Semitic phrases to describe the school in the name of fairness, be my guest

 

[tmazz235]

I used "mysoginistic" because the initial use of "Rosy" was clearly mysoginistic, along with the repeated complaints by her peers that she didn't pretty herself up/ wear lipstick to lab.

I am not accusing anyone of mysoginism, but we are continuing a legacy of mysoginism perpetrated against female science faculty, aware or not.

How come we don't see a deragatory nickname used against Einstein (I either see "Einstein" or AECOM)? Mainly because there is no legacy of male descrimination. If someone can name me one cute nickname for any of the many medical schools named after a man, then I would happily concede you have a good point.

I call him lil' Alby

 

[Lost In Transcription]

I think OP's point that it is rude to continue using a nickname that she hated (and was used against her in an antagonistic, sexist way) and that it might be nice to make an effort to stop calling it that. RF seems faster and much more polite. Dead or not, she did enough important work that she should be respected...it's not about how she feels about it as a dead person but the principle of respect.

Doesn't really seem like something to call out SJW on, @Goro. However, the rest of the posts did tend to go in that direction...Can't support those!

and yes, get in here sb247

 

[tmazz235]

Rosalind did indeed contribute greatly to science, but please baby gurl, throw on a little lipstick. No one wants to see those lizard lips up in the lab

 

[Lost in Translation]

RF? Radio frequency?

 

[Lost In Transcription]

Rosalind did indeed contribute greatly to science, but please baby gurl, throw on a little lipstick. No one wants to see those lizard lips up in the lab

 

[CerseiLannister]

I am ignoring the ad hominem remarks, suggestions to be anti-Semitic, and the poor attempts at humor by some. In case anyone is just genuinely interested, here are James Watson's remarks in his 1968 memoir:

"The real problem, then, was Rosy [...] Clearly Rosy had to go or be put in her place. … The thought could not be avoided that the best home for a feminist was in another person’s lab.”

At the end of the day, it is up to an individual if he or she wants to use "Rosy". I see quotes like the one above and then I see users continuing to use that insult-nickname today, and I think it is in poor taste. If that makes me a SJW, I really do not care.

 

[Chelsea FC]

I am ignoring the ad hominem remarks, suggestions to be anti-Semitic, and the poor attempts at humor by some. In case anyone is just genuinely interested, here are James Watson's remarks in his 1968 memoir:

"The real problem, then, was Rosy [...] Clearly Rosy had to go or be put in her place. … The thought could not be avoided that the best home for a feminist was in another person’s lab.”

At the end of the day, it is up to an individual if he or she wants to use "Rosy". I see quotes like the one above and then I see users continuing to use that insult-nickname today, and I think it is in poor taste. If that makes me a SJW, I really do not care.

It doesnt make u a SJW its what you think and thats totally fine. I and other people think that Rosy isnt a big deal , u dont like the word Rosy and think its poor taste to use it then more power to you! But just ignore other people when they use it simple as that.

 

[eteshoe]

I am ignoring the ad hominem remarks, suggestions to be anti-Semitic, and the poor attempts at humor by some. In case anyone is just genuinely interested, here are James Watson's remarks in his 1968 memoir:

"The real problem, then, was Rosy [...] Clearly Rosy had to go or be put in her place. … The thought could not be avoided that the best home for a feminist was in another person’s lab.”

At the end of the day, it is up to an individual if he or she wants to use "Rosy". I see quotes like the one above and then I see users continuing to use that insult-nickname today, and I think it is in poor taste. If that makes me a SJW, I really do not care.

But Watson's always been an a**hole so his words really should be taken with a grain of salt. I get where you're coming from but you really have to ignore all this. I feel like as a pre-med you have a whole slew of other issues that should be occupying your time.

IRL I have a hard name to pronounce (thnx to being an immigrant) for many Americans and yet I can't get offended every time someone says my name wrong (and some people do it even after being corrected). It's a name, some people don't mean any offense and some people DGAF - pick your battles and move on.

 

[Lost in Translation]

Basically what @eteshoe and @Goro said. If this offends you, then you're in for a rude awakening when you start down the path of medicine. And you don't even need to wait until med school; just volunteering you'll see a lot of "not Kosher" but not necessarily inappropriate or illegal stuff. Get used to it.

 

[Goro]

A) Rosy as a name is not derogatory.
Just ask this lady (with a variant spelling):



B) Rosalind Franklin has been dead for 50 years. We're NOT talking about her.

C) We're discussing a freaking medical school, NOT like a live human being.

D) It's shorter and easier to write Einstein. Perhaps you hadn't noticed that we're not using the full name? Are we disrespecting the greatest scientist of all time by not writing out his full name? Are we being misanthropic by doing so?

E) To protect your thin skin, apply the Ignore function in future posts.

I used "mysoginistic" because the initial use of "Rosy" was clearly mysoginistic, along with the repeated complaints by her peers that she didn't pretty herself up/ wear lipstick to lab.

I am not accusing anyone of mysoginism, but we are continuing a legacy of mysoginism perpetrated against female science faculty, aware or not.

How come we don't see a deragatory nickname used against Einstein (I either see "Einstein" or AECOM)? Mainly because there is no legacy of male descrimination. If someone can name me one cute nickname for any of the many medical schools named after a man, then I would happily concede you have a good point.

 

[Lawpy]

D) It's shorter and easier to write Einstein. Perhaps you hadn't noticed that we're not using the full name? Are we disrespecting the greatest scientist of all time by not writing out his full name? Are we being misanthropic by doing so?

I take offense to the bold. Newton is clearly better than Einstein

/fake outrage

 

[CerseiLannister]

Basically what @eteshoe and @Goro said. If this offends you, then you're in for a rude awakening when you start down the path of medicine. And you don't even need to wait until med school; just volunteering you'll see a lot of "not Kosher" stuff. Get used to it.

Again, ad hominem. @Goro (some of the bullet points) too. Not interested in this.

As far as arguments go, I respectfully disagree with the logic on these posts. Watson was a prime example, but many of his colleagues also called Rosalind "Rosey" in an antagonistic manner.

Why are we using "Rosey" instead of "Rose" if we are trying to save our precious time? It is a vestige, a direct artifact of Watson et al's mysogyny. If we were tasked with writing a paper "A History of Mysogyny in Academia and Science", I bet we would all use the use of "Rosey" and her treatment as one of the prime examples. Yes, she is dead and has been dead for quite a while. Does that excuse posthumous mysogynistic language (Watson's memoir, as an example again)? I think not. Moreover, I think using the name Rosey to refer to Rosalind Franklin carries on the awful legacy from its origin.

 

[Goro]

Again, we're talking about a medical school, not the actual person. If she were still alive, we'd probably just be writing "Franklin" or "Dr Franklin" in referring to her. Whatever language Watson used to get her skin is history, and, more to the point, irrelevant.

Look, I'm not going to convince you, and you're going to convince me, so let's leave it at that.

Does that excuse posthumous mysogynistic language (Watson's memoir, as an example again)? I think not. Moreover, I think using the name Rosey to refer to Rosalind Franklin carries on the awful legacy from its origin.

 

[CerseiLannister]

Again, we're talking about a medical school, not the actual person. If she were still alive, we'd probably just be writing "Franklin" or "Dr Franklin" in referring to her. Whatever language Watson used to get her skin is history, and, more to the point, irrelevant.

Look, I'm not going to convince you, and you're going to convince me, so let's leave it at that.

I don't think Watson's language is irrelevant because perhaps you wouldn't be using "Rosey" if it weren't for him. But OK, fair enough RE the second comment.

 

[Chelsea FC]

I don't think Watson's language is irrelevant because perhaps you wouldn't be using "Rosey" if it weren't for him. But OK, fair enough RE the second comment.

See bold point. This is your opinion man. Stop trying to tell people how to talk.

 

[Lost In Transcription]

Was OP even offended/thin-skinned?

I took it as a PSA...

 

[NimbleNavigator]

EDIT: After some thought, and after reading replies to this post from other members, I have come to the conclusion that this post was a bad idea.

Please excuse my outburst.

 

[CerseiLannister]

I was going to stop posting in this thread, but I just want to dissociate myself from @NimbleNavigator 's language against goro (I respect him and his help to many students) and what is written in nimble's signature.

 

[TJ15]

@NimbleNavigator
What issue do you have with the modern day feminist movement?

 

[NimbleNavigator]

@NimbleNavigator
What issue do you have with the modern day feminist movement?

This sums it up well, IMO:

https://www.theodysseyonline.com/huge-problem-modern-feminism

 

[Lost In Transcription]

Holy crap @NimbleNavigator
just holy crap

I dunno why you have such a big problem with @Goro...he is one of the most helpful people on SDN. I know people disagree with him and that's fine, but yikes.

Remember to respect everyone, not just those who are dead...
(unless they are insane or actually terrible people)

 

[TJ15]

This sums it up well, IMO:

https://www.theodysseyonline.com/huge-problem-modern-feminism

I mean...."Men complete women and women complete men. One must fully embrace their natural capabilities and characteristics rather than trying to become something that we're not." My gay and lesbian friends probably don't agree with this.
Also, I don't get the women are rejecting their natural capabilities and trying to become something we're not. Women are considered more nurturing than men, so should men stop trying to embrace that and stop becoming physicians, a very nurturing profession? This sounds like a right wing article that wants women back in the kitchen (nothing wrong if a woman chooses this, but overall the tone was off for me).

 

[NimbleNavigator]

I mean...."Men complete women and women complete men. One must fully embrace their natural capabilities and characteristics rather than trying to become something that we're not." My gay and lesbian friends probably don't agree with this.
Also, I don't get the women are rejecting their natural capabilities and trying to become something we're not. Women are considered more nurturing than men, so should men stop trying to embrace that and stop becoming physicians, a very nurturing profession? This sounds like a right wing article that wants women back in the kitchen (nothing wrong if a woman chooses this, but overall the tone was off for me).

Yeah I'm not saying I agree with the article 100%, and I agree that your point seems very valid. Still, I think that it's a mistake that modern day feminism constantly tries to proclaim superiority over, rather than equality with, men.

 

[Wolfpack93]

 

[Lost In Transcription]

Yeah I'm not saying I agree with the article 100%, and I agree that your point seems very valid. Still, I think that it's a mistake that modern day feminism constantly tries to proclaim superiority over, rather than equality with, men.

I don't think it does. I think that is an idea propagated by people uncomfortable with something about minorities/women/those historically oppressed really speaking up for themselves, and who only get fuel for their fires from crap like uneducated people on Tumblr or Buzzfeed.

Imagine if someone thought the only way to think about small-government/libertarian ideals was through Alex Jones or Breitbart.

 

[Goro]

This is why I have the fool on "ignore". But feel free to report if there's a TOS violation...I do enjoy the sound of the banhammer smacking loose cannons in the middle of their foreheads...right above their single eyes.

Holy crap @NimbleNavigator
just holy crap

I dunno why you have such a big problem with @Goro...he is one of the most helpful people on SDN. I know people disagree with him and that's fine, but yikes.

Remember to respect everyone, not just those who are dead...
(unless they are insane or actually terrible people)

 

[Lost In Transcription]

This is why I have the fool on "ignore". But feel free to report if there's a TOS violation...I do enjoy the sound of the banhammer smacking loose cannons in the middle of their foreheads...right above their single eyes.

But then you miss out on all the fun!

 

[NimbleNavigator]

This is why I have the fool on "ignore". But feel free to report if there's a TOS violation...I do enjoy the sound of the banhammer smacking loose cannons in the middle of their foreheads...right above their single eyes.

I honestly couldn't care less if I'm banned from this site, but I do get upset when people are disrespectful of the dead. I think it's in large part due to my Asian upbringing. I think I took it too far, though, and I regret it. Thankfully, I'm not so proud that I'm not willing to admit my mistakes.

Also, even though we both claim that we ignore each other, I'm pretty sure we secretly don't

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Was OP even offended/thin-skinned?

I took it as a PSA...

In the first paragraph of the OP, he asks if anyone else is a bothered by it, and then a couple lines later says it annoys him. I think that's a pretty good indication that it at least bothers him.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I honestly couldn't care less if I'm banned from this site, but I do get upset when people are disrespectful of the dead. I think it's in large part due to my Asian upbringing. I think I took it too far, though, and I regret it. Thankfully, I'm not so proud that I'm not willing to admit my mistakes.

Also, even though we both claim that we ignore each other, I'm pretty sure we secretly don't

No, I'm pretty sure goro has you on ignore.

 

[Lost In Transcription]

In the first paragraph of the OP, he asks if anyone else is a bothered by it, and then a couple lines later says it annoys him. I think that's a pretty good indication that it at least bothers him.

Annoyance is very different than being "thin skinned" and so offended that they can't handle it (as everyone saying WOW YOU CAN'T DEAL WITH THIS WAIT UNTIL YOU ARE A PHYSICIAN)