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ROSS vs. Antigua's medical school AUA

Discussion in 'Caribbean' started by gucci2513, 02.11.10.

  1. gucci2513

    gucci2513

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    Can I also have your opinions about these two schools please
  2. IndianVercetti

    IndianVercetti

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    omg, didnt you start the Ross thread yesterday.... not again!!
  3. serenade

    serenade Medical Alchemist

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    Go to valuemd.com

    However i will say that AUA has a smaller class size. A friend of mine is going to AUA and is relatively doing good but yah....
  4. gucci2513

    gucci2513

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    lol yea i did and i realllyyyyyy appreciate that people gave their feedback... Im thinking about these 2 schools and just want to get as much feedback as i can. I rly want to be an MD and want to get my education in the caribbean ( i like the island life).. so i want to know what people think
  5. gucci2513

    gucci2513

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    I also heard that residency spot only depend on ur USMLE score... so if you get a high score, ull get a spot regardless where u did ur basic sciences.
  6. serenade

    serenade Medical Alchemist

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    Island life? Um what exactly do you like about it other then paying 3x as much as usual for food and half of it being spoiled anyway? The only island i've ever been too that maintains a decent level of civilization is the Grand Cayman. It has a school on it called St.Mattews, however its degree is illegal in 20 states.
  7. serenade

    serenade Medical Alchemist

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    Um.. You'll need to score 20 points higher on the Usmle to get into the residency spot you want. For example a US MD/DO will need just to pass the usmle to get into IM around a 180, you'll need a 200. Btw if you fail the Usmle your done, average ross/aua medical school student fails the Uslme around 56% of the time.

    Also your rotations for 3rd and 4th year will be unknown. They can be amazingly good or crap and end your career there.

    If you can get into a US DO school i'd recommend going there.
  8. womp

    womp

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    Saba is a decent island, so is St. Maarten (AUC).

    But Dominica? That's pretty close to third world. Med school is tough as it is, you don't want that kind of distraction.
  9. serenade

    serenade Medical Alchemist

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    Isnt saba like a uninhabited or almost uninhabited island?
  10. J1515

    J1515 Member

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    Am I the only one smelling a troll?
  11. Caesar

    Caesar In Memory of Riley Jane Administrator SDN Senior Moderator

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    please post threads in the appropriate forum. The Caribbean forum is a good place for threads about the Caribbean schools.
  12. Pathlesstrvld

    Pathlesstrvld

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    Actually, humanoid like creatures have been spotted, and some report dinosaur activity.
  13. Brob311

    Brob311

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    I will be more than happy to tell you which school should choose. AUA is a med school mainly composed of people who failed out of Ross. I have many former classmates who failed out of Ross who transferred there.

    In fact, there was a representative from AUA right near the campus during our appeal week for students who were appealing being kicked out, and he would wait outside the building and offer them a spot at AUA.

    Besides this, AUA is not accredited in all 50 states, Ross is. AUA does not receive federal loans...Ross does. check out the Match stats from Ross and AUA in previous years and that will show you that you have better opportunities to match a better places than AUA.

    Hope this helps. :thumbup:
  14. marble30

    marble30

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    An area on the island also goes by the name "Jurassic Park".
  15. dragonfly99

    dragonfly99

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    Wow, that's wild...
    as a non IMG I would say to stay away from any school not accepted in all 50 US states, if you have any other option at all as far as going to med school. Don't make your life harder than it needs to be.
  16. LinhNguyen121

    LinhNguyen121

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    how many states AUA accredited? Is California one of them?
  17. Baller MD

    Baller MD

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    Do yourself a favor and apply to DO school before going the Caribbean route.
  18. jakeislove

    jakeislove MS IV

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    I'm always amazed at the expertise pre-meds have about everything, LOL!

    As an AUA student, I can say the loan situation is unbearable. Rates range from 6.99 - 13.74% and we have to make interest payments while in school.
  19. HotandCold

    HotandCold Senior member

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    Pre-meds know whats up.
    20 medical schools have opened up in the last 8 years, half of them opening in the last 5 years. And you've got about a dozen that just opened or are in the process of opening. All those IM and FM residencies folks from AUA and all the other places compete for are going to be filled to capacity.

    That's going to steam roll IMGs and FMGs out of house and home. No one who can help it should be applying to a non-US school, especially now. It's a horrible decision for anyone who wants to practice anything in the United States.
  20. jakeislove

    jakeislove MS IV

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    That's working under the assumption that US MD grads can't be out competed by DO and Carribean graduates.

    Few posters are more opinionated on this site than pre-meds. Wile E Coyote would be jealous of the super geniuses that post here.
  21. HotandCold

    HotandCold Senior member

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    Yeah, but think about it- pre meds are better versed in all this than a med student. I just spent 2 years not seeing sunlight and having anxiety attacks about step 1. They spend their time reading everything about every school they can find on a map.

    But here are my 2 cents; US MDs are not out-competed by Carribean grads, at least not in the last 15 years. Before that- sure. And the ACGME has absorbed the AOA, and that merger makes things significantly worse for IMGs.

    A sizable portion of the schools opening are actually DO schools. DOs are bringing their own residencies (which they don't have too many of). Currently, all DO programs are being forced to apply for ACGME accreditation (with "osteopathic focus") or they will be shut down (I don't see any getting shut down). Historically, a huge portion of DOs already go into somewhat competitive (albeit largely nonsurgical, save for the midwest) MD residencies and almost all DOs do ACGME fellowships already. In effect- DOs will not exist as a separate entity. The endgame is that they'll have the same match.

    Caribbean students are not competitive as it is. Many use hospitals I rotate at as rotation/educational sites, contracted by their schools abroad. But these hospitals don't accept them as applicants. I've spoken to the DME at my hospital, and a few medical directors (who also happened to be my attendings) about their outlook on FMG/Carib positions, and it's all quite negative. I've got plenty of friends who are undergrads who are/were considering the Caribbean. And the way things are going, I make it a point to tell them that it's not a good idea.

    Over the last 10 years, we've had no where near enough US physicians to fill residency spots- MD or DO. And many of these less desirable residencies go unfilled and consistently do not accept FMGs/Caribs. As in, they accept FMG applications (because that's a few extra bucks to med ed) but they throw them out and go without all their spots filled.

    Now, essentially overnight, we're going to have too many medical students in the states to train everyone. And unless medicare decides to make it rain and fund some more spots (which doesn't look like it's happening) you'll see US grads going without.

    You're right- Caribbean students will still be applying. But realistically, do you think a government funded residency system is going to prefer students who pay money to external organizations over its own closed-system students? I can't say it's not, but I can find a logical reason why it wouldn't. It just doesn't make as much money, and that doesn't make sense. And if I was a premed, I would want someone to tell me than before I end up with a CaribMD and no prospects in the 50 states 5 years later.
  22. jakeislove

    jakeislove MS IV

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    ^ There's a pretty big difference between opinion and knowledge. :)

    A few here have likely cured several cancers and solved world hunger between posts, LOL!
  23. HotandCold

    HotandCold Senior member

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    Very little of what I typed was opinion. In fact, just 2 things.
    - Medicare won't fund new residencies because we have enough
    - Caribbean students are less appealing to programs than US students

    Everything else was fact. Actually, one of the things I said was wrong. There aren't a dozen med schools opening- there are 20. In addition to the ones that have already opened.
  24. jakeislove

    jakeislove MS IV

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    I was referring to what many pre meds post.

    things will be more difficult for Caribbean grads and some schools will likely close.

    it'll be interesting to see how things change here in a few years when US MDS are battling with DOS for undesirable residency slots.
  25. HotandCold

    HotandCold Senior member

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    Oh, my mistake! I though you took a deep shot at me.

    I wonder if the larger Caribbean schools would just try their hand at relocating to the US and getting accredited- ceasing to be Caribbean schools. They've stockpiled boatloads of money, it'd only make sense. So much uncertainty. I think the merger between MDs and DOs wont change a thing for many years to come- I'm a DO student, do program directors have told me that they don't expect any MD applicants anytime soon, and that they'd favor DOs because of hospital connections and whatnot.
  26. jakeislove

    jakeislove MS IV

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    I'm still curious to see what requirements DO programs will establish for MD applicants.

    Sorry about the perceived shot. I'm using a tablet and attempts to avoid excessive tapping or dictating (and editing) occasionally makes posts read a little terse.

    If new DO schools can be opened, why can't an offshore school couldn't relocate?
  27. HotandCold

    HotandCold Senior member

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    Oh, no problem.

    It takes years for schools in the US to open. All these DO schools started their accreditation process years before anyone knew about them- through their own system, AACOM. And that process has always been held to the same standards that MD schools have been held to by their ACGME. Legally, in America, the ACGME and AACOM are both just as valid as each other- in the government's eyes. They're both American medical doctor organizations. In fact, many lectures give their same lectures for MD and DO schools- i.e. Wayne State and MSUCOM. It's a whole different ballgame when you're talking about foreign medical schools- they don't have any hospital system backing in the US, and don't have roots in the US. For example- 4 years ago in Detroit, Beaumont Hospital opened a small medical school and was able to do so because of its reputation and physician staff, history and money.

    Besides- the ACGME has merged with the AACOM (and the AOA). DOs get 2/5 seats on the ACGMEs board- which is a lot of representation when you think about the percentage of DOs in the US. But then again, the number of DOs is rising quickly. So there's never really been a similarity legally between IMGs/Caribbean grads and DOs. DOs have always, at least legally, been the same as US MDs. And now, they're part of the same organization. There's actually been talk of a degree name change too by the DME at my hospital- she thinks it's a realistic possibility. Which I am not a fan of.
  28. KyleV

    KyleV

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    Can you speak more about your experience with AUA?
  29. jakeislove

    jakeislove MS IV

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    Not really. It would reveal too much personal information.

    The climate is changing a great deal. Between the combining match and no significant increase in residency slots, I'd be very wary. There is some backroom talk of ranking Caribbean schools but as an outsider there's no information that's been shared with me.

    The loan rates are horrible. To get 6.99%, one need an EQ score above 775. At 700 you'll get 13.74%!!! No amount of "You'll be fine after residency." Can make that taste any better.
  30. Skip Intro

    Skip Intro Registered User

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    HotandCold,

    You make several good points with some slight misconceptions. As a relative newcomer to this discussion on this forum (haven't seen you post here much on it), this is a better starting point:

    http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/why-is-the-caribbean-a-bad-decision.1029336/#post-14753759

    Bottom line: the demographics will always win out. And, the expanding number of spots in the U.S. is good for otherwise potential Caribbean students, not bad for them. It's bad for the Caribbean schools though. Most of those schools will not move to the U.S. if they are pressured by the demographic shift into U.S. schools.

    Right now, Ross and St. Georges alone place over 1,500 graduates per year into residency training. Many of these students would've gotten into a U.S. program if there had been more spots available. The people sitting in the chair in the classroom, wherever that classroom might be, have to come from somewhere.

    -Skip
    jakeislove likes this.
  31. HotandCold

    HotandCold Senior member

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    Thanks for the link. Yeah, I didn't come here during preclerkship years at all. I'm trying to follow all the politics in medicine these days.

    I get that the expansion of schools is good for certain potential Caribbean candidates- anyone nearing acceptance into a MD school in the states is going to benefit from this. And the new DO schools may maintain a lot of the non-traditional student tradition most DO schools have. But there are also a lot of people who don't get in who simply stay here and reapply. And I assume they'd dwindle the numbers down slightly.

    What I generally express to my friends and people who ask, is fear of a student's residency prospects as a Caribbean grad in the coming years... From the looks of it, by the time a lot of these folks graduate from a place like Ross, St. George, or AUA, they'll be competing with a much larger "indigenous" pool of applicants. Furthermore, I'm curious about the implications of all the schools that are currently pumping out their first graduating classes in the US on students already well underway in Caribbean schools. There are a fair number of schools I can think of that are having their first graduating class next year, and the year after that.

    So from my perspective and understanding, this change is bad for the Caribbean schools, and their current students/people who matriculated and are going there.

    You don't think Ross stockpiled enough money to buy a building in the US, shack up with a hospital system and apply for accreditation? Or do you just think that everywhere that planned on open, is already doing so and the floodgates are closed?
  32. KyleV

    KyleV

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    Among many other factors (no mcat requirement, 2nd tier Carib school) their loan situation seems sketchy
  33. KyleV

    KyleV

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    Also, how does a student at AUA pay their interest on their loans while attending? Thanks
  34. jakeislove

    jakeislove MS IV

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    From the loan.

    Laugh all you want. It's no joke, LOL!
  35. Skip Intro

    Skip Intro Registered User

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    You're (potentially) confusing logic and financial sense. Never the twain shall meet.

    -Skip

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