Should I apply before my second MCAT score is released?

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chrisharimlee

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Hey everyone,

This year is my first time applying to a MD/PhD program. Last year I applied for just the MD path, but I was unfortunately not accepted off any wait lists.

Last year I didn't think I would be remotely competitive for a MD/PhD so I never gave it a shot. This year I'm thinking might as well give it a shot.

Could I pick a low ranked research schools to apply to first, and then add other schools after my 2nd MCAT score is revealed? Is there any remote opportunity of an interview?
My GPA: cumulative 3.65, science 3.7
1st MCAT 2012: 30 (PS 8, VR 10, BS 12)
2nd mcat took July 2: practice scores ranged from high 20's (my beginning practice tests) to 37 (couple days before my mcat)
Graduated 2013 with a microbio major.

Research experience; I'm going to go out on a limb and say lots?:
-Same infectious diseases lab at my undergrad college: from 2010-2014
first year: got class credit, then worked as a lab assistant 2 summers and during my junior and senior years. Also worked part time after graduation.
Many different cool projects, couple posters, one paper publication
-Worked part time at brewery as a quality assurance lab technician: 2013-2014
wrote some SOP's, did a majority of our microbio lab work, designed some experiments for improving beer clarity
-just got a job at the CDC to help optimize high throughput screening of a virus
job duration will be a year

Pretty good EC, and good LOR's

Am I making a terrible decision applying to MSTPs? and should I apply to some schools before my second MCAT score comes out? I think my application will be good to send out very soon.

Thanks everyone for your kindness and helping me out!

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What's the reputation of your undergrad? Trying to figure out the disconnect between decent GPA and lower MCAT score. This may not be enough research experience, given the brewery is not considered biomedical research.
 
What changed from last year to this year that made you think about MD-PhD, besides retaking the MCAT? Do you want a research career?
 
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What changed from last year to this year that made you think about MD-PhD, besides retaking the MCAT? Do you want a research career?

I've realized there are so many more career opportunities with having a MD-PhD. I do in fact want to have a research career, and an ID medical specialty appeals to me. However the dagger to my plans was that I never thought I would be competitive for a MD-PhD program. My plan was, seeing as I had lower stats, to get into med school first then apply for a PhD. That plan didn't work out. During my gap year I did improve my research stats. I got a publication, gained more experience in a good research lab, got a job at the CDC for my next gap year, was able to teach a few undergrads who worked under me. Thought this could help show my affinity towards research. Hopefully, with my next MCAT score I am slightly more competitive. Thought I'd give it a shot, but are my hopes totally unattainable? Do I have a non-existent chance atm?

What's the reputation of your undergrad? Trying to figure out the disconnect between decent GPA and lower MCAT score. This may not be enough research experience, given the brewery is not considered biomedical research.

UGA, not sure what our reputation is. How many hours would you say is enough research experience? The brewery job was more of a different lab experience for me. I thought I had a good exposure to basic research, so why not gain some different experiences?
 
I've realized there are so many more career opportunities with having a MD-PhD.

This may be completely true, but it is not necessarily a good reason to do the combined degree program. There are other ways such as a research residency (ABIM Research Pathway, Holman Pathway, etc.) or doing a post-doc after residency/fellowship to become involved in research as a physician.

Your research appears to be mainly part time work, although I may be wrong? Were you the primary investigator on your project(s), were you under someone, did you do tech work?

How many hours would you say is enough research experience? The brewery job was more of a different lab experience for me. I thought I had a good exposure to basic research, so why not gain some different experiences?

I would say ~2000 hours is a start (20 hours/week for 2 years) and to be more competitive towards 4000-5000 hours. Although your brewery experience sounds cool (and probably was), it is not really the lab experience schools are looking for. That is, its not investigative research, which is what they want. Is your CDC job investigative or more technical (i.e. does someone routinely give you a list of instructions to follow with little freedom)?

Your MCAT score will screen you out of some MD-PhD programs, but not all. I feel submitting MD-PhD applications (probably the same for the most part regarding MD-only apps) in August is approaching on the late side. IMO, I think it would be better to apply now and having a pending request for a new MCAT. I think your chances are better for MD-only, but if you want to spend money on MSTP apps (versus maybe taking a year off to pursue full-time investigative research and achieve a higher MCAT), there are a few schools towards your stats (although still all higher with your current MCAT) listed here.
 
You're correct that a lot of my research was part time work, but I did accumulate about 3,500 hours not including my brewery position. My CDC job will be much more investigative than technical. In most of my successful projects, during undergrad, I was not a PI, and instead worked closely with post-docs. Do the application committee's expect that I should have been the PI on many of my projects, writing my own grant proposals and such?
 
You have a low to reasonable odds (say, 50%) at the less competitive MD/PhD programs. To be frank I think you are borderline/would have difficulty getting into a university-based MD program. Your application last year should clue you in on this.

You need to spend a great deal of time crafting your essays in a way that effectively documents your research experiences (focused primarily on your major lab experience and the CDC experience, with a paragraph about the brewery experience & your role [because this isn't really research]). Working with post-docs is fine. It is rare for undergrads to work on their own projects independently like a grad student would.

Your GPA and MCAT are below average to most programs. If you raised your MCAT to 34+ your odds would be much better to a variety of programs. There is no disconnect between GPA and MCAT that the prior poster assumed.

You will need to apply to ~15+ programs, ideally 20+, including all MD/PhD programs in the southeast. As it stands right now, don't be surprised if you don't get in anywhere or if you end up on waitlists. Does your PI know you are applying to MD/PhD programs- and will he/she give you a glowing recommendation? Do you want to spend 4-5 years in a PhD program on top of the medical training? What are your primary reasons for wanting the PhD?

The advantage to applying MD/PhD is that you will not be restricted by state residency. As it stands, you are not very competitive at out of state schools on the MD track. If you get a higher MCAT, you may want to consider applying to some MD-only schools out of state in addition to your MD/PhD application. I doubt you want to apply a third time.
 
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Well I used his LOR that was in my committee letter from the last application cycle. I'm sure it was a good rec, since we're on very good terms. As to the additional time spent in a PhD program- I know it's going to be extremely hard and discouraging at times, but I know I'm going to regret not giving it a shot. The primary reason for wanting the PhD is to have a research oriented career, and I know that a great way to become a good scientist is through obtaining a PhD. I also enjoy the clinical side of medicine, so why not combine my passions for both and make that a career? So is the general consensus that I should wait on my MCAT score-- if it's good possibly apply, if not acceptance into a MSTP program most likely isn't going to happen?
 
Do the application committee's expect that I should have been the PI on many of my projects, writing my own grant proposals and such?

I would say that they definitely expect you to be the primary leader of an independent project (preferably projects, under the Principal Investigator). Writing grants, not so much (if you have this, that's a plus). But I am just an applicant...
 
I've realized there are so many more career opportunities with having a MD-PhD. I do in fact want to have a research career, and an ID medical specialty appeals to me. However the dagger to my plans was that I never thought I would be competitive for a MD-PhD program. My plan was, seeing as I had lower stats, to get into med school first then apply for a PhD. That plan didn't work out. During my gap year I did improve my research stats. I got a publication, gained more experience in a good research lab, got a job at the CDC for my next gap year, was able to teach a few undergrads who worked under me. Thought this could help show my affinity towards research. Hopefully, with my next MCAT score I am slightly more competitive. Thought I'd give it a shot, but are my hopes totally unattainable? Do I have a non-existent chance atm?



UGA, not sure what our reputation is. How many hours would you say is enough research experience? The brewery job was more of a different lab experience for me. I thought I had a good exposure to basic research, so why not gain some different experiences?
Your Georgia residency will make you very competitive at small non-MSTP programs like Medical College of Georgia. I believe they have an option to do your PhD at Georgia Tech, which would be a terrific opportunity.
 
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