So many CVSes getting fined for not having PICs

[SpartanLaser]

Sort of amusing. Page 4 disciplinary actions. Some CVS have gone 15 months without PICs.

http://www.pharmacy.la.gov/assets/docs/NewsLetters/NABP-LaNewsltr2015-01.pdf
http://www.pharmacy.la.gov/assets/docs/NewsLetters/NABP-LaNewsltr2014-01.pdf

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[WVUPharm2007]

It is probably cheaper just to pay the $15,000 than pay the increased salary and bonus.

 

[zelman]

My old store had me as the PIC in the computer for over a year after I left. I thought it was novel, but I guess it's par for the course.

 

[ChalupaBatman86]

The sups in Louisiana used to put their own names on the licenses as PIC when they couldn't get anybody. Corporate made them stop. They asked, "what are we supposed to do? Nobody will take the job." They were told to force their pharmacists take the job. I guess that worked out really well.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

The sups in Louisiana used to put their own names on the licenses as PIC when they couldn't get anybody. Corporate made them stop. They asked, "what are we supposed to do? Nobody will take the job." They were told to force their pharmacists take the job. I guess that worked out really well.

My salary would have to be 6 figures and start with "2" to be a PIC. You have to be nuts to want to do that.

 

[Dred Pirate]

this gives me hope that the market is not massively saturated in some places

 

[Leper Messiah]

this gives me hope that the market is not massively saturated in some places

it's been said before, but if CVS would actually follow the pharmacist:tech ratios, we'd be far from saturated.

 

[Dred Pirate]

it's been said before, but if CVS would actually follow the pharmacist:tech ratios, we'd be far from saturated.

or we would have a lot less techs

 

[Ackj]

My salary would have to be 6 figures and start with "2" to be a PIC. You have to be nuts to want to do that.

Could they make the overnight the PIC? I'm sure every state has it's own laws about the requirements, but it kind of fits what y'all have been saying about "dump the extra duties onto the night shift."

 

[BidingMyTime]

Could they make the overnight the PIC? I'm sure every state has it's own laws about the requirements, but it kind of fits what y'all have been saying about "dump the extra duties onto the night shift."

No legal reason the overnight pharmacist couldn't be PIC (other than many of them are too wise to do so.) Then again, it might be chain policy to make PIC's work days, so the supervisors can easily get a hold of them to complain, er offer constructive criticism.

 

[SClENCE]

I think overnight could be PIC, but not sure how that could work with many of them being 7 on 7 off

 

[RX2090]

Why does everyone keep saying "too wise to be a PIC" and "you couldn't pay me enough to do that"?

I don't understand it. Yes, it's more responsibility. Yes, more things are your fault if some wrong. But that's life. You can't live life shirking responsibilities and trying to do the bare minimum to get by.

Plus, one HUGE and under reported benefit of being a PIC--> you're the boss. Sure, you have a DM, but he visits once a month. In the confines of the pharmacy, you are the boss and what you say goes. I don't want people to think I'm power hungry or anything, but there is a big benefit in being able to delegate most tasks and being in charge and doing things the way you want to do it.

The PIC's who get stressed don't delegate enough. I delegate all day everyday and guess what? I like my job.

 

[SpartanLaser]

The pic isn't the boss. He is a corporate puppet

 

[BidingMyTime]

Why does everyone keep saying "too wise to be a PIC" and "you couldn't pay me enough to do that"?

Well, I know a lot of older staff pharmacist, who have previous experience as a PIC, but say they would never do it again. And it seems all the current PIC's I know, graduated with the last 7 years. Perhaps the "older and wiser" adage isn't true, but people see the current PIC situation and apply. Myself, at least at this stage of my life, I would not want to do it because of the extra time involved.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Could they make the overnight the PIC? I'm sure every state has it's own laws about the requirements, but it kind of fits what y'all have been saying about "dump the extra duties onto the night shift."

My boss tried to do it for about 15 seconds last fall when we couldn't find ANYBODY to manage our store. I gave him this look of confusion/contempt and he I think he realized how insane of an idea it is and he dropped it. To defend the poor guy, he was clearly at the end of his candidate list and it was a hail mary.

I probably should have though, the guy they sent us ruined our pharmacy and put us in a hole of customer reputation that will take a few more months to dig out of. We have a real manager now, though. Thank God.

 

[ChalupaBatman86]

Why does everyone keep saying "too wise to be a PIC" and "you couldn't pay me enough to do that"?

I don't understand it. Yes, it's more responsibility. Yes, more things are your fault if some wrong. But that's life. You can't live life shirking responsibilities and trying to do the bare minimum to get by.

Plus, one HUGE and under reported benefit of being a PIC--> you're the boss. Sure, you have a DM, but he visits once a month. In the confines of the pharmacy, you are the boss and what you say goes. I don't want people to think I'm power hungry or anything, but there is a big benefit in being able to delegate most tasks and being in charge and doing things the way you want to do it.

The PIC's who get stressed don't delegate enough. I delegate all day everyday and guess what? I like my job.

PIC is not the boss. Why do you think they made the title "pharmacy team leader"? They don't want the word "manager" or "supervisor" anywhere in your title. The staff pharmacists don't even report to you. You can't terminate them. If they don't follow your orders all you can do is tell on them. The state gives you some authority but the company limits that as much as possible. You are just the person with their name on the license who gets thrown under the bus for failing to follow company procedure when something goes wrong. Any other illusion of authority they allow you to have is just to keep you working 50+ hours per week instead of 40.

 

[MountainPharmD]

PIC...none of the glory and all the headaches, hassles and blame. The PIC exists because the State Board of Pharmacy says it has to. In corporate pharmacy world the PIC has no authority over any part of the pharmacy operation. A PIC literally is there because the State Board and corporate need someone to blame when things go wrong. You make the mistake of being a PIC once, usually very shortly after you graduate.

I agree with WVU. If I were to be a corporate retail PIC again my salary would have to be 6 figures and start with "2".

 

[RX2090]

PIC is not the boss. Why do you think they made the title "pharmacy team leader"? They don't want the word "manager" or "supervisor" anywhere in your title. The staff pharmacists don't even report to you. You can't terminate them. If they don't follow your orders all you can do is tell on them. The state gives you some authority but the company limits that as much as possible. You are just the person with their name on the license who gets thrown under the bus for failing to follow company procedure when something goes wrong. Any other illusion of authority they allow you to have is just to keep you working 50+ hours per week instead of 40.

Your entire post is moot because the PIC title is called "Pharmacy Manager."

Also, the staff pharmacists DO report to the PM. This has been the case since January 2014. You CAN terminate them and write them up as you see fit.

I think you're basing your judgments off of information from years ago:

 

[Pharmgrlnxdor]

Your entire post is moot because the PIC title is called "Pharmacy Manager."

Also, the staff pharmacists DO report to the PM. This has been the case since January 2014. You CAN terminate them and write them up as you see fit.

I think you're basing your judgments off of information from years ago:

HAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yeah just go and try to terminate your staff pharmacist or even lead technician on your own as the PIC at CVS and see how far you would get. Try dealing in fact not fiction.

 

[297point1]

But that's life. You can't live life shirking responsibilities and trying to do the bare minimum to get by.

I believe that is the mantra of one well-known SDN member.

HAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yeah just go and try to terminate your staff pharmacist or even lead technician on your own as the PIC at CVS and see how far you would get. Try dealing in fact not fiction.

Pharmacy aside (where if you want to be rid of someone, you just stop giving them hours), it is tremendously difficult to fire someone in large corporations/companies nowadays. Sadly, people who do the bare minimum are usually safe, so long as they keep their head down and don't cause trouble. Performance evaluations - be it quarterly or annual - are often ineffective; evaluation scales are often so poorly constructed that the individual doing the bare minimum rates out as 'good', and supervisors are loathe to score their employees below that (at least initially...which is a huge mistake).

I consider myself to do 'good' work. Sometimes 'very good', but usually just 'good'. It is a sign that the performance evaluation is broken when I always get rated at 'outstanding' or 'excellent', because I am neither.

 

[ChalupaBatman86]

Your entire post is moot because the PIC title is called "Pharmacy Manager."

Also, the staff pharmacists DO report to the PM. This has been the case since January 2014. You CAN terminate them and write them up as you see fit.

I think you're basing your judgments off of information from years ago:

>95% of your time is spent dispensing prescriptions. You are paid as a pharmacist to perform the duties of a pharmacist. You are a pharmacist with a few extra administrative tasks and tons of extra liability.

 

[Sunshine98]

Why does everyone keep saying "too wise to be a PIC" and "you couldn't pay me enough to do that"?

I don't understand it. Yes, it's more responsibility. Yes, more things are your fault if some wrong. But that's life. You can't live life shirking responsibilities and trying to do the bare minimum to get by.

Plus, one HUGE and under reported benefit of being a PIC--> you're the boss. Sure, you have a DM, but he visits once a month. In the confines of the pharmacy, you are the boss and what you say goes. I don't want people to think I'm power hungry or anything, but there is a big benefit in being able to delegate most tasks and being in charge and doing things the way you want to do it.

The PIC's who get stressed don't delegate enough. I delegate all day everyday and guess what? I like my job.

Ive been there and stepping down was the smartest thing Ive ever done. As far as being the boss, not where Im at. You have to go through so much red tape to do anything. You can hire but you cant fire. People act like 5 year olds and want to tell on you if they don't have their cake and eat it too. Its always laughable when a store manager thinks they know what is going on and they don't. For me, tt had nothing to do with the responsibility or taking on more in life. It had everything to do with no matter how hard I worked, it was never good enough. I could understand it if I was lazy, but Im not. I take initiative and do all I can. But when the person telling you its not enough and you know they are lazy, then I just said screw it, its not worth it. Yes, you can make more money, but its not worth the extra stress and headache of doing it. Besides, if you don't spend more than you make and put money to the side to invest, you can find yourself making the same pay if you were a PIC but with less crap to deal with.

 

[wagrxm2000]

I love being pic at wag. I get paid more and everyone else does all the work.

Anyone who hated being pic clearly was doing it wrong.

 

[RX2090]

I love being pic at wag. I get paid more and everyone else does all the work.

Anyone who hated being pic clearly was doing it wrong.

I agree with you, I dunno I guess it's the location or the type of staff that you have. I can see how some STAFf RPHS would probably be annoying and make your PIC title worthless because you can't fire them without getting your sup involved.

But if you have a great lead tech and a great staff that knows their role and doesn't attempt to undermine you, the PIC position is very very good.

Like you said, I don't do any work. I verify, but I make everyone else do all the paperwork and administrative work. It's called delegation, guys. Delegate to HELL and beyond.

 

[SpartanLaser]

How do you delegate when corporate keeps cutting hours down to zilch?

 

[Lnsean]

Your entire post is moot because the PIC title is called "Pharmacy Manager."

Also, the staff pharmacists DO report to the PM. This has been the case since January 2014. You CAN terminate them and write them up as you see fit.

I think you're basing your judgments off of information from years ago:

Pharmacy managers cannot terminate staff pharmacists. I am a pharmacy manager for walgreens and know many others from other chains.

Even just terminating your technicians, you had better have all the documentations in place and all the previous "write-ups" with time and discussions.

You do not know of what you speak because obviously you are not a pharmacy manager or PIC.

 

[RX2090]

Pharmacy managers cannot terminate staff pharmacists. I am a pharmacy manager for walgreens and know many others from other chains.

Even just terminating your technicians, you had better have all the documentations in place and all the previous "write-ups" with time and discussions.

You do not know of what you speak because obviously you are not a pharmacy manager or PIC.

LOL I am a pharmacy manager. Why are pharmacists on these boards so ****ing stupid? You make a blanket statement like that which makes no sense because you don't know me.

YOU CAN terminate a staff pharmacist as a PM. It's really not that hard. You need 4 write ups just like everyone else.

The problem is, once you get to a level 2, 99.9% of staff RPHS will fall in line and do what you say. They'd rather make $60 an hour and acknowledge customers immediately rather than lose their jobs.

You're a ******, and you probably don't know how to write someone up. It's really not that hard.

 

[RX2090]

How do you delegate when corporate keeps cutting hours down to zilch?

I dunno, I don't think CVS cuts hours. They have a budget and you just schedule to the budget.

I think the problem is most of you spend 20 minutes verifying a Flonase and a Zpak so you think you don't have time for anything else. Just verify your scripts and delegate tasks to other techs.

 

[Lnsean]

LOL I am a pharmacy manager. Why are pharmacists on these boards so ****ing stupid? You make a blanket statement like that which makes no sense because you don't know me.

YOU CAN terminate a staff pharmacist as a PM. It's really not that hard. You need 4 write ups just like everyone else.

The problem is, once you get to a level 2, 99.9% of staff RPHS will fall in line and do what you say. They'd rather make $60 an hour and acknowledge customers immediately rather than lose their jobs.

You're a ******, and you probably don't know how to write someone up. It's really not that hard.

Really? We're resorting to name calling now? lol.

You are obviously not PIC. What company do you work for? I am sure I can find out the procedure for your company and inform you.

 

[RX2090]

"Obviously not PIC." Yes, because I have nothing better to do than to come on forums and lie for my entertainment.

What is entertaining, however, is how stupid you are. YOU are trying to tell ME what I have done in MY career as a PM. It's hilarious. Just because you're too scared to write someone up and terminate them When they don't listen to you doesn't mean everyone else doesn't.

Set expectations for your staff RPH's show them their job description, and when they don't respond you write them up. It's really really really not that hard.

 

[Lnsean]

"Obviously not PIC." Yes, because I have nothing better to do than to come on forums and lie for my entertainment.

What is entertaining, however, is how stupid you are. YOU are trying to tell ME what I have done in MY career as a PM. It's hilarious. Just because you're too scared to write someone up and terminate them When they don't listen to you doesn't mean everyone else doesn't.

Set expectations for your staff RPH's show them their job description, and when they don't respond you write them up. It's really really really not that hard.

Then tell us the company that you work for. Back up your claims. Stop with the chit-chat and name-calling; it's immature.

I work as PIC for walgreens.

 

[RX2090]

Then tell us the company that you work for. Back up your claims.

I work as PIC for walgreens.

I work for CVS. I'm not a new poster here. I've been posting about this forever.

My staff pharmacists report to me. Using the goals for performance and success application, I can write them
Up because I am their direct supervisor. My RX supervisor supports me 100% and says he wishes other PM's did the same:

 

[Lnsean]

I work for CVS. I'm not a new poster here. I've been posting about this forever.

My staff pharmacists report to me. Using the goals for performance and success application, I can write them
Up because I am their direct supervisor. My RX supervisor supports me 100% and says he wishes other PM's did the same:

CVS PICs cannot fire staff pharmacists...lol. You've lost all credibility. I mean are you sure you work for CVS? You don't even know their procedures. lmao.

 

[RX2090]

Sure they can. And I'm done talking to you about this, since you work for walgreens. Now I've heard it all. A Walgreens PM telling a CVS pM what he can and cannot do. Unbelievable.

 

[Lnsean]

Sure they can. And I'm done talking to you about this, since you work for walgreens. Now I've heard it all. A Walgreens PM telling a CVS pM what he can and cannot do. Unbelievable.

Of course you are done; you have no credibility left. Why would anyone believe anything that you say anymore? You're a sham. You basically lied about being PIC. I just call out bs when I see it.

I know PICs that work for all the chains. I talk to the guy that is PIC for the CVS across from my store like every week. Also, there's another CVS poster in this thread that already discredited everything that you've said. lmao.

 

[BidingMyTime]

I work for CVS. I'm not a new poster here. I've been posting about this forever.

I consider anyone who has been here less than 1 year, a new poster. That would be you.

I don't doubt that you can write up your pharmacists, and if your Pharmacy Supervisor respects you, s/he may fire the pharmacist based on your write-ups.....but its your Pharmacy Supervisor who has final say, and will be the one doing the actual firing. Seriously, have *you* personally, ever, actually fired someone, as in, you sit down in the office with them & tell them they are fired & to clean out their locker & that you will send them their final check? I doubt it......I don't know of any chain pharmacy that gives their pharmacy managers this much power.

 

[Dr Wario]

I consider anyone who has been here less than 1 year, a new poster. That would be you.

I don't doubt that you can write up your pharmacists, and if your Pharmacy Supervisor respects you, s/he may fire the pharmacist based on your write-ups.....but its your Pharmacy Supervisor who has final say, and will be the one doing the actual firing. Seriously, have *you* personally, ever, actually fired someone, as in, you sit down in the office with them & tell them they are fired & to clean out their locker & that you will send them their final check? I doubt it......I don't know of any chain pharmacy that gives their pharmacy managers this much power.

I would agree with this, recently the PMs at CVS have been made responsible for writing evaluations for staff, and this led some to thinking they had direct authority. This, however, is most certainly not the case, all that really happened was that CVS shifted responsibility onto the PM, but did not, in fact, give them any real power. Of course you have the ability to write someone up in momentum, but the only people who will decide if your writeups can be used to perform actual disciplinary action are the rxsup, DM and HR business partner. By the way, PICs don't even have authority over evaluations of staff pharmacists, in my case my PM recommended an EE for myself (our store has beaten budget by 10% or greater 5 years in a row) but the rx sup knocked it down to ME because mycustomer was under target.

 

[BMBiology]

You better make sure you have an absolutely clean record if you are going to write anybody up. I am going to find every "illegal" thing you are doing and report you to the board of pharmacy.

 

[ChalupaBatman86]

"Obviously not PIC." Yes, because I have nothing better to do than to come on forums and lie for my entertainment.

What is entertaining, however, is how stupid you are. YOU are trying to tell ME what I have done in MY career as a PM. It's hilarious. Just because you're too scared to write someone up and terminate them When they don't listen to you doesn't mean everyone else doesn't.

Set expectations for your staff RPH's show them their job description, and when they don't respond you write them up. It's really really really not that hard.

Wow, a tiny bit of imaginary power goes straight to some people's heads. These are the dangerous ones. Guess what Dwight, you are not the assistant regional manager, you are the assistant TO the regional manager.

Writing people for petty issues? That's how you like your manager to treat you too, right? Guess what happens when a customer brings back an Rx with a dispensing error you made? That staff pharmacist you just wrote up for not scanning an extra care card is going to give them the phone number for the Board of Pharmacy and instruct them how to report you.

 

[BMBiology]

-

 

[SClENCE]

Having the ability to write someone up doesn't mean you have the ability to fire them... and what PIC in their right mind is going to write up their partner? If they need improvement, simply explain to them what the problem is and how to improve. The only time you need to write them up is when they deliberately disregard company policy or state/federal law.

From what I have seen in my brief experience in retail is that the PIC has to answer to the DM on metrics... not much more aside from the added legal responsibility. The PIC can't even control how many tech hours they have in the store that they supposedly run!