So... Native American... to mention or not to mention? (Long Story)

[wayves]

I was adopted at birth. My parents told me when I was very young that we are not genetically related. I always knew that I had a different genetic background than my parents but I wasn't sure what it was. All I know is that my birth parents came from poverty and were very young when they had me and that's why I was adopted. I was raised in a middle class "white" family (most family members have doctorates). That's how I was raised and I thought that was my identity... until a few years ago.

I've always known that I look a little different. I have a wider face than most, deep set eyes, and high cheekbones for instance. In middle school and early high school I thought it was just because I was an ugly anomaly (I blamed that for the reason I couldn't pick up the ladies). Later in high school I took genetics and realized that it could just be my ancestry and it was more unique than "ugly". In college once, an EMT colleague of mine asked about my ancestry and when I told him that I had no idea, he mentioned that I look sort of native american. I bought a gene testing service for two reasons; to determine if I was prone to possible genetic health problems such as alcoholism (wanted to see if I could safely drink as a college student), and to discover my genetic ancestry. The results suprised me: I am majority native american/east asian (the service I bought clumps the two together since native americans came to america from Asia and they are genetically similar).

Once I discovered that I was majority native american I began researching different tribes. Eventually I connected with a local tribe. A few times a year we get together and have canoe races, pow-wows (yes they do exist), and gambling tournaments (maybe I won't mention this though ). Over the past couple of years I have really embraced my identity as a proud native american. I understand that native americans are an URM in medicine and could be a possible advantage in admissions, but I have some concerns before I just slap "NATIVE AMERICAN" on my application. Here are some pros and cons for listing myself as a native american:


Pros:
I have grown to accept this identity
I actually am Native American, genetically speaking
Admissions Advantage
It is and will continue to be a part of my life. I've even considered working as a doctor with the indian health service.

Cons:
I grew up in a middle-class "white" family and maybe it's not fair since this is how I was raised. I wasn't born into the native american lifestyle.
There was enough breeding, if you will, with europeans that I look pretty white. The most noticeable native american features about me are in my bone structure. I don't want to come off as one of those people just trying to get an advantage.


What are your thoughts?

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[baxt1412]

It's going to be tougher for you to spin this than others, potentially, because of the fact that it's much more recent.... however that can sort of be explained by the story you gave us - adoption and the fact that you never really thought to look into it before since your family always treated you as their own, etc.


If you're going to put anything on your app, be prepared to talk about it for any given length of time.

So if you put it on there and then they start asking about it and you can't talk more than 30 seconds about it, they will see right through it.


If it is how you IDENTIFY YOURSELF, then go ahead and put it. Don't put it just in hopes that it will help you if you don't normally identify as Native American. That is unethical in my opinion, FWIW

 

[PreciousHamburgers]

It sounds like you identify with being Native American (and it wasn't just for application reasons) and you might be likely to serve the community as a doctor (or relate to the patients) which seems to be the reasoning behind recruiting URM. I say self-identify as Native American and explain the situation in your apps. Let the school's decide what to make of it.

 

[PlaqueBuster]

You can not use your genetic identity as a reason for URM. You were adopted at birth so your grew up without any of the disadvantages that native americans' experience. You can, however, mention how you came to identify your identity as a nativeamerican after so many years of growing up in a white household, focus on what you learned about your roots, how and why you wanted to reconnect with native americans and mention about your interest in working with the population. But do not try to get yourself recognized as a URM because honestly you are not.

An interesting thing for you to do is talk to native americans about tribal medicine. See if you can understand the pros and cons of that before you say I want to provide medical services to native americans because from the little I know, I believe that they are based on natural homeopathic medicine whereas what you will learn in medical school is different. It is important to understand their medical practices and how you can blend your education with their lifestyles.

 

[baxt1412]

You can not use your genetic identity as a reason for URM. You were adopted at birth so your grew up without any of the disadvantages that native americans experiences. You can, however, mention how you came to identify your identity as a nativeamerican after so many years of growing up in a white household, focus on what you learned about your roots, how and why you wanted to reconnect with native americans and mention about your interest in working with the population. But do not try to get yourself recognized as a URM because honestly you are not.

An interesting thing for you to do is talk to native americans about tribal medicine. See if you can understand the pros and cons of that before you say I want to provide medical services to native americans because from the little I know, I believe that they are based on natural homeopathic medicine whereas what you will learn in medical school is different. It is important to understand their medical practices and how you can blend your education with their lifestyles.

My opinion is more along these lines.

 

[wayves]

You can not use your genetic identity as a reason for URM. You were adopted at birth so your grew up without any of the disadvantages that native americans experiences. You can, however, mention how you came to identify your identity as a nativeamerican after so many years of growing up in a white household, focus on what you learned about your roots, how and why you wanted to reconnect with native americans and mention about your interest in working with the population. But do not try to get yourself recognized as a URM because honestly you are not.

An interesting thing for you to do is talk to native americans about tribal medicine. See if you can understand the pros and cons of that before you say I want to provide medical services to native americans because from the little I know, I believe that they are based on natural homeopathic medicine whereas what you will learn in medical school is different. It is important to understand their medical practices and how you can blend your education with their lifestyles.

This an extreme stereotype.
It's not fair to say that every tribe still uses homeopathic medicine. It varies from tribe to tribe and population to population. Keep in mind that some tribes are totally integrated with modern society and only maintain some of their traditions.

In some places there are entire traditional hospitals based on serving native populations. Alaska Native Medical Center in Anchorage, Alaska is an example.

The Indian Health Service - IHS is a government program that provides traditional medicine services to natives.

 

[PlaqueBuster]

Like I said, "the little I know". I don't know about their health services very well. If what I mentioned is incorrect, I apologize but what I said still holds. Make sure you mention how you can integrate yourself into their health services.

 

[WillburCobb]

You'll very likely need to be a member of a federally recognized tribe to receive any URM benefits. This requires genealogical documentation not just genetic testing.

 

[wayves]

You'll very likely need to be a member of a federally recognized tribe to receive any URM benefits. This requires genealogical documentation not just genetic testing.

So you're saying that medical school admissions will call up Indian Tribes to verify? I have a feeling if I tell my story to a tribal leader I could join the tribe. The chief of the tribe I've been affiliated with has been very welcoming of me even though I look European.

I keep saying I look european. For any of you who are curious what I actually look like, I look like this guy (Lorenzo Bates a politician for the Navajo tribe):
http://www.dineresourcesandinfocenter.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Bates.Spkr_1.jpg

^Except that I'm much younger.

 

[WillburCobb]

So you're saying that medical school admissions will call up Indian Tribes to verify? I have a feeling if I tell my story to a tribal leader I could join the tribe. The chief of the tribe I've been affiliated with has been very welcoming of me even though I look European.

No, they'll ask for federal tribal identification. I'm aware of at least 6 schools that require it to be considered for any benefits given to Native Americans in the admissions process. (This is considering just race, which is what OP is asking about, not background as a whole).
http://www.doi.gov/tribes/enrollment.cfm

 

[wayves]

I'm actually in the process of obtaining tribal identification for the Cherokee tribe.

 

[mimelim]

My suspicion is that you will get a multitude of different perspectives on this from adcoms (unlike the vast majority of questions asked on SDN and other places), would like @LizzyM @Goro and @gyngyn to comment if possible.

How I would approach this is...

You are who you are. You should emphasize that in your application. It sounds simple, but it is the best way to think about it. You certainly should not check the box for "disadvantaged". But, I would consider you an under represented minority. Maybe not in the same way that the majority of people are, but you have a different background and beyond that, a background that has affected you significantly in a positive way. Outside of medical school admissions, you identify yourself as native american. That is worth mentioning. Regardless of what checkboxes on your app you select, if this has shaped who you are in a significant, positive way, it should be in your application. Diversity isn't just about race and skin color. It is about differences of backgrounds and ideas as well.

Edit: Also, if you have tribal identification, this is all moot. You qualify as URM.

 

[wayves]

I will at least include it somewhere. I was really ecstatic when I discovered my identity.

I have a whole team of people working on getting documents and such to fully solidify my genealogy which will likely result in contacting Indian Affairs for identification.

Would this be a good essay topic or not?

 

[DokterMom]

@mimelim brings up a really good point -- By writing about your Native American lineage as a positive, rather than as a disadvantage, you will be bringing something unique to the table. Since you were raised in a middle class white family and don't look non-white, claiming URM status is likely to backfire on you, regardless of the genetic truth.

But by not claiming URM, and emphasizing the positive and your involvement in the Native American community, you avoid the possible 'URM-grubbing' taint and [legitimately] claim the advantages your cultural diversity entails. You've also got a compelling back-story, and have handled an uncomfortable truth in a positive way.

If a school (rather than you) were to later claim you as Native American based on your genetic heritage, that's on them.

 

[baxt1412]

Weird that this never came up until you were essentially a young adult.

You never asked your parents what you were even though you knew you were adopted? They never talked to you about it?


Good luck with your future app.

 

[baxt1412]

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/would-taking-hebrew-look-bad.1093065/
OP is Jewish
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/thr...ars-look-too-controversial-political.1094885/
OP didn't mention Native American ties just 2 months ago. OP is a politically-oriented Native American Jew in a frat. Unique app for sure.

 

[mimelim]

Weird that this never came up until you were essentially a young adult.

You never asked your parents what you were even though you knew you were adopted? They never talked to you about it?


Good luck with your future app.

Some kids wonder early, some don't. Some accept their adoptive family entirely, some don't. Most kids aren't as obsessed with race the way adults are. They are far more color blind.

 

[wayves]

@baxt1412 Unless you're adopted, please don't comment on that. You wouldn't understand. I know people who didn't fully discover their genealogy/heritage until their late 50s.

Also, do you really think it's weird that a child who was raised in a middle-class white family is Jewish? I didn't ask to be Jewish. I was adopted by Jewish parents.

By the way, tri-beta isn't a "frat", it's an honors society. But that's not the point of this thread.

And yes, it certainly is a unique application. I'll admit that proudly.

 

[PlaqueBuster]

Just be careful that you are doing this not to get an easier acceptance into medical school because that is what it comes across as for me right now. I understand your passion of learning about your roots but this does not require you to get documentation. Do you need the documentation and federal identification wtih a tribe to learn about your culture and integrate yourself within it? Are you trying to get into medical school the easy way? Think about those two questions and please do not rage at me....this is how it comes across for me.

 

[raiderette]

Weird that this never came up until you were essentially a young adult.
You never asked your parents what you were even though you knew you were adopted? They never talked to you about it?
Good luck with your future app.

Depending on how the adoption was handled, most likely the adoptive parents had no idea about the heritage if the child "looks" white. Public adoptions in most states are still closed. That is why it is so difficult for adoptees later when they try to track down genetic heritage, medical history. College is a common time to dig deeper into identity, especially for adoptees.

 

[wayves]

Just be careful that you are doing this not to get an easier acceptance into medical school because that is what it comes across as for me right now. I understand your passion of learning about your roots but this does not require you to get documentation. Do you need the documentation and federal identification wtih a tribe to learn about your culture and integrate yourself within it? Are you trying to get into medical school the easy way? Think about those two questions and please do not rage at me....this is how it comes across for me.

There are a lot more benefits provided to Native Americans than "easier acceptance to med school". It is a representation of identity. Before I knew that I was Native American by bloodline I didn't have any demographic to identify with other than my parents but I still knew that I was different. I was in demographic limbo so to speak. Now that I have unlocked the ancestral curtain it is important to me (and this is a personal decision) that I fully identify with my heritage. I know since this is a pre-med gunner website I may come off as just another pre-med trying to get a leg-up, but I can assure you that it is not my intention. That being said, if you discovered that you were underrepresented, I have a feeling you would take the opportunity too. Opportunity knocks, you just need to answer. I had no idea that I would have any Native American blood at all. I come from a very white neighborhood (literally 99% white), so I assumed I would be European. I wouldn't have had a problem if I were European, Asian, African, or whatever. I'm just finally glad I can have a group to identify with.

Depending on how the adoption was handled, most likely the adoptive parents had no idea about the heritage if the child "looks" white. Public adoptions in most states are still closed. That is why it is so difficult for adoptees later when they try to track down genetic heritage, medical history. College is a common time to dig deeper into identity, especially for adoptees.

Well said.

 

[sundancing]

Weird that this never came up until you were essentially a young adult.

You never asked your parents what you were even though you knew you were adopted? They never talked to you about it?


Good luck with your future app.

My sister is adopted and she has asked very little about where she came from before she joined our family. I'm not adopted myself so I can't really offer firsthand insight, but I imagine the decision to learn more about one's roots/birth parents (or not) is very personal and difficult.

 

[wayves]

I don't normally read buzzfeed, but this is pretty good:
http://www.buzzfeed.com/alexjon/14-annoying-things-native-americans-hear-from-non-ajcs

 

[baxt1412]

There are a lot more benefits provided to Native Americans than "easier acceptance to med school". It is a representation of identity. Before I knew that I was Native American by bloodline I didn't have any demographic to identify with other than my parents but I still knew that I was different. I was in demographic limbo so to speak. Now that I have unlocked the ancestral curtain it is important to me (and this is a personal decision) that I fully identify with my heritage. I know since this is a pre-med gunner website I may come off as just another pre-med trying to get a leg-up, but I can assure you that it is not my intention. That being said, if you discovered that you were underrepresented, I have a feeling you would take the opportunity too. Opportunity knocks, you just need to answer. I had no idea that I would have any Native American blood at all. I come from a very white neighborhood (literally 99% white), so I assumed I would be European. I wouldn't have had a problem if I were European, Asian, African, or whatever. I'm just finally glad I can have a group to identify with.



Well said.

then it seems like there is no question as to if you should put it on your app or not. if this is something that IS you... then why wouldn't you put it on your application? it seems like you answered your own question. maybe your next question should be, what do i need to do to make this official?

 

[Goro]

The sage LizzyM has discussed this in detail, but a synopsis is that you're a suburban privileged kid, and trying to play the URM card will backfire.

Demonstrate that you've spent the last year on the Rez doing volunteer work, and that's a different story. Having married an adoptee myself, I think you'll get more traction out mentioning you're adopted than checking the "Native American" box.


I grew up in a middle-class "white" family and maybe it's not fair since this is how I was raised. I wasn't born into the native american lifestyle.
There was enough breeding, if you will, with europeans that I look pretty white. The most noticeable native american features about me are in my bone structure. I don't want to come off as one of those people just trying to get an advantage.

 

[wayves]

There's a difference between being disadvantaged and being an URM.

You can be URM but very privileged (the Obama daughters for instance). You can also be ORM and very disadvantaged (white kid from a trailer park).

 

[BMC11]

I was adopted at birth. My parents told me when I was very young that we are not genetically related. I always knew that I had a different genetic background than my parents but I wasn't sure what it was. All I know is that my birth parents came from poverty and were very young when they had me and that's why I was adopted. I was raised in a middle class "white" family (most family members have doctorates). That's how I was raised and I thought that was my identity... until a few years ago.

I've always known that I look a little different. I have a wider face than most, deep set eyes, and high cheekbones for instance. In middle school and early high school I thought it was just because I was an ugly anomaly (I blamed that for the reason I couldn't pick up the ladies). Later in high school I took genetics and realized that it could just be my ancestry and it was more unique than "ugly". In college once, an EMT colleague of mine asked about my ancestry and when I told him that I had no idea, he mentioned that I look sort of native american. I bought a gene testing service for two reasons; to determine if I was prone to possible genetic health problems such as alcoholism (wanted to see if I could safely drink as a college student), and to discover my genetic ancestry. The results suprised me: I am majority native american/east asian (the service I bought clumps the two together since native americans came to america from Asia and they are genetically similar).

Once I discovered that I was majority native american I began researching different tribes. Eventually I connected with a local tribe. A few times a year we get together and have canoe races, pow-wows (yes they do exist), and gambling tournaments (maybe I won't mention this though ). Over the past couple of years I have really embraced my identity as a proud native american. I understand that native americans are an URM in medicine and could be a possible advantage in admissions, but I have some concerns before I just slap "NATIVE AMERICAN" on my application. Here are some pros and cons for listing myself as a native american:


Pros:
I have grown to accept this identity
I actually am Native American, genetically speaking
Admissions Advantage
It is and will continue to be a part of my life. I've even considered working as a doctor with the indian health service.

Cons:
I grew up in a middle-class "white" family and maybe it's not fair since this is how I was raised. I wasn't born into the native american lifestyle.
There was enough breeding, if you will, with europeans that I look pretty white. The most noticeable native american features about me are in my bone structure. I don't want to come off as one of those people just trying to get an advantage.


What are your thoughts?

Have you officially joined a tribe? You cannot claim Native American status unless you have met the legal requirements for doing so. The best advice I can give you is please do NOT check the box unless you have met the legal requirements, blood quantum, and are officially part of a tribe etc. You will be asked about this in interviews, and it's pretty serious if you can't back up the claim with documentation (serious enough to be rejected).

Do some serious research on what is required to claim status. Figure out exactly which tribes your parents were from and what that qualifies you to join. Learn about blood quantum. The federal courts have been involved in what is required as have the tribes. Some Native Americans cannot claim status because they're parents are from different tribes and each group requires something different. RESEARCH!!

PS It does not matter how "white" you look. You are what you are and your appearance has nothing to do with it. URMs are not defined by skin color.

 

[womanofscience]

I'm curious...since the genetic test lumped East Asian and Native American together, how did you come to the conclusion that you're NA?

 

[wayves]

I'm curious...since the genetic test lumped East Asian and Native American together, how did you come to the conclusion that you're NA?

Based on genealogy. I was able to (through state records where I was born) verify that I have at least 2 grandparents with Native affiliation. Now I just need to get verification from the tribes and send that to BIA. I think BIA will also check my blood. Not sure though.

 

[womanofscience]

Based on genealogy. I was able to (through state records where I was born) verify that I have at least 2 grandparents with Native affiliation. Now I just need to get verification from the tribes and send that to BIA. I think BIA will also check my blood. Not sure though.

Wasn't sure if you could easily access those documents! Good luck and thank you for sharing! Could you PM me the resource you used for the genetic test? I also am part Native American so I'm curious about the "how much." Too lazy to do the genealogy currently haha.

 

[ridethecliche]

Yeah, URM and disadvantaged are two different things.

The fact that the OP is native american but adopted doesn't magically make them more represented in medicine. Flip the tables: White upper middle class family adopts african american child. Is that child still a minority?
I'd say that they are. They certainly might not be socio-economically disadvantaged, but that doesn't change the fact that the race is under represented in medicine.

Whether the OP is trying to use this for gain or not isn't really the question. If they have papers that prove their ancestry and they can track down the tribal affiliations of their birth parents, then that's certainly some sort of proof.

 

[alpinism]

I was adopted at birth. My parents told me when I was very young that we are not genetically related. I always knew that I had a different genetic background than my parents but I wasn't sure what it was. All I know is that my birth parents came from poverty and were very young when they had me and that's why I was adopted. I was raised in a middle class "white" family (most family members have doctorates). That's how I was raised and I thought that was my identity... until a few years ago.

I've always known that I look a little different. I have a wider face than most, deep set eyes, and high cheekbones for instance. In middle school and early high school I thought it was just because I was an ugly anomaly (I blamed that for the reason I couldn't pick up the ladies). Later in high school I took genetics and realized that it could just be my ancestry and it was more unique than "ugly". In college once, an EMT colleague of mine asked about my ancestry and when I told him that I had no idea, he mentioned that I look sort of native american. I bought a gene testing service for two reasons; to determine if I was prone to possible genetic health problems such as alcoholism (wanted to see if I could safely drink as a college student), and to discover my genetic ancestry. The results suprised me: I am majority native american/east asian (the service I bought clumps the two together since native americans came to america from Asia and they are genetically similar).

Once I discovered that I was majority native american I began researching different tribes. Eventually I connected with a local tribe. A few times a year we get together and have canoe races, pow-wows (yes they do exist), and gambling tournaments (maybe I won't mention this though ). Over the past couple of years I have really embraced my identity as a proud native american. I understand that native americans are an URM in medicine and could be a possible advantage in admissions, but I have some concerns before I just slap "NATIVE AMERICAN" on my application. Here are some pros and cons for listing myself as a native american:


Pros:
I have grown to accept this identity
I actually am Native American, genetically speaking
Admissions Advantage
It is and will continue to be a part of my life. I've even considered working as a doctor with the indian health service.

Cons:
I grew up in a middle-class "white" family and maybe it's not fair since this is how I was raised. I wasn't born into the native american lifestyle.
There was enough breeding, if you will, with europeans that I look pretty white. The most noticeable native american features about me are in my bone structure. I don't want to come off as one of those people just trying to get an advantage.


What are your thoughts?

While we can argue all day about what constitutes "middle class", most people in the middle class don't have a family full of doctorates.

Realistically you can present yourself an adopted URM who comes from a very advantaged background.

 

[wayves]

While we can argue all day about what constitutes "middle class", most people in the middle class don't have a family full of doctorates.

Realistically you can present yourself an adopted URM who comes from a very advantaged background.

I'll just focus on URM then.

 

[godawg300]

Idk about others but in my experience Adcoms want to see what types of additional experiences you can bring and share with others (aka your peers). It sounds like you didn't have any, at least until recently that relate to your being Native American. This doesn't mean you have to embody everything that is native, but it really sounds like you have a typical middle class upbringing which is more common for white folks. Anyhow, you can check the box for Native American if that's how you identify and then not think about it afterwards. Only you know what you identify, so check that. I doubt it will really hurt you. But be prepared to answer questions about your heritage and experience. Those are all fair game in an interview.

 

[ridethecliche]

If the OP is genuinely interested in their cultures past and makes an effort to reach out and do work at a reservation or related to native american disparities, then this could be good. However, if this is done poorly without much thought or much time spent, then it looks like an effort to get a bump in admissions. Magically becoming interested in your past the semester before applications with no long term activities would look sketchy, imho.

Edit: From the OP it seems this has taken place over a few years at the least, so there's certainly something there.

 

[wayves]

If the OP is genuinely interested in their cultures past and makes an effort to reach out and do work at a reservation or related to native american disparities, then this could be good. However, if this is done poorly without much thought or much time spent, then it looks like an effort to get a bump in admissions. Magically becoming interested in your past the semester before applications with no long term activities would look sketchy, imho.

Edit: From the OP it seems this has taken place over a few years at the least, so there's certainly something there.

It wasn't this past semester. It was a few years ago before I was even interested in pre-med. Wouldn't you be interested in your ancestry?

 

[ems2doc]

OP -

Do you identify as Native American?
Do you have sufficient evidence documenting your ancestry? CDIB/Blood Quantum/Genetics Results are fine. If you have the documents and can tell your story then you are considered Native American or at least partially.
Were you interested in genealogy prior to 1 year before your application?

If the answer to the above is yes, then it doesn't matter what people on here say. You are Native American and that's your identity. Be prepared to discuss it as it will certainly come up in interviews. That being said, from what I've seen you have a very interesting story and have a lot to talk about. I love interviewing candidates with interesting backgrounds such as yours. Are you an underrepresented minority? Yes since you can document and identify as Native American. Are you disadvantaged? No, the two are separate.

 

[ridethecliche]

It wasn't this past semester. It was a few years ago before I was even interested in pre-med. Wouldn't you be interested in your ancestry?

Did you read the rest of my post? I'm actually one of the posters here on your side. I think you have a case if your activities reflect your interest.

And I was born and grew up elsewhere. Got my full growing up.

 

[LizzyM]

If the 2020 US census were held today, how would you self-identify in terms of race and ethnicity?

This is a very complicated question for children of one race raised in a household of another race. I really don't have a good answer.

 

[naytive]

When people discover their alleged Indian roots, their first reaction usually is "What can I get? Casino money? Benefits? Affirmative Action? Etc" - which bothers me as a full blood Indian myself. I wish their reaction would be, "I just discovered I am Indian. What can I do for my people?"

I am really sorry but I think it would be a very bad idea if you called yourself an Indian. It is guaranteed to backfire from the point of view of medical admissions. A great deal of what you said so far does not pass the smell test. I am saying this as an Indian myself who lives on a reservation.

I'm actually in the process of obtaining tribal identification for the Cherokee tribe.

There is no "Cherokee tribe." There's the CNO, EB (Eastern Band of Cherokee) and many other bands of Cherokee Indians but there is no "the Cherokee tribe" as such. I am really sorry but the adcoms will see right through your deception, and even if the adcoms won't, any Indians you encounter during your time at the medical school will clearly recognize you as an imposter. There are a number of errors you made in your story but I don't want to draw attention to those errors so that smarter individuals won't learn to avoid those errors and falsely claim Indian status to get admitted to medical school.

Once again, I am really very sorry.

 

[wayves]

If I can get CDIB then it's not "falsely claiming", I have proof.

Thanks for your cocern though, "naytive" with 1 post.

 

[Silverflash]

Just my opinion, but I would lean toward not labeling yourself URM, but instead just tell your story in an essay. Adopted, discovered heritage, participation in local tribe, etc. That can only be a positive, while claiming URM *may* backfire at some schools. Why risk it? Play it safe.

 

[Promethean]

So, I am of Native American and European descent. I refuse to affiliate with the Cherokee tribe since they kicked out many hundreds of members for having some African ancestry, even though many of those people had been participants in Cherokee culture and had ancestral ties. They were the decendants of people who had been held as slaves by members of the tribe and of free black people who had joined the tribe generations ago. They had lived as Cherokee, remembered the stories and the traditions, but failed a paper bag test. I didn't want to support a racist government, so I turned my back on the federally recognized tribe.

I was conflicted about whether to include my heritage on my application. The rules say that you have to be affiliated with a recognized tribe. That rule only applies to Native Americans, since other groups aren't required to maintain cultural ties in order to be considered to be of that group. I decided that the rule was discriminatory and I wrote down on my app that I am Cherokee. That is my heritage, and it is how I identify. My opposition to a political group which claims to define who is native does nothing to erase my family history. I would be happy to explain this to any adcom who wanted to talk about it, but none asked.

Natives have had much more than their land taken from them. Our heritage, our identity has also been stolen away... OP is not nearly the only native child to be given up for adoption or taken away from impoverished parents to be raised white. OP should report himself in the way that he identifies. There is certainly no better authority.

The essential test is: If you thought that reporting your ancestry would hurt your chances, would you still claim it? If so, then go ahead. If you wouldn't, then you have no right to claim it at all.

EDIT: Yes, I am aware that there is more than one band of Cherokee. I was trying to keep the matter simple, for the purposes of this discussion. If anyone really wants to discuss tribal politics, let's take it someplace more appropriate.

 

[wayves]

When people discover their alleged Indian roots, their first reaction usually is "What can I get? Casino money? Benefits? Affirmative Action? Etc" - which bothers me as a full blood Indian myself. I wish their reaction would be, "I just discovered I am Indian. What can I do for my people?"

I am really sorry but I think it would be a very bad idea if you called yourself an Indian. It is guaranteed to backfire from the point of view of medical admissions. A great deal of what you said so far does not pass the smell test. I am saying this as an Indian myself who lives on a reservation.



There is no "Cherokee tribe." There's the CNO, EB (Eastern Band of Cherokee) and many other bands of Cherokee Indians but there is no "the Cherokee tribe" as such. I am really sorry but the adcoms will see right through your deception, and even if the adcoms won't, any Indians you encounter during your time at the medical school will clearly recognize you as an imposter. There are a number of errors you made in your story but I don't want to draw attention to those errors so that smarter individuals won't learn to avoid those errors and falsely claim Indian status to get admitted to medical school.

Once again, I am really very sorry.

Okay... what's your point? So I don't know that much about Native American culture? I just barely discovered I'm Native American. Do you think all black children know about the African Tribal structure? Especially if they were adopted and raised in a white household? Does that make them any less black? No.

The essential test is: If you thought that reporting your ancestry would hurt your chances, would you still claim it? If so, then go ahead. If you wouldn't, then you have no right to claim it at all.

Yes I am and always will claim to be Native American because that's who I am. It's my identity. Nobody on this thread can change that. I can't even change what my genes tell me.



Here are some things people should think about before posting things:

I did not choose to be Native American. I didn't come into this thinking "god it sure would be nice to be Native American, that would totally help me out". I began this journey before I even considered premed. I honestly thought I was just an odd mix of European ancestors. I was surprised to learn that I am Native American. However, this was a happy surprise as I finally found an identity to connect with. After feeling like I had no real identity I finally found one. It made me very happy and excited to connect to my roots. Quite frankly it makes me sad to see so many people try to downplay my ancestry and turn me away from it, claiming I'm just doing it for medical school admissions purposes. If I were going into custodial services I would still want to connect to my ancestry. Wouldn't you?

It is not your job to judge me. The question here is not whether I'm Native American or not. That is for me, a tribal leader, my family, and the government to figure out. Stay out of this aspect. I'm working on it and I already know I'm eligible because I have traced ancestors back to the Dawes Rolls. I just need to fill in a few holes about relatives I don't know much about on my family tree. I also have genetic evidence. Let's drop this whole "you're not Native American" act. Were you the one looking at the gene test results? No. Are you actively involved in making my family tree? No. Are you the member of the BIA reviewing my CDIB application? Probably not. Are you the tribal leader whom I've contacted about citizenship? No. If you don't fit into any of those categories, then do yourself a favor and shut up, because you're making yourself look like a fool.

Yes I'm Jewish, and yes I don't know that much about Native American culture (though I'm working on this aspect). Does that really surprise you? I was raised in a middle class white Jewish household. And yes, people with doctorates can be middle class. Education doesn't always equal pay. Not knowing the exact tribal structure doesn't mean I'm not Native American. I just wasn't raised learning about that. I know plenty of Native Americans who are no longer in contact with their tribe and do not keep to the customs and traditions that they were raised with. This doesn't make them any less Native American. It's in our blood. A black child in America probably doesn't know what African tribe they belonged to. An adopted black child especially wouldn't know that much at all about African culture. That doesn't make them any less black. If you just found out that you were mostly of Ukranian descent would you instantly know about Ukranian culture? Of course not. This is a long process and will take time for me to fully understand the culture. I never pretended to know a lot about the culture.

I am Native American and I choose to accept that identity. This is my identity no matter what.

 

[baxt1412]

then just put it on your damn application.

if you are so irritated with everyone giving you their opinions, and you're just going to do it anyway, then go do it. it's like you want us to be fans of yours because you have this recently discovered identity.


i just find it strange that you thought an affiliation with a relatively common religion tracing back to your adolescence was potentially more controversial than your identity as a URM (as evident by you mentioning your religion in your "controversial?" thread but not your URM identity). URM is much more of a hot topic than Judaism unless you're applying to like Loma Linda or LUCOM, for example.

 

[PlaqueBuster]

Okay... what's your point? So I don't know that much about Native American culture? I just barely discovered I'm Native American. Do you think all black children know about the African Tribal structure? Especially if they were adopted and raised in a white household? Does that make them any less black? No.


Yes I am and always will claim to be Native American because that's who I am. It's my identity. Nobody on this thread can change that. I can't even change what my genes tell me.

I don't think you know what identity is. Identity is not your genetic background. Identity is shaped as much by environment as it can be by genetics. I identify myself as an American even though my ethicnity is different. Your ethnicity is native american but I refuse to believe that is your identity if you were raised from birth at a white household. I think you are confused. You sudden passion for native american culture is a cause of having ethnic connections (genetics). To say that you identify as a Native american will sound silly. You enjoy aspects of your culture but you have been white-washed (for a lack of a better word). You cannot honestly believe even for a second that because of your genetic linkage, you are entitled to being a native american when you haven't lived this lifestyle. I agree that you should learn, participate, and attend tribal events to immerse yourself into understanding your roots, but to say I identify myself myself as a native american from a few years of exposure is silly. An african american in the USA today would not say this is my tribal affiliation and identiy because his genes trace him back to Africa. They will embrace their heritage and feel proud of it but their identification is American because they have been raised that way their entire life. Hope this makes sense.

 

[wayves]

Does a black child who grew up in a white suburban neighborhood with a good education still identify as African-American/Black/Whatever He Believes? Yes, because that's the color of his skin and his ancestry. Think of it the same way except the color of my skin isn't too different from yours. This thread was not intended to be a debate on whether I'm Native American or not, so please let's stay on topic. I am Native American. You can choose to believe it or not, just don't argue about it with me.

it's like you want us to be fans of yours because you have this recently discovered identity.

I could also make the argument that maybe some of you are turning me away from this identity because you don't believe in affirmative action/don't want me to have an "advantage"/are jealous/whatever. If you don't like being here, then feel free to leave. I'm not asking for fans, I'm asking if you think it should be put on my application and why/why not.

There are many possible arguments for or against as stated in my original post. Also there are different ways I could include it in my application. I could check the box "officially", I could write about it, or I could bring it up in an interview and bring my CDIB.

 

[baxt1412]

Besides maybe a post or two have all given you opinions on whether or not the poster believes you should put it on your app or not.


At the end of the day, if you identify as a Native American, put that on your app. If you identify as a URM, then put that.

The reason I said it seems as if you want fans is because you seem to argue with the people who are stating their reasoning behind them thinking that you should not put this on your app.

 

[PlaqueBuster]

I am not arguing whether or not you are native american or not. That is fact. What I am saying is for you to be careful of making a strong claim that native american is your identity. It may work in yoour favor the way you talk about it in your PS or backfire. I am actually giving you advice about how to think about it. Sorry if it came out negatively. I apologize

 

[wayves]

I am not arguing whether or not you are native american or not. That is fact. What I am saying is for you to be careful of making a strong claim that native american is your identity. It may work in yoour favor the way you talk about it in your PS or backfire. I am actually giving you advice about how to think about it. Sorry if it came out negatively. I apologize

I understand. Thanks for the advice.