Teaching University or PsyD program professors

[Harry3990]

There was one previous thread I saw about teaching university salaries that was helpful, but I was also interested in seeing whether anyone had any direct experience with jobs themselves as well.

Other than considering VA/AMC or other hospital jobs once I'm licensed (still have a couple years before that happens), I've also thought that a good fit for me might be to be a prof at a teaching university or at a PsyD program and work part-time in private practice. This also might be something I consider doing later in my career if not near the start, the primary reason being that I really enjoy teaching and am fairly certain I will miss it. However, I'm not too keen on adjunct salaries. Don't really think it's worth it for the time invested.

I was wondering if any of the regulars or other posters on the forum happen to have prior experience in this type of job. If not first-hand experience, maybe you know colleagues who have went this route. What do you guys think are the pros/cons of this type of work setup? Any major drawbacks?

The appealing part to me is getting to teach and possibly supervise students while also having full-time employment benefits and salary typically associated with a teaching professorship. From what I've heard/seen, schedules tend to end up being rather flexible thereby allowing a decent amount of time to devote to private practice work as well.

Thoughts?

P.S. Just FYI, I would avoid applying to institutions that I believe are just straight-up predatory. E.G., Alliant, Argosy, etc.

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[ClinicalABA]

[QUOTE="Harry3990, post: 17975644, member: 644948" ] However, I'm not too keen on adjunct salaries. Don't really think it's worth it for the time invested.[/QUOTE]

I don't know about adjuncting as a primary source of income, but I've been doing it for awhile in various masters degree programs (counseling; behavior analysis), and once you get the course set up, its a good source of extra income. The first time you do a course is a TON of work, but after that it's not that bad. I've generally had taugh one course per semester (occasionally 2, if one is hybrid live/online), requiring 3 hours per week instruction, with big bursts of correcting tests/papers when the time comes. Average about $5k per class, with the additional benefit of staying on top of the research, networking, being inspired by new or early career folks who are excited to be doing what they are doing, and access to online databases/journals. Overall, it's comes out to an additional 15-20k income per year, and (other than those long weekends where I dread assigning papers), and doesn't seem like too much work for me.

 

[Harry3990]

Average about $5k per class

That's good to know. I've typically heard about $3k in the past in my area. Though that is typically for undergrad classes I believe, and at public institutions that are known to pay lower than flagship or private schools in the same state.

Out of curiosity, what is your typical class size?

 

[ClinicalABA]

It's been around 10. In my current gig, if it's more than 10, I get a co-instructor (i.e. TA). Always been graduate classes. State school paid a little less, and also took out Union dues. Still pretty close to 5k, though.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

I think you are thinking of a program like Loyola Maryland
http://www.loyola.edu/academic/psychology/faculty-staff/alphabetical
They have a lot of clinical faculty that also have private practices.

Are you thinking of a tenure track position, a non-tenured (but not adjunct) clinical training position, or lecturer? Do you have geographic restrictions? Tenure track position are still competitive at non-predatory universities. These are full time jobs and you can start a small private practice but you will likely want to save the bulk of that work until after tenure.

Not sure about competition for non-tenured, full- or part-time clinical training positions. But these are still pretty sweet jobs if you are interested in training and enjoy the academic setting. Having a private practice is much more doable in these positions.

Also, there are lecturers that teach a lot of courses but can also continue a private practice around the courses.

 

[Doctor-S]

Before I provide a meaningful response to your comments - about maintaining a private clinical practice plus an academic career - please provide me with some useful information (and names of universities are NOT needed) ...

You said that you are a "couple years" away from becoming "licensed" as a clinical psychologist. So, I am assuming you are currently a graduate student in an APA-accredited clinical psychology program, eh? Or you're a post-doc who is completing supervised hours (etc.) in preparation for the EPPP, eh? Is that correct? If yes, have you published original research?

Thank you.

 

[Harry3990]

currently a graduate student in an APA-accredited clinical psychology program

Yes.

If yes, have you published original research?

About 10-12 posters (4-5 first author), 1 symposia presentation, 3-4 journal pubs (1 first author)

So, not super competitive for research-focused departments, but I think competitive enough to demonstrate competency for teaching purposes in a teaching/clinical focused program. What do others think?

In general, I'm planning and am very much looking forward to getting a primarily clinical job when licensed. But I'll likely keep my eye out for teaching jobs as well. Not entirely decided yet.

I'm also somewhat geographically flexible in that me and my wife are open to living in her home state, my home state, or possibly somewhere in the middle. Tenure track would be nice, but not a necessity.

 

[Doctor-S]

Yes.

About 10-12 posters (4-5 first author), 1 symposia presentation, 3-4 journal pubs (1 first author)

So, not super competitive for research-focused departments, but I think competitive enough to demonstrate competency for teaching purposes in a teaching/clinical focused program. What do others think?

In general, I'm planning and am very much looking forward to getting a primarily clinical job when licensed. But I'll likely keep my eye out for teaching jobs as well. Not entirely decided yet.

Thank you for the additional information.

The research-focused departments will often require a proven track record of research and peer-reviewed publications, etc. So, I agree with you: you need more research "publications and potential for more" on your c.v., before you will be considered competitive for most tenure-track opportunities offered by a research-oriented clinical psychology program.

Concerning teaching in a clinical psychology program (PhD and/or PsyD) ... in your post, you stated that you are "looking forward to getting a primarily clinical job when licensed." I agree with you: face-to-face clinical experience will be a good initial step in moving toward your idea of becoming a teacher-clinician in a clinical psychology program - especially since you want to maintain a private practice at the same time.

On the other hand, and in case you're curious, here is some typical recruiting language inviting applicants for an assistant professor tenure-track position in clinical psychology:

Requirements: Ph.D. in Clinical Psychology, completed an APA-approved internship, evidence of history of scholarship related to theory and practice related to clinical psychology, must be able to provide clinical supervision; and be able to obtain licensure as a clinical psychologist within one year of hiring. The successful candidate will be expected to publish original research, seek/obtain grant funding, mentor graduate students, supervise clinical training, and teach graduate and undergraduate courses.

If that doesn't sound appealing to you, you might want to consider the community college teacher-clinician game plan:

Community colleges will often hire licensed clinical psychologists as "adjunct" lecturers to teach clinically-oriented psychology classes for students who are earning two-year degrees (and who might be planning to transfer to a four-year university to earn a bachelor's degree). In general, part-time (adjunct) lecturer-clinicians have accumulated substantial hours of experience as licensed clinical psychologists (e.g., in excess of 3000-4000 hours as a licensed clinical psychologist in a private practice or in a hospital-based practice) before they will be considered for adjunct teaching positions in clinical psychology programs. Well, at least that is the case in my geographic region of the USA. I don't know about everywhere else.

After the part-time teacher-clinicians acquire a certain amount of adjunct teaching experience and receive positive reviews/evaluations/references, they may go on to get hired as compensated members of the teaching faculty of other clinical psychology programs, including non-APA and APA-accredited clinical programs. Experience counts.

Thank you.