The LOCUMS how to guide

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Seriously wondering how many back pain patients you get per day/wk?
I probably see about 5 back pains a week. If they are acute then I treat. If they are chronic with long term issues and looking for pain medication I refere them back to their PCP or ortho as I do not refill narcotics for an old injury. Why?

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I probably see about 5 back pains a week. If they are acute then I treat. If they are chronic with long term issues and looking for pain medication I refere them back to their PCP or ortho as I do not refill narcotics for an old injury. Why?


Why? Well, b/c it seems like this comes up a lot. I know of patients with chronic back pain; and they are in fact afraid of narcotic relief, but then they refuse to listen to the PCPs or specialists. It's kind of frustrating, b/c some of these folks are like chronic victims, but regardless of what the experts recommend, they don't listen. One woman in particular is an IDDM with other complications, but she refuses to move. B/c she had radiation tx for breast cancer, when she gets an URI, it has, more than once moved into pneumonia and other complications. She just refuses to accept the complications/risks of immobility, yet nothing that any physician recommends "work," or "will work," according to her. So, we've been waiting for her to fall prey to complications of immobility, as she did before. She coded while they were performing a pericardial window--effusion that started with complications of an infection, mixed with the fact that radiation scarring is the gift that keeps on giving. She's just difficult. So on one hand, it's like PCPs have to deal with those seeking narcotics or the whole other gamut of folks that just won't listen to medical advice and get themselves into more trouble. It's kind of frustrating. At least with my pediatric clients, many of their parents are more likely to listen to medical advice. But these pts that come in for help but don't listen, well, it's frustrating.

Basically, though, I was wondering how often the average PCP has the "back pain" patients come in to be seen.
 
Well, I am doing urgent care so I have the luxury of declining those seekers and chronic folks. I see the initial injury only. No refills.
 
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I've heard a lot of people recommend sticking to large / long-lasting locums companies. You've mentioned CompHealth and Delta and some others, but have you worked with or do you know people who work with Mint Physician staffing? I'm wondering how they compare...
 
I've heard a lot of people recommend sticking to large / long-lasting locums companies. You've mentioned CompHealth and Delta and some others, but have you worked with or do you know people who work with Mint Physician staffing? I'm wondering how they compare...
I have only worked with comphealth and delta - have 2 ladies who I try to alternate jobs so they each get a share. I am signed with OnyxMD but have not been placed by them.
 
I probably see about 5 back pains a week. If they are acute then I treat. If they are chronic with long term issues and looking for pain medication I refere them back to their PCP or ortho as I do not refill narcotics for an old injury. Why?


5 per week, wow you are a lucky dog! At my last clinic job I'd see at least 2-4 per day. So many were drug-seekers that became immediately obvious when running their script history.

My favorite was the pt whose back pain caused leg pain requiring a cane and a good five minutes to walk 10 feet. When I said no to the oxys this patient just stormed out of the room without her cane. Man, it was funny hearing my nurse shout down the hall, "Wait, slow down, you forgot your cane!"
 
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5 per week, wow you are a lucky dog! At my last clinic job I'd see at least 2-4 per day. So many were drug-seekers that became immediately obvious when running their script history.

My favorite was the pt whose back pain caused leg pain requiring a cane and a good five minutes to walk 10 feet. When I said no to the oxys this patient just stormed out of the room without her cane. Man, it was funny hearing my nurse shout down the hall, "Wait, slow down, you forgot your cane!"

I hear ya about the drug seekers. Since I work rural health, word gets around quite quickly that "the new doc doesn't give out pain meds". They stop coming after a few weeks.
 
Cabinbuilder, how much say do you get in your schedule at the jobs you take? It sounds like you prefer taking on an intense work load when you're at a work site, but could you find a steady stream of 40 hour a week gigs if you wanted to? Just wondering if it would be possible to make a career out of "part time" locums work if you're feeling a bit burnt out from a crazy resident's schedule..
 
Cabinbuilder, how much say do you get in your schedule at the jobs you take? It sounds like you prefer taking on an intense work load when you're at a work site, but could you find a steady stream of 40 hour a week gigs if you wanted to? Just wondering if it would be possible to make a career out of "part time" locums work if you're feeling a bit burnt out from a crazy resident's schedule..


Yes, there are plenty of 9-5 40 hour/week locums jobs. Or 7 on/ 7 off hospitalist jobs. It comes down to how much you want/need to make and/or explore the region where the job is. I have total say and know what my personal goals are so I take the jobs that will guarantee the hours I want.
 
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Revitalizing this thread as I am getting lots of "how to" questions again. I currently have a permanent position working urgent care that is 10 days a month. I also have 3 locums positions that I work as well on my days off. One is a weekend only gig since I never am scheduled weekends. The other 2 contact me with schedules when they need help and I pick up what shifts work around my regular schedule. Generally I pick up 6-10 extra shifts a month between the 3.
 
Revitalizing this thread as I am getting lots of "how to" questions again. I currently have a permanent position working urgent care that is 10 days a month. I also have 3 locums positions that I work as well on my days off. One is a weekend only gig since I never am scheduled weekends. The other 2 contact me with schedules when they need help and I pick up what shifts work around my regular schedule. Generally I pick up 6-10 extra shifts a month between the 3.

I am glad you revitalized this because I am currently looking into locums and it appears that you provide excellent input into this. I am in my last 4 months of fellowship and my wife and I just had our first child. I would like for her not to have to go back to work after maternity leave but paying bills (loan repayment, cars, rent, food, etc) on just a fellows salary is tough. I am looking to do locums shifts on weekends and figure if I can work 1-2 per month then she can stay home.

How difficult is it to just get shifts on weekends? I have signed up with locumtenens.com and a couple others. I got an email on a few positions and they are requesting an 8-12 shift commitment. Is that something that you can do over several months? Is that even the norm? I know you had said something in one of your 2013 posts about companies wanting a 1-2 month commitment due to all the time spent on credentialing. Do they generally allow 1-2 shifts per month for 4-5 months? Any input would be most appreciated.
 
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I am glad you revitalized this because I am currently looking into locums and it appears that you provide excellent input into this. I am in my last 4 months of fellowship and my wife and I just had our first child. I would like for her not to have to go back to work after maternity leave but paying bills (loan repayment, cars, rent, food, etc) on just a fellows salary is tough. I am looking to do locums shifts on weekends and figure if I can work 1-2 per month then she can stay home.

How difficult is it to just get shifts on weekends? I have signed up with locumtenens.com and a couple others. I got an email on a few positions and they are requesting an 8-12 shift commitment. Is that something that you can do over several months? Is that even the norm? I know you had said something in one of your 2013 posts about companies wanting a 1-2 month commitment due to all the time spent on credentialing. Do they generally allow 1-2 shifts per month for 4-5 months? Any input would be most appreciated.
The 8- 12 shifts is generally per month. Would have to look at urgent care or er to do less than that. You need to work with the locums person assigned to you to find the type of job you are looking for. If locumtenens doesn't give you a go to person then you need a different company. Call my lady Ann Schilling at delta locums. I have been with her for 7 years. 214- 442- 4243 is her direct line.
 
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The 8- 12 shifts is generally per month. Would have to look at urgent care or er to do less than that. You need to work with the locus person assigned to you to find the type of job you are looking for. If locumtenens doesn't give you a go to person then you need a different company. Call my lady Ann Schilling at delta locus. I have been with her for 7 years. 214- 442- 4243 is her direct line.
She's a Dallas person?!? I will be looking for locums positions in that area until my permanent position starts in 2018. Thanks.
 
She's a Dallas person?!? I will be looking for locums positions in that area until my permanent position starts in 2018. Thanks.
Yes she is located in Dallas but has jobs all over the country
I have worked for her in Texas Alaska and oregon. She keeps trying to get me to Maine but haven't had time. I just texted her. She knows I'm cabin. I've been with her for 7 years. Good luck.
 
Yes she is located in Dallas but has jobs all over the country
I have worked for her in Texas Alaska and oregon. She keeps trying to get me to Maine but haven't had time. I just texted her. She knows I'm cabin. I've been with her for 7 years. Good luck.
Thanks again.
 
Locums is for losers or masochists. "See the world?" That's the Navy's line! :laugh:
 
Thank you for sharing your experience Dr cabinbuilder
 
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Why? Well, b/c it seems like this comes up a lot. I know of patients with chronic back pain; and they are in fact afraid of narcotic relief, but then they refuse to listen to the PCPs or specialists. It's kind of frustrating, b/c some of these folks are like chronic victims, but regardless of what the experts recommend, they don't listen. One woman in particular is an IDDM with other complications, but she refuses to move. B/c she had radiation tx for breast cancer, when she gets an URI, it has, more than once moved into pneumonia and other complications. She just refuses to accept the complications/risks of immobility, yet nothing that any physician recommends "work," or "will work," according to her. So, we've been waiting for her to fall prey to complications of immobility, as she did before. She coded while they were performing a pericardial window--effusion that started with complications of an infection, mixed with the fact that radiation scarring is the gift that keeps on giving. She's just difficult. So on one hand, it's like PCPs have to deal with those seeking narcotics or the whole other gamut of folks that just won't listen to medical advice and get themselves into more trouble. It's kind of frustrating. At least with my pediatric clients, many of their parents are more likely to listen to medical advice. But these pts that come in for help but don't listen, well, it's frustrating.

Basically, though, I was wondering how often the average PCP has the "back pain" patients come in to be seen.

Well, you have to remember that I only do urgent care so my "management" is not the same as a PCP.
 
You posted earlier that you worked on an island in Alaska where you were the only physician, what was that like? Have you ever worked in a locums location so beautiful or in a practice that fit you so well that you didn't want to leave?
 
You posted earlier that you worked on an island in Alaska where you were the only physician, what was that like? Have you ever worked in a locums location so beautiful or in a practice that fit you so well that you didn't want to leave?
I wasn't always the only doctor on the island but was many times when the other doc was at CME or on vacation. Not sure about what it's like? You do your best to take care of patients. The nursing staff helps you as does ems staff when needed.

I had a few jobs where I didn't want to leave but usually I didn't stay either due to low paying salary or because it would mean moving my kids again.
My permanent job currently is actually a prior locums site. They had the best package and most tolerable administration. My kids are grown and do their own thing now.
 
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One of the biggest draws to locum work for me would be the idea of working hard during the week and sometimes getting a long weekend off to explore the area. Does locum work allow you to do much of that or are you constantly busy? Also, if my wife were to come with me, would a locum company provide hotel/motel housing or rental apartment/house? What is the shortest amount of time you can be in an area and what is the longest? Would the locum company also be able to help with getting the wife any work if we were in an area for a longer amount of time? (Probably out of their scope, but maybe if an area was desperate enough to get a doctor there...) Thank you!
 
One of the biggest draws to locum work for me would be the idea of working hard during the week and sometimes getting a long weekend off to explore the area. Does locum work allow you to do much of that or are you constantly busy? Also, if my wife were to come with me, would a locum company provide hotel/motel housing or rental apartment/house? What is the shortest amount of time you can be in an area and what is the longest? Would the locum company also be able to help with getting the wife any work if we were in an area for a longer amount of time? (Probably out of their scope, but maybe if an area was desperate enough to get a doctor there...) Thank you!


1. The hours on the job depend on the needs of the job site, whether you are doing FP clinic, urgent care, or ER coverage. You can basically say that you would want a 3 days weekend every other week, etc. I did that on one of my jobs to see my kids for a long weekend. It just comes down to what your contract says. Most places will let you work as much as you want. Most schedulers are very accommodating and are happy with whatever help you can give within reason.

2. Yes, the job always provides travel, housing, and rental car. No problem having your wife there. My husband goes with me these days and travel even does his ticket for me and they take the cost out payroll deduction so I don't have to worry about money up front.

3. The shortest job I have done is every other weekend for an extended time. The longest job I have done was 5 days/week, 12 hrs shifts for 9 months with no break. Some places will extend indfinitely (I just finished a job that was 2 weekends a month for the past 18 months) I'm tired of the politics there so did not extend. I could have gone indefinitely. Some jobs know they will only need help for a few months, etc. and won't extend. So my next job is in New Hampshire and it's from April-Aug with no extension expected.

4. No, the locums company does not help your wife find a job unless she is a health care provider.
 
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1. The hours on the job depend on the needs of the job site, whether you are doing FP clinic, urgent care, or ER coverage. You can basically say that you would want a 3 days weekend every other week, etc. I did that on one of my jobs to see my kids for a long weekend. It just comes down to what your contract says. Most places will let you work as much as you want. Most schedulers are very accommodating and are happy with whatever help you can give within reason.

2. Yes, the job always provides travel, housing, and rental car. No problem having your wife there. My husband goes with me these days and travel even does his ticket for me and they take the cost out payroll deduction so I don't have to worry about money up front.

3. The shortest job I have done is every other weekend for an extended time. The longest job I have done was 5 days/week, 12 hrs shifts for 9 months with no break. Some places will extend indfinitely (I just finished a job that was 2 weekends a month for the past 18 months) I'm tired of the politics there so did not extend. I could have gone indefinitely. Some jobs know they will only need help for a few months, etc. and won't extend. So my next job is in New Hampshire and it's from April-Aug with no extension expected.

4. No, the locums company does not help your wife find a job unless she is a health care provider.

My wife is a nurse (RN), would they find temporary work for her or are you talking physicains when you state health care provider?
 
My wife is a nurse (RN), would they find temporary work for her or are you talking physicains when you state health care provider?
I"m talking doctors/PA/NP for providers. Travelling nurses have their own companies they go through. I do know that nurses need ICU experience if they want to travel.
 
Revitalizing this thread as I am getting lots of "how to" questions again. I currently have a permanent position working urgent care that is 10 days a month. I also have 3 locums positions that I work as well on my days off. One is a weekend only gig since I never am scheduled weekends. The other 2 contact me with schedules when they need help and I pick up what shifts work around my regular schedule. Generally I pick up 6-10 extra shifts a month between the 3.

Nice schedule! How much are you making per year with this kind of steady flow, if you don't mind me asking?
 
Revitalizing this thread as I am getting lots of "how to" questions again. I currently have a permanent position working urgent care that is 10 days a month. I also have 3 locums positions that I work as well on my days off. One is a weekend only gig since I never am scheduled weekends. The other 2 contact me with schedules when they need help and I pick up what shifts work around my regular schedule. Generally I pick up 6-10 extra shifts a month between the 3.

Thanks for this guide. I'm thinking about doing locums and I have a few questions:

1. Where do you establish your primary residence? Do you own / rent another property (besides the locum housing) or can the locum housing be the primary residence? If the locum gigs end early, does the agency still pay for housing or are you on your own?

2. Did you maintain multiple state licenses? If so, how do you keep track of all the different states requirements and fulfill the CME requirements of all the licenses?

3. Why did you create patient logs? I'm assuming you're not getting paid by production so why do extra work? Was it needed for credentialing for future facilities or for your own records?

4. In the contract with the agency, does it stipulate the maximum number of patients a day? If not, I can imagine the hospital / clinic taking advantage of you and make you see an impossibly large number of patients a day.

5. Do you make more being employed or doing locums?

Thanks!
 
Thanks for this guide. I'm thinking about doing locums and I have a few questions:

1. Where do you establish your primary residence? Do you own / rent another property (besides the locum housing) or can the locum housing be the primary residence? If the locum gigs end early, does the agency still pay for housing or are you on your own?

I am assure you have stuff and a car somewhere? That's where your primary residence is. No the locums housing is not a primary residence. Most of the time I stayed in a hotel chain. I would suggest if you don't have that then you need to establish residency somewhere. I would suggest a state that does not have state income tax. It will be better for you on the taxes in the end. The locum gig should not end early unless it's unbearable and you opt for the 30 days notice and end the job. They do not pay for your housing once the job is over.

2. Did you maintain multiple state licenses? If so, how do you keep track of all the different states requirements and fulfill the CME requirements of all the licenses?

Yes, I have 6 active licenses currently. Most states have the same requirements. My permanent job pays for all my CME so I go to just about every conference I can. I get almost 12K for CME, books, travel, hotel per year so it's pretty easy to just go to conferences.

3. Why did you create patient logs? I'm assuming you're not getting paid by production so why do extra work? Was it needed for credentialing for future facilities or for your own records?

I created patient logs to keep track of my charting, still do. Especially in urgent care I don't always get to chart until hours later. In places that still have dictation (yes those do exist) it helps me keep track of what still needs to be done. Also sometimes dictations get lost and I would have a few charts I would have to dictate remotely. That happens a lot in Texas with all the electrical storms.

Also, as FP when I did a hospitalist job or an ER job it helped me prove that I had the numbers to be considered for the next job. My current locum Job in NH actually asked for patient logs (most do) and I was able to sent those over from my computer. I pay my son to put all the info in a spreadsheet each year from my notebooks.

4. In the contract with the agency, does it stipulate the maximum number of patients a day? If not, I can imagine the hospital / clinic taking advantage of you and make you see an impossibly large number of patients a day.

No, but they generally give you an idea of the volume for that location. Now I only do urgent care so you could have 10, you could have 50. Hospitalist is a different story and you would need to know what is expected before you agreed to the job.

5. Do you make more being employed or doing locums? I make way more being employed due to quarterly bonuses, base pay, and RVU's. I also have health insurance, disability, medevac insurance, and life insurance. I still do locums because I work in a place where the staff has more say than the physicians and the front office staff runs everything. I get tired of it and I no longer pick up extra shifts because I won't work with other staff outside my own. My regular job is 10 shifts a month and I get restless so I still do locums to pay off bills (like my new car), keep my mileage plan stocked, and my hotel plans full of points so I don't really have to pay for vacations anymore. It's also nice to be where they actually respect you as a provider an are grateful to have you there.

Thanks!
 
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excuse this question if a little off topic but have you considered telemedicine cabinbuilder?
 
excuse this question if a little off topic but have you considered telemedicine cabinbuilder?
No. Never saw the point of it. Don't want to be on video. I like to see the patients in person. People lie and I don' trust not to get caught up in a lawsuit.
 
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Great thread!

I'm curious to know how much it costs the employment sites to pay the locums company for your services.

Say you're getting paid $1000 per day, how much would the locums company charge the site for you services ($1000 + Travel + Expenses + Overhead + Profit = ???)

Wondering what the ballpark total cost is? 1.5x salary, 2x salary, more?
 
Great thread!

I'm curious to know how much it costs the employment sites to pay the locums company for your services.

Say you're getting paid $1000 per day, how much would the locums company charge the site for you services ($1000 + Travel + Expenses + Overhead + Profit = ???)

Wondering what the ballpark total cost is? 1.5x salary, 2x salary, more?
You are not privy to that information as the provider.
 
It’s interesting. If you just do locums, I wonder what you list for practice location on your licenses and DEA.
You change your dea location when you go to the next job site. When I go back and forth between 2 jobs I change it each time. It takes about 5 minutes online.
 
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I do weekend coverage locum as a psychiatrist side gig, sometimes the address of the locum company is used on hospital staff applications etc
That may be the case but you should be provided with the site address for dea changes. Now I do a weekend job 100 miles from my perm job. I don't change my dea for that one since I'm in the same area code.
 
If you only do locums and don’t have a permanent job, would you need to change the address of your medical licenses too? I know some states publish physicians’ work addresses on their websites and these show up when people do a public search.
 
If you only do locums and don’t have a permanent job, would you need to change the address of your medical licenses too? I know some states publish physicians’ work addresses on their websites and these show up when people do a public search.

No you don't. As long as the state has a permanent mailing address you don't change your medical licence address. In 8 years I have never had to change my address with the state while doing locums jobs. I only update my permanent mailing address. Most get hold of you via email anyway if there are issues.
 
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I will finish my fellowship July 2019 and will plan to do locums work, likely urgent care for 3-6 months when I finish while my wife wraps up with her work. How early would you recommend starting to pursue these jobs?
 
I will finish my fellowship July 2019 and will plan to do locums work, likely urgent care for 3-6 months when I finish while my wife wraps up with her work. How early would you recommend starting to pursue these jobs?

Depends on where you expect to work. Have to think about time to get a license in that state (6wks to 10 months) and time it takes to credential you at the site with insurance/Medicaid/medicare ( Generally it takes 90 days) I would start looking in Jan/Feb with a July/Aug availability. I currently look ahead at jobs 4-5 months out due to the credentialing factor that takes so long and that's with already having the state license.

Now remember that you can always work at any IHS facility with any state license.
 
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Depends on where you expect to work. Have to think about time to get a license in that state (6wks to 10 months) and time it takes to credential you at the site with insurance/Medicaid/medicare ( Generally it takes 90 days) I would start looking in Jan/Feb with a July/Aug availability. I currently look ahead at jobs 4-5 months out due to the credentialing factor that takes so long and that's with already having the state license.

Now remember that you can always work at any IHS facility with any state license.

Thank you very much. The state I hope to work in takes 2-3 months it seems. Your posts have been invaluable in thinking about this.
 
Thank you very much. The state I hope to work in takes 2-3 months it seems. Your posts have been invaluable in thinking about this.
YW. Just remember that getting licensed and getting credentialed are two different things. You will also need to be credentialed at the locums company as well which is a whole another packet (generally good for 2 years). Have everything scanned (diplomas, etc) on your computer so you can just email everything. Get copies of your immunizations or proof of titers (measles, mumps, rubella). Will have to show flu shot proof.
 
Hi cabinbuilder thank you for putting this guide and thread together it's certainly been helpful. I was wondering if you had any experience or know anyone that has done locums through the VA. I'm considering doing locums through the VA and I just want to get input from other providers that have done locums through the VA. Thanks.
 
Hi cabinbuilder thank you for putting this guide and thread together it's certainly been helpful. I was wondering if you had any experience or know anyone that has done locums through the VA. I'm considering doing locums through the VA and I just want to get input from other providers that have done locums through the VA. Thanks.

I never did VA locums cuz it would not pay the bills ($60/hr generally). Of course I would assume that has all changed with Trump in office since everything is changing for the better in the VA system and very quickly. I would imagine they are now comparable to the private sector.
 
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