The **NEW & IMPROVED** official low gpa thread...

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Here's my stats:

Virginia Tech
May 2002 - BS Comp Sci
GPA: 2.54
SciGPA: ?

Currently at Northern VA Community College doing Bio 102. Applying at George Mason for the Fall of 2005 to take advantage of their Pre-Med advising and pre-med honor society.

I am currently 27, I hope to enter medical school before age 30.

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I went to Carleton College and had my thumb up my ass for 4 years and a 2.9 gpa to show for it. I am going to do the harvard thing next fall and hopefully use my thumb for something constructive.

Hey titoincali if you read this, when did you graduate?
 
bugger said:
Okay, I will join in
2.67-UNC undergrad, my BCPM is even worse.
Did really well my last two semesters, but I have a grip of C's and a handful of D's.(chronic illness and immaturity)
SFSU-postbacc~3.3-working 30+hours a week
MCAT (w/1 month studying and no O-chem or physics)-26T 12V, 7P, 7B
Retook this April-fingers crossed for better score!
-Working as RA at biotech company for the past 2 and half years.
-painter, construction worker, demolition work
-slicer of meats at a deli
-worked at group home for 2 years
-worked in US sweatshop-packaging bathrobes (the ones that the fancy hotels give out for free)
-volunteer for free clinic and women's prison organization

I am going to apply for 2005 if my MCAT scores are better!

I wish everyone the best of luck, and just think that our low GPA's actually make us more well rounded. We were off experiencing life instead of studying :D

Hey just wanted to provide an update. I have had three interviews, with a fourth on the way. I have interviewed at Tulane, UIC, and Meharry. My next interview is with Drew/UCLA.

I was accepted to UIC yesterday. This past semester has been rough. I have been working 35 hours, and taking Molecular Genetics, Calc 1, and O-chem 2, and volunteering. So, this acceptance is a godsend.

Good luck to everyone, and remember that there is a light at the end of the tunnel!
 
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beanbean said:
Boston University undergrad (Biomed Eng, 1990): GPA ~ 2.5
(had some significant chronic health issues)

UCONN post-bacc (on my own and then formal program): 1 1/2 years: GPA = 4.0

MCAT: 33S (11V, 11PS, 11BS)

Accepted to UCONN (only school applied to)

Currently an MS1 for a couple more weeks

Could you tell me more about th Uconn Psot bac and the Uconn school of medicine, ie, your bacground and how you like it there? I'm applying to both and need some feedback to decide if its right for me.
Thanks!
 
Guess I'll join too, as I don't really know what to do next. I applied DO this cycle. with a 3.31/3.17 cum/sci GPA and a 22 (10 VR, 5 PS, 7 BS) MCAT. I only mailed 3 secondary apps because I didn't want to end up far away for now (getting married in June) and received 3 interview invitations. Went to 2, got rejected post-interview from both, and withdrew from the third so I wouldn't waste any more money. I know some will say it was the interview that did me in, but that's only true for one school; the second interview was excellent, so I don't know what the deal is.

Anyways, here are the DO and MD stats I'm reapplying with after this semester. Please tell me what you guys think I need to do to have the best shot at my two state schools (USC and MUSC). I'm planning on applying to a majority of DO schools, but will add a few MD schools (including USC and MUSC) just because I no longer care which I am, as long as I'm one of them.

I already plan to retake the MCAT in April.

Osteopathic
Cumulative: 3.41
Science: 3.33

Allopathic
Cumulative: 3.36
Science: 3.25

Now, I do have somewhat of a "pattern" to my grades, which is something I know they look at. I finished this past fall semester with a 3.88 GPA, which is my highest ever.

The question is, given my stats, what should I be doing? It is possible to take at maximum two more sciences classes in the Spring, but it would only raise my science gpa to a 3.33 assuming I make A's in both. I can always take biochem and a low-level physics class and I should be ok doing that.

Would I have a decent shot at state schools and some of the "safety" MD schools with my grades and, say, a 30ish MCAT? Should I bother with more sciences, or just focus on owning the MCAT in April?

Thanks!
:)
 
I'm so glad I've stumbled onto this forum. Here I was, agonizing over my undergrad gpa and wondering how on earth I'll get into med school... I didn't think there were others in the same agony. No, really. It seems like there are post bac programs for those who haven't had undergrad sciences or those who want to spruce up their already respectable science gpas (you know, those programs that want at least a 3.0 science gpa) but hardly any for those of us who took our prereqs but didn't quite do so well...
So here's my sitch: Amherst undergrad 3.0 overall gpa
science gpa... well... i guess it's like a 2... i have a couple of (gasp) Ds...
now I'm teaching in Japan, trying to regroup before I begin the crusade.
I was hoping to get some advice (and some support). Can anyone recommend any postbacs that are good for applicants with a lot of drive and commitment but not-so-hot science grades? Any advice is appreciated. And I just want to give my support to all of you guys. I know the road is tough.
Thanks. :luck:
 
Wow nice to see people who arent good at proving their knowledge through 10 percent brackets of regurgitation! Im right there with you guys at that cruel existential impasse.


GPA: 2.2
MCAT: 33 11-11-11

I talked to the premed advisor and she told me after i finish my BS do another, do graduate school and then go to PA school. Hahaha. Good luck guys.
 
imthadon said:
Wow nice to see people who arent good at proving their knowledge through 10 percent brackets of regurgitation! Im right there with you guys at that cruel existential impasse.


GPA: 2.2
MCAT: 33 11-11-11

I talked to the premed advisor and she told me after i finish my BS do another, do graduate school and then go to PA school. Hahaha. Good luck guys.

Tell your premed advisor to get bent. I heard the same sort of crap. What you should do is seek out one of the masters programs and rock it, e.g. BU or Georgetown. I was in a very similar position to you, and I'm doing pretty well right now, without the 2nd bachelor's or PA.

I can't understand why people always be hating on the low GPAers.
 
Singing Devil said:
Tell your premed advisor to get bent. I heard the same sort of crap. What you should do is seek out one of the masters programs and rock it, e.g. BU or Georgetown. I was in a very similar position to you, and I'm doing pretty well right now, without the 2nd bachelor's or PA.

I can't understand why people always be hating on the low GPAers.

Just look at the acceptance rates for people with sub 3.0 GPA, not very promising. Maybe they are being very cautious because of that.
 
blankguy said:
Just look at the acceptance rates for people with sub 3.0 GPA, not very promising. Maybe they are being very cautious because of that.

I agree completely, but that's not really my point (not that it was well made). I have no problem with people being cautious, it's the "you will probably not succeed" approach that I don't like. I don't know if imthadon wants to do an MD, but it's possible, and having someone tell you to do a second bachelors and then a graduate degree and then go to PA school sounds like the advisor is trying to clandestinely say "it's not worth it--give up."

I'd rather hear an advisor say, "If you do these things, there is an excellent chance you could be a doctor." Unfortunately, I think many people think a low GPA is unforgivable and is the kiss of death. I'm sitting here screaming at the top of my lungs that it's not the kiss of death, it just takes a big change in the pattern.

Course, if imthadon wants to be a PA, then I misread it, and I rushed to judgment. well, I probably rushed to judgment anyway.

I might add that I have heard very few people give the supportive approach, except for people in my program in which they are ALL supportive. We need more love for the low GPAers in the world, and I'm dishing it out.
 
Well, I got two acceptances with a previous 3.0 ugrad average, and a 3.64 gpa in my post bacc program.

I was out of undergrad 13 years and I think that made a big difference for me. Of course, I applied to a ton of schools but then you only need one acceptance and so I was happy.

:)
 
Paws said:
Well, I got two acceptances with a previous 3.0 ugrad average, and a 3.64 gpa in my post bacc program.

I was out of undergrad 13 years and I think that made a big difference for me. Of course, I applied to a ton of schools but then you only need one acceptance and so I was happy.

:)
Isn't post-bacc part of your undergrad GPA?? I get confused when people list their previous GPA and then the post-bacc GPA.
 
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blankguy said:
Isn't post-bacc part of your undergrad GPA?? I get confused when people list their previous GPA and then the post-bacc GPA.

Tis true blankguy. I think people separate the post-bac GPA from the undergrad GPA to show the upward trend.
 
jays2cool4u said:
Tis true blankguy. I think people separate the post-bac GPA from the undergrad GPA to show the upward trend.
Yes, particularly as in my case or Paws' above, where many years intervene between the completion of the bachelors and the post-bacc. The theory being that grades achieved 10+ years ago are relatively meaningless to a student's current capabilities.
 
liverotcod said:
Yes, particularly as in my case or Paws' above, where many years intervene between the completion of the bachelors and the post-bacc. The theory being that grades achieved 10+ years ago are relatively meaningless to a student's current capabilities.

Yes but it means the recent good grades are still going to get buried by bad grades from years past resulting in a weak overall GPA. People here suggest to take a Special Masters Program to get a new strong GPA separated from the sorry undergrad GPA so that schools will use that not the undergrad GPA to evaluate you and avoid the pitfalls of say being weeded out by GPA cutoffs.
 
blankguy said:
Yes but it means the recent good grades are still going to get buried by bad grades from years past resulting in a weak overall GPA. People here suggest to take a Special Masters Program to get a new strong GPA separated from the sorry undergrad GPA so that schools will use that not the undergrad GPA to evaluate you and avoid the pitfalls of say being weeded out by GPA cutoffs.
Like I noted earlier, this is a hotly debated topic. Use of the GPA numbers seems to differ from school to school. Some school (anecdotally) more or less ignore graduate GPAs and focus on undergrad only; in which case obviously a special masters program would be less valuable. At any rate, a "cutoff" system would likely use undergrad only, so as to have an even playing field.
 
jays2cool4u said:
Tis true blankguy. I think people separate the post-bac GPA from the undergrad GPA to show the upward trend.

Actually AMCAS separates the GPAs as such:

FR
SO
JR
SR
PBU
CUG
GRAD

So, schools will see a grad GPA, a cum. undergrad, and a postbacc (which is added into the cum. undergrad).
 
Yeah I wanted/want to be a doctor not a PA, we will see my gpa is a kiss of death but so what? Im gonna retake the MCAT and Ive got a year or so left in my bachelors and then who knows what. All I need is an interview, which will be the 4.0/27 mcat/black jcpenny suit competitor's kiss of death. Hahaha.

Does anyone here know of med school's that focus on the MCAT in place of GPA? public, private or overseas I dont care, just someone who will look at MCAT and extracurriculars and deemphasize gpa? I know it sounds rediculous but if you guys could recommend schools I'll apply to them. Thanks all!
 
imthadon said:
Yeah I wanted/want to be a doctor not a PA, we will see my gpa is a kiss of death but so what? Im gonna retake the MCAT and Ive got a year or so left in my bachelors and then who knows what. All I need is an interview, which will be the 4.0/27 mcat/black jcpenny suit competitor's kiss of death. Hahaha.

Does anyone here know of med school's that focus on the MCAT in place of GPA? public, private or overseas I dont care, just someone who will look at MCAT and extracurriculars and deemphasize gpa? I know it sounds rediculous but if you guys could recommend schools I'll apply to them. Thanks all!
2.2 is gonna hurt you for US allo and osteo schools even though you've got a solid mcat score. I think it's going to be nearly impossible to get into a US school without a postbac of some sort. And pulling up your undergrad gpa is going to take a long time.

Let's say after three years you have 90 credits with a 2.2 cume. Let's say you take 15 credits from here on out. To break 3.0 you would need to get a 4.0 in 30 credits of your senior year, and a 4.0 for three consecutive semesters (45 credits) just to break the 3.0 barrier. Even then it's going to be very hard (but not impossible). That's one route you could take.

Osteopathic schools tend to have lower cutoffs, but even then you're going to need around about a 2.7-2.8ish cume and similar science gpa to get secondaries from most schools. (Most of this info is in the AACOM's Information Book which you can download off their website).

The other choice is to do a graduate level postbac like Drexel IMS, VCU's postbac premed certificate, or Boston U MAMS (look up the older threads on these). Maybe Rosalind Franklin's too (I don't know if they have cutoffs to get in their program). RFU seems to have the best unofficial linkage, but if you do the program and stay there for four more years, you're looking at over a quarter million $$$ ($52k/five years :eek: ) . There are peeps in the postbac forum that have done these programs and been accepted to med schools with sub-3.0 GPAs. So it's a reasonable option, but there's no guarantee.

If all of this sounds like too much, there's foreign schools. Make sure you know the licensure issues. Texas, California, and New York tend to have more strict licensure policies. So make sure you check those policies so you know which rotations you have to do and what hoops you have to jump. You might want to look into the Caribbean schools, specifically SGU, Ross, and AUC. You can practice in all 50 states provided that you meet their specifications. With your MCAT you could probably get into Ross or AUC no problem. It's not hard to get an acceptance, but it may be hard to stay in. The attrition/decel rates are unbelievably high. SGU, you might or might not get in. And it seems to have the best rep of the three. There are a lot of issues you'll have to face going down to the Carib (e.g., match disadvantage, less freedom for electives and auditioning, fewer research opportunities, stigma, hurricanes, radically different lifestyle, high attrition or decel rates), but it is often a viable option. This will obviously depend on your goals. If you're considering a very competitive residency (not necessarily very competitive fellowships), you'll have a hard time coming from the Carib. Specialties like anesthesia, general surgery, EM, IM, obgyn, peds, are doable. Specialties like rads and ortho are possible, but you'll definitely have your work cut out for you. Some of the other foreign schools that are popular for US students are in Israel, Australia, and Ireland. Check the international forums and valuemd.com for more info. At any rate, don't think you can go to a foreign school and magically change your study habits and determination. Some people think they can walk onto a Caribbean island and go from a 21 mcat and 2.6 gpa to a 4.0 foreign med student that's going to ace the USMLE Step 1 and 2 and shine in rotations. There's always the random anecdote, but this is just not realistic. If you finish strong senior year and don't want to spend extra time doing postbac studies, then shoot for the foreign schools. But if you remain around a 2.2 cume by the time you graduate, don't expect to ace foreign med school--even with a solid MCAT. Even then, I think it would be a good idea to do a postbac and learn proper study habits, time management, etc. before pursuing med school anywhere.
 
graduated dartmouth (03) with:
2.7 bcpm
2.8 overall
postbac at harvard (7 classes):
3.7 bcpm and 3.7 overall
total:
~ 2.9 bcpm/overall.. 10V 13B 12P P

applying for Fall 2005 (MD programs only):
2 interviews
1 ACCEPTANCE

dunno how.. but it worked..
 
Has anyone heard of a low gpa applicant applying through early decision if they have a very high mcat and solid post-bacc? The theory being that state schools might admit the applicant anyway, and would probably want the higher mcat to boost their averages.
 
Coming out of some serious hiding because of this thread.
I came out of ASU (no, not that one. the one in NC. in the mountains. that only graduates about 4 pre-meds a year. *ahem.*) with a 2.93 overall and a science gpa that wasn't any better because of the buckets full of C's and 2 D's. I went straight into a physics post-bac after graduation, took the mcat last April, got a 28 (11v, 10b, 7p,) freaked out because my advisors said I'd never get in with anything less than a 30, and retook it in August and got a 26 (10v, 9b, 7p. At least I'm consistent with the physical chem, I guess.)
Now, I'm working 2 jobs, volunteering in the ER, and I'm in school full time. I've got a 3.5 that I'm desperately trying to pull up because those same advisors said that I'd never get in unless I got 4.0 post-bac. I should probably stop listening to them, though.
I applied to 16 schools, got secondaries from 15, rejected pre-secondary from 1 (damn you Carolina! I really got my hopes up.) and have 2 interviews so far. I haven't heard back from the others. Maybe no news is good news.
My first interview is next Friday. I've got that queasy feeling already...
 
junebuguf said:
Has anyone heard of a low gpa applicant applying through early decision if they have a very high mcat and solid post-bacc? The theory being that state schools might admit the applicant anyway, and would probably want the higher mcat to boost their averages.
I had my right forefinger millimeters from clicking submit to apply ED to VCU this year with those exact conditions. 2.95 overall GPA, 39 MCAT, 4.0 (52 credits) post-bacc (at VCU). I even had the encouragement of the director of admissions.

But I chose not too; I felt it was too risky being that I definitely didn't want to be a reapplicant. Also, there are a lot of neat schools that I was interested in applying to.

As it turns out, VCU flat-out rejected me as a regular decision candidate post-interview, while (so far) 4 other schools have accepted me, including my top choice. So it turned out pretty well. I guess I don't know how my application would have been fared as ED, though. You definitely want to communicate with the adcom at the school you're considering. Best wishes.
 
liverotcod said:
I had my right forefinger millimeters from clicking submit to apply ED to VCU this year with those exact conditions. 2.95 overall GPA, 39 MCAT, 4.0 (52 credits) post-bacc (at VCU). I even had the encouragement of the director of admissions.

But I chose not too; I felt it was too risky being that I definitely didn't want to be a reapplicant. Also, there are a lot of neat schools that I was interested in applying to.

As it turns out, VCU flat-out rejected me as a regular decision candidate post-interview, while (so far) 4 other schools have accepted me, including my top choice. So it turned out pretty well. I guess I don't know how my application would have been fared as ED, though. You definitely want to communicate with the adcom at the school you're considering. Best wishes.

I'm really perplexed and a little unnerved by your post. If you're in-state, with a 4.0 in 50+ hours at VCU and with a 39 MCAT, how does VCU not admit you? Did you ask anyone in admissions (the DOM, perhaps) why you were rejected? I'm hoping VCU gave up on you because they figured you'd probably not attend anyway, or that the interview didnt go so well. Otherwise, its really daunting to think that in the same boat, with numbers slightly less than yours (2.89 overall, 70 hours post-bacc at 3.9 and 35-36 MCAT), I may have even less of a chance in-state than I originally thought....and I'm a FL resident, with fewer seats per in-state applicant than just about every other state.
 
junebuguf said:
I'm really perplexed and a little unnerved by your post. If you're in-state, with a 4.0 in 50+ hours at VCU and with a 39 MCAT, how does VCU not admit you? Did you ask anyone in admissions (the DOM, perhaps) why you were rejected? I'm hoping VCU gave up on you because they figured you'd probably not attend anyway, or that the interview didnt go so well. Otherwise, its really daunting to think that in the same boat, with numbers slightly less than yours (2.89 overall, 70 hours post-bacc at 3.9 and 35-36 MCAT), I may have even less of a chance in-state than I originally thought....and I'm a FL resident, with fewer seats per in-state applicant than just about every other state.
It is a little curious. I'm actually 0 for 3 in-state in Virginia. Waitlisted at EVMS and got my UVa rejection today. But successful out-of-state. Don't sweat it, you'll do fine. It's why I suggest not doing ED, though, unless you *really, really* want to go to a particular school. I applied to 30 schools and although it was expensive, you can't argue with the results.

As for VCU, I had a child psychiatrist for my interview, and he spent 1/2 hour or so grilling me on my alcoholism. I think that's what did me in; when I called the DOM, she said the adcom notes said they were "concerned, based on my undergraduate performance, that I wouldn't be able to handle the academic load," which I think is code for "we're not going to tell you." Or maybe they just disagree with the other schools that *aren't* worried about my academic abilities. Whatever. I'm happy :thumbup:
 
just graduated from northeastern university
BS. in computer engineering technology
minored in business

undergrad gpa 3.07
not sure of my science gpa but its probably low, took advanced calculus and advanced physics

i'm interested in going to med school, but i haven't taken any chemistry or biology classes. i'm thinking about enrolling in a post bacc program at rider

you guys think i have a decent chance of getting into a DO school or med school, i don't really care where as long as its in the united states.

Do med schools take into account your undergrad major, cause engineering is more difficult then say business or sociology. I haven't taken the MCAT yet but i've looked at the review and it looks ridiculously hard, but then again i haven't taken chemistry or biology since high school.

anyhow glad i found this forum later guys
 
goldbeda said:
just graduated from northeastern university
BS. in computer engineering technology
minored in business

undergrad gpa 3.07
not sure of my science gpa but its probably low, took advanced calculus and advanced physics

i'm interested in going to med school, but i haven't taken any chemistry or biology classes. i'm thinking about enrolling in a post bacc program at rider

you guys think i have a decent chance of getting into a DO school or med school, i don't really care where as long as its in the united states.

Do med schools take into account your undergrad major, cause engineering is more difficult then say business or sociology. I haven't taken the MCAT yet but i've looked at the review and it looks ridiculously hard, but then again i haven't taken chemistry or biology since high school.

anyhow glad i found this forum later guys


Well, the MCAT could be a very important factor here. With high MCAT scores, you'd have a decent shot. For me personally, physics was the most difficult of the science courses. If you can do well in physics IMO, you'll do fine in other science courses. So, perhaps you should do a post-bacc, write the MCAT, and then apply to medschool. Or complete the courses informally, as a non-degree student, write the MCAT and then apply. If you don't get in, you can always do a one-year special master's program which offers graduate level science courses, and then apply to medschool.
 
I guess I'll share my sufficiently weird story here...
Undergrad cume: 2.7
Majored in compsci, minor in math. The math GPA was 4.0. The CS one was way lower due to the fact that there was a huge cheating scandal in my department and I was one of like two students who didn't cheat. I blew the whistle my senior year and the thing went to a huge honor council trial, professors got fired... it was crazy. I don't plan on addressing that at all to med schools- I don't want to seem like I'm making excuses....
Post-bacc GPA: 4.0
BCPM: 4.0



How weird is that? I'm applying for a conditional linkage out of my post-bacc. Hope it goes well...

EDIT: Oh, my cumulative GPA is up to 3.1 now after post-bacc.
 
UnskinnyBop said:
I guess I'll share my sufficiently weird story here...
Undergrad cume: 2.7
Majored in compsci, minor in math. The math GPA was 4.0. The CS one was way lower due to the fact that there was a huge cheating scandal in my department and I was one of like two students who didn't cheat. I blew the whistle my senior year and the thing went to a huge honor council trial, professors got fired... it was crazy. I don't plan on addressing that at all to med schools- I don't want to seem like I'm making excuses....
Post-bacc GPA: 4.0
BCPM: 4.0

How weird is that? I'm applying for a conditional linkage out of my post-bacc. Hope it goes well...

EDIT: Oh, my cumulative GPA is up to 3.1 now after post-bacc.

Up to 3.1?? You're out of the club now! Just kidding :laugh:

The cheating thing really does suck, though I'm not so sure I'd so quickly dimiss the idea of mentioning the situation to med schools. From what I gather (not personal experience, of course, since I haven't applied yet), schools at least want an explanation for low grades, since they want to be reasonably sure that your prior academic performance won't recur during med school. While I agree that "excuses" don't cut it, I really think this is a legit explanation, particularly since you can point to your BCMP grades, both undergrad and postbacc. Wouldn't hurt if you could get some support, maybe a letter, from your UG institution as well. I doubt you'd want to make this theme a prominent part of your personal statement or anything, but I personally would definitely bring it up if asked directly about your grades, which is likely in an open-file interview.

Others that are in the current admissions cycle can provide wisdom from their experiences (paging liverotcod!!), but just my thoughts on the subject. I would hate for you to gloss over something that could help you significantly. With a solid MCAT, you have a wonderful shot at even some top-tier med schools -- that 4.0 science GPA is huge!!

If you don't mind sharing, how many credits of postbacc have you taken (I'm guessing around 50 to 55, based on rough calculations), and where did you do them... somewhere in Philly, I gather? Thanks for contributing, congrats on your progress, and good luck on the MCAT!
 
you guys think i should take the pre reqs at the community college or if i should take them at a formal post bacc program or just as a non matric student at a regular university. the community college where i live is pretty good academically, but i don't know if med schools like to see that you took the pre reqs at a community college . thanks
 
goldbeda said:
you guys think i should take the pre reqs at the community college or if i should take them at a formal post bacc program or just as a non matric student at a regular university. the community college where i live is pretty good academically, but i don't know if med schools like to see that you took the pre reqs at a community college . thanks


Take it as at regular university if you can't get into a formal post-bacc. Avoid Community Colleges if you can. I think there plenty of people on this board who would tell you not to take them at a community college.
 
Thanks to everyone who has made this thread so compelling...

We know that having a low ugrad gpa means there are some, well, challenges, to be overcome. But what are the real limitations? I'm going back to school after ten years carrying a 2.12 transfer gpa on my back. I reckon that after about 70 units I'll be able to bring that up to about 2.95 by the time I graduate. I'll still have a low gpa, but if I'm able to otherwise distinguish myself (4.0 in recent work; dominated the MCAT, research, volunteering, Nobel Prize, etc) is it still unreasonable to apply to some top schools (Harvard, Hopkins, etc)? I know that begars can't be choosers, and I'll be happy to get in anywhere, but my grandpappy told me to believe that anything is possible. Did he forget to tell me the "except with a low gpa" part?

There have been a few mentions on this thread about gpa limits for state schools. Are these limits published and publicly available? For private schools that don't have hard limits, but still screen for gpa, what can we do to get adcoms to just look at our apps... to find the flowers in the rough?
 
El Smacko said:
is it still unreasonable to apply to some top schools (Harvard, Hopkins, etc)?
By all means apply. It's about a hundred bucks per school, and then you'll know. As I'm sure everyone knows by now :D my app has been pretty successful with numbers in the range you're suggesting. I applied at Harvard, no interview, with only a week before they stop inviting. I also applied at UMichigan (7 rank, FWIW) and have an interview upcoming. I interviewed at Pitt (15 rank), decision forthcoming. I regret not applying to a few more "top-tiers."
 
El Smacko said:
There have been a few mentions on this thread about gpa limits for state schools. Are these limits published and publicly available?
Some of these limits appear in the MSAR (Medical School Admission Requirements) book published by the AAMC. You can get it off the AAMC.org website or off a website like Amazon. (I have an old MSAR and I know it states some of this info, but some of the specifics may have changed.)
 
El Smacko said:
Thanks to everyone who has made this thread so compelling...

We know that having a low ugrad gpa means there are some, well, challenges, to be overcome. But what are the real limitations? I'm going back to school after ten years carrying a 2.12 transfer gpa on my back. I reckon that after about 70 units I'll be able to bring that up to about 2.95 by the time I graduate. I'll still have a low gpa, but if I'm able to otherwise distinguish myself (4.0 in recent work; dominated the MCAT, research, volunteering, Nobel Prize, etc) is it still unreasonable to apply to some top schools (Harvard, Hopkins, etc)? I know that begars can't be choosers, and I'll be happy to get in anywhere, but my grandpappy told me to believe that anything is possible. Did he forget to tell me the "except with a low gpa" part?

There have been a few mentions on this thread about gpa limits for state schools. Are these limits published and publicly available? For private schools that don't have hard limits, but still screen for gpa, what can we do to get adcoms to just look at our apps... to find the flowers in the rough?

Many state schools do not use gpa cutoffs, using some variation of the old 10*gpa*weight + MCAT formula, where a score of something like 63+ guarantees a secondary. Maybe someone else can comment on this.
 
well i have applied for a post bacc. program. Good thing to cause there are like no jobs in engineering right now. I have applied everywhere and i don't get any interviews. tough to find entry level positions. year of bio, chem, and org chem then its mcat time
 
El Smacko said:
Thanks to everyone who has made this thread so compelling...

We know that having a low ugrad gpa means there are some, well, challenges, to be overcome. But what are the real limitations? I'm going back to school after ten years carrying a 2.12 transfer gpa on my back. I reckon that after about 70 units I'll be able to bring that up to about 2.95 by the time I graduate. I'll still have a low gpa, but if I'm able to otherwise distinguish myself (4.0 in recent work; dominated the MCAT, research, volunteering, Nobel Prize, etc) is it still unreasonable to apply to some top schools (Harvard, Hopkins, etc)? I know that begars can't be choosers, and I'll be happy to get in anywhere, but my grandpappy told me to believe that anything is possible. Did he forget to tell me the "except with a low gpa" part?

There have been a few mentions on this thread about gpa limits for state schools. Are these limits published and publicly available? For private schools that don't have hard limits, but still screen for gpa, what can we do to get adcoms to just look at our apps... to find the flowers in the rough?

Since 10 years have passed, under Texas law... I don't know if it applies elsewhere, you can apply through academic fresh start and they won't penalize you for your old grades. You just have to retake the pre-reqs and take the MCAT. If you do well, then you're just as competative at a top student out of undergrad.
 
cher25 said:
Since 10 years have passed, under Texas law... I don't know if it applies elsewhere, you can apply through academic fresh start and they won't penalize you for your old grades. You just have to retake the pre-reqs and take the MCAT. If you do well, then you're just as competative at a top student out of undergrad.
Only in Texas. Pretty cool program for us old folks.
 
cher25 said:
Since 10 years have passed, under Texas law... I don't know if it applies elsewhere, you can apply through academic fresh start and they won't penalize you for your old grades. You just have to retake the pre-reqs and take the MCAT. If you do well, then you're just as competative at a top student out of undergrad.

This is a unique TX law... but you do have to take more than just retake the prereqs to qualify. The fresh start provision requires at least 90 new credits of academic work, completed after throwing out the 10+ year old prior grades. PM me if you need more info, I have researched this a bit.
 
Went to U of Rochester and graduated with a 2.82 and a major in History. I didn't get my vision of Aesclipius/Thoth calling to me until I was past 35 (egad!) and have just started to take classes/pursue post-bacc programs (not even in one yet...).

Have a Master's in Information Systems, though, and had a 3.76 for that program. That would help of course on my app but one's Master's GPA doesn't affect one's undergrad GPA. I will observe this about college/studying and life/work; life/work prepares you for college/studying, not the other way around. Sending people to college at age 18 right out of high school is definitely not the best way to get them into a success track. If schools made people wait a few years, they'd do much better and take it more seriously. But alas, when there's money to be made, nothing stops the wagon-train!
 
*****Update 2/5/2005****

I've been accepted to the University of Texas at San Antonio for this fall's upcoming class! It's literally a dream come true. Monday night was the happiest night of my life and I've been on cloud nine ever since.

Do NOT give up.

Do NOT lose hope.

Go for your dream and you can make it a reality!
MD Applicants page
************************************

From: Texas

My story:

So it all started (as all good stories must) on a dark and stormy night many, many moons ago - 1996. I was a freshman in college following a five-year stint in the Marines. I knew that I wanted to be a physician, and in typical gung-ho Marine style I had jumped feet first into pre-med coursework. I did okay my first semester, getting four A's and a B. But there were two big problems: the school's pre-med office and the feeling that I was older, out of step with the young gunners straight out of high school.

My pre-med advisory office told me that medical schools wouldn't take someone with a B on their record. That they didn't like older, non-traditional applicants , and that I might as well just forget about it. :eek: Seriously! They said this! It felt like running into a brick wall....and as for feeling out of place, well, I had a difficult time relating to people barely old enough to vote.

Anyway, long story short: the next three semesters were relatively bad for various reasons, but I managed to drastically improve by graduation. I scored decently on the MCAT. However, despite this, my applications to various programs produced nothing. Not even interviews. It was a very depressing experience. Who likes to fail?

After talking with several Deans of Admission I determined that I'd need to do a lot of postbacc work to get myself into medical school. It was a difficult time, because I really doubted whether I'd ever be able to acheive my dreams. I'd never failed before and this was hard to take.

So I enrolled in another school for a post-bacc year and did very well. It was heartening to know that I could do well, but I had to face reality: I would have to take post-bacc courses for years in order to raise my GPA . I had taken sooo many undergrad science courses that there just wasn't much left. What if I never made it into med school, what would I do with myself? I figured that I had to be smart and plan for a future without med school....which lead to my enrollemnt in a MS program in genetics.

It was a decision that turned out wonderfully. I have really come to love doing research, and more importantly I have learned how to read/absorb/excel with really difficult material. I have learned how to effectively learn large volumes of new, often difficult material. Most of all, though, the experience has given me the confidence that although difficult, medical school is completely possible.

I suppose that this confidence has infused everything I've done in the last few years. I re-took the MCAT this past April. I did well because I believed in myself. I'm due to have two first-author publications in good journals, and I even managed to get accepted off a waitlist for Fall 2005 (crazy story!).

Acceptance in hand, I'm looking to see if any TX or AMCAS schools are going to show me love. It's been a long, hard journey but here I am. It still hasn't really occurred to me that I've already acheived one of my major life goals......yet every so often I look at the doctors around me and think: "Yep, that'll be me in a few short years."
 
:clap:
EvoDevo said:
*****Update 2/5/2005****

I've been accepted to the University of Texas at San Antonio for this fall's upcoming class! It's literally a dream come true. Monday night was the happiest night of my life and I've been on cloud nine ever since.

Do NOT give up.

Do NOT lose hope.

Go for your dream and you can make it a reality!
MD Applicants page
************************************

Congratulations on being accepted to UT-San Antonio!! :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: I'm sure you'll have the best pre-med story of your 200 new classmates. Man, I wish I was a TX resident! Oh well, thanks for sharing the feel-good story, particularly when many of us are mired in classwork, wondering if we'll ever make it.
 
Really which is the most important?ur MCAT or ur GPA?
I myself think that it's not fair to compare ppl with their GPA's when it's among different kindda majors and universities i mean different systems!!but MCAT really shows ur abilities !maybe one with lower GPA (with many reasons)shows h** can get a very good mark on MCAT!!
can a GPA 2.8 for physics (the max is 3.5 in this class ) outta U.S system with a good MCAT 35+(hope so!) enters to a med univ?!
 
junebuguf said:
:clap:

Congratulations on being accepted to UT-San Antonio!! :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: I'm sure you'll have the best pre-med story of your 200 new classmates. Man, I wish I was a TX resident! Oh well, thanks for sharing the feel-good story, particularly when many of us are mired in classwork, wondering if we'll ever make it.
Thanks man. Good luck with your application. :thumbup:
 
anavistas said:
Really which is the most important?ur MCAT or ur GPA?
I myself think that it's not fair to compare ppl with their GPA's when it's among different kindda majors and universities i mean different systems!!but MCAT really shows ur abilities !maybe one with lower GPA (with many reasons)shows h** can get a very good mark on MCAT!!
can a GPA 2.8 for physics (the max is 3.5 in this class ) outta U.S system with a good MCAT 35+(hope so!) enters to a med univ?!
2.8/35 is pretty low on the scale, sorry to say. When you say 3.5 is the maximum for your physics program, what does that mean? Is it the theoretical maximum, or is it the highest observed GPA for graduates of the program?

One thing the adcoms will look closely at is trends. If the 2.8 is the result of a bad semester or two, followed by mostly As and a few Bs, then that's a plus. If instead it is the result of a steady stream of Bs with some Cs, then that's a bad sign for adcoms. If the latter, you will almost certainly need to prove your academic abilities with postbaccalaureate work or a masters in a hard science.
 
thx liverotcod for ur concern ,as i said i'm not in U.S and in our system grades r outta 20,in many hard lessons like quantom mechanics our best grade is 13 outta 20 :eek: !and in this hell university GPA around 14 which is ur C is a very good grade!ofcourse i can't say i was studying hard i really didn't!but not that low that u mentioned!i was searching applicant's profiles GPA through the site and i saw ppl with very high GPA's where easily accepted though they had bad results on MCAT!! :eek: but a 43 MCAter with just 2 interviews
!so if somebody is doing well on MCAT how can u say that u don't have the ability?!how can u compare a 4 GPA in english or psychology with a 3 GPA in
hard majors like electronics?i get mad seeing their policy!not fair at all +pity+
best luck :luck:
 
anavistas said:
thx liverotcod for ur concern ,as i said i'm not in U.S and in our system grades r outta 20,in many hard lessons like quantom mechanics our best grade is 13 outta 20 :eek: !and in this hell university GPA around 14 which is ur C is a very good grade!ofcourse i can't say i was studying hard i really didn't!but not that low that u mentioned!i was searching applicant's profiles GPA through the site and i saw ppl with very high GPA's where easily accepted though they had bad results on MCAT!! :eek: but a 43 MCAter with just 2 interviews
!so if somebody is doing well on MCAT how can u say that u don't have the ability?!how can u compare a 4 GPA in english or psychology with a 3 GPA in
hard majors like electronics?i get mad seeing their policy!not fair at all +pity+
best luck :luck:
It sounds as though you may applying as a non-resident of the US, in which case the bar is set considerably higher. You will have to look at the AMCAS application conversion for grades from your school to get a sense of what your AMCAS GPA will be. For example, the conversion for Canadian schools, which use a percentage grading scale, defines an A (as I recall) as 85%, which surprises many American undergrads; here an A is typically 93%. The explanation is that the scales are simply not compatible. I don't know how AMCAS will convert your 20 point scale, but however it does, you will most definitely need to be well above 3.0 in AMCAS, with your 35 MCAT, to attempt to compete in US allopathic schools as a non-resident.

I don't mean to disappoint or worry you, but I believe that I'm calling it like it is.
 
Does anyone major in biological science in undergraduate and <3.0 gpa..(me..2.6) and repeat pre-req? I graduated in 2003 and I wont be able to start my post-bac (either formal or not) until 2006. So, I am trying to figure out whether I should repeat my pre-req classes or try to take uppper division sciences...

anyone?

thanks so much~!
 
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