the reality of paying off $250K in debt

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Boyder

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So just what am I looking at as a psychiatrist? Huge debt at $250K and an reasonably expected income of $125 to $175 without a significant other bringing extra bacon home. The figure for estimating income is what would be reasonable to expect (guaranteed) not just the "I could get lucky with a bustling private practice". Just what is my reality here? To me it seems that given the expense of kids' college x3, starting practice near 40 years of age, and having to save for retirement that I'd be living like a resident forever. You'll ask so let me just say that the spouse could certainly work but would probably top off at around 38K per year in her field making it questionable just how much the extra effort would help when considering before/after school daycare for the kids. Help out with your ideas please!

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How many years into private practice will it take to hit $175K? 3 years or so? I assume that I'll have to start in the public sector then build my practice afterwards. I'd be looking to practice in the upper midwest so it would be great to know what the job market is in this area. A google search for pyschiatrist jobs didn't net much info in this area, much less the compensation provided.
 
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How many years into private practice will it take to hit $175K? 3 years or so? I assume that I'll have to start in the public sector then build my practice afterwards. I'd be looking to practice in the upper midwest so it would be great to know what the job market is in this area. A google search for pyschiatrist jobs didn't net much info in this area, much less the compensation provided.


in the midwest you can easily make 220K+ right out of residency working 40 hours a week inpatient. In addition you can moonlight other jobs or have a pp on the side and net some additional income....cheers
 
Some places will assist in paying your debt.

As for your student debt, I don't know what interest rate its locked at, but in my case, the interest is very low, so low that it actually pays to pay it off as slowly as possible. All my other debt (e.g. the mortgage) is at a higher interest rate.

I'm currently trying to figure out myself the best place to practice considering the money & the lifestyle. I'm currently working in Cincinnati and I don't see any shortage going on here. I love the area but I'm thinking I could be making 1/3 more for the same amount of work if were working elsewhere.
 
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220K would pay off my loans. I wonder, what type of city in the midwest are you thinking? Chicago? Unfortunately that's a no go for us because we hate the Bears.

No, we actually don't like the city...
 
gone are the days of those low LOW interest rate for student loans. More like 6 or 7 something % when it's all put together.
 
my roomates brother is a child psychiatrist in des moines, Iowa. He making about 300k. Its really wide open in places like that. Especially with child psychiatry...there's so much that you can do. I think he works about 60 hours a week.
Thats funny that you don't like chicago...thats actually where im doing my residency. Just moved here about 2 months ago and its pretty good so far...
 
Well what I'm hearing is that there are jobs out there that compensate well -- $175K, $220K+, 300K:eek:. Those figures really make my picture much more realistic for doing psych. Oh -- did I mention that I have to save for retirement?? Oh, crap.

Anyway I could really use all the info I can muster on this topic as I was late switching to psych and I'm going to apply to residencies in 2-3 weeks after I'm 100% sure that it is doable for me. This comes after extensive soul-searching that I wouldn't be completely satisfied with my former(?) choice -- but most certainly wouldn't be living in a box in that field either.

How frequently can you find the above-mentioned jobs after residency? Like I said, I've looked but just can't find them advertised. Is it really competitive to get into them -- or is the field just wide open? Am I looking at medium-sized cities or very large ones to get this work?
 
As for your student debt, I don't know what interest rate its locked at, but in my case, the interest is very low, so low that it actually pays to pay it off as slowly as possible.

can you explain this point for those of us who are financially inept? what's a "low" interest rate? are you investing money instead of paying the loan off?
 
Kumar and whopper28 -- I sent you both a PM with some more specific questions. Feel free to respond to this post instead.
 
My student loans are less than 4% per year.

My other loans are more than that.

So--I opted to pay off my student debt at the slowest rate possible and on top of that, its tax deductible as well. Several other types of loans are not such as car loans etc.
 
Regarding the psych jobs issue, what is your understanding of just what I can make coming out of residency, and what type of income are you going to find in the jobs that pay off student loans?

Someone asked me this question, I'll answer here since I think its relevant to this topic.

Coming out of residency-what you make is going to depend on several factors. Many of these factors are common sense & I'm sure I'll be wasting your time going over them (e.g. hrs you choose to work)

However some factors residents are not aware of...
1)Choosing to work in an extremely underserved area will land you more money. Several of these underserved areas will have the state give you yearly bonuses & the places offering jobs are willing to pay more. If you choose to make a private practice in these areas--your docket of patients will load up quickly--and you will probably have the option of accepting cash only patients because you will be in such high demand.

The difference? Could be $120K vs $225K for the same amount of work--all depending on where you choose to work. Another bonus is the same areas that are underserved often times have a very low cost of living.

The place I'm working at now, I'm making about $140K a year. That however is for only 40 hrs/week of work and no calls. I could do calls for extra money (make about $75/hr for the call work). I'm choosing not to right now mostly because I'd rather study for my boards & get board certified. I'm also living in an area where there is no shortage because there's a good residency program in the area.

2) Post residency training & Liscences. Get Board certified--you can up your pay & get more job oppurtunities. Some places will only take board certified psychiatrists. Get a fellowship, that too can add money. Other types of post residency things you can go for--methadone or suboxone liscencing (get suboxone, it almost makes methadone obselete), ECT certification, clozapine liscencing, among several others.

3) The type of work you choose to do. There's plenty of different types of psychiatry work out there--outpatient, inpatient, consult, day program, PACT (AKA ACT) Teams.

4) US Military-if you choose to sign up as a resident, they have several benefits that can pay for student loans and give you a nice stipend. You will owe them military service (I believe its 6 months of service for every year they gave you a stipend as a resident, you'd need to double check). However as bad as that may sound, during that time in doing your service-you will get paid as an attending. It looks great on your record, you can get lots of good military benefits (since you'll be made an officer) & they provide the room & housing. If you're very young and want to see the world, its not a bad option.

What type of income in the places that offer to pay for student loans? This is too broad a question. Several places offer to help pay for loans as part of their package for signing on.
 
I could do calls for extra money (make about $75/hr for the call work). I'm choosing not to right now mostly because I'd rather study for my boards & get board certified. I'm also living in an area where there is no shortage because there's a good residency program in the area.
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$75 per hour is low for actual work, but would be a good rate if you're being paid for carrying a beeper and aren't seeing patients the whole time.
 
250K is about how much I owe. You could try to find a program where the majority of your call is done via moonlighting. Something to consider.
 
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I'd cut out the kids' collegeX3 expenses, for one. They can work and get loans-my parents never paid a dime after age 18 and I did fine working through college. Just didn't have time for any partying. You need to pay your own loans off before paying for adult kids' expenses. If you find yourself financially flush later, you can always offer to help your kids pay back their loans if you feel you must. Good luck!
 
I WISH I was going to be $250k in debt when I graduate. Instead my estimates appraoch $400k. Its really my own fault for going to a private undergrad. My parents didn't pay for a dime of my school loans either. (Then I took private loans out in an effort to get accepted to medical school - I will forever pay the price). Anyway, I'm thinking about psych and maybe a child psych fellowship. However I'm concerned about my debt. During residency I'm going to try to start making payments on the private loans. Plus, I'm going to moonlight like crazy. Any opportunity and I will take it.
My question is, these jobs people talk about in underserved areas with higher pay, are they competitive? I mean I know there is a shortage of psychiatrists. But would it be easy to find a job just out of residency/fellowship making 175k+? On top of that if I'm will to work >60hrs a week, does anyone know the earning potential?
Thx :)
 
That makes sense but to me it seems like government loan forgiveness programs are too good to be true. Has anyone had any experiences with a program? I've tried researching about the topic and many states offer 20-25k/yr for a minimum of 2 yrs and up to 35k for up to 2 years after that. Also are you eligible right after you finish residency/fellowship?
 
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