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As of late, I've been seeing more and more posts on these forums asking whether or not a student should choose to attend a CSU or UC campus for their undergraduate education and which will give them a "better" chance of getting into a professional (dental) school. As someone who went to a CSU for undergrad and is attending a UC for dental school, and as someone who has a sibling who attended a UC for both undergrad and medical school I think I have a pretty realistic perspective on the pros and cons of both systems. Anyone else who has anything to add please do so! Let's get started......
First and foremost, the common misconception that it's difficult to get into a dental school from a CSU simply stems from the fact that a fraction of CSU students APPLY to dental school compared to UC students. If you're lucky enough to interview at UCLA and UCSF for dental school, they will both tell you that they have fewer CSU than UC students simply because they have fewer CSU than UC applicants. If you look at the more important statistic, the acceptance RATE, you will see that the ratio of enrollee's to applicants between CSU and UC students is much more similar than common perception would have you believe.
In my own personal experience, given a chance to do-over my undergraduate education I would choose the CSU again 10 times out of 10 and here's why:
- Simply put - CSU's focus on high-quality instruction. In my biology degree, I NEVER had a course not taught by a full-time faculty with a PhD. Many of these faculty had their PhD's from Ivy League campuses, UC's and other prestigious universities, and because the CSU's focus far more on teaching the students than on research I feel that I learned a tremendous amount more than I would have at a UC. My teachers knew many of their students by name and were always available to talk in office hours. According to my many friends and sister who attended UC campuses this was definitely not the case - their classes were often huge, taught by grad assistants and they had a hard time forming meaningful relationships with faculty. Think about which option will be more beneficial when it comes time to get high-quality LOR's.
- The UC's are more "prestigious" than the CSU's because they bring in so much more money for research and other activities. This can be good and bad - and from an undergraduate perspective it's definitely more bad than good. The UC's attract plenty of talented masters and doctoral candidates, and often times their extensive resources go more towards helping them produce publications than it does to the quality of instruction in undergraduate courses. Because the UC's have so many prestigious graduate students, it's hard to get real hands-on research experience at a UC campus. This is definitely not the case at a CSU - we don't offer many PhD's and as a result, undergrads are often leaned on to do more hands-on research work than they would at a UC campus. Again, think about how this will impact your application.
All of that being said, there are certainly some distinct advantages to attending a UC for undergrad. First and foremost, some of the bigger UC's offer a much more fun "college experience" than the CSU's (minus SDSU of course). UCLA, Cal, UCSD, and UCSB all come to mind when I think of having a great undergraduate experience, and what they can provide in terms of having fun as an undergraduate is far more than most CSU's can offer you. In fact, a number of CSU campuses are primarily commuter schools with a large number of older and "non-traditional" students more focused on their own lives than enjoying the college experience like most 18-22 year olds would want to do.
I think another glaring difference between the CSU's and the UC's is that the AVERAGE UC student is far superior to the average student at a CSU and I think that plays a large role in the perception of why it's hard to get into dental school from a CSU. This can be both good and bad depending upon your personal point of view. In all honesty, you will be around many more bright, motivated, and competitive students at a UC than you would at a CSU. This could either fuel you to strive harder, or make it more difficult for you to stand out in a positive way. On the other hand, attend a CSU as a really motivated student (like I'm sure most of you that are on these forums are) it can be much easier to succeed and build a great resume for your applications.
All in all, if you're thinking about attending a CSU vs. a UC for undergrad I would strongly urge you to consider a CSU. In my opinion (and personal experience), as an undergraduate you will get a more personalized education and you will get it while paying about 30% of what you would at a UC (DO NOT UNDERESTIMATE THE COST). You will have to sacrifice a lot of the fun you may have at a cool UC campus with a real college environment but I think in the long run it would be worth it.
First and foremost, the common misconception that it's difficult to get into a dental school from a CSU simply stems from the fact that a fraction of CSU students APPLY to dental school compared to UC students. If you're lucky enough to interview at UCLA and UCSF for dental school, they will both tell you that they have fewer CSU than UC students simply because they have fewer CSU than UC applicants. If you look at the more important statistic, the acceptance RATE, you will see that the ratio of enrollee's to applicants between CSU and UC students is much more similar than common perception would have you believe.
In my own personal experience, given a chance to do-over my undergraduate education I would choose the CSU again 10 times out of 10 and here's why:
- Simply put - CSU's focus on high-quality instruction. In my biology degree, I NEVER had a course not taught by a full-time faculty with a PhD. Many of these faculty had their PhD's from Ivy League campuses, UC's and other prestigious universities, and because the CSU's focus far more on teaching the students than on research I feel that I learned a tremendous amount more than I would have at a UC. My teachers knew many of their students by name and were always available to talk in office hours. According to my many friends and sister who attended UC campuses this was definitely not the case - their classes were often huge, taught by grad assistants and they had a hard time forming meaningful relationships with faculty. Think about which option will be more beneficial when it comes time to get high-quality LOR's.
- The UC's are more "prestigious" than the CSU's because they bring in so much more money for research and other activities. This can be good and bad - and from an undergraduate perspective it's definitely more bad than good. The UC's attract plenty of talented masters and doctoral candidates, and often times their extensive resources go more towards helping them produce publications than it does to the quality of instruction in undergraduate courses. Because the UC's have so many prestigious graduate students, it's hard to get real hands-on research experience at a UC campus. This is definitely not the case at a CSU - we don't offer many PhD's and as a result, undergrads are often leaned on to do more hands-on research work than they would at a UC campus. Again, think about how this will impact your application.
All of that being said, there are certainly some distinct advantages to attending a UC for undergrad. First and foremost, some of the bigger UC's offer a much more fun "college experience" than the CSU's (minus SDSU of course). UCLA, Cal, UCSD, and UCSB all come to mind when I think of having a great undergraduate experience, and what they can provide in terms of having fun as an undergraduate is far more than most CSU's can offer you. In fact, a number of CSU campuses are primarily commuter schools with a large number of older and "non-traditional" students more focused on their own lives than enjoying the college experience like most 18-22 year olds would want to do.
I think another glaring difference between the CSU's and the UC's is that the AVERAGE UC student is far superior to the average student at a CSU and I think that plays a large role in the perception of why it's hard to get into dental school from a CSU. This can be both good and bad depending upon your personal point of view. In all honesty, you will be around many more bright, motivated, and competitive students at a UC than you would at a CSU. This could either fuel you to strive harder, or make it more difficult for you to stand out in a positive way. On the other hand, attend a CSU as a really motivated student (like I'm sure most of you that are on these forums are) it can be much easier to succeed and build a great resume for your applications.
All in all, if you're thinking about attending a CSU vs. a UC for undergrad I would strongly urge you to consider a CSU. In my opinion (and personal experience), as an undergraduate you will get a more personalized education and you will get it while paying about 30% of what you would at a UC (DO NOT UNDERESTIMATE THE COST). You will have to sacrifice a lot of the fun you may have at a cool UC campus with a real college environment but I think in the long run it would be worth it.
