Tired of Inferior Nurses

[toogood1]

You know I am in my last year of this stuff and I guess I should be used to it, but I am really getting tired of "some" nurses. Don't get me wrong, about 90% are really great and don't feel like you are being a bother when you ask a question. Many have gone out of their way to help me with IV, blood draws, etc. However, I have me a few that have been total "bitches" to me. I don't I understand this underlying hostility some nurses have against medical student, especially female med students.

For example, a resident and I were going over some drugs in the ICU and the nurse came interrupting about a particular drug--aminocaproic acid. Me, being the medical student, talking to myself by the way, just said "used to treat thrombocytopenia". She looks at me and says I know that in a condescending way. I am like bitch I was saying this for my own learning; I really hope you know what drug you are pushing. Then another ER nurse basically tells me to leave the trauma bay b/c I wasn't putting the foley in fast enough. I politely took off my gloves and told her that I would let her DO HER JOB! It's just suttle stuff like that that really bothers me and makes these clerkships even harder. Just wanted to know if anyone else agreed.

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[ambientbaby]

Here we go again...

 

[fab4fan]

Funny, I was just thinking today about how I enjoy working with 99.99% of med students, but that 0.01% can really wreck my day. (Particularly the one that is currently on rotation in the dept. where I work.)

 

[Janders]

I understand your side of the story, but in reading both of your examples, I can see why those nurses might have been angry.

In the first-- from the nurses perspective-- all she heard was you stating the activity of the drug she's pushing. Your reason might have been benign, but honestly, if I was her I would not have assumed you were doing a self-learning exercise... i would have thought you were trying to "teach" me. If the roles were reversed, would you have appreciated it?

And in the trauma bay: (a) things can get hurried, and tempers often flare (b) perhaps you were doing "the nurses job", but one could also say that she was giving you the chance to learn by taking the first shot.

Anyway, not trying to get on your case at all... but medicine is stressful enough as it is... try to turn the other cheek

 

[fang]

Funny, I was just thinking today about how I enjoy working with 99.99% of med students, but that 0.01% can really wreck my day. (Particularly the one that is currently on rotation in the dept. where I work.)

touche.

From the few times I've seen you post around here, I'd guess you're NOT one of the nurses who gives us a hard time (an undeserved hard time that is). But, they do exist, and I think it's worse when you're a female med student working with a female nurse. Here's a hopefully productive question though-- when you're working with med students or interns, what do we do that you find rude that might not be obvious to us? What can we do that helps the relationship?

 

[smkoepke]

You know I am in my last year of this stuff and I guess I should be used to it, but I am really getting tired of "some" nurses. Don't get me wrong, about 90% are really great and don't feel like you are being a bother when you ask a question. Many have gone out of their way to help me with IV, blood draws, etc. However, I have me a few that have been total "bitches" to me. I don't I understand this underlying hostility some nurses have against medical student, especially female med students.

For example, a resident and I were going over some drugs in the ICU and the nurse came interrupting about a particular drug--aminocaproic acid. Me, being the medical student, talking to myself by the way, just said "used to treat thrombocytopenia". She looks at me and says I know that in a condescending way. I am like bitch I was saying this for my own learning; I really hope you know what drug you are pushing. Then another ER nurse basically tells me to leave the trauma bay b/c I wasn't putting the foley in fast enough. I politely took off my gloves and told her that I would let her DO HER JOB! It's just suttle stuff like that that really bothers me and makes these clerkships even harder. Just wanted to know if anyone else agreed.

As an RN student, it has been my admittedly limited experience that the nurses who are snippy with the med students are just as mean to the nursing students and everyone else. (probably more so becaue we have to follow them and take direction from them). People are people. The mean nurses would be just as mean if they were MD, RPH, PT et... Ignore them get your job done and have as little interaction with them as possible. Also please don't let their attitude color your opinion of the group as a whole. On my clinical floor there are 2 flat out rude nurses. There are a couple who are decent but obviously do not want to have anything to do with students of any kind, there are some who are as nice as pie, but are not good teachers and there are countless others who could not be more helpful and go above and beyond the call for the students. The same with the docs. Some will see you on the floor and call you in to watch a procedure or talk about a disease and treatment, some look right through you and won't answer you when you ask a question. Others still are just indifferent to anyone who isn't a practicing doctor, nurse or other professional. I just grin and bear it. I make sure I learn what I need to and leave the other B.S. on the floor when I leave.

 

[fab4fan]

touche.

From the few times I've seen you post around here, I'd guess you're NOT one of the nurses who gives us a hard time (an undeserved hard time that is). But, they do exist, and I think it's worse when you're a female med student working with a female nurse. Here's a hopefully productive question though-- when you're working with med students or interns, what do we do that you find rude that might not be obvious to us? What can we do that helps the relationship?

Here's what our current student does that you should NOT do:

1. Grabs the chart out of your hands/grabs chart away from you while you are still charting.

2. Interrupts staff to ask, "Where is my patient?" Dude, you're following a doc who has six patients here at the moment. Could you be a little more specific? Interrupts when you're on the phone calling in scripts/taking orders.

3. Is very cold and unresponsive to patients, to the point that it has unnerved some of them. Then I have to get these anxious pts. settled down. I had two ask me if I thought he knew what he was doing.

4. Barked at me the other day because I got an EKG on a pt. ("We didn't order that!") I explained that maybe the doc he was following didn't, but per anesthesia protocol, the pt. needed it. He didn't seem to understand that concept.

We are bemoaning the loss of our previous student. She was great with pts. and staff. If she needed a form from a chart someone was working on, she'd ask if she could have it...none of this grabbing the whole thing out of someone's hands. She was terrific.

I think part of this guy's problem is that he's shy and insecure. But that doesn't give him a pass on being rude. Someday he is going to have to learn to work as part of a team.

When you work in a teaching hospital, it can be like a revolving door with new interns and students constantly coming and going. Most of them are just fine. On the flip side, they have to readjust to new units and new staff every couple of weeks. I am mindful of that and do try to be helpful and overlook minor stuff. But this guy is really starting to get to me. Funny how it seems like the good ones come and go so quickly, but the bad ones seem to stay forever.

BTW: No, I'm not a hazer. It's unprofessional, and if nothing else, the med student you haze today could be the attending you have to deal with tomorrow.

 

[Lgb325]

Just wanted to say thanks for the info from the previous poster, Fab4Fan.
Sometimes it is extremely helpful to have the perspective of the "other side".

I think Fab4fan is exactly the kind of nurse I enjoy working with.... one who acknowledges that it may not be easy being in the position of the med student AND is just looking to be treated with common courtesy and respect. That I can do! And I do make an effort to treat the nurses like that. Sometimes it just seems wasted on some people.

BUT like another poster mentioned..... people are people and sometimes it's not about you/ the med student. It's just that person.

 

[Dr JPH]

You know I am in my last year of this stuff and I guess I should be used to it, but I am really getting tired of "some" nurses. Don't get me wrong, about 90% are really great and don't feel like you are being a bother when you ask a question. Many have gone out of their way to help me with IV, blood draws, etc. However, I have me a few that have been total "bitches" to me. I don't I understand this underlying hostility some nurses have against medical student, especially female med students.

For example, a resident and I were going over some drugs in the ICU and the nurse came interrupting about a particular drug--aminocaproic acid. Me, being the medical student, talking to myself by the way, just said "used to treat thrombocytopenia". She looks at me and says I know that in a condescending way. I am like bitch I was saying this for my own learning; I really hope you know what drug you are pushing. Then another ER nurse basically tells me to leave the trauma bay b/c I wasn't putting the foley in fast enough. I politely took off my gloves and told her that I would let her DO HER JOB! It's just suttle stuff like that that really bothers me and makes these clerkships even harder. Just wanted to know if anyone else agreed.

This has happened to everyone at one time or another. Let it roll off your back.

7 more months!!

Hang in there!!

 

[DOtobe]

This has happened to everyone at one time or another. Let it roll off your back.

Agreed. There are nurses with a chip on their shoulder everywhere. Luckily, they are in the minority. If you get yelled at by a nurse, just ignore it. They are worse to medical students, I think. I got yelled at a lot when I was a med student, but as a resident I get along with all the nurses in my hospital. But you have to be nice to them, and not treat them as people who are below you because you are a "doctor" or are going to be a "doctor." A few of my fellow residents have gotten that high and mighty attitude with nurses, and they've suffered on their call nights as a result...

 

[ocean11]

Agreed. There are nurses with a chip on their shoulder everywhere. Luckily, they are in the minority. If you get yelled at by a nurse, just ignore it. They are worse to medical students, I think. I got yelled at a lot when I was a med student, but as a resident I get along with all the nurses in my hospital. But you have to be nice to them, and not treat them as people who are below you because you are a "doctor" or are going to be a "doctor." A few of my fellow residents have gotten that high and mighty attitude with nurses, and they've suffered on their call nights as a result...

From what I've seen I think nurses are nicer to family doctors than anyone else.... and hate surgeons the most.... as for internists... it can go either way!

SEE YA!

 

[djquickfingers]

You know I am in my last year of this stuff and I guess I should be used to it, but I am really getting tired of "some" nurses. Don't get me wrong, about 90% are really great and don't feel like you are being a bother when you ask a question. Many have gone out of their way to help me with IV, blood draws, etc. However, I have me a few that have been total "bitches" to me. I don't I understand this underlying hostility some nurses have against medical student, especially female med students.

For example, a resident and I were going over some drugs in the ICU and the nurse came interrupting about a particular drug--aminocaproic acid. Me, being the medical student, talking to myself by the way, just said "used to treat thrombocytopenia". She looks at me and says I know that in a condescending way. I am like bitch I was saying this for my own learning; I really hope you know what drug you are pushing. Then another ER nurse basically tells me to leave the trauma bay b/c I wasn't putting the foley in fast enough. I politely took off my gloves and told her that I would let her DO HER JOB! It's just suttle stuff like that that really bothers me and makes these clerkships even harder. Just wanted to know if anyone else agreed.

Your number one problem is that you think nurses are inferior. Get that out of your mind now. They are just as important as any other health care professional. Treat them as such, both in your mind and in practice. Now you will encounter some down-right rude ones, as you will in any profession. Just ignore it and move on. You have a goal and don't let things like this steer you off track

 

[fab4fan]

I'm still trying to figure out what either of those nurses did that made the OP call them "inferior." Neither of them neglected a pt., nor did they give care that was sloppy. They both seemed to have challeneged the OP, at least by his perception. That seemed to rub him the wrong way. But I don't see how that made them inferior, unless he's suggesting that nurses in general are inferior to him.

If that's the case, he's in for one tough row to hoe.

 

[sn160]

Agreed. There are nurses with a chip on their shoulder everywhere. Luckily, they are in the minority. If you get yelled at by a nurse, just ignore it. They are worse to medical students, I think. I got yelled at a lot when I was a med student, but as a resident I get along with all the nurses in my hospital. But you have to be nice to them, and not treat them as people who are below you because you are a "doctor" or are going to be a "doctor." A few of my fellow residents have gotten that high and mighty attitude with nurses, and they've suffered on their call nights as a result...

Doctors should not get " that high and mighty attitude" with nurses simply because they are afraid that nurses will make their call nights hell. Doctors, and in particular medical students, should not get an attitude because the nurses are an integral part of the care team and may be more knowledgeable in a certian content area. Believe it or not, nurses do not just empty urinals and distribute bandages. They must create care plans, nursing diagnosis, understand the pharmacokinetics and pharmacodynamics of medications, understand lab values to anticpate what tests will be ordered, prepare teaching plans for patients, understand the role of OT, PT, Dietary, Pastoral Care...etc. etc. etc. It is important that all members of the care team support each other to provide the best care for our patients.

 

[DOtobe]

Doctors should not get " that high and mighty attitude" with nurses simply because they are afraid that nurses will make their call nights hell. Doctors, and in particular medical students, should not get an attitude because the nurses are an integral part of the care team and may be more knowledgeable in a certian content area. Believe it or not, nurses do not just empty urinals and distribute bandages. They must create care plans, nursing diagnosis, understand the pharmacokinetics and pharmacodynamics of medications, understand lab values to anticpate what tests will be ordered, prepare teaching plans for patients, understand the role of OT, PT, Dietary, Pastoral Care...etc. etc. etc. It is important that all members of the care team support each other to provide the best care for our patients.

I agree. The nurses are the reason I got through a lot of my call nights as an intern relatively unscathed. Especially ICU nurses, who could blow me out of the water with some of their knowledge.
Everybody in the hospital is working as a team. Too bad a lot of people don't realize that.