TouroCOM-NY Class of 2014

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Yes it is a new school but do you feel its worth it to take out so many loans in a place that is not staple.

Thats really up to you, I'm fine with it.

Do you feel that you will be prepared for boards and residency wont be a problem?

Yes I feel that I will be ready. I don't see why this is an issue, board scores are what YOU put into it.

Are the rotations all in NYC. Can someone please confirm. I do not want to wind up rotating upstate. Thank a bunch.

As of right now there are no rotations in Manhattan. They are mostly in Queens/Brooklyn/The Bronx, some in New Jersey, and I think one at Pallisades Hospital which is about 20-30mins north of manhattan.

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There seems like there is so much going on. Yes it is a new school but do you feel its worth it to take out so many loans in a place that is not staple. Do you feel that you will be prepared for boards and residency wont be a problem? Are the rotations all in NYC. Can someone please confirm. I do not want to wind up rotating upstate. Thank a bunch.

1) yea. I feel pretty confident in the school. Its tuition is pretty much par for the course among the schools I looked at. And if uncertainty worries you (and there really isnt any reason to be uncertain with the school) then take your own uncertainty into account. But there is nothing here that makes me think its unstable at all.

2) Residency definitely won't be an issue because the 3rd years are (according to the ones i've talked to) getting rave reviews from their residents and attendings. And getting into a residency is much much much more about connections made in the 3rd and 4th years than board scores, which in many (but not all) residencies serve as an arbitrary cut off to limit applicant pool rather than a true "influencer" of one qualified doc versus another for the spot. (obviously sometimes it will be the decider, but its the case much less often that previous experience with the hospital). Am i worried about the boards? Not more than any other student. Especially in the 1st year, they are trying everything to get us all the info we could ever cram in our heads, and in the end, the boards are very much a personal endeavour to study for. They are even enrolling us all in kaplan review course. (im sure a few of us would wish we could opt out for different courses, but kaplan is solid and it shows their dedication to really raising the board scores)

3) read what the guy above me said. We don't have any manhattan right now because there simply isnt spots to be had in any of these hospitals. We have a huge amount of space in a bronx rotation "plan" and a queens brooklyn rotation "set". We also have a more than enough space in long island and north jersey for those who would want to go there (we have a lot of long islanders and jersey people in our class). As far as upstate goes? We have a rotation set in rockland county thats about 20-30 minutes from manhattan. And my understanding is that we have more spaces than people, so we have a handful (6? 8?) of spots in far upstate NY for anyone interested in that (though i dont think a single person will 'have' to go there) and the same for a rotation in texas for those who are in the army scholarship, which requires a few months spent in fort hood texas anyway.
 
And here I thought the school I was attending was painful with hypocritical administrators. After reading some of the stories, I am very nervous about my interview and the institution's outlook in general. I had applied to TouroCOM as an in-state backup as I do not want to go to California or Florida to get a medical degree. :scared:
 
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And here I thought the school I was attending was painful with hypocritical administrators. After reading some of the stories, I am very nervous about my interview and the institution's outlook in general. I had applied to TouroCOM as an in-state backup as I do not want to go to California or Florida to get a medical degree. :scared:

I think ultimately, you should make your decision after your interview, your visit, and based on YOUR opinion of your experience at Touro, not what so and so says. I'm not sure why you think the outlook of the school is bleak. If anything, it will continue to flourish and I really feel that it has the potential to be an even stronger school in the future, mostly because of its attractive location continuing to bring in stronger applicants.

There are also a lot of other factors that will continue to help Touro improve, eg the recent meeting with COCA to help effect change for the better at Touro, the acquisition of NYMC, etc.
 
I'm having a hard time finding an academic calendar online. Might someone know when the first day of classes is at TouroCOM this fall (for first year students)?

Thanks in advance!
 
1st year orientation starts on July 19th. They have to start school earlier next year because of how the jewish holidays fell on the calender. It works out because we have more time off during the year.
 
Wow for blatant misinformation. We have ZERO hospitals in Brooklyn, even thought they said they were 'close to being finalized.'
The 'huge' amt in the bronx would be 24 spots (class of 125) - and if you are at the bronx you have to travel 4 of the 10 months to nj for surgery, ob/gyn and psych. Those NJ sites are at least an hour away by public transportation - so you need a car. Staten island track - also travel to queens for 2 months. The Queens track has no traveling - but that hospital is on the border of LI. So I'm not sure of the brooklyn/queen set you're talking about.

The army/texas site - they are only allowed to do 3 months and then they have to come back for the rest of the year.

The rest are in NJ - no hospital there has every rotation at one site.

For the first years commenting on rotations, the rotation grids are posted. Please don't post misinformation.

posted this before the grids went up. So i was working with the information given to me off of our tour hand out sheets which just changed over the day the grids went up. It was accurate to that. The grids are up now and i have seen them, my bad.

now for your information, i just checked the grid. If you go to the bronx you have to spend 1 of the 10 months in NJ, not 4. There is variability, but in a quick walk by i saw plenty 1 and 2 month NJ stints with 8 or 9 in NY in most of the slots. Though i do not doubt that 4 is also an option, but it is def not the majority as, i think, you presented it as.

I'm a first year so feel free to diminish my opinion, but i cant undertand how you could be dissappointed with the final product choices. I'm very familiar with the rotation available at other schools since i'm the fifth person in my family all having entered/exited med school in the past 6 years. Sure we thought we'd have some magical smorgasbog of choices, but what we ended up with is still really solid. A SI/Queens track, a pure queens track, an fully NJ track, a Texas specialty setup, and two hybrid tracks that (to my understanding) are a combination of the bronx and palisades,which is RIGHT across the river, where you spend 7 or 8 months at one and 2 at the other. If this varies from that, then i'm wrong, but i know i checked a good few lines before i spoke this time now that i have the actual blocks.

and on it being a bronx/nj hybrid, from midtown they are both identical distances apart of 40 minutes door-to-door. Google maps and mapquest confirmed. Though I have heard that the 10th month of the hybrid formats gets sticky (do you go to queens or rockland for a month etc etc) its still a very good track.

I type too much. i always do. But the short version is that it may not be the ideal situation we were originally told, but it is still a very good 3rd year set of options decently competitive with other places. And we are in our second class ever doing clinicals. No one expected perfection, we buy in knowing stuff is rapidly improving year to year.
 
Worse comes to worse - though it might be too late for some 2nd years now - but the school has given permission to go out and find your own rotations where ever you want. you go to the hospitals, talk to them, fill out all of your paper work and get it done yourself, and then the school will deem the hospital adequate or not.

which is a great option if you 1) don't like any of the current hospitals the school has provided 2) if you are out of state and want to go back home 3)have a need/reason/obligation to go where ever.

How long this option will be available, we don't know. but currently it is available.
 
I'm sorry, where did it ever state that it was absolutely necessary for all rotation spots to be within a 25 mile radius to the school? You make it sound like the school has done us a disservice by not providing rotation spots in Manhattan, which would make it easier to commute, but it is by no means necessary. To use Stony Brook Med for example, their rotation spots include Winthrop in Mineola, the VA hospital in Huntington, and Stony Brook. Yes, they're both in Long Island, but Winthrop is about an hour and a half from Stony Brook, and the VA hospital is about an hour from Stony Brook. Guess what, students have to commute or find housing or whatever for those few months that they rotate there.

Furthermore, I haven't heard from any third years about specific rotation sites where they are not being taught medicine. You make it sound like Manhattan hospitals are the only hospitals that can teach. Just do the core rotations like you have to in any other medical school, and do the electives away. A third year has told me that the school is very efficient in setting up the electives and it's not that difficult or much of a hassle to get the proper paperwork signed. Just plan.
 
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I'm sorry, where did it ever state that it was absolutely necessary for all rotation spots to be within a 25 mile radius to the school? You make it sound like the school has done us a disservice by not providing rotation spots in Manhattan, which would make it easier to commute, but it is by no means necessary. To use Stony Brook Med for example, their rotation spots include Winthrop in Mineola, the VA hospital in Huntington, and Stony Brook. Yes, they're both in Long Island, but Winthrop is about an hour and a half from Stony Brook, and the VA hospital is about an hour from Stony Brook. Guess what, students have to commute or find housing or whatever for those few months that they rotate there.

Furthermore, I haven't heard from any third years about specific rotation sites where they are not being taught medicine. You make it sound like Manhattan hospitals are the only hospitals that can teach. Just do the core rotations like you have to in any other medical school, and do the electives away. A third year has told me that the school is very efficient in setting up the electives and it's not that difficult or much of a hassle to get the proper paperwork signed. Just plan.

:thumbup:
 
I was hoping someone would elaborate on the quality of the clinical rotations. I hear that they are far but have students felt like they are gaining great experiences? I would also like to hear about the OMM offered at Touro in NYC. I have an interview on Monday and if things go well I will be choosing between Touro in CA and NYC. Does anyone out there have any input on this specific choice? Lack of quality clinical rotations is my primary concern in CA, second only to the next big earthquake.
 
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during the COCA meeting with students - a 2nd year said that he was granted permission to do his entire 3rd year in a different city if he set it up - pretty sure he was not lying - btw he IS doing his entire 3rd year in a different city; also a first year was given permission to find a hospital in his home state for his entire 3rd year

Ask anyone who was there. were you there? since a 2nd year also brought up that we were not allowed to set up our own rotations and then was shown otherwise by the people who said they were granted permission to do rotations in other places.
 
Again, where did you get this information?????

The director of rotations was asked in a public town hall meeting (where you even in attendance??) and on personal one - to - one meetings if we could set up our own rotations. The answer was a resounding 'No. Not a chance"

No we cannot set up our core rotations. Only electives (but this is at every school)

I would appreciate it if questions about rotations were answered by 2nd or 3rd years - since clearly the 1st years have been living in this bubble of dreams.

This is straight out incorrect as the most prominent person in your class got approval to do exactly this in boston and stated so during the COCA meeting. Also my roommate (a second year) was in the process of doing the same thing for hospitals in California and I was helping him out personally. He ran out of time though (started too late) so he is working on it for next year.

In addition we have a 1st year who has received approval to do so for LI North shore if they can get the hospital to agree to take them and three who are approved to go for the Danbury Hospital system (which during the town hall meeting we were originally told 'no' for, but they later saw how many of us wanted it and changed on that). And these aren't "oh i heard so and so" stories. These are two of my closest friends and in one case I went out to eat with them right after they came out of the clinical dean's office with the paperwork and that was all they could talk about.

Englewood is far away at 90 minutes via mass transit from midtown, but thats still not bad. Especially given pretty much every school ships the majority of their students very very far out of state. And I don't mean just across the river. Palisades hospital is 40 minutes by mass transit alone from the upper west side/midtown (hopstop checked). We only comment because we may have a much more rose-tinted view than you guys have (and you will always have full reason to, i never deny that), but there are times where your assertions just aren't correct because no one can possibly know everything going on. Just as there are times where mine arent correct. E.G. I did go and read the charts and i never saw englewood hospital on the rotation round for the hybrid route. I only saw Rockland/BronxLeb/Palisades. I spoke from the best of my knowledge, but Im not going into harlem any time this weekend to check it though, i have to assume I'm wrong cause you'd def have read that in much more detail than I did.

And you're right, we weren't ever told that the manhattan hospitals were locked. And we still want them just as much as you do, but I can't see how you can be disappointed with the slots we did secure. They are all solid and all very close by. No one really has to pack up and leave the metropolitan area unless they want to (dont think anyone will be required to go far upstate)
 
I believe the number was 78% passing first time and that the number of folks who passed overall is now in the 90's %. Per higher authority (not school admin) for a first year class, this is pretty much the norm for the passing rate. While their might have been a few individuals in 2011 that where different than what you might expect, I would not dismiss the whole class based upon this. They did go through a lot and from all I have heard are performing well on rotations. Since the quality of teaching has improved vastly, the board pass rate should go up.

As for the future, Touro just bought NY medical college. I can't see this place failing

I'm not sure I see the place failing, but you can't base this on the assumption that ties with Touro are maintained. Rumors are floating around about the school being sold (thus losing the Touro association) and the school has twice been visited by a group of people who may have been potential buyers. NY medical college does nothing whatsoever to strengthen the osteopathic school. What would that have to do with us? If anything, that purchase gives Touro the MD medical school its wanted for a while in NY and it may no longer be interested in the osteopathic school also in NY.

When medical schools report pass rates, they report them as a first pass figure or an "as of date" figure. Is Admin going to be able to count the people who may be left back for passing too late twice? These people passed for 2011 and 2012?

No one really knows for sure what the first try pass rate was. As of Oct 15, it was supposedly 78%.
 
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I think ultimately, you should make your decision after your interview, your visit, and based on YOUR opinion of your experience at Touro, not what so and so says. I'm not sure why you think the outlook of the school is bleak. If anything, it will continue to flourish and I really feel that it has the potential to be an even stronger school in the future, mostly because of its attractive location continuing to bring in stronger applicants.

There are also a lot of other factors that will continue to help Touro improve, eg the recent meeting with COCA to help effect change for the better at Touro, the acquisition of NYMC, etc.

Again, what would the acquisition of NYMC have to do with us? Touro University now has the MD school it has been seeking for a while. It really has no bearing on the osteopathic medical school. We're not sharing rotations. Admin has already said that this isn't happening and I really don't think NYMC would be okay with that anyway. And from my understanding, nothing can change at NYMC until the last class that entered before the purchase graduates.
 
As of right now there are no rotations in Manhattan. They are mostly in Queens/Brooklyn/The Bronx, some in New Jersey, and I think one at Pallisades Hospital which is about 20-30mins north of manhattan.

Not correct - there are no core rotations in Brooklyn, repeat NONE. There is one hospital in the Bronx (Bronx Leb.) One hospital in Queens is for psych only and the other hospital technically in Queens (St Johns) is on the Queens/Long Island border at the end of Rockaway. There are also rotations at Staten Island University Hospital North site.

In general, if you want to live in Brooklyn, Queens, or Manhattan for the second two years expect to be doing a hell of a lot of commuting.
 
2) Residency definitely won't be an issue because the 3rd years are (according to the ones i've talked to) getting rave reviews from their residents and attendings. And getting into a residency is much much much more about connections made in the 3rd and 4th years than board scores, which in many (but not all) residencies serve as an arbitrary cut off to limit applicant pool rather than a true "influencer" of one qualified doc versus another for the spot. (obviously sometimes it will be the decider, but its the case much less often that previous experience with the hospital). Am i worried about the boards? Not more than any other student. Especially in the 1st year, they are trying everything to get us all the info we could ever cram in our heads, and in the end, the boards are very much a personal endeavour to study for. They are even enrolling us all in kaplan review course. (im sure a few of us would wish we could opt out for different courses, but kaplan is solid and it shows their dedication to really raising the board scores)

3) read what the guy above me said. We don't have any manhattan right now because there simply isnt spots to be had in any of these hospitals. We have a huge amount of space in a bronx rotation "plan" and a queens brooklyn rotation "set". We also have a more than enough space in long island and north jersey for those who would want to go there (we have a lot of long islanders and jersey people in our class). As far as upstate goes? We have a rotation set in rockland county thats about 20-30 minutes from manhattan. And my understanding is that we have more spaces than people, so we have a handful (6? 8?) of spots in far upstate NY for anyone interested in that (though i dont think a single person will 'have' to go there) and the same for a rotation in texas for those who are in the army scholarship, which requires a few months spent in fort hood texas anyway.


Hmm....

The Kaplan course consists of a whole lot of lecture. After two years of lecture based learning, is another 3-4 week of lecture really going to help? Many have opinion that Kaplan isn't very good yet Admin is trying to push it off as mandatory although that is probably going to fail. They can make us pay for it, but most are probably not going to attend as at least half of 2012 payed for another board prep

I think you're way off on rotations.

First of all - Bronx doesn't have tons of space. I'm really not sure where you're getting that from. We have 4 rotation slots there (meaning we can have 4 students in each rotation that bronx leb offers at a time) to accommodate 24 students for the year, and, off the top of my head, we don't have surgery, ob/gyn, or psych there so any student at bronx leb will have to go to NJ or somewhere else.

Brooklyn/Queens rotations are set? Who on earth is telling you this? We're doing our rotation lottery this Monday. Go take a look outside the library. There is nothing in Brooklyn and multiple people have asked Admin about Brooklyn and they have confirmed we have nothing there.

Not having rotation spots in Manhattan isn't because "there aren't spots." Money and politics, more likely.

We'll know how 2011 does in residency match when they actually go through the match. Silly endearments conveyed from Admin like "the doctors really like them" mean absolutely nothing. I want them to do well but I would never, ever take Admin's prediction of the future because it seems like they're not very experienced and so many of their predictions have been abysmally wrong.

I'm glad you like the school. I want Touro to succeed because it's in all of our best interests but I think that you're not helping people make a decision by giving inaccurate information.
 
Worse comes to worse - though it might be too late for some 2nd years now - but the school has given permission to go out and find your own rotations where ever you want. you go to the hospitals, talk to them, fill out all of your paper work and get it done yourself, and then the school will deem the hospital adequate or not.

which is a great option if you 1) don't like any of the current hospitals the school has provided 2) if you are out of state and want to go back home 3)have a need/reason/obligation to go where ever.

How long this option will be available, we don't know. but currently it is available.

Who got permission? Many students have been denied, even just last week. I agree with you 100% that this would help the situation at Touro, but it seems like Admin likes control and going outside of their hospital list does not allow as much control.

Again, multiple students have very recently been denied this. Who told you this would be possible?
 
I'm sorry, where did it ever state that it was absolutely necessary for all rotation spots to be within a 25 mile radius to the school? You make it sound like the school has done us a disservice by not providing rotation spots in Manhattan, which would make it easier to commute, but it is by no means necessary. To use Stony Brook Med for example, their rotation spots include Winthrop in Mineola, the VA hospital in Huntington, and Stony Brook. Yes, they're both in Long Island, but Winthrop is about an hour and a half from Stony Brook, and the VA hospital is about an hour from Stony Brook. Guess what, students have to commute or find housing or whatever for those few months that they rotate there.

Furthermore, I haven't heard from any third years about specific rotation sites where they are not being taught medicine. You make it sound like Manhattan hospitals are the only hospitals that can teach. Just do the core rotations like you have to in any other medical school, and do the electives away. A third year has told me that the school is very efficient in setting up the electives and it's not that difficult or much of a hassle to get the proper paperwork signed. Just plan.

Actually, we had these expectations because we were given this (false) information when we interviewed. It's not unreasonable to expect what was presented to us when we made the decision to go to Touro.

Reg: Stony Brook, the students I know there do not have these issues. They have many affiliations that can accommodate students quite well. I would not even remotely compare their clinical rotation offerings to ours.

Regarding the quality of education at our clinical sites - many are good, some are not so good. Once you get to the end of second year and into third year, you will see how studying for boards, the potential for having to move, and long commutes will affect you. It's not unreasonable for others to be concerned about this, though. I've had numerous conversations with third years who are pleased with their clinical experience within the hospital but are NOT happy about how much traveling they have to do and the general disorganization surround rotations - i.e. grading, submitting evals, etc. I just recently spoke to a student whose psych rotation site was changed and he didn't even know it until a classmate told him. No one from Admin contacted him.

Oh and getting electives has been a hassle for some. I've spoken with a number who had major issues getting Touro to submit the paper work.

And then there's the whole issue that Touro hasn't even gotten the school set up for ERAS (Electronic Residency Application Service) yet. That is a serious problem.
 
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Um, the student you're talking about was initially denied and then was granted a concession because of a new child.

Multiple students have been denied. What administrator are you working with? I'd really like to know because I know a few students who want to do this but have been told that they can't. Please PM the Administrators name to me if you can and the student whom he/she made this concession to.

This is straight out incorrect as the most prominent person in your class got approval to do exactly this in boston and stated so during the COCA meeting. Also my roommate (a second year) was in the process of doing the same thing for hospitals in California and I was helping him out personally. He ran out of time though (started too late) so he is working on it for next year.

In addition we have a 1st year who has received approval to do so for LI North shore if they can get the hospital to agree to take them and three who are approved to go for the Danbury Hospital system (which during the town hall meeting we were originally told 'no' for, but they later saw how many of us wanted it and changed on that). And these aren't "oh i heard so and so" stories. These are two of my closest friends and in one case I went out to eat with them right after they came out of the clinical dean's office with the paperwork and that was all they could talk about.

Englewood is far away at 90 minutes via mass transit from midtown, but thats still not bad. Especially given pretty much every school ships the majority of their students very very far out of state. And I don't mean just across the river. Palisades hospital is 40 minutes by mass transit alone from the upper west side/midtown (hopstop checked). We only comment because we may have a much more rose-tinted view than you guys have (and you will always have full reason to, i never deny that), but there are times where your assertions just aren't correct because no one can possibly know everything going on. Just as there are times where mine arent correct. E.G. I did go and read the charts and i never saw englewood hospital on the rotation round for the hybrid route. I only saw Rockland/BronxLeb/Palisades. I spoke from the best of my knowledge, but Im not going into harlem any time this weekend to check it though, i have to assume I'm wrong cause you'd def have read that in much more detail than I did.

And you're right, we weren't ever told that the manhattan hospitals were locked. And we still want them just as much as you do, but I can't see how you can be disappointed with the slots we did secure. They are all solid and all very close by. No one really has to pack up and leave the metropolitan area unless they want to (dont think anyone will be required to go far upstate)
 
during the COCA meeting with students - a 2nd year said that he was granted permission to do his entire 3rd year in a different city if he set it up - pretty sure he was not lying - btw he IS doing his entire 3rd year in a different city; also a first year was given permission to find a hospital in his home state for his entire 3rd year

Ask anyone who was there. were you there? since a 2nd year also brought up that we were not allowed to set up our own rotations and then was shown otherwise by the people who said they were granted permission to do rotations in other places.

I was there. What you are seeing is the lack of policy and Administration playing favorites perhaps. The one student who announced that he could arrange his own was initially denied. Later, he was told he could because he had a child.

Just because Admin says something in conversation doesn't mean much. You may learn that as you go along. Aside from random exceptions here and there that are rumored but not materialized, nothing matters unless there is a documented policy. Students have been denied the ability to arrange their own cores at teaching hospitals very recently.

To my knowledge, there are two third years who arranged their own cores. One had extenuating circumstances and was granted an exception and the other may have just been a favorite of Admin. Who knows.
 
I privately responded to you with a list of people in both classes who were given the rights to do the core rotations elsewhere.

As i told you in the PM (and am just echoing here cause its an important note): being able to do the cores wherever you want is a very unique blessing that you can do here. BUT its for those who have a very strong connection already with a certain area. You have to prove you're worth the extra work of the admin having to also monitor the education at your new hospital as well. Many schools (all of the four DO schools people in my family went to) would have no way no how allowed this. The fact is that we are trying to expand so it is worth it for the admin to put the effort in for a small number of students who can prove to be worth it because they have the connections already existing with a valuable market. It isnt any option for anywhere near the majority. but the majority will be happy to just be doing it anywhere. this is for those who bust their ass to seal the deal and already have the networking in place. I just dont want it being said that its not possible, because its a pretty interesting unique feature we have for the core rotations, even if its inaccessible to most.

haha and quoting me from 2 weeks ago is a little lame because that was back when i was reliant on paperwork they give on tours and the old town hall meeting, before the official sheets came out. Though you are right my stuff was somewhat off base saying that there was a brooklyn option, im calling technicality and saying i ran with the info i had at the time :laugh:

but i still thing youre missing the point that unless youre trying to do the hybrid NY/NJ/Rockland county set up you really wont have bad commutes at all. You just need to realize that you cant live on the island of manhattan to do it. My cousin came from Touro CA and had no choice but be sent to the exact Queens/SI rotation that we do right now. He chose not to use the housing that St. John's provides to many of its student doctors and lived in Brooklyn. He didnt have any complaints about his commute between those two locations. I think, and this is wholly me making assumptions, that people are too recalcitrant against moving out of manhattan to any other borough or suburb and they forget that all other schools have rotation sites all over the place.

Example: kirksville has rotation sites in St Louis, at least one near kirksville itself, columbus ohio, michigan, utah and phoenix. We have it in wholly contained in a tight circle of the NYC metropolitan area (and one less talked about binghamton/utica option). Sure you cant live in manhattan for it, but you also dont have to fly across the country. Again, my cousin at Vallejo had no choices in california, he had to move across the continent to brooklyn. I understand your arguments, but I'm gonna stick by my guns that the commutes (with one rotations exception) are really really easy if you give up the overpriced studio apt in manhattan for a cheaper closer and bigger apartment elsewhere. The exception is the hybrid one, and even in that case, those hospitals are all very close to each other as long as you have a car. Thats the price you pay for picking that one, moving to bronx, westcherster, north jersey or rockland and getting a car. I lived two of those four areas. Absolutely wonderful, but you need a car.

Now are you wronged because they told you manhattan was a lock. Sure. I agree. You were mislead. If being in manhattan and manhattan alone was your only reason for coming here then I am extremely sorry for this happening to you, but maybe you should have weighed more things into your selection. But there comes a time to let that one point of anger go and realize that, without that filter of being mislead there, the rotation sites actually look REALLY nice compared to what others have to deal with. Am I almost always on the cheery side of things? Yes. But this is a very fair summary of things this time I think.
 
And then there's the whole issue that Touro hasn't even gotten the school set up for ERAS (Electronic Residency Application Service) yet. That is a serious problem.

tiny additional note: COCA said that the school wouldn't be able to set up ERAS until they officially have a 4th year class anyway. I cannot honestly say that I remember their exact wording and reasoning, so someone else will have to elaborate on this more, but that was the gist of it. I pretty sure COCA is going to give it to us straight since their job is to bully the admin when they aren't doing their duties.
 
Sorry to come in slightly off topic, but I have a question about the application timeline. I have pretty good stats, 31Q MCAT, 3.5 science/non science GPA, decent ECs. I JUST sent off my secondary application this friday to touro. I called the admissions office before doing so to see if it was even worth it at this stage to send my 200 fee in or if I was really too late for the application cycle. They told me not to worry, and that they are interviewing through May. I just wanted to ask you guys here what you thought "realistically" about my applying this late. Do I have a shot? Is the class mostly filled by now? Also, how long after sending in my secondary should I expect to hear about an interview invite at this stage?

Thanks!
 
Sorry to come in slightly off topic, but I have a question about the application timeline. I have pretty good stats, 31Q MCAT, 3.5 science/non science GPA, decent ECs. I JUST sent off my secondary application this friday to touro. I called the admissions office before doing so to see if it was even worth it at this stage to send my 200 fee in or if I was really too late for the application cycle. They told me not to worry, and that they are interviewing through May. I just wanted to ask you guys here what you thought "realistically" about my applying this late. Do I have a shot? Is the class mostly filled by now? Also, how long after sending in my secondary should I expect to hear about an interview invite at this stage?

Thanks!

Last year my roommate and I both were in a similar situation as you, with similar stats. We were both wait listed, however we were pretty high on the list. I don't know how competitive this incoming class is, but I would call it as a 50/50 shot for you.
 
As of wednesday the class was ~75% filled.
Source = Obed.
 
Reg: Stony Brook, the students I know there do not have these issues. They have many affiliations that can accommodate students quite well. I would not even remotely compare their clinical rotation offerings to ours.

Regarding the quality of education at our clinical sites - many are good, some are not so good. Once you get to the end of second year and into third year, you will see how studying for boards, the potential for having to move, and long commutes will affect you. It's not unreasonable for others to be concerned about this, though. I've had numerous conversations with third years who are pleased with their clinical experience within the hospital but are NOT happy about how much traveling they have to do and the general disorganization surround rotations - i.e. grading, submitting evals, etc. I just recently spoke to a student whose psych rotation site was changed and he didn't even know it until a classmate told him. No one from Admin contacted him.

Oh and getting electives has been a hassle for some. I've spoken with a number who had major issues getting Touro to submit the paper work.

My point about Stony Brook was that they have rotation sites 45mins-1 hr away. Even if they move closer to the hospital site, they may still have to come back to the main Stony Brook site for a lecture once a week or something akin to that. As a poster mentioned before, you would either A) move closer to your site or B) be unwilling to move out of Manhattan and take the Port Authority buses to NJ, or take the A train all the way to Far Rockaway.

Rotation sites are good, not so good at other schools as well. It's unreasonable to think that all the rotation spots would be stellar in all the fields they offer. Everyone has different learning styles, and it's a learning process to know which ones work best at whichever location. The most unpopular site seems to be St Johns, but even then some have been wanting to switch out of Bronx Lebanon for it because they preferred it there. Unfortunately, the third years are being the guinea pigs for all of us and reporting fairly well about which places are best to go for what, without having had the same advantage. However, I hope that their 4th year goes more smoothly. But yeah, Surgery is a completely different experience when you take it at the VA hospital (in Northport, sorry I mislabeled the location before) vs. Stony Brook Hospital.

I just wanted to point out that it is not only our school who hates certain rotation sites, have to deal with commutes to certain hospitals, etc. I hate to put it this way, but sometimes I feel that sometimes the expectations from Touro are too high, especially when some of these issues happen at other schools as well. Maybe it was because of the letdown from being told Manhattan hospitals were secured, and it's justifiable to be upset about that. But I honestly think you're taking everything as such an offense without seeing the benefit of some of these rotation sites.

Edit: Oh, and by the way, I really wish you would stop disregarding everything we say as pesky first years who have no idea what we're talking about. We attended the same COCA meeting, heard the same information reported back to us from third years, and were also active in seeking change at Touro / learning about the rotation sites. We have as much right to comment on them as you highly esteemed second years.
 
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The most important thing is to see if the roations are associated with hospitals with good residency programs. If they are not I would not go to this school. Who cares about commuting? I would commute 2 hours if I had a chance to rotate at a hospital with good residency programs where I can make some strong connections.

My point about Stony Brook was that they have rotation sites 45mins-1 hr away. Even if they move closer to the hospital site, they may still have to come back to the main Stony Brook site for a lecture once a week or something akin to that. As a poster mentioned before, you would either A) move closer to your site or B) be unwilling to move out of Manhattan and take the Port Authority buses to NJ, or take the A train all the way to Far Rockaway.

Rotation sites are good, not so good at other schools as well. It's unreasonable to think that all the rotation spots would be stellar in all the fields they offer. Everyone has different learning styles, and it's a learning process to know which ones work best at whichever location. The most unpopular site seems to be St Johns, but even then some have been wanting to switch out of Bronx Lebanon for it because they preferred it there. Unfortunately, the third years are being the guinea pigs for all of us and reporting fairly well about which places are best to go for what, without having had the same advantage. However, I hope that their 4th year goes more smoothly. But yeah, Surgery is a completely different experience when you take it at the VA hospital (in Northport, sorry I mislabeled the location before) vs. Stony Brook Hospital.

I just wanted to point out that it is not only our school who hates certain rotation sites, have to deal with commutes to certain hospitals, etc. I hate to put it this way, but sometimes I feel that sometimes the expectations from Touro are too high, especially when some of these issues happen at other schools as well. Maybe it was because of the letdown from being told Manhattan hospitals were secured, and it's justifiable to be upset about that. But I honestly think you're taking everything as such an offense without seeing the benefit of some of these rotation sites.
 
tiny additional note: COCA said that the school wouldn't be able to set up ERAS until they officially have a 4th year class anyway. I cannot honestly say that I remember their exact wording and reasoning, so someone else will have to elaborate on this more, but that was the gist of it. I pretty sure COCA is going to give it to us straight since their job is to bully the admin when they aren't doing their duties.

Yeah, I think I remember COCA being nonchalant about the issue and brushing it off as simply "You don't have to worry about that until 4th year."

The most important thing is to see if the roations are associated with hospitals with good residency programs. If they are not I would not go to this school. Who cares about commuting? I would commute 2 hours if I had a chance to rotate at a hospital with good residency programs where I can make some strong connections.

As far as rotation sites and where I think we can stand to make a bigger improvement is having rotation sites at academic centers/ teaching hospitals, where they actually offer residencies because LORS matter more from them than the community hospitals. Unfortunately, many DO schools are not associated with huge university hospitals. This is both a benefit and a negative. The benefit is that you have more hands on training often because if there are no residents, you are often the first assistant on many of these cases. The negative is obviously the lack of a connection afterward. If you're shooting for a Manhattan residency in the future, I would highly recommend audition rotations. And then you can blast them away by saying "yes I've put in a central line before," etc.

Not having rotation spots in Manhattan isn't because "there aren't spots." Money and politics, more likely.

Yes, money and politics. However there is no "going rate" of payment for students to rotate at hospitals. I don't think anyone should write off the lack of Manhattan hospitals on our rotation list as Touro being unwilling to cooperate with them. Many Manhattan schools do not pay for their students to rotate through.
 
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Sorry to come in slightly off topic, but I have a question about the application timeline. I have pretty good stats, 31Q MCAT, 3.5 science/non science GPA, decent ECs. I JUST sent off my secondary application this friday to touro. I called the admissions office before doing so to see if it was even worth it at this stage to send my 200 fee in or if I was really too late for the application cycle. They told me not to worry, and that they are interviewing through May. I just wanted to ask you guys here what you thought "realistically" about my applying this late. Do I have a shot? Is the class mostly filled by now? Also, how long after sending in my secondary should I expect to hear about an interview invite at this stage?

Thanks!

I got in straight out doing everything two weeks earlier. I know my friend did it right around the time frame you did and was high waitlisted, and taken off and put onto full acceptance about 3 days later. Its obviously less likely than an earlier applicant, haha, obed told us they were almost all full last year when i did all this stuff, but still people were waitlisted and came off of it after me. so not totally useless.

I had a little over a one week gap between everything being in (you get an e-mail telling you its all in) and being offered an interview date. interviews were held about 3 weeks later (but youre given choices) and then acceptance is 2 weeks following that.
 
The most important thing is to see if the roations are associated with hospitals with good residency programs. If they are not I would not go to this school. Who cares about commuting? I would commute 2 hours if I had a chance to rotate at a hospital with good residency programs where I can make some strong connections.

Well St. Johns (where one of my family members ended up doing residency) is a huge huge place for AOA residencies. They have all the basics youd expect and derm and opthomology. One of our teachers is the son of the head of DO residencies there, so we have plenty of ins there. (And Dr. Sheldon Sirota also has some minor board position so you see him from time to time in the hallways as well)

but yea, as someone else said. the goal is to either be at a place with a strong residency from the start, or use the 4th year as an audition round at the places you do want to go and knock them out with all of the extra hands-on experience you had given the special environment some of the other hospitals give.
 
Sorry to come in slightly off topic, but I have a question about the application timeline. I have pretty good stats, 31Q MCAT, 3.5 science/non science GPA, decent ECs. I JUST sent off my secondary application this friday to touro. I called the admissions office before doing so to see if it was even worth it at this stage to send my 200 fee in or if I was really too late for the application cycle. They told me not to worry, and that they are interviewing through May. I just wanted to ask you guys here what you thought "realistically" about my applying this late. Do I have a shot? Is the class mostly filled by now? Also, how long after sending in my secondary should I expect to hear about an interview invite at this stage?

Thanks!

I sent in my secondary and got an interview within two weeks. In fact, I just interviewed today and was told that the class was 3/4 full. However, also remember that many students make a deposit but opt for a different school. I would send in your secondary. However, its up to you to decide if its worth $200.

Good luck!:luck:
 
thanks for your responses! hopefully I can get an interview quickly after sending everything in because I know I am down to the wire. So am I understanding that when someone is placed on the high waitlist they can be reconsidered immediately instead of having to wait until mid june? That would be amazing.
 
thanks for your responses! hopefully I can get an interview quickly after sending everything in because I know I am down to the wire. So am I understanding that when someone is placed on the high waitlist they can be reconsidered immediately instead of having to wait until mid june? That would be amazing.

yes. They are being completely truthful when they say that the waitlist is a true rolling waitlist. People come off of it every day. As said before, my friend was only on it for 3 or 4 days from being told he was on it to being told he was accepted.
 
yes. They are being completely truthful when they say that the waitlist is a true rolling waitlist. People come off of it every day. As said before, my friend was only on it for 3 or 4 days from being told he was on it to being told he was accepted.

Obed is waiting till they interview everyone until they start pulling people off waitlist. So no waitlist movement till May for this year, this is directly from him.

Would be nice if it was faster.
 
Obed is waiting till they interview everyone until they start pulling people off waitlist. So no waitlist movement till May for this year, this is directly from him.

Would be nice if it was faster.

there you go. most up to date info out there. It would be nice if they told us tour guides more about the waitlisting process cause ive been asked a few times on tours and had to shrug and just tell them i hope they dont have to worry about waitlists :laugh:
 
Even so, may is earlier than june which is when non rolling based admissions take a second look at apps. So this definitely indicates they are interviewing through the entire month of April?
 
Even so, may is earlier than june which is when non rolling based admissions take a second look at apps. So this definitely indicates they are interviewing through the entire month of April?

They are interviewing through April. Obed said wait list movement will occur after he get done interviewing everyone, by may. I am hoping thats early may.
 
Wow. I thought applying to medical school's would be so different. Thanks for everyone's honesty and comments. I keep hearing changes, misinformation, bullying, this class vs that class, me and not us. This is our careers and there is so much going on. I would like to hear from the students that transfered out. If I ever wanted to transfer? Is it complicated?
 
Wow. I thought applying to medical school's would be so different. Thanks for everyone's honesty and comments. I keep hearing changes, misinformation, bullying, this class vs that class, me and not us. This is our careers and there is so much going on. I would like to hear from the students that transfered out. If I ever wanted to transfer? Is it complicated?

Extremely. You have to have a very good reason. By that I mean that you have to have a very sick relative you need to take care of, or your spouse is in another state and he/she can't come to yours, or the school you currently attend was hit by a hurricane. You also need a letter from your dean verifying this, and that you are in good standing with the school. You also may need to start from year one depending on how the curriculum match up, unless you are in 3rd or 4th year.
 
Does anyone know whether accepted students will receive any official letter or package stating our accptance to TouroCOM? Does this school have any official correspondence at all besides Obed's emails?
 
We have as much right to comment on them as you highly esteemed second years.

I don't think anyone has discouraged you from commenting. I encourage input. It helps people make a decision about coming to Touro.
 
Wow. I thought applying to medical school's would be so different. Thanks for everyone's honesty and comments. I keep hearing changes, misinformation, bullying, this class vs that class, me and not us. This is our careers and there is so much going on. I would like to hear from the students that transfered out. If I ever wanted to transfer? Is it complicated?

Don't come to Touro with a plan of transferring out. It's not easy. I know of 6 students who have accomplished it.

I think Touro would be a great place if the Admin at the top changed. They are the problem. I really think everyone else is great for the most part - the professors, the students, even the secretaries.

Admin really just has no idea of what they're doing. Most of them are inexperienced and instead of looking at what other medical schools do, they try to invent something strange and new. Let's face it, Touro right now is probably in the bottom 10 medical schools in the country. Admin should be trying to pull board scores up, networking for its students to get great residencies, and trying to make students happy so that it develops a reputation as a great place.

Instead, they do strange things like compressing first year basic science to add pathology and pharmacology to the first year and then adding 3rd and 4th year clinical material to second year at the expense of basic sciences again. What's next? Are the deans going to warp spacetime and give us degrees before we start classes? Are we going to start our residencies before clinical rotations? It just makes no sense.

I'm taking the boards in less than two months and instead of winding down school, I have five exams and three quizzes in the last three weeks of school on top of an intro to rotations class, a white coat ceremony and an infection control class.

There is bullying. There are threats. I'm not sure if this has changed for 2013, but I know that 2011 and 2012 have many stories that warrant being shared here but I unfortunately can't because it would identify people involved who would not want any kind of retaliatory action. I would bet that Admin reads some of these posts as well, or that some students print these out and run to admin with a copy every time something less than positive is said about the school. It's happened before. Without a doubt though, people have been threatened with expulsion and told they will have negative things put on their files in order to ruin their chances at residency.

Again, I see this as problem with select group at the top. I hope this will change eventually. I really think Touro could be a great place and one a very good school if it had proper, experienced leadership.
 
I read your PM. Again, when there is a documented policy and people have actually accomplished arranging their own cores, then this is a marketable "benefit" of the school.

It's not so much the fact that we were mislead about the Manhattan slots, it's that we're not really in NYC at all aside from Bronx Leb, and Staten Island, if you really want to count that borough. And it's also the lack of transparency and the seeming lack of effort at getting rotations slots elsewhere. There are plenty of hospitals in Brooklyn and Queens.

The rotation situation is more a symptom of the systemic problem at Touro. Top level admin does what it wants, whenever it wants and doesn't expect any repercussions.

Are you aware of the "auditing" policy? Most medical schools have a split semester option for students who have trouble - basically the second year gets spread out into two years. Touro changed that and took it away. Anyone who failed three or more classes were officially expelled in writing but then were told that they must "audit" the second semester by attending all classes and taking all tests and pay a 7500 dollar fee. They are still expelled but they "may" be allowed back in depending on how they do. They no longer have access to student loans because they are not registered students and they aren't told what grades they need to get to get back into the school. How can a school expel students and then charge them tuition when they can't get student loans in order to keep some kind of vague undefined connection to the school? It's really awful. This isn't some isolated event. There are at least half a dozen students in this situation.

And then there are the third years who took longer to pass the COMLEX. Even though we never have had a documented cut off date that would result in expulsion, these students were also expelled on paper and then told they had to remediate basic sciences....even though they had already passed the COMLEX and had passed the first few months of rotations!! And not only that, a dean announced that the new rule is that we all have to take the COMLEX by june 30th but can fail it and then have a year to pass it and not be removed from rotations. So they expelled students, made them pay money, left them back a year even though they HAD PASSED THE COMLEX at this point and then let them back in the school even though they made up new rules in the end anyway. It's absolutely absurd.

I privately responded to you with a list of people in both classes who were given the rights to do the core rotations elsewhere.

Now are you wronged because they told you manhattan was a lock. Sure. I agree. You were mislead. If being in manhattan and manhattan alone was your only reason for coming here then I am extremely sorry for this happening to you, but maybe you should have weighed more things into your selection. But there comes a time to let that one point of anger go and realize that, without that filter of being mislead there, the rotation sites actually look REALLY nice compared to what others have to deal with. Am I almost always on the cheery side of things? Yes. But this is a very fair summary of things this time I think.
 
I don't think anyone has discouraged you from commenting. I encourage input. It helps people make a decision about coming to Touro.

It was in reference to sss349 a couple of posts back who had written:

"I would appreciate it if questions about rotations were answered by 2nd or 3rd years - since clearly the 1st years have been living in this bubble of dreams."

In reference to your other post about the auditing policy, yes, I've only recently become aware of it through some friends who are now going to have to repeat first year or be expelled entirely because they failed too many classes. I wasn't aware of ANY expulsion policy, and assumed that because of 2011 data that said people had failed 4+ classes and still went on to take the boards, that there simply wasn't any expulsion policy. Didn't hear about the COMLEX rule. It doesn't make sense to me that they'd make that rule based on one year's data that showed the earlier they took it, the better they did. Then again, it's Lenihan... Why am I not surprised?

I'm conflicted about the expulsion policy because I believe that they should have made it clear to the class instead of springing it on them. But I also see where the administration is coming from and having to show better numbers that they weren't getting from people they were allowing to move on to the next year despite failing too many classes.

The COMLEX rule I think can be changed. I'm not sure why they have to be left behind a year for failing the early date. They can just take a retake a few months later on, right? Or is that only for the USMLE?
 
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