U of Colorado vs U of Michigan

[PersianCzar]

Hi! I hope everyone is receiving some sort of good news at this point in the game.

After a few attempts at this, I got what I wanted. I have been looking at these two schools for 2 weeks trying to figure out the best option for me. I got my pros and cons list, and it's an equalizer in a way!! So I want to see what you guys can come up with.

So with all due respect to both schools, what would be the best option if you had to pick?

The questions I have that I haven't been able to answer are:

1- Which school better prepares students in clinicals? Better patient pool?
2- When did Colorado double class size from 40 to 80, and have they transitioned smoothly to equip the new class size?
3- How are the facilities in U of M? It didn't look as new as UC but nevertheless, very nice!

Thanks in advance and I hope you all get what you worked so hard for.

PZ

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[cacajuate]

pretty sure all that matters is the weather in Colorado. Easy choice.

 

[SXCoronado]

.

 

[xerxes106]

Here's my two cents living in CO and working at the medical campus:

+Amazing weather, outdoors, food, breweries in Denver, light rail stations open at the medical campus in 2 years.
-Really expensive COL right now, Anschutz campus is in a bad part of town, bad drivers all of a sudden, expensive parking in the likely event you have to commute

 

[6049]

While I cannot compare between the two schools, I can provide you with some information about Umich that might be helpful. In terms of clinical prep, you're in clinic and you see your fist patient (Prophy) after 1 year (summer of D2). In the fall of that year, you get a couple of restorations that you get to do. By winter, you have ~5 patients that you're treating. By time you enter D3 year, you have a 40 or so patients that you treat. D4 around 60. You get to do a ton of composites, ton of Prost ( crowns, dentures, etc), lots of scaling and cleanings.. Endo is kind of hard to get your hands on, but nothing to be concerned about. Overall, I think they do a pretty a good job preparing you for clinic.. clinics are pretty old... but huge renovations are in the works. There's talk about a $120 million renovation of the whole school. Downside is that you'd have to deal with that, if it's during your time there.

 

[PersianCzar]

Here's my two cents living in CO and working at the medical campus:

+Amazing weather, outdoors, food, breweries in Denver, light rail stations open at the medical campus in 2 years.
-Really expensive COL right now, Anschutz campus is in a bad part of town, bad drivers all of a sudden, expensive parking in the likely event you have to commute

Right on!! Thank you for a good answer. Just out of curiosity, how much is parking if I may ask? And also, are there good places to live in by the campus at least? Seems like a couple new high rise apartments in the area are the way to go. Not sure of the name but it's a 10 minute walk to the school I believe and they come furnished.

 

[xerxes106]

Right on!! Thank you for a good answer. Just out of curiosity, how much is parking if I may ask? And also, are there good places to live in by the campus at least? Seems like a couple new high rise apartments in the area are the way to go. Not sure of the name but it's a 10 minute walk to the school I believe and they come furnished.

Parking for me is 70 bucks a month. I remember being told that student passes are only good for after hours and weekends, which makes it a huge pain. The apartments on campus are really nice, but the price reflects that, they're comparable to price ranges in the downtown areas but you have a lot of competition when school is in session because of so many students wanting close living. The area around campus is just.....ehhhhh....not good.

 

[PersianCzar]

While I cannot compare between the two schools, I can provide you with some information about Umich that might be helpful. In terms of clinical prep, you're in clinic and you see your fist patient (Prophy) after 1 year (summer of D2). In the fall of that year, you get a couple of restorations that you get to do. By winter, you have ~5 patients that you're treating. By time you enter D3 year, you have a 40 or so patients that you treat. D4 around 60. You get to do a ton of composites, ton of Prost ( crowns, dentures, etc), lots of scaling and cleanings.. Endo is kind of hard to get your hands on, but nothing to be concerned about. Overall, I think they do a pretty a good job preparing you for clinic.. clinics are pretty old... but huge renovations are in the works. There's talk about a $120 million renovation of the whole school. Downside is that you'd have to deal with that, if it's during your time there.

Thank you for a great response. I have heard nothing but good things for U of M, but the weather is what is holding me back, Haha.

More importantly, I want to stay in the southwest because if I go to U of M and return home, I may lose my network of friends quicker than maybe staying in the southwest from the beginning (Colorado being closer to home). Is that wrong of me to think that? But either way, both schools are out of state.

 

[PersianCzar]

Parking for me is 70 bucks a month. I remember being told that student passes are only good for after hours and weekends, which makes it a huge pain. The apartments on campus are really nice, but the price reflects that, they're comparable to price ranges in the downtown areas but you have a lot of competition when school is in session because of so many students wanting close living. The area around campus is just.....ehhhhh....not good.

Are there enough chairs in clinic to accommodate every student? I heard of that and that there are low faculty to student ratio so procedures take awhile. I didn't recall this myself but I read it somewhere here. Can you clarify this for me?

Thanks

 

[PersianCzar]

So lets bring in the money factor....

Do I go to U of M and save $37k in tuition over UC, or choose UC because there is a CHANCE I may get the WICHE scholarship, allowing me to save $100k? So then that would make UC $67k cheaper than U of M. It's not a guarantee but I did get the call on Dec 1st so I think I may just get it. But if I don't, I don't want to know I passed up on a great program like U of M.

Once again, what would you do? These figures don't include Cost of Living.

 

[6049]

So lets bring in the money factor....

Do I go to U of M and save $37k in tuition over UC, or choose UC because there is a CHANCE I may get the WICHE scholarship, allowing me to save $100k? So then that would make UC $67k cheaper than U of M. It's not a guarantee but I did get the call on Dec 1st so I think I may just get it. But if I don't, I don't want to know I passed up on a great program like U of M.

Once again, what would you do? These figures don't include Cost of Living.

I think this is one of the very few reasons where it might be a good idea to invest in putting two deposits down, as the potential savings in all outcomes outweighs the total investment in deposit money.

 

[ThatsMyFlossify]

I didn't read what anyone else said, but after having lived in CO for many years and having done my undergrad at CU, I have a few thoughts.

1- Location wise, Colorado is the best place to live in the United States. You can't go wrong.
2- CU Denver has fantastic dental facilities and I'm sure they are great at what they do.
3- While Coloradans generally have a fantastic demeanor, CU students and faculty ride the highest horses I've ever seen (pun intended). During my undergrad, I had it up to HERE with their attitude. They honest to goodness are snobby as all get out. Granted, this was at the undergraduate level (and in Boulder), but I felt that very "we are untouchable and unapproachable" feel every time I interacted with the dental process, as well.

Just my thoughts, but that's after having dealt with them for 4+ years. Coming in fresh, I think anyone would really enjoy it.

 

[xerxes106]

I didn't read what anyone else said, but after having lived in CO for many years and having done my undergrad at CU, I have a few thoughts.

1- Location wise, Colorado is the best place to live in the United States. You can't go wrong.
2- CU Denver has fantastic dental facilities and I'm sure they are great at what they do.
3- While Coloradans generally have a fantastic demeanor, CU students and faculty ride the highest horses I've ever seen (pun intended). During my undergrad, I had it up to HERE with their attitude. They honest to goodness are snobby as all get out. Granted, this was at the undergraduate level (and in Boulder), but I felt that very "we are untouchable and unapproachable" feel every time I interacted with the dental process, as well.

Just my thoughts, but that's after having dealt with them for 4+ years. Coming in fresh, I think anyone would really enjoy it.

Number 3 is perfect. 90 percent of CU Boulder students fit that description.

 

[mgatorc]

Hello,

Hi! I hope everyone is receiving some sort of good news at this point in the game.

After a few attempts at this, I got what I wanted. I have been looking at these two schools for 2 weeks trying to figure out the best option for me. I got my pros and cons list, and it's an equalizer in a way!! So I want to see what you guys can come up with.

So with all due respect to both schools, what would be the best option if you had to pick?

The questions I have that I haven't been able to answer are:

1- Which school better prepares students in clinicals? Better patient pool?
2- When did Colorado double class size from 40 to 80, and have they transitioned smoothly to equip the new class size?
3- How are the facilities in U of M? It didn't look as new as UC but nevertheless, very nice!

Thanks in advance and I hope you all get what you worked so hard for.

PZ

Hello,

I'm a current first year at CU and after skimming through the other posts, I felt I needed to comment as well as some of the information you received is incomplete.

First off, the parking does not need to be expensive. You can pay $10, $36 or $70/month depending on the lot proximity. I personally pay $10 for the "rock lot," which is only a 10 minute walk to most of my classrooms. It's basically right next to the Fitz apartments.

Speaking of apartments, many of my classmates live at Fitz because of its walking distance to campus, but I personally feel it's overpriced (maybe except for the smallest 3/3 that they offer). I currently live with 2 second years in a house 10 minutes east of campus. It's all right. I wish I had known more about the area before moving in, but as an OOS from Florida, I just went with the campus proximity/price. Next year, I'm considering moving to Park Hill or Lowry areas, which are not too too far of a commute (10-20 min.) and having friends who live there now, I feel it's ideal if you want to live in between Denver and campus.

Overall, I've loved my experience at CU so far. It's been challenging at times, but if you manage your time well, you'll have enough time to enjoy the outdoors and the amazing weather out here.

Good luck making your decision!

Let me know if you have any other questions!

 

[PersianCzar]

Hello,


Hello,

I'm a current first year at CU and after skimming through the other posts, I felt I needed to comment as well as some of the information you received is incomplete.

First off, the parking does not need to be expensive. You can pay $10, $36 or $70/month depending on the lot proximity. I personally pay $10 for the "rock lot," which is only a 10 minute walk to most of my classrooms. It's basically right next to the Fitz apartments.

Speaking of apartments, many of my classmates live at Fitz because of its walking distance to campus, but I personally feel it's overpriced (maybe except for the smallest 3/3 that they offer). I currently live with 2 second years in a house 10 minutes east of campus. It's all right. I wish I had known more about the area before moving in, but as an OOS from Florida, I just went with the campus proximity/price. Next year, I'm considering moving to Park Hill or Lowry areas, which are not too too far of a commute (10-20 min.) and having friends who live there now, I feel it's ideal if you want to live in between Denver and campus.

Overall, I've loved my experience at CU so far. It's been challenging at times, but if you manage your time well, you'll have enough time to enjoy the outdoors and the amazing weather out here.

Good luck making your decision!

Let me know if you have any other questions!

Sweet!! Thank you so much for your feedback. It is greatly appreciated.

Would you happen to know the competencies that have to be met in clinic as far as how many extractions, endo's, implants, cleanings, etc. have to be done in the D3-D4 year?

I have been thinking real hard and figure maybe UofM having so many specialties, might be a detriment if I want to just be in GP, no? Assuming because most complex cases truly go to the specialists. And I want that exposure more in the DDS program. Is it wrong of me to think like this?

CU has only Perio that would affect my patient pool in D4. And the students in GPR (? Students) & ISP (40 students).

UofM has ISP (10 students), OMFS, Endo, Perio, Pros, GPR, Pedo, and I'm afraid this could take away from my D4 year.

 

[PersianCzar]

While I cannot compare between the two schools, I can provide you with some information about Umich that might be helpful. In terms of clinical prep, you're in clinic and you see your fist patient (Prophy) after 1 year (summer of D2). In the fall of that year, you get a couple of restorations that you get to do. By winter, you have ~5 patients that you're treating. By time you enter D3 year, you have a 40 or so patients that you treat. D4 around 60. You get to do a ton of composites, ton of Prost ( crowns, dentures, etc), lots of scaling and cleanings.. Endo is kind of hard to get your hands on, but nothing to be concerned about. Overall, I think they do a pretty a good job preparing you for clinic.. clinics are pretty old... but huge renovations are in the works. There's talk about a $120 million renovation of the whole school. Downside is that you'd have to deal with that, if it's during your time there.

So do I have to camp out in the clinic my D4 year for endo cases? What about surgical extractions, crowns (PFM and/or Cerec), and implants?

Do you feel UofM having many specialties takes away from the DDS clinical experience? I know their program is amazing regardless, but that would be a great fact to know since I need to know what fits me the best.

Thanks again.

 

[6049]

So do I have to camp out in the clinic my D4 year for endo cases? What about surgical extractions, crowns (PFM and/or Cerec), and implants?

Do you feel UofM having many specialties takes away from the DDS clinical experience? I know their program is amazing regardless, but that would be a great fact to know since I need to know what fits me the best.

Thanks again.

Not really, no... It honestly all depends on your luck... If you're lucky, you can get 3-4 roots done before you even enter your D4 year... It just depends on the patients that you get and what they need done. which is how it is anywhere that you decide to go. However D4's get all of the molar endo cases as D2 and D3's are not allowed to do those.
Same goes for surgical extractions... It really depends on what your patient needs. And once you've done your OS rotation, you can do most extractions. Now for crowns, there are more than plenty to go around. You'll do a ton of PFM, a few Gold and Ceramic. We have a Cerec machine if that's the route that your patient wants to go with. As for implants, you dont get to place any implants yourself ( you can assist in either OS or Perio, if you want)... But you do get to restore implants and i'd say you get a good handful of casses.

The grad program is quite busy as it is, and so the only cases that get referred to them are the cases that you wont be able to do or want to do anyways.. It's not like they're going to send the most simple stuff to grad because they need to..

There's a lot of luck to go with how much you're exposed to regardless of where you go, here they see a lot of well off older generation patients, hence why they do so many crowns.

 

[PersianCzar]

Not really, no... It honestly all depends on your luck... If you're lucky, you can get 3-4 roots done before you even enter your D4 year... It just depends on the patients that you get and what they need done. which is how it is anywhere that you decide to go. However D4's get all of the molar endo cases as D2 and D3's are not allowed to do those.
Same goes for surgical extractions... It really depends on what your patient needs. And once you've done your OS rotation, you can do most extractions. Now for crowns, there are more than plenty to go around. You'll do a ton of PFM, a few Gold and Ceramic. We have a Cerec machine if that's the route that your patient wants to go with. As for implants, you dont get to place any implants yourself ( you can assist in either OS or Perio, if you want)... But you do get to restore implants and i'd say you get a good handful of casses.

The grad program is quite busy as it is, and so the only cases that get referred to them are the cases that you wont be able to do or want to do anyways.. It's not like they're going to send the most simple stuff to grad because they need to..

There's a lot of luck to go with how much you're exposed to regardless of where you go, here they see a lot of well off older generation patients, hence why they do so many crowns.

Thanks again for your help. Clearly a well put program. I agree that it is all about luck. I would never step on my colleagues toes but I would always prefer to have the complex case.

Slightly off topic, do you believe the cheaper price on tuition for dental school is KING when determining which school to pick? I hate to say it but the bottom line (financial security) is one of the many factors we are in this line of profession in the first place.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Years! And Happy Holidays if you don't celebrate. Got to cover all your bases these days!!

 

[6049]

Thanks again for your help. Clearly a well put program. I agree that it is all about luck. I would never step on my colleagues toes but I would always prefer to have the complex case.

Slightly off topic, do you believe the cheaper price on tuition for dental school is KING when determining which school to pick? I hate to say it but the bottom line (financial security) is one of the many factors we are in this line of profession in the first place.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Years! And Happy Holidays if you don't celebrate. Got to cover all your bases these days!!

Thank you, Merry Christmas and happy New Year to you as well! I wouldn't that tuition is KING, because regardless of where you go, you will be finically secure.. There are probably more than 1000 students that will graduate dental school from a 350-400K Dental school each year.. They're not going to be bankrupt, that's for sure... With that said of course, you need to take into account the difference in tuition. I would say anything more than 30-50K for the 4 years is a significant difference, and unless it's between a school that is not fully accredited vs one that is, then it's not worth that much more.. That's just my opinion..

 

[mgatorc]

Sweet!! Thank you so much for your feedback. It is greatly appreciated.

Would you happen to know the competencies that have to be met in clinic as far as how many extractions, endo's, implants, cleanings, etc. have to be done in the D3-D4 year?

I have been thinking real hard and figure maybe UofM having so many specialties, might be a detriment if I want to just be in GP, no? Assuming because most complex cases truly go to the specialists. And I want that exposure more in the DDS program. Is it wrong of me to think like this?

CU has only Perio that would affect my patient pool in D4. And the students in GPR (? Students) & ISP (40 students).

UofM has ISP (10 students), OMFS, Endo, Perio, Pros, GPR, Pedo, and I'm afraid this could take away from my D4 year.

Sorry for the late reply. As far as the competencies go, I don't know the exact numbers, but if you'd like I could put you in touch with a current third or fourth year so you can talk to them directly about the clinics. Not sure where you've heard CU has only perio because it has other specialties as well such as GPR, ortho, OMFS and pretty sure pediatrics. They do not take many residents though so maybe that's why not a lot of them have heard of them (I think the OMFS program takes only 1). As far as whether it takes away from your clinic experience, I don't think so, but then again, you'd be better off asking an upperclassman.

I also saw your post about the tuition being the determining factor in choosing between schools. Personally, I agree with 6049 above. I was between my state school (UF) and CU and even though UF's tuition would've been slightly lower (~$10k), I still went with CU as I wanted to experience a new environment and thought it was worth the difference. However, I don't think I would've made the same choice if my state tuition was significantly lower.

 

[futuredoc2019dds]

Sorry for the late reply. As far as the competencies go, I don't know the exact numbers, but if you'd like I could put you in touch with a current third or fourth year so you can talk to them directly about the clinics. Not sure where you've heard CU has only perio because it has other specialties as well such as GPR, ortho, OMFS and pretty sure pediatrics. They do not take many residents though so maybe that's why not a lot of them have heard of them (I think the OMFS program takes only 1). As far as whether it takes away from your clinic experience, I don't think so, but then again, you'd be better off asking an upperclassman.

I also saw your post about the tuition being the determining factor in choosing between schools. Personally, I agree with 6049 above. I was between my state school (UF) and CU and even though UF's tuition would've been slightly lower (~$10k), I still went with CU as I wanted to experience a new environment and thought it was worth the difference. However, I don't think I would've made the same choice if my state tuition was significantly lower.

I don't know where you got your information from but they do not have an OMFS and pediatrics residency at the CU Dental School…there's an OMFS program at Denver Health (not on the campus but in the Denver area) and a pediatrics program at Children's Hospital, which is located on the campus but it's not affiliated with the Dental School.

Because these residency programs aren't affiliated with the Dental School, cases aren't always taken away from students but it still occurs because they have the GPR program. However, I can speak from experience that not all cases get deferred away from dental students because I had a friend that visited the clinic with 2nd molar endo needing to be done and a dental student did it for them rather than the GPR residents. If the GPR residents at schools took all the hard cases, there will be a very long wait for patients to be seen which is why dental students still get to see these cases.