University of Florida?

[psych7711]

Any interview input from florida this year???

does anyone know if they filled all their spots last year (after they forgot to certify the list)?

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[golfpropsychguy]

Did u interview there?

 

[golfpropsychguy]

They finished ther iv's so I don't know if it will help.

 

[GatorMedMan]

Yes, they filled last March. Things could have ended up much worse. They ended up getting a few transfers and two applicants who would have matched at UF who were able to get out of their contracts at their matched programs. But the class definitely doesn't have the strength of previous years' classes. Luckily though, since UF has their outpt year during PGY2, the applicants who match there this year won't have to worry about working with them during their inpt psych months. Instead they will be working with the PGY3's who are supposedly one of the strongest classes UF has had in years.

 

[golfpropsychguy]

Yes, they filled last March. Things could have ended up much worse. They ended up getting a few transfers and two applicants who would have matched at UF who were able to get out of their contracts at their matched programs. But the class definitely doesn't have the strength of previous years' classes. Luckily though, since UF has their outpt year during PGY2, the applicants who match there this year won't have to worry about working with them during their inpt psych months. Instead they will be working with the PGY3's who are supposedly one of the strongest classes UF has had in years.

So are you saying that the current pgy 1 class is weak due to what happened with the match?

 

[GatorMedMan]

So are you saying that the current pgy 1 class is weak due to what happened with the match?

(Rolls eyes) Uh...Yes, by saying they're "not strong," I mean they're "weak." I've worked with some of them and also heard this from some attendings, psych residents, and non-psych residents who have worked with them. Plus the fact that there are more FMG's than previous years. Like I said, some spots were filled with transfers, but the rest were filled from the scramble. And think about the quality of an applicant who can't match into one of, if not the, least competive specialty out there.

 

[Faebinder]

(Rolls eyes) Uh...Yes, by saying their "not strong," I mean their "weak." I've worked with some of them and also heard this from some attendings, psych residents, and non-psych residents who have worked with them. Plus the fact that there are more FMG's than previous years. Like I said, some spots were filled with transfers, but the rest were filled from the scramble. And think about the quality of an applicant who can't match into one of, if not the, least competive specialty out there.

UF is an ancient evil ivory tower. Still you could do worse in my opinion.

 

[golfpropsychguy]

(Rolls eyes) Uh...Yes, by saying their "not strong," I mean their "weak." I've worked with some of them and also heard this from some attendings, psych residents, and non-psych residents who have worked with them. Plus the fact that there are more FMG's than previous years. Like I said, some spots were filled with transfers, but the rest were filled from the scramble. And think about the quality of an applicant who can't match into one of, if not the, least competive specialty out there.

Interesting opinion. I Guess I just look at it a different way. Good luck to you finding a program that is IMG/FMG free. It seems thats where you want to be.

 

[GatorMedMan]

Interesting opinion. I Guess I just look at it a different way. Good luck to you finding a program that is IMG/FMG free. It seems thats where you want to be.

Yes and no. I break foreign grads down into three types:

1) Non-American born who completed med school back home and who have a very good (not just good) grasp of the English language.

2) The same as above but without the English language skills.

3) The Grenada, West Indies, D.R., St. George, etc. students that couldn't get into a US school.

#'s 2 and 3 are what I'm trying to avoid and the ones that I'm referring to in the UF case.

Sorry to get off topic. Getting back on....But with all that aside, I would still rank UF quite highly if it wasn't in Gainesville. Approachable attendings, very social residents, psych opportunities galore if you seek them out, lots of moonlighting (some from home), easy call (often from home), etc. Plus like I said before, PGY1's work w/ PGY3's so it's not really an issue for the incoming class except the whole reputation thing that the program now has for not certifying it's rank list. But that shouldn't be a big deal for most I would hope.

 

[golfpropsychguy]

Yes and no. I break foreign grads down into three types:

1) Non-American born who completed med school back home and who have a very good (not just good) grasp of the English language.

2) The same as above but without the English language skills.

3) The Grenada, West Indies, D.R., St. George, etc. students that couldn't get into a US school.

#'s 2 and 3 are what I'm trying to avoid and the ones that I'm referring to in the UF case.

Sorry to get off topic. Getting back on....But with all that aside, I would still rank UF quite highly if it wasn't in Gainesville. Approachable attendings, very social residents, psych opportunities galore if you seek them out, lots of moonlighting (some from home), easy call (often from home), etc. Plus like I said before, PGY1's work w/ PGY3's so it's not really an issue for the incoming class except the whole reputation thing that the program now has for not certifying it's rank list. But that shouldn't be a big deal for most I would hope.

Thanks. I appreciate your reply. You mentioned " I would still rank UF quite highly if it wasn't in Gainesville." what is it about Gainesville that would deter you from ranking UF highly?

 

[mgdsh]

Yes and no. I break foreign grads down into three types:

1) Non-American born who completed med school back home and who have a very good (not just good) grasp of the English language.

2) The same as above but without the English language skills.

3) The Grenada, West Indies, D.R., St. George, etc. students that couldn't get into a US school.

#'s 2 and 3 are what I'm trying to avoid and the ones that I'm referring to in the UF case.

Sorry to get off topic. Getting back on....But with all that aside, I would still rank UF quite highly if it wasn't in Gainesville. Approachable attendings, very social residents, psych opportunities galore if you seek them out, lots of moonlighting (some from home), easy call (often from home), etc. Plus like I said before, PGY1's work w/ PGY3's so it's not really an issue for the incoming class except the whole reputation thing that the program now has for not certifying it's rank list. But that shouldn't be a big deal for most I would hope.

You sound like a complete elitist pr!ck.

 

[GatorMedMan]

Thanks. I appreciate your reply. You mentioned " I would still rank UF quite highly if it wasn't in Gainesville." what is it about Gainesville that would deter you from ranking UF highly?

Just personal reasons. Went here for undergrad and had a blast. But now being older I'm looking for a bit more than a college town. It is a great family town if that's what you're looking for. But for that 25-40 age range it's definitely lacking.

You sound like a complete elitist pr!ck.

Ah, how sweet. So do you fall into the #2 or #3 category. Forgive me for not wanting to be in a class of interns where:

There's worry about some of them passing Step 3,
One was banned from speaking his/her native language so he/she could learn to speak English better,
One was fired and the others had to pick up the slack,
The other services like internal medicine don't consider them competent and only give them two patients.

All this happened this year at UF.


Haha, maybe I'm just bitter because I just finished blowing $1000 and driving to Atlanta to take some test that most US med students could pass after a month of third year.

 

[golfpropsychguy]

Just personal reasons. Went here for undergrad and had a blast. But now being older I'm looking for a bit more than a college town. It is a great family town if that's what you're looking for. But for that 25-40 age range it's definitely lacking.




Ah, how sweet. So do you fall into the #2 or #3 category. Forgive me for not wanting to be in a class of interns where:

There's worry about some of them passing Step 3,
One was banned from speaking his/her native language so he/she could learn to speak English better,
One was fired and the others had to pick up the slack,
The other services like internal medicine don't consider them competent and only give them two patients.

All this happened this year at UF.


Haha, maybe I'm just bitter because I just finished blowing $1000 and driving to Atlanta to take some test that most US med students could pass after a month of third year.

I can't believe that this was the fallout to what happened with the match last year. Can you mention why the the intern was fired. It seems that they must have been pretty desperate to find people to fill up the spots.

Do you know exactly what happened and why they didnt certify there list last year. I heard it was actually another dept. outside of psychiatry that dropped the ball.

 

[Faebinder]

I can't believe that this was the fallout to what happened with the match last year. Can you mention why the the intern was fired. It seems that they must have been pretty desperate to find people to fill up the spots.

Do you know exactly what happened and why they didnt certify there list last year. I heard it was actually another dept. outside of psychiatry that dropped the ball.

No program is desperate in all honesty. They probably looked for all the wrong attributes in their applicants while trying to fill. Being an ivory tower does place many prejudice on the selection process, which if done too quickly ends up selecting some non-fitting applicants.

It seems that people dont want to accept that they could have simply forgotten? It's kinda funny.. There are worse things to forget out there.

 

[mgdsh]

Ah, how sweet. So do you fall into the #2 or #3 category. Forgive me for not wanting to be in a class of interns where:

There's worry about some of them passing Step 3,
One was banned from speaking his/her native language so he/she could learn to speak English better,
One was fired and the others had to pick up the slack,
The other services like internal medicine don't consider them competent and only give them two patients.

All this happened this year at UF.


Haha, maybe I'm just bitter because I just finished blowing $1000 and driving to Atlanta to take some test that most US med students could pass after a month of third year.

And what does that say about you, ending up alongside those that you detest oh so much?

For the record, I don't fall into either of your stereotypical categories.

It's awesome how you make assumptions that AMGs never get kicked out of programs or fail their Step 3.

If you think about it for a second, those that you group into #2 and #3 (and even #1) have taken a far longer and more difficult road to end up exactly where you did. I'm not saying they are all good people/residents, but to assume they are all terrible residents is nothing more than prejudice.

My issue isn't with the fact that you'd rather not end up in a program where you'd have to pick up slack for a resident that's fired, or fails their step 3. My issue is with the fact that you stereotype such a large portion of the residents / doctors in the US.

 

[golfpropsychguy]

And what does that say about you, ending up alongside those that you detest oh so much?

For the record, I don't fall into either of your stereotypical categories.

It's awesome how you make assumptions that AMGs never get kicked out of programs or fail their Step 3.

If you think about it for a second, those that you group into #2 and #3 (and even #1) have taken a far longer and more difficult road to end up exactly where you did. I'm not saying they are all good people/residents, but to assume they are all terrible residents is nothing more than prejudice.

My issue isn't with the fact that you'd rather not end up in a program where you'd have to pick up slack for a resident that's fired, or fails their step 3. My issue is with the fact that you stereotype such a large portion of the residents / doctors in the US.

So I take it that UF is not all that popular this year for the match. How long do you think it is going to take for them to build things back up to where it is a competitive program?

 

[GatorMedMan]

Here goes one long post. Asking forgiveness in advance for taking mgdsh's bait. I'll to reply to everyone's questions and insults/name calling. Let me know if I forget anything or if you have any other ?'s. Thanks.

I can't believe that this was the fallout to what happened with the match last year. Can you mention why the the intern was fired. It seems that they must have been pretty desperate to find people to fill up the spots.

One intern was fired in January. Please keep in mind I'm just a lowly MS4, so I'm pretty sure I don't know everything that happened. But problems with the intern included: Not showing up for morning rounds on numerous occasions, not ordering labs then saying he/she did, and refusing to invol commit a patient after directly being told to do so by the attending.

Do you know exactly what happened and why they didnt certify there list last year. I heard it was actually another dept. outside of psychiatry that dropped the ball.

Not really sure. One department says one thing, others say another. So I don't want to speculate. There's so many people that could have screwed up: The PD's secretary, the PD, the chair, the dean of GME. They all have their hands on the rank list at some point in time. But it did happen. At least you know it will never happen again at UF. Just think about how the oversight in the psych dept will be this year.

No program is desperate in all honesty. They probably looked for all the wrong attributes in their applicants while trying to fill.

But remember, the were initially scrambling for ALL their positions. I remember one attending on the selection committee saying they had to through out half (he was probably exaggerating about the number) of the scramble applications because they could barely understand their personal statements. So I don't think it was a matter of looking for the wrong attributes, but just trying to find some good attributes (like English) in the leftover applicants who were scrambling.

Being an ivory tower....

Ivory tower is quite a buzz word for you. What does it mean? I assume it's similar to "ivy league" and that type of environment or mentality. If so, I really don't get that feeling around here, with the exception of the newly appointed chairman. Just my opinion though. Please enlighten me, do you have some experience or exposure to UF psych? I see you're located in FL. You seem to have some kind of beef with them. I'm sure the current applicants considering UF would like your input. Thanks.

It seems that people dont want to accept that they could have simply forgotten? It's kinda funny.. There are worse things to forget out there.

Agreed. Some seem to want to make it out to be some conspiracy or something done on purpose. Though when you say "cool" I hope you are referring to these people's thoughts and not the fact that this mistake happened. That would be very "uncool," seeing how many applicants got royally screwed. In theory, it could have screwed up the whole psych match and if you take couple's matching into account, the match in other specialties also. Again, just in theory.

And what does that say about you, ending up alongside those that you detest oh so much?

First, I thank you from refraining from calling me a "prick" this time. Second, be careful putting words in other's mouths. I never said detested. I hope you don't do this when presenting a patient on rounds. Third, huh?? "ending up alongside." My apologies, I'm confused. Perhaps you are referring to something else. Seeing that I'm still a medical student, I don't really know where I've "ended up" yet. Do you know? Can you please tell me? I'd love to go ahead and start house-hunting?

For the record, I don't fall into either of your stereotypical categories..

Just a joke. But was it a different mgdsh who started a thread on 8/1/07 called "A recent grads chances for 08" which included the text

I'm a recent grad of a carib school who applied last year but marginally failed his Step 2 CS.

I'm sure this person would probably be upset about my previous CS comment also. Oops.

It's awesome how you make assumptions that AMGs never get kicked out of programs or fail their Step 3.

Again putting words in my mouth. I never assumed anything like that. I just stated this program's worries about SOME of it's interns. For your information, the intern that was fired was an AMG. Besides don't foreign grads have to take step 3 before starting residency? I'm not sure where I'm getting that from. Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'm sure you'll be happy to.

...to assume they are all terrible residents is nothing more than prejudice.

Again never said that. But there's always at least some truth to stereotypes and generalizations. Everyone uses them to some extent. Everyday occurrences and thoughts would take too long not to.

If you think about it for a second, those that you group into #2 and #3 (and even #1) have taken a far longer and more difficult road to end up exactly where you did.

Agreed. Though I'm not exactly sure how you are familiar with the "road" that I have taken. Sounds kinda like you're stereotyping me.

So I take it that UF is not all that popular this year for the match. How long do you think it is going to take for them to build things back up to where it is a competitive program?

Can't speak for it's popularity nation wide. I can stay that about half of the MS4's going into psych want to stay. And like I said previously, I would have no problem staying if UF wasn't in G'ville. Not really sure how much the program was damaged from last year's blunder, it's really just a reputation thing. But reputation is important in recruiting new applicants, so I'm sure some harm was done that will take some time to fix. Overall, I do think that UF is getting better and not worse. There's a new PD coming in who I, and most attendings, are very happy about. A few of the residents are concerned, probably mainly because they really like the current PD and it's kind of the "fear of the unknown" to them. He'll probably make them work a little bit harder to, which I think is a good thing. I always thought UF didn't push it's residents enough. There's tons of learning and research opportunities at UF, but most residents don't seem to seek out that which is not required of them.

Holy crap, did I really type that much. Probably more than all my other posts combined. Sorry 'bout that. Sorry about the pissing contest also.

 

[golfpropsychguy]

"

 

[golfpropsychguy]

Can't speak for it's popularity nation wide. I can stay that about half of the MS4's going into psych want to stay. quote]

How many of you guys are going into psych?

 

[GatorMedMan]

How many of you guys are going into psych?

6 total going into psych: 2 who definitely are staying, 1 who was giving it good consideration last I heard (which was a month or two ago though), 1 who I have no idea about and 2 who want to leave

 

[mgdsh]

First, I thank you from refraining from calling me a "prick" this time. Second, be careful putting words in other's mouths. I never said detested. I hope you don't do this when presenting a patient on rounds. Third, huh?? "ending up alongside." My apologies, I'm confused. Perhaps you are referring to something else. Seeing that I'm still a medical student, I don't really know where I've "ended up" yet. Do you know? Can you please tell me? I'd love to go ahead and start house-hunting?

Let's recap:

Yes and no. I break foreign grads down into three types:

1) Non-American born who completed med school back home and who have a very good (not just good) grasp of the English language.

2) The same as above but without the English language skills.

3) The Grenada, West Indies, D.R., St. George, etc. students that couldn't get into a US school.

#'s 2 and 3 are what I'm trying to avoid and the ones that I'm referring to in the UF case.

Haha, maybe I'm just bitter because I just finished blowing $1000 and driving to Atlanta to take some test that most US med students could pass after a month of third year.

Ah, how sweet. So do you fall into the #2 or #3 category. Forgive me for not wanting to be in a class of interns where:

There's worry about some of them passing Step 3,
One was banned from speaking his/her native language so he/she could learn to speak English better,
One was fired and the others had to pick up the slack,
The other services like internal medicine don't consider them competent and only give them two patients.

All this happened this year at UF.

Well you obviously don't think very highly of them. There's really no other way to take what you've stated. Maybe detest was too harsh of a word, but somehow you've still stereotyped all FMGs/IMGs into 3 broad categories. Two of which you know you are "trying to avoid," and one you list next to no reason, other than you think they didn't get into a US school.

You fail to realize that not everyone applied to US schools (me), and there are plenty of discrepancies of candidate quality among states. Some states have far fewer medical school acceptance spots per capita than others, and as I'm sure you've heard, getting into a school outside your state of residence isn't exactly easy either. Plenty of my friends fall in the latter category.

Beyond that, there are other reasons that people don't get into US medical schools. Either they didn't realize they wanted to early enough, they didn't want to wait and apply, they had difficulties in their personal/family lives during undergrad, they weren't mature enough to work hard enough at the time, etc etc.

But even then, what does it matter? Does it make someone a better doctor because they went to a US medical school? Surely you're kidding if you say yes.

Maybe one day you'll realize it doesn't really matter where you went to school, but the person you are and how you interact with your patients and colleagues.

And whether you'd like to acknowledge it or not, even though you are a med student, you are training at the same university they are in the specialty you'd like to end up in: you basically did end up along side "them."

Just a joke. But was it a different mgdsh who started a thread on 8/1/07 called "A recent grads chances for 08" which included the text I'm sure this person would probably be upset about my previous CS comment also. Oops.

I personally don't care about your CS comment. I think the CS is a waste of time/money too. Most people taking the exam would tell you that (irregardless of where you came from). IMO it's just another way for the medical board to extract more $$ from students along the way -- but you'd rather just blame FMGs. If that really was the case, in that the test was designed to weed out the #2s, how is it that there are so many #2s running around that you'd have to spend your precious time worrying about them?

You're right. I didn't pass my CS the first time I took it. To this day I still can't figure out why. It's a pretty subjective exam in which we never get to see exactly why. I took it the second time and did everything exactly the same as the first. Seems odd.

Maybe I didn't drape the patients properly the first time around? I really don't know. I do know I had a lot on my mind the first time around I took the exam (both of my remaining grandparents and both on the paternal side had passed away with in a week of each other in the few weeks leading up to the exam).

But aside from that, despite it being the only exam I've ever failed in my entire life, I can actually talk about and say I've learned from it as a very humbling experience.

Again putting words in my mouth. I never assumed anything like that. I just stated this program's worries about SOME of it's interns. For your information, the intern that was fired was an AMG. Besides don't foreign grads have to take step 3 before starting residency? I'm not sure where I'm getting that from. Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'm sure you'll be happy to.

I'm glad you finally mentioned that. Apparently AMGs could do no wrong in your opinion, and it was only US-IMGs and FMGs that caused all the problems at your program.

You do realize that at any program you go to, you maybe required to pick up the extra slack of a resident (again irregardless of where they came from) for any number of reasons (illness, pregnancy, burn out, wanting to relocate, etc).

Step 3 is not required before residency, but plenty of foreign grads do take the test and get it out of the way.

Again never said that. But there's always at least some truth to stereotypes and generalizations. Everyone uses them to some extent. Everyday occurrences and thoughts would take too long not to.

And the key here is to "some extent." In your previous posts you've basically used those stereotypes and generalizations to discriminate against 2 particular groups and basically infer that they were the root of all the problems at UF, yet now you've mentioned that one of the residents that was kicked out was an AMG. Hmmm.

All I'm saying is, it shouldn't matter where someone went to school. Whatever hurdles they've gone through, or haven't gone through... they've essentially made it to the exact same point you and I have. Besides, I really doubt most patients care.

 

[GatorMedMan]

So much to say.......So much to say......But this debate has nothing to do with the original topic of the thread, so I'll stop now. If anyone has any more questions about UF I'll be happy to answer them honestly as thoroughly as I can. If anyone wishes to call me a prick again, say I detests foreign grads,etc., feel free to PM me so neither of us wastes everyone else's time.

Faebinder, I would still like to hear your response though. Thanks.


Shutting up now.

 

[jcofey]

If anyone has any more questions about UF I'll be happy to answer them honestly as thoroughly as I can.

I have a couple of questions about the program and I would love to hear your input.

1. According to FREIDA they have 8 slots, but their quota on the NRMP website is 4. Did they prematch 4 people?

2. Do you know in what ways the new chairman and new PD may change the program?

3. Any idea what the balance between psychotherapy and psychopharmacology would be under the new leadership?

4. On average, how much does moonlighting pay per hour?

Thanks in advance for the help.

 

[golfpropsychguy]

I've heard that since everything had happened last year they made efforts to bring in new people and change the curriculum around. From what I've heard the next few years are going to be bumpy but that there efforts will eventually produce a stronger program.

 

[GatorMedMan]

I have a couple of questions about the program and I would love to hear your input.

1. According to FREIDA they have 8 slots, but their quota on the NRMP website is 4. Did they prematch 4 people?

2. Do you know in what ways the new chairman and new PD may change the program?

3. Any idea what the balance between psychotherapy and psychopharmacology would be under the new leadership?

4. On average, how much does moonlighting pay per hour?

Thanks in advance for the help.

1. Something like that. They are getting two from UF who are transferring from a different specialty (surg and im, i think). They're also accepting two PGY2 transfers (both former UF med students who got screwed last year because of the match blunder), so I think they're taking two of the new PGY1 spots (they use to have only 6) for these two residents. My first thought when I heard this was that interns would be taking much more call. But the incoming PGY2's will be required to take call with the interns, so the call frequency shouldn't change that much, if at all.

2. It's really surprising that Dr. Gold is the new chair, seeing that he always stated he didn't want the job when he was interim. But things change I guess. I can't speak for any big changes from him other than the ones he has already made. But I could be wrong. If you're really curious, I would consider emailing some of the residents to get their opinions. Personally, I really don't like the guy and many residents and younger attendings feel the same way. He's friendly, but extremely arrogant and loves to talk about himself, his books, all his drug discoveries & patents and how he was a doctor for many celebrities including the cast of SNL. He's a research guru, especially in the field of addiction (so if that's your thing, this would be a really good place to be). Overall, I don't think he will be that involved in the residency program, at least I hope not. He did cancel the residency applicant dinners which are usually the night before the interview because he thought they were a waste of money. I know the PD and assis-PD were fighting to get them back, but not sure of the outcome. Maybe someone here else who interviewed a bit later in the season can answer that. But it definitely shows the importance, or lack there of, he puts on the program. As far as the new PD goes, I definitely think he will be a good thing. I'll just refer to the reasons I typed earlier.

3. Nope, don't know. There's plenty of opportunity for additional psychotherapy and psychotherapy advisors though if you want them, so I'd say that the resident can kind of tailor the balance to his or her choosing. One MS4 here, who will be staying for residency, has even started psychotherapy on patients and has his own advisor. Funny, I'm trying to do as little as possible during fourth year.

4. It has changed (or will be changing soon) a little bit. But there will still be ample. I'm not sure of the exact hourly rate or if there even is one. At some sites it's more like base rate plus a certain amount for each admission. And just like call this can be done from home as long as you can get to the hospital within 20 minutes or so (Which in G'ville is no problem). Overall, residents can definitely rake it in, doubling their salaries if they really become moonlighting hoes. Months ago I ran into one who made just under 3k in one weekend. I posted the numbers in a bit more detail, but am to tired to find the old thread. Do a search by my username in the psych forums. I think the thread was called "resident salaries" or "moonlighting salaries." Hope this helps.

 

[golfpropsychguy]

Wow! Thank you so much for all of the feedback. It really seems like UF is going through a lot of change.

I read on there website that they only interview about 25-30 out of all the applications they get. Do you know if that's true?

How competitive do you think it will be this year with all that is going on in there program?

 

[GatorMedMan]

I read on there website that they only interview about 25-30 out of all the applications they get. Do you know if that's true?

How competitive do you think it will be this year with all that is going on in there program?

I can't remember how many interviews they do. Can't really tell you how competitive matching at UF will be this year either, that really just depends on all the applicants' perceptions of the program. While last year's blunder may make UF a little less competitive this year, the fact that there probably are only 4 PGY1 spots this year will make UF harder to match at than in previous years. And while I definitely can't speak for the PD and the rest of the UF selection committee, it's extremely easy for me to assume that the two UF MS4's who want to stay are basically shoo-ins, leaving only two spots for everyone to compete for. Like I said, nothing is for certain. But if I could sell half my portfolio and place a bet that those two MS4's are at the top of UF's ROL, I would.

 

[AA35]

During my interview I was told they were interviewing approx 35 applicants. That was at the beginning of December and did not accomodate the numerous people who cancel interviews in January. I was also told that they were strongly considering taking away the opportunity for moonlighting. Apparently the faculty was upset when they learned that residents were doubling their salaries. The decision was something still in the air in December. Needless to say, many of the residents were upset about it!

 

[GATORANALYST]

During my interview I was told they were interviewing approx 35 applicants. That was at the beginning of December and did not accomodate the numerous people who cancel interviews in January. I was also told that they were strongly considering taking away the opportunity for moonlighting. Apparently the faculty was upset when they learned that residents were doubling their salaries. The decision was something still in the air in December. Needless to say, many of the residents were upset about it!

Thanks for the info. Are you a med student at UF? how did you find out this inside info. I've heard this from other sources as well but I took it with a grain of salt.

If you dont mind how did you find out about the cancellations in Jan? Why do you think they interview so few applicants and why did so many people cancel interviews?

Thanks for the info

 

[GatorMedMan]

I was also told that they were strongly considering taking away the opportunity for moonlighting. Apparently the faculty was upset when they learned that residents were doubling their salaries. The decision was something still in the air in December. Needless to say, many of the residents were upset about it!

Yes and no. It has nothing to do with attendings being jealous about the $ residents are making. Sorry, but that's just ridiculous. UF moonlighting is nothing new. The attendings haven't been locked up in a closet for years, not realizing it exists. And why would they be upset, or at least enough of them upset to make such a drastic change?

From what I've been told, the moonlighting issue began when the UF Dean of GME was overlooking the billable hours report of the different residencies and saw that some psych residents had over 80 hours. What he failed to realize was that psych moonlighting is home call. So the only time that counts towards the 80-hour rule is time actually spent in the hospital or time spent on the phone while at home. Not knowing the difference, he immediately sent a letter to Dr. Gold, who was then the interim chair, citing the ACGME violation. Being the sack that he so often is, without first talking to the PD or any of the residents, he then immediately threatened to kill all moonlighting. The residents obviously flipped, while the attendings knew it wouldn't happen. Some committee was then formed, yada, yada, yada....

To simplify it, there were three different moonlighting opportunities. 1) the typical weekend inpt work handling new admissions, 2) Night work during the week, usually just pager call from home (nursing calling for tylenol sort of crap), 3) During the week, traveling to Ocala (30-40 min drive) to cover an private inpt unit for the evening, not overnight. From what I have heard #1 is going nowhere and #3 is or has been removed. As far as #2 goes, I'm not really sure. I haven't heard anything either way, but I was at a dinner last week and a PGY4 was there while he was on moonlighting call. So it's still around as of right now.

Overall, I think removing #3 is a good thing. And I think getting rid of #2 or at least limiting a resident to just one or maybe two nights of it per week is ok to. Many attendings had said that it was wearing the residents out. But getting rid of moonlighting all together just won't happen. Someone has to fill in the gap that it would leave. And if residents can't do it, it means attendings must. Won't happen.

 

[GatorMedMan]

If you dont mind how did you find out about the cancellations in Jan? Why do you think they interview so few applicants and why did so many people cancel interviews?

Thanks for the info

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I think he just means the typical cancellations that all programs receive in January. Hell, almost half the programs I applied to I cancelled...that's why I scheduled them all in January.

 

[GATORANALYST]

Yes and no. It has nothing to do with attendings being jealous about the $ residents are making. Sorry, but that's just ridiculous. UF moonlighting is nothing new. The attendings haven't been locked up in a closet for years, not realizing it exists. And why would they be upset, or at least enough of them upset to make such a drastic change?

From what I've been told, the moonlighting issue began when the UF Dean of GME was overlooking the billable hours report of the different residencies and saw that some psych residents had over 80 hours. What he failed to realize was that psych moonlighting is home call. So the only time that counts towards the 80-hour rule is time actually spent in the hospital or time spent on the phone while at home. Not knowing the difference, he immediately sent a letter to Dr. Gold, who was then the interim chair, citing the ACGME violation. Being the sack that he so often is, without first talking to the PD or any of the residents, he then immediately threatened to kill all moonlighting. The residents obviously flipped, while the attendings knew it wouldn't happen. Some committee was then formed, yada, yada, yada....

To simplify it, there were three different moonlighting opportunities. 1) the typical weekend inpt work handling new admissions, 2) Night work during the week, usually just pager call from home (nursing calling for tylenol sort of crap), 3) During the week, traveling to Ocala (30-40 min drive) to cover an private inpt unit for the evening, not overnight. From what I have heard #1 is going nowhere and #3 is or has been removed. As far as #2 goes, I'm not really sure. I haven't heard anything either way, but I was at a dinner last week and a PGY4 was there while he was on moonlighting call. So it's still around as of right now.

Overall, I think removing #3 is a good thing. And I think getting rid of #2 or at least limiting a resident to just one or maybe two nights of it per week is ok to. Many attendings had said that it was wearing the residents out. But getting rid of moonlighting all together just won't happen. Someone has to fill in the gap that it would leave. And if residents can't do it, it means attendings must. Won't happen.

Thanks for the info

 

[GatorMedMan]

Its also a bit concerning that the Chairman is so unaware of the inner workings of his program. Most programs are run by the PD is UF different in this respect?

Although he definitely isn't on my Christmas card list, I do have to give him a little benefit of the doubt...but just a little. He was just the interim chair at that time and he had not been in that position for that long. Then he gets a message from the GME Dean saying that "his" program is in violation of the 80 hour rule. I think anyone would be upset at this. My beef with him is how he handled the situation INITIALLY. In the end, I believe the outcome would have been the same even if someone else was at the helm.

I would not be surprised if they have a few available spots after the match

Highly doubt that since there are really only two PGY1 spots up for grabs this year.

 

[RookieRoo]

"Forgive me for not wanting to be in a class of interns where:

There's worry about some of them passing Step 3,
One was banned from speaking his/her native language so he/she could learn to speak English better,
One was fired and the others had to pick up the slack,
The other services like internal medicine don't consider them competent and only give them two patients.

All this happened this year at UF."

First off I am a resident at UF and will correct some of the misstatements made by this medical student. No one was banned from speaking his/her native language in our program. In fact they are often called to take patients that do not speak English. The bilingual residents also speak to each other during breaks at lecture and no on is offended by this.

It is true that one resident was replaced. The person who replaced her is stellar

After actually working on the other services I can tell you that this last one is a lie. I had just as many patients as the other interns. Both my senior resident and the attending thought that I was one of their better interns. In fact, a couple of the faculty members tried to get me to do a combined program because they thought I was more than just "competent."

As far as having to scramble to fill our spots this year we were very lucky. 1/2 the people we got were originally on our list (because they only ranked UF or got waivers). A couple were FMGs and the rest transferred in from other specialties. We do have some very good people in the class. As far as FMG's go, there are FMGs in other class years as well. In fact, some of our best residents (have been chiefs in the past, are favored for it this year, have prestigious fellowships since starting residency, have stellar PRITE scores) are FMGs.

Certainly if you are concerned about working with people from other countries and think so highly of yourself that you are afraid you might just be better than the people that you are working with, then UF was not for you. It has always been and continues to be a place where the residents are friendly, laid back, and humble. Good luck to you on wherever you match this year.

 

[golfpropsychguy]

Thanks for the post and the info. Its interesting that there is two totally different points of view and opinions of the program. Regardless, thanks,

 

[GatorMedMan]

"First off I am a resident at UF and will correct some of the misstatements made by this medical student. No one was banned from speaking his/her native language in our program. In fact they are often called to take patients that do not speak English. The bilingual residents also speak to each other during breaks at lecture and no on is offended by this.

Just what I was told by an attending. Maybe it was just on his service. I didn't mean to imply that this intern couldn't speak to patients that spoke his/her native language, but instead meant that he/she was told not to chat with the other residents in spanish in hopes that this would improve his/her much less than stellar English. My bad, sorry for the confusion. I will say that I have heard that he/she is doing much better now...and no longer spells "Psychiatry" wrong on his/her notes.

After actually working on the other services I can tell you that this last one is a lie. I had just as many patients as the other interns. Both my senior resident and the attending thought that I was one of their better interns. In fact, a couple of the faculty members tried to get me to do a combined program because they thought I was more than just "competent."

Good for you. But unless you've been on every single medicine and neuro service every single month since you started in July, please refrain from calling me a liar. You have had your experiences and I have had mine. Just because they're different doesn't mean one is wrong. I've seen and heard on numerous occasions about psych residents only being assigned 2-3 patients while the medicine and prelim residents usually averaged 6-8.

 

[MD3:16]

this is an honest and candid plea from a current resident at UF. I would strongly advise anyone who is considering to apply here for residency NOT to do so. this program is currently not befitting for anyone who is looking for a stable and good program that will develop their professional talents. i know some individuals have post that UF is a laid back and cordial program, but let me dispense the truth. laid back and cordial is a cover-up for lack of teaching, structure, and mentoring. as a current resident here at UF some of the most disturbing things have been:

1. the complete snafu of the match last year, and yes this will continue to haunt this program for it's incompentent filing of the match list for years to come.

2. the departure of the former department chairman without any valid explainantion to the program, and the replacement with a chairman who swore up and down he didn't want the job, but has made every effort to dissamble the current program. some examples include the discontinuation of moonlighting which i know some individuals say it is not gone yet. but trust me it will happen! also providing additional.

3.currently we are up in the air about who the current program director is. holbert has taken a very spineless and anemic role in defending residents and currently his "assistant" dr. ware is essentially functioning as the acting program director. despite what people will tell you holbert has been demoted and replaced.

4. the recent firing of a resident without appropiate consel and feedback. i personally knew the resident and she was a fairly compentent first.

needless to say if i knew then what i know now. i would have nevered considered this program. the reason they keep residents like me from speaking at the applicant interviews is to continue promoting the lie and concealing the truth. so please consider strongly before you apply here. if you can get into another program i highly recommend it. because this ship is sinking and i am desperately seeking a life boat.

 

[Belle826]

Hi,

I would just like to respond to the message that MD3:16 posted. I am not a resident or a medical student at UF, however I did interview at UF, along with many other programs this year. While I cannot say from first-hand experience how the residency at UF is, I can say that the scene that was depicted by MD3:16 is not at all what I experienced or have heard from medical students or residents at UF. While the residents are a part of the recruiting process, I did feel that I was able to get an unbiased viewpoint of the program from some of the current medical students.

As far as what occurred with the match last year, well, I think everyone agrees that created a hurdle for the program. It has been discussed extensively in this forum. I am more of an optimist and tend to believe that the program will "clear the hurdle" with time. Will this mishap continue to "haunt" the program for years to come? Maybe, but maybe not. I, for one, really liked several aspects of UF's program and it was very high on my ROL. I do not feel that the program at UF is nearly as bad as it has been portrayed by the previous poster.

I do not know the situation surrounding the departure of the Department Chair or the promotion of the new Chairman, so I cannot comment on those statements.

As far as the statements regarding Dr. Holbert, my understanding, as of a few weeks ago, was that he was still the current PD. There is some possibility that Dr. Ware may step in in the near future, however, I do not think this is due to the current PD being demoted. I would also like to say, that in my experience with the current PD, I would never think of or use words to describe him such as "spineless" or "anemic". While I cannot think of a reason to describe him as such, perhaps the poster has specific reasons for these comments that he/she could clearly explain, that would justify such harsh words.

I have a question also to MD3:16. It appears from your previous posts that you transferred into UF from another program. However, you were asking questions about the program in late March of last year and just 17 days later were making very negative comments regarding the program, as if you were already a part of it. What bothers you so much about the UF Psych Program? If you are a resident there, why would you transfer to a place that you had and have such negative feelings about?

 

[GatorMedMan]

this is an honest and candid plea from a current resident at UF. I would strongly advise anyone who is considering to apply here for residency NOT to do so. this program is currently not befitting for anyone who is looking for a stable and good program that will develop their professional talents. i know some individuals have post that UF is a laid back and cordial program, but let me dispense the truth. laid back and cordial is a cover-up for lack of teaching, structure, and mentoring.

Damn, you must really be miserable. Revisiting some of your previous posts:

hey everyone this rookieroo person is full of it. come on rookie tell us how many people were kicked out of the program. i mean literally forced out for no reason. my God neurosurgery at mass general is more laid back than uf psych.

How many residents kicked out for no reason you ask? Zero. UF psych worse than MGH neurosurg? Be sure to catch your credibility before it hits rock bottom.

or how about this one: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=42407

Well, ok, that has nothing to do with the thread's topic, but I'm sure all of us eagerly and anxiously awaiting 3/20 could use a good laugh. Sorry, couldn't resist.

1. the complete snafu of the match last year, and yes this will continue to haunt this program for it's incompentent filing of the match list for years to come.

It very well could, we will just have to wait and see. I think it will hurt the program some, but not tremendously. On the interview trail, most applicants didn't seem to know about it.

2. the departure of the former department chairman without any valid explainantion to the program, and the replacement with a chairman who swore up and down he didn't want the job, but has made every effort to dissamble the current program. some examples include the discontinuation of moonlighting which i know some individuals say it is not gone yet. but trust me it will happen!

No valid explanation? Huh? He left to do a stint at the NIMH. It was all over UF psych's web site. He even gave a cheesy little speech about it and his other accomplishments at the resident's graduation last year. Thank god for the alcohol in me, which made the speech more tolerable. As far as moonlighting goes, like I said before, it's quite difficult to just do away with it. Making it required call for the residents would be tough, since it would push some above 80 hours. That leaves the attendings. Forcing them to suddenly work nights and weekends would be a huge feat.

3.currently we are up in the air about who the current program director is. holbert has taken a very spineless and anemic role in defending residents and currently his "assistant" dr. ware is essentially functioning as the acting program director. despite what people will tell you holbert has been demoted and replaced.

Spineless and anemic. Wow! Most of the residents were/are upset about the change in PD's because they like Holbert so much. With all due respect, I think you are definitely alone, or almost alone, on this one. Dr. Ware is the incoming PD, so shouldn't he get more and more responsibilities over time instead of just starting day one with nothing under his belt? From what I understand, Holbert is leaving for medical reasons including the need for a multi-organ transplant. Are you unaware about this to, or do you just not think it's relevant?

4. the recent firing of a resident without appropiate consel and feedback. i personally knew the resident and she was a fairly compentent first.

Are you kidding me!? She was horrible. I already listed a few of the reasons above. You are the first resident I've ever heard to defend her. All I have spoken to can't stand her. I remember the first time I encountered her. It was at a drug rep dinner. She was sitting alone at a table while all the other residents ate at a table that was meant to hold far less people so they wouldn't have to be near her. I saw this numerous times. Ultimately at every dinner she would end up sitting with the private practice docs or the MS3's. At first I felt bad, but then I heard so much fowl stuff about her.

Overall, I'm sorry MD3:16 that you are so miserable. I wonder why you would transfer here, especially after having such a horrible opinion of the program before your transfer. Also, I wonder why you are so "up in the air" as you say about the going-on's at UF psych? There's no explanation why a lowly med student such as myself knows this stuff while a resident doesn't. I haven't seen you at many, if any, of the resident events or drug rep dinners. You should come to more, that's where all the juicy details come out.

 

[GatorMedMan]

Correction to one of my previous posts.

I stated earlier that two UF MS4's that were psych-bound wanted to stay at UF. One of them has now decided to take a year off before residency, freeing up one more spot for the non-UFers hoping to match at UF. Just letting everyone know. Good luck on the 20th.

 

[GATORANALYST]

this is an honest and candid plea from a current resident at UF. I would strongly advise anyone who is considering to apply here for residency NOT to do so. this program is currently not befitting for anyone who is looking for a stable and good program that will develop their professional talents. i know some individuals have post that UF is a laid back and cordial program, but let me dispense the truth. laid back and cordial is a cover-up for lack of teaching, structure, and mentoring. as a current resident here at UF some of the most disturbing things have been:

1. the complete snafu of the match last year, and yes this will continue to haunt this program for it's incompentent filing of the match list for years to come.

2. the departure of the former department chairman without any valid explainantion to the program, and the replacement with a chairman who swore up and down he didn't want the job, but has made every effort to dissamble the current program. some examples include the discontinuation of moonlighting which i know some individuals say it is not gone yet. but trust me it will happen! also providing additional.

3.currently we are up in the air about who the current program director is. holbert has taken a very spineless and anemic role in defending residents and currently his "assistant" dr. ware is essentially functioning as the acting program director. despite what people will tell you holbert has been demoted and replaced.

4. the recent firing of a resident without appropiate consel and feedback. i personally knew the resident and she was a fairly compentent first.

needless to say if i knew then what i know now. i would have nevered considered this program. the reason they keep residents like me from speaking at the applicant interviews is to continue promoting the lie and concealing the truth. so please consider strongly before you apply here. if you can get into another program i highly recommend it. because this ship is sinking and i am desperately seeking a life boat.

I'm sorry that you have had such a bad experience at UF. I must say though that I am pretty shocked at your description of the program. I have heard great things from other residents and have had some really great interactions with Dr. Holbert.

Have you thought of transfering to another program or would that be difficult since you transferred from LIJ to UF?
Why do you think you are one of the few residents that is unhappy or are there more like you that feel the same way? Besides the program how do you like living in Gainesville?

 

[LimbicResponse]

Hello,

I just wanted to revive this old topic. I am what some would call a "competitive" applicant for any residency program in the country. Due to family/geography/ I'm strongly considering UF for residency. I was wondering if anyone can comment as to how this debacle has developed over the years and the current status of the program. I would appreciate input from current residents/interviewees.

 

[LimbicResponse]

Bump

 

[LimbicResponse]

Anyone ?

 

[vistaril]

Anyone ?

There is no 'debacle' within the UF program....what happened in 08 or whatever was a one time incident/mistake.

Florida is not a lot different than other university programs in that region sans Duke, maybe vanderbilt and maybe emory......it's a typical university program in a noncompetitive field. As a result, some years they(like most programs in the region) struggle to find 'good' people.

 

[Zydis]

Take this with a grain of salt but I wouldn't even apply to UF. The residency has deteriorated into a malignant program under the care of its current program director. It is under UF internal review for resident mistreatment. The residents are overworked and there are not enough residents to cover all the services. The curriculum that is listed on the website is a far cry from what is actually assigned. The call for the first two years of residency is brutal and the call schedule is often changed, being used as a form of punishment. The former chair left on a whim with no notice given. Numerous residents and faculty have left as well. All I'm saying is where there is smoke...there is usually fire. Do yourself a favor, if you want to work like crazy at a malignant program, at least go to a residency at a prestigious university.

 

[LimbicResponse]

Do you have any evidence to support this? Does this also apply to the child program?

Take this with a grain of salt but I wouldn't even apply to UF. The residency has deteriorated into a malignant program under the care of its current program director. It is under UF internal review for resident mistreatment. The residents are overworked and there are not enough residents to cover all the services. The curriculum that is listed on the website is a far cry from what is actually assigned. The call for the first two years of residency is brutal and the call schedule is often changed, being used as a form of punishment. The former chair left on a whim with no notice given. Numerous residents and faculty have left as well. All I'm saying is where there is smoke...there is usually fire. Do yourself a favor, if you want to work like crazy at a malignant program, at least go to a residency at a prestigious university.

 

[Lexapros]

Reading this thread was mildly alarming but hopefully the issues listed above have resolved in the past 8 years. Here's an update from the perspective of MS3 at UFCOM after the six week psychiatry rotation.

Overall impression: Really positive. The majority of residents, especially the PGY3 class, seemed incredibly competent and satisfied with what they were doing. I never got the impression that anyone was being overworked. I had excellent conversations with a PGY2, PG3, and PG4 about business and the stock market on three separate occasions, which I think is a good gauge of overall intelligence and a measure of how much free time they have apart from their professional responsibilities.

Attendings/Faculty: I have been impressed with EVERY single attending I have worked with at Shands Vista, the VA, and the residential drug treatment center. Every attending has been personable, approachable, and interested in teaching medical students, interns, and residents. I was very impressed by the psychiatry attendings at the VA, in particular. Their attending team has great professional chemistry and manages to balance professionalism with some humor. I really didn't want the 2 weeks at the VA to end. The attending I worked with at Vista was also extremely competent, friendly, and professional. Btw, the psych hospital (Vista) is really nice. The facilities are clean, the cafeteria is serviceable, the plaza next door has a Publix supermarket and an Italian cafe (Pomodoro) the MS3's have lunch at occasionally. The psych rotation director invited everyone to her home for pizza and a movie each rotation (One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest usu).

Interns: They seemed fine. I was with the same intern for 4 out of the 6 weeks, so I didn't really have an opportunity to work with other members of that class.

Residents: PGY3's - I think they have a really strong class. Every member of that class I have met seems to be on top of their game professionally and have other relevant interests in business, markets, family life, etc. I've met and talked to two of the four upcoming chief residents and they are triple Gators (undergrad, med school, residency) and they seem to be awesome. PGY2's - yeah, they seem great. I grew up on the same cul-de-sac as one of them and never knew it until a few weeks ago. PGY4's- I think I've met only one, maybe two, and they seemed professional and only mildly intimidating.

Gainesville: I kind of like Gainesville. It's grown on me. I did undergrad here. I was an athlete at UF and part of Greek life. I wanted to get out of Gainesville as fast as I could after college and I didn't really like Gainesville until the past 6 months or so. Gainesville can feel small but I honestly don't notice it that much anymore. The dating scene isn't bad either. And of course, it is inexpensive to live here. I had dinner last Friday with another member of my class going into psych in downtown and I think I paid like $28 for dinner + tip and the other Ms3 mentioned he paid more for one drink at a comedy club in Las Olas (Ft. Laudy). And it's not as if I don't know what good nightlife is like, I lived on Lincoln Blvd in Miami across from the ocean in Hallandale Beach/Aventura a mile down from trump towers after undergrad. Nightlife obviously can't compare to Miami / Liv @ Fountainbleu or Space/Mint etc. but I don't really do that much anymore. So yeah, I would basically have no concerns about cost of living in Gainesville and the community has low crime statistics.

My Concerns: I've been hearing things about the moonlighting on this thread. I got a very favorable review about how moonlighting works from one of the upcoming chiefs. I got another review from one of the child(psych) fellows who told me it's not bad but it doesn't compare well in terms of compensation to the $120/hr he was making moonlighting in Atlanta where he did his first 3 years of residency. He did add that he was very very happy to be at UF because the work load is very forgiving - like 1.5 hour lunches everyday and it is not a malignant program (he doesn't miss those 80 hr workweeks) like the one he came from. I mean yeah, the moonlighting isn't anywhere close to $120/hr but still it's pretty good. The other concern is the strength of the incoming class. Hopefully it will be strong but match was last week so I have no idea how strong it will be. I do know one member is a UFCOM graduate and from previous conversations with him, based on his application strength, he would have been competitive at most psych programs in the country. One of the other members of the current MS4 UFCOM class did a MD/PhD going into psych but for reasons that his wife would probably leave him if they stayed in Gainesville any longer, decided to match elsewhere. I've been to grand rounds and have seen how attendings are invested in teaching so I am not worried about that. I just hope the class I may be coming into with is strong because that would make things more interesting. Now take this review with a grain of salt since I really like the program, but I'm still looking forward to interview season at other programs across the country to get a feel of how other programs do things. Feel free to PM me if there is anything else you want to know. I have an elective in child psychiatry here and another in flexible psychiatry in 4th year, so maybe i'll update this later.

 

[HarryMTieboutMD]

Reading this thread was mildly alarming but hopefully the issues listed above have resolved in the past 8 years. Here's an update from the perspective of MS3 at UFCOM after the six week psychiatry rotation.

Overall impression: Really positive. The majority of residents, especially the PGY3 class, seemed incredibly competent and satisfied with what they were doing. I never got the impression that anyone was being overworked. I had excellent conversations with a PGY2, PG3, and PG4 about business and the stock market on three separate occasions, which I think is a good gauge of overall intelligence and a measure of how much free time they have apart from their professional responsibilities.

Attendings/Faculty: I have been impressed with EVERY single attending I have worked with at Shands Vista, the VA, and the residential drug treatment center. Every attending has been personable, approachable, and interested in teaching medical students, interns, and residents. I was very impressed by the psychiatry attendings at the VA, in particular. Their attending team has great professional chemistry and manages to balance professionalism with some humor. I really didn't want the 2 weeks at the VA to end. The attending I worked with at Vista was also extremely competent, friendly, and professional. Btw, the psych hospital (Vista) is really nice. The facilities are clean, the cafeteria is serviceable, the plaza next door has a Publix supermarket and an Italian cafe (Pomodoro) the MS3's have lunch at occasionally. The psych rotation director invited everyone to her home for pizza and a movie each rotation (One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest usu).

Interns: They seemed fine. I was with the same intern for 4 out of the 6 weeks, so I didn't really have an opportunity to work with other members of that class.

Residents: PGY3's - I think they have a really strong class. Every member of that class I have met seems to be on top of their game professionally and have other relevant interests in business, markets, family life, etc. I've met and talked to two of the four upcoming chief residents and they are triple Gators (undergrad, med school, residency) and they seem to be awesome. PGY2's - yeah, they seem great. I grew up on the same cul-de-sac as one of them and never knew it until a few weeks ago. PGY4's- I think I've met only one, maybe two, and they seemed professional and only mildly intimidating.

Gainesville: I kind of like Gainesville. It's grown on me. I did undergrad here. I was an athlete at UF and part of Greek life. I wanted to get out of Gainesville as fast as I could after college and I didn't really like Gainesville until the past 6 months or so. Gainesville can feel small but I honestly don't notice it that much anymore. The dating scene isn't bad either. And of course, it is inexpensive to live here. I had dinner last Friday with another member of my class going into psych in downtown and I think I paid like $28 for dinner + tip and the other Ms3 mentioned he paid more for one drink at a comedy club in Las Olas (Ft. Laudy). And it's not as if I don't know what good nightlife is like, I lived on Lincoln Blvd in Miami across from the ocean in Hallandale Beach/Aventura a mile down from trump towers after undergrad. Nightlife obviously can't compare to Miami / Liv @ Fountainbleu or Space/Mint etc. but I don't really do that much anymore. So yeah, I would basically have no concerns about cost of living in Gainesville and the community has low crime statistics.

My Concerns: I've been hearing things about the moonlighting on this thread. I got a very favorable review about how moonlighting works from one of the upcoming chiefs. I got another review from one of the child(psych) fellows who told me it's not bad but it doesn't compare well in terms of compensation to the $120/hr he was making moonlighting in Atlanta where he did his first 3 years of residency. He did add that he was very very happy to be at UF because the work load is very forgiving - like 1.5 hour lunches everyday and it is not a malignant program (he doesn't miss those 80 hr workweeks) like the one he came from. I mean yeah, the moonlighting isn't anywhere close to $120/hr but still it's pretty good. The other concern is the strength of the incoming class. Hopefully it will be strong but match was last week so I have no idea how strong it will be. I do know one member is a UFCOM graduate and from previous conversations with him, based on his application strength, he would have been competitive at most psych programs in the country. One of the other members of the current MS4 UFCOM class did a MD/PhD going into psych but for reasons that his wife would probably leave him if they stayed in Gainesville any longer, decided to match elsewhere. I've been to grand rounds and have seen how attendings are invested in teaching so I am not worried about that. I just hope the class I may be coming into with is strong because that would make things more interesting. Now take this review with a grain of salt since I really like the program, but I'm still looking forward to interview season at other programs across the country to get a feel of how other programs do things. Feel free to PM me if there is anything else you want to know. I have an elective in child psychiatry here and another in flexible psychiatry in 4th year, so maybe i'll update this later.

I went to UF for med school (though I chose to leave for residency) and agree with most of this. I also have close ties to several of the current faculty members, so I am aware of the current state of affairs. UF is one of the better programs in the Southeast (though not close to Duke or Emory but probably equivalent to or just below MUSC). Recent grads I know have gone on to child fellowships at Yale, Boston Children's and MGH. The department is in somewhat of a flux, as they are looking for a new chair, and with the opening of North Florida Psychiatry, huge financial incentives are drawing some faculty away. Also a big selling point was the DBS clinic, but one of the attendings took said job at North Florida, and with Okun becoming that chair of neurology, it's hard to say how much he'll want to invest in a psych DBS clinic in his movement disorders center. Also keep in mind Dr. Gold shaped the Department (for the better in my opinion, albeit uniquely), so the new chair will be a lot different. Hopefully the administration makes a slam dunk hire for chair who can grow the department and bring in NIH money.

I think a major drawback to UF is that the off service medicine months are very "diet". You do one month of inpatient at the VA and carry max 6-7 patients, none of whom are THAT sick (for the most part). The rest is urgent care, outpatient, etc. I know this is largely influenced by GME funding (and might be a positive for some people), but I think it is detrimental to training. I'm very grateful that at my program all of our medicine months were inpatient, and we were expected to carry a full patient load with very sick patients- it was extremely difficult at first (as it is for most interns), but it was invaluable for learning and made me much more confident.

 

[MedWorkerCivilRights]

I went to UF for med school (though I chose to leave for residency) and agree with most of this. I also have close ties to several of the current faculty members, so I am aware of the current state of affairs. UF is one of the better programs in the Southeast (though not close to Duke or Emory but probably equivalent to or just below MUSC). Recent grads I know have gone on to child fellowships at Yale, Boston Children's and MGH. The department is in somewhat of a flux, as they are looking for a new chair, and with the opening of North Florida Psychiatry, huge financial incentives are drawing some faculty away. Also a big selling point was the DBS clinic, but one of the attendings took said job at North Florida, and with Okun becoming that chair of neurology, it's hard to say how much he'll want to invest in a psych DBS clinic in his movement disorders center. Also keep in mind Dr. Gold shaped the Department (for the better in my opinion, albeit uniquely), so the new chair will be a lot different. Hopefully the administration makes a slam dunk hire for chair who can grow the department and bring in NIH money.

I think a major drawback to UF is that the off service medicine months are very "diet". You do one month of inpatient at the VA and carry max 6-7 patients, none of whom are THAT sick (for the most part). The rest is urgent care, outpatient, etc. I know this is largely influenced by GME funding (and might be a positive for some people), but I think it is detrimental to training. I'm very grateful that at my program all of our medicine months were inpatient, and we were expected to carry a full patient load with very sick patients- it was extremely difficult at first (as it is for most interns), but it was invaluable for learning and made me much more confident.

UF is horrible. Worst decision I could have made. Recruitment is pure lies. They will tell you they are flexible and understanding. The minute you match there you will repeat the same rotations so many times that you will forget there is anything to psychiatry except consult services. They will tell you that your start time is 8 am but once you sign your contract, it will be 6:30. Forget trying to use your vacation days until you are a 4th year. They say you have 10 sick days but you will be punished for using any of them. The residents had to practically revolt to get any didactics. Grand rounds only happenings during recruiting season, so they can get people to sign on . The rest of the year there is 0 interest in resident education. The ACGME surveys have horrible scores and they never improve. Instead you will get weeks of lectures threatening that the program will loss accrediation unless you lie on the survey. And the units are not safe. If you get attacked by a patients, you will be punished. They did an in house study and only 33% of residents felt safe on the unit. They used the fact that only 2 had been attacked that year as proof that it was not that bad. So to go here, hope you have a strong stomach and no expectation of having staff with any interest in teaching you. You will be a work horse working for a institution with sovereign immunity, treating patients in a way that will get you sued in private practice. You will not learn the skills you need to work for anyone else except them. The like that because they always need more attendings, so they count on residents being too afraid of being sued to leave. Residents are afraid that they have not learned what they need to know to perform private practice without getting sued, so they sign with UF. UF needs to retain these residents because attendings hate working for UF. There contracts constantly change and the attendings only outlet for anger is to take it out on the residents. Happy Hunger Games!