VSAS/applying for aways

[Transformers]

When do you guys start applying? Is there an informal process of sending the program an email?! I guess it sucks with the limited spots, but what are your recommendations?

Thanks!

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[mdjo]

You should start applying in March (or whenever it is) as soon as VSAS opens. Be quick because places can go fast. If you need any special immunization forms or titers drawn (different for every school), make sure those are all done in advance. That was something that held up my applications a little. And there are some great programs that offer aways but not through VSAS, so if there's somewhere you're interested in, google their website to see how to apply for an away there.

 

[HatsAnd Sunscreen]

Agreed, earlier is better especially if your school is strict about what months you can do away rotations. Spots tend to fill up fast for August, September. You will log onto VSAS and select programs that way. If you have questions about a given program their contact information will be there so you can get in touch with their coordinator. Getting a record of immunizations ahead of time is a good idea. Make sure you have a recent PPD. Some programs also require a drug screen and criminal background check

 

[Transformers]

Agreed, earlier is better especially if your school is strict about what months you can do away rotations. Spots tend to fill up fast for August, September. You will log onto VSAS and select programs that way. If you have questions about a given program their contact information will be there so you can get in touch with their coordinator. Getting a record of immunizations ahead of time is a good idea. Make sure you have a recent PPD. Some programs also require a drug screen and criminal background check

Gotcha...thanks for all these tips

1.) How many derm programs did you apply to in VSAS? I have a select few places I want to rotate at (mostly regional)...not the top programs (i.e.- penn, nyu, harvard)...do you apply to a ton, and then decide later? Additionally, how much of the conventional wisdom of rotate coast-to-coast impact your decision to rotate/ultimately get interviews (i.e.- hence show your geographical preferences)

2.) Would it be a good idea to contact the derm program/express interest prior to applying via VSAS?

3.) I guess its honestly a crapshoot in getting accepted an away sometimes...How does evaluation to get an away work? Any benefit in having a friend in the residency program to help push for you to get the rotation or is it more of a first-come/first-serve?

 

[HatsAnd Sunscreen]

1) I applied to 3 or 4 programs per rotation block that I wanted aways in. Every place does it differently, some require a minimum step 1 score (250 usually if they have a requirement) you need to rotate but in my experience the places I rotated at were first come first serve. I would apply to places that you most interested in, since in dermatology it is extremely common to match at either your home program or where you did aways. I don't know how big of a deal rotating in different geographic areas is. Unless you get a letter of recommendation from a program honestly most places you apply to later won't even know where you rotated. I would just pick based on where you think you would like to go personally and not overthink it.

2) I don't think there is a need to

3) Having friends in high places is always nice and if you have connections I wouldn't be shy about letting them know you are interested and applying.

 

[Transformers]

1) I applied to 3 or 4 programs per rotation block that I wanted aways in. Every place does it differently, some require a minimum step 1 score (250 usually if they have a requirement) you need to rotate but in my experience the places I rotated at were first come first serve. I would apply to places that you most interested in, since in dermatology it is extremely common to match at either your home program or where you did aways. I don't know how big of a deal rotating in different geographic areas is. Unless you get a letter of recommendation from a program honestly most places you apply to later won't even know where you rotated. I would just pick based on where you think you would like to go personally and not overthink it.

2) I don't think there is a need to

3) Having friends in high places is always nice and if you have connections I wouldn't be shy about letting them know you are interested and applying.

Ahh got it...so to verify...if programs start accepting on say march 15th...start processing on April 1st...

1) when do you apply with that timetable in mind? Prior to that I'm trying to get all that extra stuff done...immunizations, etc....just worried if I send something like on March 25th I'm not totally screwed.
2) when you say 3-4 per rotation block? Can you not just apply to like 30 schools and choose all blocks between June-September?
3) Finally, when is the very last meanigful month to rotate? Meaningful in the sense of often, not always, an away garners you an interview.

 

[mdjo]

1) The sooner the better. A few weeks won't make a difference for most places, but it might make a difference for somewhere you wanted, so you may as well apply the week it opens. You won't be "totally screwed" if you wait a few weeks, but you might not get your top choices.
2) There's a max of ~10 total applications allowed. If you apply to one program for August and September both, that counts as two applications even though it's the same program.
3) Not sure...probably late October/early November?

 

[HatsAnd Sunscreen]

November is the last month. It is too late to get letters by this point but you will have had enough exposure to dermatology at this point to really try and impress. Just treat it as a month long interview and even try to get started on a publication so you will be very recent and memorable by this time next year.

 

[doctor85]

November is the last month. It is too late to get letters by this point but you will have had enough exposure to dermatology at this point to really try and impress. Just treat it as a month long interview and even try to get started on a publication so you will be very recent and memorable by this time next year.

I had to do aways late in the year due to scheduling issues (last away ended in early Dec.). Both were after my dean's letter and application went in. I didn't ask for letters from the places because it was so late, but I got interviews there and really positive feedback. You're fresh in their memory (that could be good or bad) at interviews if you rotated late. Also, if you rotate late then you won't be rotating with multiple other home and away students at the same time as is the case July through Sept/Oct., which means less competition for facetime with faculty and residents. That made things way less stressful for me. Food for thought.

 

[doctor85]

I'd also put in a plug for checking out the 2 week aways on VSAS. I did one and thought it was the right amount of time. It's more cost effective. You get to see the program enough in 2 weeks and you don't get tired or burned out. You'll know in 2 weeks time whether or not you like the program. If they like you, they'll know that by 2 weeks as well. It shows enough interest to get you an interview if you do a nice job on rotation.

 

[Transformers]

Just wanted to update...I am planning on doing the standard 1 home clinical (June or July) and 2 clinical aways (July-October) range

Hope I'm not going overboard, but I actually have a few extra months starting in April and was hoping to squeak in a "research away" on top of the 3 clinical derm rotations above with a derm faculty member who I worked with in the past (published several papers including JAAD, presented at AAD etc..). It would entail a mix of some minor research and clinic and great 1-on-1 time and not so much the classic clinical derm elective scattered with working with different attendings, etc...overall, a relatively chill elective. It would be great to get a letter from a well known faculty member and hopefully land an extra interview down the road especially with a department I have worked with.

Anyways, I shot him an email and he said he'd be happy to have me. Their derm department said I have two options on how to do this 4-week research elective.

a.) First option is apply via VSAS but the earliest start date is June 1st. Considering I would have 3 more months of derm after that, it feels a bit too late to pile all these back-to-back on before October/November when it'll be a bit late. I could also maybe do this last (after all my rotations say in September, but the downside would be maybe not getting my letter of recc from him on time to send to other schools).

b.) Second option (preferred) is just volunteer (non-VSAS), preferably for me, a bit earlier in late April (end of next month). That way I'd have ample time to do the other 3 clinical derm rotations without pressure (i.e.- a few break weeks in between). Not to mention, it's a non-VSAS month so I don't expect any volunteers (i..e- graduation week, etc...)

What do you recommend? I was opting for the volunteer idea (seems flexible with the start date + the late-April to late-May range prob won't have any other med students rotating too) as the hopeful goal would be to get a solid letter from Dr. Feldman. The only downside I can see is that it won't be through VSAS and hence I don't get "credit" for it which I am not sure how important having a rotation even a research one being listed on VSAS is (I also don't really need the credit for 4th year).

Thanks!

 

[1dayatatime]

How long is everyone making their CV's for VSAS? Is 3 pages too long? Are college extracurriculars appropriate to include (if it's health-related)?

 

[MilkIsGood]

How long is everyone making their CV's for VSAS? Is 3 pages too long? Are college extracurriculars appropriate to include (if it's health-related)?

Mine is 2.5 pages. Didnt include college stuff except for research I did in college

 

[1dayatatime]

mine is 2.5 too. thanks for the solidarity, Milk!

 

[Dermione Granger]

2 page is probably a good length for most people except those who have a prolific research / academic career (MD-PhDs, research fellows etc). In that case, it is appropriate to have a longer CV due to longer list of presentations/talks/pubs

 

[Testup]

Any suggestions: I've applied rotations thru VSAS at couple of places for the same time frame. Received one acceptance and accepted it but would like to have one that's closer ( pending ). If I get this one can I drop the first one? By dropping does that have any effect on residency app for that institution?

 

[smartparts]

Any suggestions: I've applied rotations thru VSAS at couple of places for the same time frame. Received one acceptance and accepted it but would like to have one that's closer ( pending ). If I get this one can I drop the first one? By dropping does that have any effect on residency app for that institution?

we were told that if you accept the rotation, then withdraw, it looks bad.

 

[FIREitUP]

we were told that if you accept the rotation, then withdraw, it looks bad.

I've heard the same.

 

[1dayatatime]

what does rejecting an offered rotation or letting it expire do then? I mean, they must understand there's just not enough time to do it all!

 

[Slack3r]

we were told that if you accept the rotation, then withdraw, it looks bad.

SUNY Downstate (on VSAS) says that if you accept their elective offer and then withdraw they send a letter to your Dean about professionalism and you're black-balled from applying to other electives at Downstate. Whether or not this affects your interviews is up in the air, although if I were a betting man....

 

[smartparts]

what does rejecting an offered rotation or letting it expire do then? I mean, they must understand there's just not enough time to do it all!

i would think that it has no bearing on your application but no one can say for certain that there isnt some curmudgeon out there that will hold it against you. i would definitely turn it down over letting the offer expire though.

 

[FIREitUP]

SUNY Downstate (on VSAS) says that if you accept their elective offer and then withdraw they send a letter to your Dean about professionalism and you're black-balled from applying to other electives at Downstate. Whether or not this affects your interviews is up in the air, although if I were a betting man....

That's not entirely true (it's only true if you don't cancel within 4 weeks). Either way, kind of a dick move IMO:

Cancellation Policy:
If you can no longer attend an elective which you have accepted, you must notify the Visiting Student Coordinator via email no later than 4 weeks prior to your start date. The Visiting Student Coordinator will then notify the department that you cannot attend. No re-scheduling of electives is permitted. If you fail to notify the Visiting Student Coordinator at least 4 weeks prior to your start date, SUNY Downstate will withdraw you from any future scheduled elective and your home school will be notified. (A letter informing the home school of a lack of professionalism in communication by the student is sent directly from our dean of medical education to the home school dean. The student is also no longer eligible to apply for rotations at SUNY Downstate.)

 

[Dral]

That seems a little extreme, but I agree that it is unprofessional behavior if it doesn't involve something like a family emergency or such.

 

[FIREitUP]

That seems a little extreme, but I agree that it is unprofessional behavior if it doesn't involve something like a family emergency or such.

Oh, yes definitely. I meant its kinda dick to go as far as contacting your dean for professionalism. It's probably an empty threat, but it doesn't seem like canceling an elective is grounds for doing such a thing.