Wearing Uniform to and from Hospital

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Neogenesis

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Correct me if I am wrong, but per Army regulations, the uniform is required for wear when on duty. This does not include travel to and from duty station, correct?

I'm just wondering how many of you are required to wear your uniform to and from the hospital every day. The command here is adamant about people arriving to and leaving from our facility in uniform. Which wouldn't necessarily be a big deal if you were going to wear said uniform throughout the day. But if you spend 99.99% of your time in scrubs, why on earth would you want to put on ACU's just to travel to and from work?

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When I was at Tripler I would wear shorts, T-shirt and flip flops to and from work. Toss on scrubs and sneakers and go about my day.

The nurses and support staff tho had to wear ACU's to and from work


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I used to arrive at the hospital at about 0445, so my attitude was if someone wanted to wait for me outside at bust me at that time of day, they were welcome.
 
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Back in the day, Bethesda required everyone to be in uniform when arriving or departing. A silly rule that we attributed to "inside the beltway" nonsense (there was a lot of that kind of thing). It was a little annoying but not that big a deal ... since the uniform only got worn for two car rides and two very short walks per day, it didn't need to be washed or dry cleaned very often.

Commands can set whatever rules they like. Sorry to hear yours is being foolish about it.
 
I realize the foolishness. The annoying part is that it applies only to the hospital. The post itself allows soldiers to travel to and from in uniform but in no way mandates it (even bordering on discouraging it after talking with several of the line type folk I know). And since I'm not allowed to wear my duty uniform (scrubs) outside the hospital I'm actually having to change multiple times throughout the day.

Completely agree about arriving in AM. Not a single one of the people that care about that stuff are here when I get to the hospital. The tough part is leaving because it tends to be during the "prescribed duty hours" of the facility. So not only are they irritated if they see you not in uniform walking out to the car, they're disgruntled that you're "leaving early".
 
Back in the day, Bethesda required everyone to be in uniform when arriving or departing. A silly rule that we attributed to "inside the beltway" nonsense (there was a lot of that kind of thing).

According to older Navy staff at Bethesda, in the 90s the rule was blues or whites only when inside the beltway--no khakis.


Commands can set whatever rules they like. Sorry to hear yours is being foolish about it.

One of the seemingly endless "papercuts" of military life. I've been at commands that had this rule and commands that didn't care. When I was at commands that had the rule, I generally disobeyed it and did a lot of skulking. When I got caught by someone who knew who I was and cared about the rule (which was not often), I gave a lot of blank looks, "noteds", and occasionally quoted MLK's Letter from Birmingham City Jail.

For any Sergeant Majors who cruise this board and dream of the day when they can take a position in a hospital troop command and "reinstitute some military discipline and standards", please view one of my all-time favorite military photos:
battle-bulge-500-35.jpg
 
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I realize the foolishness. The annoying part is that it applies only to the hospital. The post itself allows soldiers to travel to and from in uniform but in no way mandates it (even bordering on discouraging it after talking with several of the line type folk I know). And since I'm not allowed to wear my duty uniform (scrubs) outside the hospital I'm actually having to change multiple times throughout the day.

Completely agree about arriving in AM. Not a single one of the people that care about that stuff are here when I get to the hospital. The tough part is leaving because it tends to be during the "prescribed duty hours" of the facility. So not only are they irritated if they see you not in uniform walking out to the car, they're disgruntled that you're "leaving early".
I hear that. What about wearing PTs? That would be easier than changing into ACUs.
 
According to older Navy staff at Bethesda, in the 90s the rule was blues or whites only when inside the beltway--no khakis.




One of the seemingly endless "papercuts" of military life. I've been at commands that had this rule and commands that didn't care. When I was at commands that had the rule, I generally disobeyed it and did a lot of skulking. When I got caught by someone who knew who I was and cared about the rule (which was not often), I gave a lot of blank looks, "noteds", and occasionally quoted MLK's Letter from Birmingham City Jail.

For any Sergeant Majors who cruise this board and dream of the day when they can take a position in a hospital troop command and "reinstitute some military discipline and standards", please view one of my all-time favorite military photos:
Once you get your fifth star, you're allowed to put your hands in your pockets. That's in the reg.
 
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At my last duty station, you were expected to wear ACUs to and from work, and I did....most of the time. When I came in for the OR, I was there under cover of night and earlier than anyone who cared, so I didn't. When I was a resident, I almost never wore my uniform and I certainly never wore it to work. At my current duty station, I'm actually made it part of my goal to not wear my uniform any more between now and when I go on terminal leave. It'll be easy with ASUs. I'm excluding PT, of course. ACUs...that's the challenge....

A lot of units to allow you to show up in PTs. I think it's a pain in the @$$ either way.
 
I just don't get it. Many of the line people I know across multiple services at multiple bases in different parts of the country all seem to look at me like it's ridiculous to be mandated to travel to and from in uniform. Why does the medical community seem to have such a love for making this mandatory?
 
I just don't get it. Many of the line people I know across multiple services at multiple bases in different parts of the country all seem to look at me like it's ridiculous to be mandated to travel to and from in uniform. Why does the medical community seem to have such a love for making this mandatory?
Because we have people in command positions who have fallen away from clinical work, and into operational billets, and now they feel more like they're real Army (or insert service), but no one in the real Army respects them as if they've earned their rank, so they're overcompensating by trying to seem as if they're running a tight ship. Even though in actuality the ship hasn't floated in many years.
 
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Sadly if they did spend time with the line they should have picked up on what Neogenesis is saying: the uniform, outside of your secure area, makes you a target. Middle of nowhere, no big deal. Bigger cities, I very much dislike walking around in uniform off base.
 
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I just don't get it. Many of the line people I know across multiple services at multiple bases in different parts of the country all seem to look at me like it's ridiculous to be mandated to travel to and from in uniform. Why does the medical community seem to have such a love for making this mandatory?

My theory is that its about delays at the gate. Every time I try to drive onto base out of uniform I get the new guy who too nervous to drop the salute before I return it. But I can't return his salute uncovered. So I say good morning. And he holds the salute. And I say thank you. And he holds the salute. And I do that curt little nod thing. And he holds the salute. And I just stare at him for awhile. And he holds the salute. Try the nod again ... And this goes on. One time I just drove off with him still saluting me, but I felt like a tool all day for doing it. Every time I get stuck in traffic at the gate I assume that's what happening up front.
 
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I just don't get it. Many of the line people I know across multiple services at multiple bases in different parts of the country all seem to look at me like it's ridiculous to be mandated to travel to and from in uniform. Why does the medical community seem to have such a love for making this mandatory?
Because they suspect folks like you don't actually own a uniform and it makes them feel better when they see you in one. I agree PT gear is the way to go although at SAMMC that is not supposed to fly either.
They recently outlawed civilians showing up in yoga pants. That was a sad day.
 
Yoga pants in the land of the gastric bypass should be banned (or at least require prior authorization). There's a reason BAMC is well known for NAFLD research.
 
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Sadly if they did spend time with the line they should have picked up on what Neogenesis is saying: the uniform, outside of your secure area, makes you a target. Middle of nowhere, no big deal. Bigger cities, I very much dislike walking around in uniform off base.

I have heard about this too but have there actually been incidents?
 
My theory is that its about delays at the gate. Every time I try to drive onto base out of uniform I get the new guy who too nervous to drop the salute before I return it. But I can't return his salute uncovered. So I say good morning. And he holds the salute. And I say thank you. And he holds the salute. And I do that curt little nod thing. And he holds the salute. And I just stare at him for awhile. And he holds the salute. Try the nod again ... And this goes on. One time I just drove off with him still saluting me, but I felt like a tool all day for doing it. Every time I get stuck in traffic at the gate I assume that's what happening up front.
Is this a service specific thing? I've always returned the salute...maybe it's only an AF thing. It's a courtesy to return the salute uncovered or out of uniform. I don't think I've ever seen anyone not return it regardless of attire
 
Is this a service specific thing? I've always returned the salute...maybe it's only an AF thing. It's a courtesy to return the salute uncovered or out of uniform. I don't think I've ever seen anyone not return it regardless of attire

It's Navy specific. We don't return a salute uncovered but I end up returning a salute if the gate guard is from a different branch.
 
We certainly return salute in the Army, even when I'm out of uniform.
 
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Is this a service specific thing? I've always returned the salute...maybe it's only an AF thing. It's a courtesy to return the salute uncovered or out of uniform. I don't think I've ever seen anyone not return it regardless of attire
I was taught not to. Never looked it up.

This came up a lot at my residency, actually. My hospital was four buildings with a giant courtyard in the middle of it, so the fastest way between anything was to go outdoors. To keep everyone from having to carry around covers all day, the CO made the very sane and reasonable decision that in the courtyard it was OK to be uncovered. However, because nothing can ever be simple, we did get scolding emails every few months that if you happened to have a cover on you, you needed to be wearing it. Also that if you were wearing a cover you needed to salute, even if the person you are saluting was uncovered.

I never saw anyone return a salute uncovered. People mostly developed this curt little nod thing to make the salute stop. When there were a lot of covered enlisted around it made the officers look like deranged pigeons.
 
I was taught not to. Never looked it up.

This came up a lot at my residency, actually. My hospital was four buildings with a giant courtyard in the middle of it, so the fastest way between anything was to go outdoors. To keep everyone from having to carry around covers all day, the CO made the very sane and reasonable decision that in the courtyard it was OK to be uncovered. However, because nothing can ever be simple, we did get scolding emails every few months that if you happened to have a cover on you, you needed to be wearing it. Also that if you were wearing a cover you needed to salute, even if the person you are saluting was uncovered.

I never saw anyone return a salute uncovered. People mostly developed this curt little nod thing to make the salute stop. When there were a lot of covered enlisted around it made the officers look like deranged pigeons.

Huh...must be different in each service. In all our areas like this on all AF bases 8ve been on there are signs which dictate "No hat/no salute" areas.
 
My theory is that its about delays at the gate. Every time I try to drive onto base out of uniform I get the new guy who too nervous to drop the salute before I return it. But I can't return his salute uncovered. So I say good morning. And he holds the salute. And I say thank you. And he holds the salute. And I do that curt little nod thing. And he holds the salute. And I just stare at him for awhile. And he holds the salute. Try the nod again ... And this goes on. One time I just drove off with him still saluting me, but I felt like a tool all day for doing it. Every time I get stuck in traffic at the gate I assume that's what happening up front.

Make it easy on everyone and just return the salute. Just pretend like the roof of your car is the cover.
 
When I was handed over to the Army, I just did it their way. Not some 18 year old gate guard's fault that he doesn't know Navy traditions.
 
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I have heard about this too but have there actually been incidents?

recruiting stations. to me though the "cognitive dissonance" piece of this is that we take mandatory training on OPSEC and anti-terrorism that emphasizes how "not to be a target" but then we are told we have to broadcast our military affiliation from the time we leave our residences until we arrive on base. granted, it's just a commute, but it's just as legit as the stuff they cover in our training. i tell people my civilian clothes i come to work is my civilian camouflage uniform.

they periodically crack down on this, which usually results in increased compliance for a month or two until people slide back. we also have had varying degrees of "fancy fridays" which now are just the first friday of the month. because, you know, the ASU dress uniform is so well suited to patient care.

Make it easy on everyone and just return the salute. Just pretend like the roof of your car is the cover.

yeah, i feel sorry for the dudes and i just give them a cursory salute back to avoid weirdness. in reg or not i just want to get through the damn gate.

--your friendly neighborhood scrubs can be fancy if you wear a jacket caveman
 
yeah, i feel sorry for the dudes and i just give them a cursory salute back to avoid weirdness. in reg or not i just want to get through the damn gate.

WRAMC had civilian gate guards back in the day so saluting was not an issue. As an aside, those same civilian gate guards engaging in gunfights on Georgia Ave. because one called another '******ed' was an issue, but nevertheless, saluting was not an issue.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/06/21/AR2007062101627.html

We had our 1 hour lecture on basics of military customs and courtesies during intern orientation where the Master Sergeant specifically instructed us on the appropriateness of returning salutes to gate guards (even though we were in a vehicle, uncovered, and possibly not in uniform). On my first rotation at NNMC, I was tracked down by a CPO because the Seaman gate guards informed him that I returned uncovered salutes at the gate. The CPO made me sit through a 30 minute presentation on military customs and courtesies.

Fast forward 4 years, where a few months into "staffdom" at Fort Benning, the department NCOIC tracks me down to ask why I nod at the MPs guarding the gate instead of returning their salutes and proceeds to ask me if I wanted a 15 minute refresher on military customs and courtesies.

I went home that night and started rereading Catch-22.
 
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WRAMC had civilian gate guards back in the day so saluting was not an issue. As an aside, those same civilian gate guards engaging in gunfights on Georgia Ave. because one called another '******ed' was an issue, but nevertheless, saluting was not an issue.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/06/21/AR2007062101627.html

We had our 1 hour lecture on basics of military customs and courtesies during intern orientation where the Master Sergeant specifically instructed us on the appropriateness of returning salutes to gate guards (even though we were in a vehicle, uncovered, and possibly not in uniform). On my first rotation at NNMC, I was tracked down by a CPO because the Seaman gate guards informed him that I returned uncovered salutes at the gate. The CPO made me sit through a 30 minute presentation on military customs and courtesies.

Fast forward 4 years, where a few months into "staffdom" at Fort Benning, the department NCOIC tracks me down to ask why I nod at the MPs guarding the gate instead of returning their salutes and proceeds to ask me if I wanted a 15 minute refresher on military customs and courtesies.

I went home that night and started rereading Catch-22.

Lesson learned - Navy don't salute. Army, salute.
 
Lesson learned - Navy don't salute. Army, salute.

No, do the right thing for whatever service you're in.

Nitwits may give you crap for doing the right thing, but in the end it tends to work out better anyway.


Fast forward 4 years, where a few months into "staffdom" at Fort Benning, the department NCOIC tracks me down to ask why I nod at the MPs guarding the gate instead of returning their salutes and proceeds to ask me if I wanted a 15 minute refresher on military customs and courtesies.

Hopefully his tone was ... appropriate. And I hope you didn't let him give you the refresher. Better yet, you could've asked him to give the MPs a refresher. :)
 
I got saluted the other day at the gate in jeans and a tshirt without having shaved all day.....it felt gross
 
The Navy, Marine Corps, and Coast Guard never salute uncovered.
 
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Because we have people in command positions who have fallen away from clinical work, and into operational billets, and now they feel more like they're real Army (or insert service), but no one in the real Army respects them as if they've earned their rank, so they're overcompensating by trying to seem as if they're running a tight ship. Even though in actuality the ship hasn't floated in many years.

My brother (an Infantry Captain) calls the phenomenon "infantry envy".
 
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