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weird situation: Got into DO but want to reapply to MD...

Discussion in 'Re-Applicants [ MD / DO ]' started by afedorahat, 03.19.12.

  1. afedorahat

    afedorahat

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    I'm not sure if anyone else is in a similar boat as I am... (sorry this might be a little long)

    I graduated in May of 2011 with a 3.36 from UC Berkeley. My MCAT scores were 30P and 27R respectively. I applied the 2011-2012 cycle and only was able to interview and get accepted into DO schools. I have some great extracurriculars, great letter of recommendations, and I think a decent personality to get through the interviews. But I did not receive any interviews at any MD schools and now have decided to go to a DO school in the upcoming school year (Aug 2012)

    I was thinking of attending the school and reapplying to MD schools in the upcoming cycle after retaking the MCAT. I really think I could score higher. But I'm just not sure about being in a DO program and applying to the MD program. As much as I really appreciate the DO philosophy, there's no point in denying that opportunities are much more vast for MD students (recognition, residency positions, etc). I don't know (if I do get interviews) if the schools will think it's weird that I am applying to MD schools while I am at a DO school. Would it be helpful? Will it be deleterious?

    My plan for right now is to:
    Study for the MCAT: now - end of May
    take the MCAT: end of May
    turn in primaries: beginning of June
    release my MCAT score: when it comes out in early July

    I am at the beginning stage of my thought process but I am definitely aware of the fact that I need to make my decisions SOON. I just wanted to hear some thoughts. Much help is appreciated!
  2. Dharma

    Dharma

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    I disagree that the opportunities are MUCH more vast; although there are less obstacles and roadblocks on the allo path, I'm not sure if your chosen words are fitting. That said, if you really are having reservations about attending D.O. schools then DON'T GO! I'm sure I'm not the only one who will say that it's selfish as all hell to snag a seat, start school, and then bail. Just think of that other person out there who would love to have that seat of yours that you are taking for granted. Not cool to take it if you really don't want it.

    That said, if you do this, your chances are pretty slim at the MD schools. I know it's been done in the past, but I'm not sure it will look so good to adcoms. With your grades I doubt you can pull off an acceptance before July, so that would mean starting classes at the DO school, and then interviewing (if you get one) during your semester. Good luck with that.

    If you're having reservations about DO school, hold off. Do whatever you have to do to improve your application. You may even have to accept the fact that it could take another year or so to pull off an MD acceptance. But if you want to go for it this year, don't take the DO seat, apply MD early and broadly (i.e. almost anywhere), and roll the dice... because throwing away a seat is definitely a gamble. Again, I have to say, occupying a seat in the DO school (at the start of classes) that someone else could've had is unethical IMHO. Do the right thing.

    I'd count my blessings and start medical school this year though... that is, with the intentions of graduating from this school. Best of luck with your decision.
  3. SLC

    SLC Lock, Step, & Gone

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    This post begs the question...Why the hell did you even apply DO in the first place?

    I don't agree that it should only be viewed as a backup plan, but you clearly treated it as such; whatever, that's fine. But still, you obviously weren't what the MD schools were looking for, so your plan B worked and now you aren't happy?

    I hope you decide not to attend the DO, then reapply and get rejected across the border. Only then will you know what an incredible opportunity you're thinking of squandering.

    Sorry, I know it's harsh, but you should be ashamed.
    imran1011 likes this.
  4. Jlaw

    Jlaw

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    There isn't much difference between DO and MD. Sure Harvard > RVU but compare a DMU or KCUMB to MD schools and the playing field will look alot more even. Bottom line is do well where you are and opportunity will present itself.

    That said, if you want to go MD then do not enroll at the DO school, the MD schools you apply to will be aware of this and I would be shocked if they even sent you secondaries let alone gave you an interview. Why should they poach another schools students? Plus it makes you look indecisive and insecure.

    Also not to be a dick but what makes you think you can do better on the MCAT? You've taken it twice and scored below MD standards both times and your retake was only 3 points higher than your first time.


    My best advice is to be happy with what you have, you would be crazy to turn down an acceptance to gamble on the future. You could very easily score a 33 on the MCAT this summer, reapply and not get in anywhere.
  5. Bernoull

    Bernoull

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    You should be very careful about doing this. Med schools DO NOT like to poach students from other programs, even non-medical programs, let alone medical ones. This is partly why they insist you finish any degree program prior to matriculation (e.g. MBA --> MD etc). Furthermore, this can come off as opportunistic, if you start DO just to then apply MD. Lastly, I'm not sure if MD schools would consider you as a transfer applicant, if they do, you will need a VERY compelling reason to have a shot at a transfer. Either way, you need to have a very good reason (better opportunities won't cut it) for MD schools to take ur application seriously. Again, they don't want to poach students.

    You want to think long and hard, if you go DO, u'll be a physician in 4 years and if u work hard, u'll have a good shot at ur specialty of choice. If you ditch DO, u're taking a gamble with NO guarantees of an MD acceptance.

    Lastly, on ur MD re-application, they'll like to know how ur application has improved over last year's and "starting DO, then thinking a leaving..." may not be the best answer to that essay question.

    GL
  6. Finches

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    Oh, please. For people whose goals are the MD degree, applying to both MD and DO, with the latter usually being a backup plan, is pretty common and strategic. I don't agree with OP's attend-then-bail idea, but seriously man, calm down.

    By the way, the bolded part: totally uncalled for, especially in a community of people trying their best to get into their goal/dream schools.
  7. MedPR

    MedPR

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    OP you got a 30, then retook and got a 27? That's the way it appears in your post. If that's the case, you are going to need one hell of a score to get a shot at MD since you retook it once already and did worse than you did the first time.
  8. afedorahat

    afedorahat

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    Haha thanks Finches...
    I do think the curse that SLC cast on me was a little uncalled for, but whatever. and besides that, thanks for everyone's thoughtful words! I think I was having a little anxiety attack at the last minute, but I have decided to just attend the school that I was originally planning on attending and getting my degree. I do still believe that there's a lot of misunderstanding about DO's and that is something that we can't ignore but in the end, I will become a doctor, and that's what is important! I'm sorry I came off as being selfish and inconsiderate to other pre-med students - that was never the intention. Good luck with everyone's endeavors (whatever they may be) and thanks again!
  9. centraldogma

    centraldogma The Young Wolf

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    This is completely uncalled for. OP is asking for advice on his/her situation, not your judgement.

    I would say if you want to apply again, contact your school and see if you can defer for a year. That way you'll still have them as a backup just in case.

    Also if you're going to apply again your MCAT really needs to improve. Also you might want to look into programs to improve your gpa. Hope this helps. Good luck, OP :)
  10. KaseyA

    KaseyA

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    What are your science gpa and non-sci gpa?
  11. docnotsopc

    docnotsopc

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    Wow there is a lot of unnecessary hate. I am currently a first year DO student considering applying to MD schools this summer. Why? It WILL make a difference in the long run if I want go into something competitive. I know for sure now I do not want to go into Family Medicine, psych, or neuro which the majority of DO students go into. Do DO students match into impressive residencies? Of course, but the chances are so against you its ridiculous.

    Hopefully, (im pretty sure this is true) my first year DO grades will be included in my GPA calculation, which will do wonders when you consider that first year med school is 70+ credits.

    Also most importantly something I greatly underestimated the importance of: Quality of education. Going from a well respected top school in undergrad to my current school was a huge change. I went to from top professors in their fields to average joe smoes who dont know how to teach. For the record, I go to one the "top 3" DO schools if not the best depending on who you talk to. No matter what medical school you attend (DO or MD), everyone learns the same material for the most part. What makes the difference in quality of education is how well professors present the material, and how well your school prepares you for the boards. This makes the path MUCH less bumpy. Most MD schools are heavy on academics and have a ton of money to throw around.

    Will getting into an MD school solve this? Ya probably depending on the school. Could I achieve the exact same residency as a DO? Totally, but it would be much much harder to achieve.

    OP, do what you want. Dont feed into this "take someone elses spot". if you earned the seat, and you pay the tuition it is your right to do whatever you want with it. Worst scenario, you stay DO and become a doctor which is a pretty good "worst" scenario
    trinity111222 likes this.
  12. AvidAvatar

    AvidAvatar

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    Personally, I think this is totally silly. You have a 3.36 and 30/27? A 3.4 is low any way you slice it, and even if you improve your MCAT score I just don't see it having a high probability of happening. Maybe if you get >35...or you have some ace up your sleeve. Add in the challenges of applying to another program while in a medical school program?? Yikes dude. :thumbdown:

    The only thing you should be worrying about right now is hitting the gym and buffing up so you can impress some girls in OMM, thus getting plenty of 'studying opportunities' for later. Hit the books, concentrate on your current program, and do great. You will get to do whatever you want to get into! :thumbup:

    This is not supposed to be mean. I have no hostility towards you OP.
    Last edited: 04.07.12
  13. ruiner

    ruiner

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    I don't think this is the best plan. You've already gone down on the MCAT. You didn't get any interviews at MD school this cycle. I know how it is applying md/do but sometimes you just need to be realistic and happy with your available opportunities. Enjoy your time before school starts.
  14. Prncssbuttercup

    Prncssbuttercup Established Member -- OMSIII

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    This seems like trolling to me. Honestly. The two of you know that you MUST put down you've been accepted to and matriculated to a medical school right??? So how EXACTLY are you going to bridge that when it comes up?? You people are ridiculous. I should just point out, because it seems you don't know, that lying on your application is absolute grounds for dismissal even through your residency if they catch you... Just an FYI... Get your heads out of your butts, if you didn't want a DO degree don't apply and waste everyone's time...
  15. docnotsopc

    docnotsopc

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    I have a 100% legitimate reason. Im not from this country, and to make things A LOT easier to return home (if I want to) an MD would work in my favor. I already emailed several schools and they didnt seem this to be a problem at all.

    I see you are a pre-med. There is MANY things you will learn once you get into med school, especially if its a DO school. Things you didnt know. For example: At this time of year, do you what the difference between MD and DO curriculum is for 2nd years? Im willing to bet you have no idea. Many DO schools dont finish for a while (ie mid to end may). Boards are in June-July. Many MD schools are finishing up now and many MD schools have been prepping their students with board style review classes for the last month. What does that mean? Quite a few MD schools are at a huge advantage for the boards because of this. I hope you are smart enough to see how this doesn't work in favor of DO students.

    Dont get me wrong, Im fine should I have no option and stay a DO. I will be a doctor. It will probably limit my options of going home, but "worst" case scenario im a doctor in the US which isn't really that bad. I would just prefer to go home (my fianceee cant get into this country, since the US visa rules are ridiculous)

    Get our heads out of butts and stop wasting everyones time? Wow. You are going to do wonders speaking to your patients, should you even get into med school
  16. listentoadvice

    listentoadvice Removed

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    Wait, let me get the details straight. You're a first year right now and planning to apply to MD schools for the 2012 - 2013 cycle while you're an OMS-II. For arguments sake, I'll assume you get accepted. Are you planning on retaking your two preclinical years again or applying as a transfer student?
  17. TriagePreMed

    TriagePreMed Removed

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    No, you don't have a legitimate reason. What you think is a legitimate reason is "I didn't do my research on Osteopathic medicine" or "I'm using DO as a backup" because that's the reality here. You should have known about your country before applying, and honestly, I think you probably did.
  18. plauto

    plauto

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    Go for it. You'll open up a DO spot for someone who wants it....(and you won't get in and MD school).
  19. Prncssbuttercup

    Prncssbuttercup Established Member -- OMSIII

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    Yes, I am a pre-med with two acceptances and I start in July. My comment stands, & now I think YOU'RE a pompous asshat. I don't worry for my future patients but I do worry for yours. Since you didn't want a DO, don't want to practice in the US and are clearly SO superior to DO students, why didn't you just apply in the Carib in the first place so you could have your coveted MD? I'm surprised that "you talked to several schools" because I looked at several MD schools policies on 'advanced-standing transfers' and they ALL said you have to have been accepted to an MD school in the first place, so I assume you'll be repeating MS I/II... And taking on an additional ~80-120k in debt, yes, you're clearly much smarter than I am...
  20. Cognitive

    Cognitive

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    [​IMG]
  21. dbizzy

    dbizzy

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    OP said he was gonna attend the DO school. About 12 posts ago. Close this damn thread already before somebody gets (their feelings) hurt.
  22. Planets

    Planets

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    Read my mind. A few people my class actually did this and took off (2 of them to Caribbean schools!). It's unbelievable what people do for a title. Even though it's not a huge difference in opportunities (DOs have their own programs in competitive fields), these guys going to Caribbean schools from DO schools cut their chances of a competitive field just to get that MD.
  23. donkeykong1

    donkeykong1

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    There is a lot of of misconceptions in this thread. If anyone wishes to consider the real Stats on how US MD compare to US DO when it comes to matching E-ROAD ACGME residencies see below for the percentage of grads successfully matching in each specialty:

    Rads MD (0.7%) DO (0.7%)

    Gas MD (4.3%) DO (4.6%)

    EM MD (8.1%) DO (11.3%)

    Ortho MD (4.0%) DO (0.1%)/2 students

    For highly specialized fields with a small number of residency programs like ENT, derm, ortho, optha, urology DOs in general are better of going AOA.

    http://www.nrmp.org/data/resultsanddata2011.pdf
  24. Oxer45

    Oxer45

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    Wow. Just wow. I have yet to meet a DO in real life who hates DO so much. No wonder you don't like your school or the education you're receiving. I'm gonna come back to this post in a year. Let us know if you got into MD school or not.

    You're obviously don't think things through:
    1. Instead of spending 2nd yr re-applying and interviewing, why not study hard and get a good usmle/comlex score and get into the residency you want?

    2. Also unless you're thinking of re-doing yr 1+2, that means you'll start MD school at clinical yrs (3-4). If you're in the top 3 DO schools, you'll do clinical rotations at the same hospitals as your MD counterparts. So what's the point?

    3. If you redo yr 1-2, then you just wasted 2 yrs. Why not do research for 1 yr, get your med school tuition 1/2 free, and get into any specialty you want? Have you ever heard of a DO anatomy fellow not get into any surgical sub-specialty he or she wanted
  25. ruiner

    ruiner

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    I just noticed there were two different people asking in this thread. I don't think it's the best idea for you either, but if you really feel you have a strong reason, and your's is not the worst I've heard (also far from the best though), I have heard of other students applying and getting into an allopathic school. You can even mark your course work on AMCAS as osteopathic so it's obviously not unheard of. If you are not happy where you are go for it, though I would be careful how much you piss off your home institute. AMCAS is separate from DO schools though so besides getting your transcript sent in, it is unlikely they would know unless you say something. But really think about it, are you just one of those "grass is greener" people and will (most likely) repeating 2 years of really make you happy? If answer is yes, investigate it.
  26. Jlaw

    Jlaw

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    So docnotsopc and the OP are you both still considering this? I honestly think there is probably a 99.9% chance this will not work....transferring between medical schools is extremely difficult and transferring between medical schools with different medical philosophies is even more so. Most cases involve extenuating life circumstances that occurred after your acceptance (if you wanted to practice in your home country and a DO degree won't let you do that then too bad, should have thought of that before hand). Also most schools think of their curriculums as unique in some way so they will probably require you to repeat your pre clinical years so as to be on the same level as the other students.

    Also remember that adcoms are aware that by letting you transfer they are essentially letting you ruin two other students chances to attend medical school- the one you beat out for a seat your first school and the one you are taking a seat from at your new school.
  27. Jlaw

    Jlaw

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    I don't agree with this. Medical school, unlike undergrad is much more self directed...remember most med students don't even attend lectures unless they are mandatory. There is so much material to learn that the best prof in the world is not going to make one lick of difference if the student doesn't have the motivation to learn on their own. Sure their are good and bad professors but at this level it matters much less than in undergrad.

    Now I think it is true that some curriculums prepare students better for boards than others but this varies from school to school and is not an MD vs DO thing. There are DO schools with better board scores than MD and there are MD schools with better board scores than DO. But even so this also depends on the students themselves, one class might have a 97% first time pass rate while the next class will go through the exact same curriculum with the exact same support and score a 94% first time pass rate.
  28. TriagePreMed

    TriagePreMed Removed

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    This person should go sit in some MD classes and see if he really finds the change he expects. I suspect he will not. I went to a top 4-year institution and then went to a community college for Pre-Med due to financial hardship. There were some professors at my community college were exceedingly better than those at my 4-year institution. Usually institutions are considered "top" because of the research they produce, not the quality of teaching undergrads.
  29. somekindof

    somekindof

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    If you think you will do better on boards because you think a school has a "better quality of education," you are going to be in for a rude awakening. I find it hard to believe that someone that has gone through a year of medical school would think that how a professor presents the ridiculous volume of information we are expected to learn will make any difference in how well you learn it. Most medical schools are self-learning anyways, especially the PBL-based ones, so it doesn't really matter how good a professor is. Some students at schools with lectures don't even attend the lectures and still do fine. If you think you aren't learning, it's almost undoubtedly your fault, not the professors.
  30. dragonfly99

    dragonfly99

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    I went to a famous supposedly Top 5 MD school in the US and the teaching sucked, in my opinion (overall). And yes they had money but they didn't necessarily spend it on med students...though some things like the financial aid office and the other administrative offices were well run. I'm not sure switching from DO to an MD school is going to increase the likelihood of good teaching. A bird in the hand is usually worth two in the bush.
  31. Morsetlis

    Morsetlis SGU MS-4

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    Applies to a lot of other things in life too for conservative non-risk-taking people like physicians! :p
  32. pre med 2014

    pre med 2014 SDN Gold Donor Gold Donor

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    Now I don't have the facts to back this up, but I have heard girls in DO schools are better looking. :)
  33. pre med 2014

    pre med 2014 SDN Gold Donor Gold Donor

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    actually physicians tend to engage in adventurous risk taking hobbies because of the increased disposable income they typically have to spend on such pursuits
  34. COMedic2Doc

    COMedic2Doc

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    Actually in my opinion, Physicians have to be risk takers to a certain degree. Physicians take measured risks, meaning statistically they will come out on top. For me this comes about in patient care and management.
  35. ruiner

    ruiner

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    definitely true, its a law of physics i think
  36. Renegade85

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    Last edited: 08.16.12
  37. rad0nc

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    No one is going to argue with you about the opportunites for an MD being greater, but It will be very difficult to get into any MD school with that GPA. If you really want to practice medicine then suck it up and go the DO route. Whatever you do, don't matriculate into a DO school with the intention of reapplying to an MD school.
  38. COMedic2Doc

    COMedic2Doc

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    +1. Do not absolutely do not apply DO with the intention of reapplying MD if accepted DO. This does get around and will bite you in the *****. So make a decision and stick to it.
  39. Roguelyn

    Roguelyn

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    Since money isn't a bog concern, you may as well just go Caribbean. There's nearly guaranteed acceptance and some have rolling/continuous admission, so you wouldn't have to wait until the next school year to get started.
  40. afedorahat

    afedorahat

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    this thread is closed
    JoshSt likes this.
  41. xffan624

    xffan624

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    Wow, thanks for bumping a 2 year old thread to let us know that.
  42. RoadtoMD

    RoadtoMD

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    Lmfao... This thread is top of the list... Great now I know it's closed.
  43. JoshSt

    JoshSt Train, Say Your Prayers, Take Your Vitamins

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    Lol, thanks for that.

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