Wheaton Psy.D.

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Chase3557

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I will be attending Wheaton College come this fall. I'm curious what you all think about the Psy.D. program there.

Let's not turn this into any kind of a debate over "Christian psychology" or "de-gayifying" homosexuals. And please don't try to convince me to not attend here, or bash the school without any knowledge. I am enrolled and attending for good reason so please honor my decision. I'm fine with opposition; I just ask that you be respectful.

I have three questions so you can decide which to answer (or all three).
1. After graduation, what challenges might I face with a degree from a Christian private school?
2. With a professional degree like a Psy.D., doesn't it matter more in the experience (i.e., internships, practicum, post-doc) you can get rather than the school from which you've graduated?
3. How might I be at an advantage in having a Psy.D. from a Christian school?
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Chase3557 said:
I will be attending Wheaton College come this fall. I'm curious what you all think about the Psy.D. program there.

Let's not turn this into any kind of a debate over "Christian psychology" or "de-gayifying" homosexuals. And please don't try to convince me to not attend here, or bash the school without any knowledge. I am enrolled and attending for good reason so please honor my decision. I'm fine with opposition; I just ask that you be respectful.

I have three questions so you can decide which to answer (or all three).
1. After graduation, what challenges might I face with a degree from a Christian private school?
2. With a professional degree like a Psy.D., doesn't it matter more in the experience (i.e., internships, practicum, post-doc) you can get rather than the school from which you've graduated?
3. How might I be at an advantage in having a Psy.D. from a Christian school?
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I currently work with an individual who attends/attended a Christian Psy.D. program. From what this person has told me, and from what I've seen myself, she's definitely faced an uphill battle at nearly all levels of training (in this case, finding internship and post-doc placements).

The experience does matter, but I know she feels and/or has been told that her applications to at least a few sites have been summarily dismissed for no other reason than the name of her program. Thus, in some cases, the school can matter more than the training; however, the two often go hand-in-hand, as the school may have attained its reputation owing to the perceived subpar training of its applicants in the past (not saying this applies to the person with whom I work, who is a very talented clinician, or Wheaton). Additionally, I believe she had to take it upon herself to obtain training opportunities/placements not directly offered by her program in order to become a competitive applicant.

I honestly couldn't tell you if the Christian component of her training provided any additional stigma above and beyond the professional school Psy.D. factor, though.
 
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Thanks for the info. Even though it's not all that positive, it does help to know. I'm just trying to get a grasp of what I'm entering into. I'm trying to do some little things that might boost my intern applications (like working on my Spanish). We'll see how it goes though.
 
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Chase3557 said:
Thanks for the info. Even though it's not all that positive, it does help to know. I'm just trying to get a grasp of what I'm entering into. I'm trying to do some little things that might boost my intern applications (like working on my Spanish). We'll see how it goes though.
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Wasn't at all trying to discourage you, just letting you know what I've seen and heard. At the least, it should hopefully (as you've said) help you prepare yourself for internship applications by possibly securing a few additional practica and research opportunities to increase clinical and research training and breadth. That's something I'd recommend to pretty much anyone, regardless of their grad program.
 
I am currently on practicum with two other students from Wheaton College. I've learned a bit about the program from working with them. Wheaton's community is very close-knit, so you'll know your classmates very well. They also work to help you find practicum placements and hold their own practicum fair to provide you with additional opportunities to meet sites. There are also a number of research opportunities available, which I would encourage you to pursue to strengthen your applications, as well as improving your Spanish. I know that Wheaton students can struggle in matching to some of the more competitive placements like in hospitals, but some still do end up placing in more competitive sites. There are a number of alumni in the Chicagoland area, so if you are looking to get involved with a group practice after licensure there might be some opportunities to work with those practices as well. From what I gathered hearing about this most recent Match Day, the Wheaton students did fairly well overall on their internship match process. While there might be some struggles, I think if you are willing to work hard and try to find opportunities to help set yourself apart in comparison to other students, you'll be fine with a PsyD from Wheaton.
 
AcronymAllergy said:
Wasn't at all trying to discourage you, just letting you know what I've seen and heard. At the least, it should hopefully (as you've said) help you prepare yourself for internship applications by possibly securing a few additional practica and research opportunities to increase clinical and research training and breadth. That's something I'd recommend to pretty much anyone, regardless of their grad program.
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Oh I totally understand. That is exactly the kind of info I'm wanting. Both sides. Thank you for telling me in a kind and optimistic manner though.

Lyra33 said:
I am currently on practicum with two other students from Wheaton College. I've learned a bit about the program from working with them. Wheaton's community is very close-knit, so you'll know your classmates very well. They also work to help you find practicum placements and hold their own practicum fair to provide you with additional opportunities to meet sites. There are also a number of research opportunities available, which I would encourage you to pursue to strengthen your applications, as well as improving your Spanish. I know that Wheaton students can struggle in matching to some of the more competitive placements like in hospitals, but some still do end up placing in more competitive sites. There are a number of alumni in the Chicagoland area, so if you are looking to get involved with a group practice after licensure there might be some opportunities to work with those practices as well. From what I gathered hearing about this most recent Match Day, the Wheaton students did fairly well overall on their internship match process. While there might be some struggles, I think if you are willing to work hard and try to find opportunities to help set yourself apart in comparison to other students, you'll be fine with a PsyD from Wheaton.
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Thank you for your very helpful advice and comments about the school! That makes me feel better. I'm trying to keep from worrying as I know this is years in the future. But I want to be as informed as possible so that I can start off on the right foot.
 
I was wondering what you thought of Wheaton College now that you have attended? I will likely be applying for next year.
@Chase3557
 
I took a graduate course taught by a professor from Wheaton. Wonderful and knowledgable professor; however, his Christian twinge (on neuropsychology out of all things) drove me crazy. Though I would still recommend the professor and the program as a whole.
 
Honest question here. If there is a religious component to training, is it at the expense of core coursework, practica, time in supervision or patient care common to other programs? During a given course such as psychopathology or history and systems or developmental, what amount of the time is devoted to discussing religious issues? If it is the case you're getting less generalist training in psychology to accommodate religious training (or "forensic track" training... insert whatever you'd like here), you could argue it would represent a disadvantage for the training program. On that note, do different Christian programs vary in how much time is devoted to psychology versus religion?
 
Some of the faculty members in our program graduated from Rosemead School at Biola University. They have a Christian/Spiritual focus in all of their courses with a Psychodynamic emphasis. They get a MS in Theology on the way to completing the PhD/PsyD in Clinical Psychology. Spiritual and Psychology are intertwined throughout the whole program. One of the faculty members taught a Intro to Neuropsychology Course one semester and other students indicated that he used mindfulness and yoga principles of neuropsychology from a Eastern Religions perspective and Cultural perspective. Well...that was the last time he taught Intro to Neuropsychology course!;)
 
Did the professor get canned for saying he personally practiced something non-Christian, for teaching a non-Christian practice, or because he went off track from neuropsych? I actually had an interesting presentation on mindfulness and meditation in a master's program, but that was a cognitive neuroscience course where we spent a lot of time on consciousness.
 
student til 30 said:
Honest question here. If there is a religious component to training, is it at the expense of core coursework, practica, time in supervision or patient care common to other programs? During a given course such as psychopathology or history and systems or developmental, what amount of the time is devoted to discussing religious issues? If it is the case you're getting less generalist training in psychology to accommodate religious training (or "forensic track" training... insert whatever you'd like here), you could argue it would represent a disadvantage for the training program. On that note, do different Christian programs vary in how much time is devoted to psychology versus religion?
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I know at Wheaton there are separate courses to handle Spiritual/Religious topics. There are several required theology and integrative courses, as well as a series of seminars devoted to processing clinical experiences from practicum within a Christian worldview. This seminar seems to be more to help Christian students work through ethical concerns that may come up as a result of their worldview than it is to change how the student would handle certain individuals in treatment. While there may certainly be mention of Spiritual/Religious topics in a core course such as Psychopathology, no significant time is spent on that subject.

I can't speak for the school but it seems to me that their core coursework and supervision is preparing students to practice as any other school would, up to APA standards. The Christian bent of the program is more for thinking about/working through some seemingly contradictory ideas that may come up when studying Psychology while maintaining an evangelical Christian worldview.
 
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She believed in teaching most of her courses from a Christian/Spiritual/Buddhist mindset and did well teaching multicultural diversity courses but did not get good ratings for teaching Intro to Neuropsychology and another faculty member was hired to teach the Neuropsychology and Physiology Psychology courses.
 
corndog56 said:
I know at Wheaton there are separate courses to handle Spiritual/Religious topics. There are several required theology and integrative courses, as well as a series of seminars devoted to processing clinical experiences from practicum within a Christian worldview. This seminar seems to be more to help Christian students work through ethical concerns that may come up as a result of their worldview than it is to change how the student would handle certain individuals in treatment. While there may certainly be mention of Spiritual/Religious topics in a core course such as Psychopathology, no significant time is spent on that subject.

I can't speak for the school but it seems to me that their core coursework and supervision is preparing students to practice as any other school would, up to APA standards. The Christian bent of the program is more for thinking about/working through some seemingly contradictory ideas that may come up when studying Psychology while maintaining an evangelical Christian worldview.
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So if a client comes in and mentions a couple routine things that might be hot topics for Evangelical Christians, then says they want to work on some common clinical problem, does the therapist treat it in a way that's no different than any other therapist, then process their reactions as a Christian therapist behind the scenes? For example, what happens when an unmarried client who hasn't been to church since childhood and has a history of severe social anxiety has a panic attack in her doctor's waiting room, causing her to leave the office without getting the contraceptive she came for? Let's assume the client's goal is not to have the panic attack. Do we have a conventional course of treatment using some modality with a good evidence base, then some form of religious processing after the session is over? Religious counseling first, then implementation of some secular practice? I'm wondering what differences in practice actually look like, to the extent they exist.
 
student til 30 said:
So if a client comes in and mentions a couple routine things that might be hot topics for Evangelical Christians, then says they want to work on some common clinical problem, does the therapist treat it in a way that's no different than any other therapist, then process their reactions as a Christian therapist behind the scenes? For example, what happens when an unmarried client who hasn't been to church since childhood and has a history of severe social anxiety has a panic attack in her doctor's waiting room, causing her to leave the office without getting the contraceptive she came for? Let's assume the client's goal is not to have the panic attack. Do we have a conventional course of treatment using some modality with a good evidence base, then some form of religious processing after the session is over? Religious counseling first, then implementation of some secular practice? I'm wondering what differences in practice actually look like, to the extent they exist.
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Yes, evidence based treatment always. The only time religion/spirituality would be brought into a therapy session is if the client wants to explore that themselves. Granted, many Christian psychologists from programs like Wheaton go on to work at Christian counseling practices, which typically will draw a Christian crowd - so the topic may be brought up quite a bit.
 
There is an evidence base to support that people can use religion or spirituality as a coping tool. There are also patients that struggle with religious concepts that are part of their internalized system of beliefs and some of these might be maladaptive. Any psychotherapist, regardless of theoretical modality, is going to be talking about religion and beliefs with many patients. How you approach these topics and process them with your patients depends very much on your own modality. I actually think that we as a field tend to be more uncomfortable with how to address than we do any other topic with our patients. We tend to focus on the more negative and pathological aspects of religious beliefs. We also have a much lower rate of religious involvement or identification than the general population so we need to take that into account, as well.
 
student til 30 said:
So if a client comes in and mentions a couple routine things that might be hot topics for Evangelical Christians, then says they want to work on some common clinical problem, does the therapist treat it in a way that's no different than any other therapist, then process their reactions as a Christian therapist behind the scenes? For example, what happens when an unmarried client who hasn't been to church since childhood and has a history of severe social anxiety has a panic attack in her doctor's waiting room, causing her to leave the office without getting the contraceptive she came for? Let's assume the client's goal is not to have the panic attack. Do we have a conventional course of treatment using some modality with a good evidence base, then some form of religious processing after the session is over? Religious counseling first, then implementation of some secular practice? I'm wondering what differences in practice actually look like, to the extent they exist.
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This makes me laugh...as if these things make me wince and squirm when I see patients.

While, personally, I might prefer not having children out of wedlock, I can think of about 100 other things worse that we encounter every day as MH professionals.
 
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Plus contraceptives have uses other than pregnancy prevention (and even the Catholic Church is cool with BC use for those). I mean, I get that wasn't your point, but I hate that arguments about women's access to BC don't ever seem to consider that aspect of it.
 
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student til 30 said:
So if a client comes in and mentions a couple routine things that might be hot topics for Evangelical Christians, then says they want to work on some common clinical problem, does the therapist treat it in a way that's no different than any other therapist, then process their reactions as a Christian therapist behind the scenes? For example, what happens when an unmarried client who hasn't been to church since childhood and has a history of severe social anxiety has a panic attack in her doctor's waiting room, causing her to leave the office without getting the contraceptive she came for? Let's assume the client's goal is not to have the panic attack. Do we have a conventional course of treatment using some modality with a good evidence base, then some form of religious processing after the session is over? Religious counseling first, then implementation of some secular practice? I'm wondering what differences in practice actually look like, to the extent they exist.
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A licensed psychologist would treat the anxiety and if there are beliefs that are underlying the anxiety we would talk about that, as well. It is unethical for me to not respect other's personal religious beliefs as that is counter to some aspect of the APA ethics code and since I am just on lunch and this is not a "real" issue, I'm not going to bother to look it up. A licensed psychologist also has to be very cognizant of their own personal beliefs and how to represent themselves or not. I question whether or not it is ethical for someone to brand themselves as a "Christian Psychologist". There are different types of pastoral counselors and I believe that so long as they are clear in their roles, that is fine. Having the title of Psychologist is a different matter. What about a Christian Surgeon or a Buddhist Neurologist?
 
smalltownpsych said:
A licensed psychologist would treat the anxiety and if there are beliefs that are underlying the anxiety we would talk about that, as well. It is unethical for me to not respect other's personal religious beliefs as that is counter to some aspect of the APA ethics code and since I am just on lunch and this is not a "real" issue, I'm not going to bother to look it up. A licensed psychologist also has to be very cognizant of their own personal beliefs and how to represent themselves or not. I question whether or not it is ethical for someone to brand themselves as a "Christian Psychologist". There are different types of pastoral counselors and I believe that so long as they are clear in their roles, that is fine. Having the title of Psychologist is a different matter. What about a Christian Surgeon or a Buddhist Neurologist?
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Like the title or not, there is a large population who would not see a Psychologist or other mental health professional unless there was an understanding that they held the same religious beliefs. As mentioned above, this field is overwhelmingly non-Christian, and that is evident to the public through the vocal few who claim religious beliefs to be psychopathology. From these individuals perspective, a traditional Psychologist would just try to talk them out of their religion. So someone identifying as a Christian Psychologist would certainly be appealing to this population.

I agree that ethically this may not be an appropriate title. I'm guessing the actual work of someone who uses this title is a mix of psychology and pastoral counseling, depending upon the need of the client. I think so long as the treatment is being clearly identified to the client, and not being disguised as evidence based treatment when it is in fact just pastoral counseling, I don't see a problem.
 
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corndog56 said:
As mentioned above, this field is overwhelmingly non-Christian, and that is evident to the public through the vocal few who claim religious beliefs to be psychopathology. From these individuals perspective, a traditional Psychologist would just try to talk them out of their religion. So someone identifying as a Christian Psychologist would certainly be appealing to this population.
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I have yet to see this viewpoint from a licensed psychologist. Who are these vocal few?
 
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WisNeuro said:
I have yet to see this viewpoint from a licensed psychologist. Who are these vocal few?
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Freud, off the top of my head. You also hear similar sentiments from the anti-religious in the non-psychological realm who take Freud's idea of religion as "universal obsessional neurosis", and run with it. People like Bill Maher, Dave Silverman, and Sam Harris can be routinely found heralding this narrow view. I know that the current literature in Psychology indicates religion can be a helpful coping mechanism and has many benefits, but that is not always communicated to the public. Many people unfamiliar with the field immediately categorize all Psychologists as Freud-clones, not just with regards to religion, but also traditional psychoanalysis, etc.
 
^

I'm not saying this is a correct view, or that all (or any current) Psychologists hold these views. I'm just saying that is often how the field is viewed from Christians whose only experience with psychology is via pop-culture. At least in my experience.
 
WisNeuro said:
I have yet to see this viewpoint from a licensed psychologist. Who are these vocal few?
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I guess they are referring to Freud. Not sure how vocal he is these days though seeing as how he has been dead for quite a few decades.
:confused:
Edit: Yep.^^^
corndog56 said:
Like the title or not, there is a large population who would not see a Psychologist or other mental health professional unless there was an understanding that they held the same religious beliefs. As mentioned above, this field is overwhelmingly non-Christian, and that is evident to the public through the vocal few who claim religious beliefs to be psychopathology. From these individuals perspective, a traditional Psychologist would just try to talk them out of their religion. So someone identifying as a Christian Psychologist would certainly be appealing to this population.

I agree that ethically this may not be an appropriate title. I'm guessing the actual work of someone who uses this title is a mix of psychology and pastoral counseling, depending upon the need of the client. I think so long as the treatment is being clearly identified to the client, and not being disguised as evidence based treatment when it is in fact just pastoral counseling, I don't see a problem.
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I see people from many different ethnicities and religious backgrounds and I am a licensed psychologist. I would never try to talk someone out of any of their beliefs. That is not what we do. Anybody who is a licensed psychologist that attacks someones beliefs is not practicing within the spirit of the ethics code IMO. If their beliefs are contributing to their pathology in some way, it is possible that I might point that out, but usually I will direct them to talk to their minister, bishop, rabbi, priest, shaman, curandero about that issue. The reason being is that everytime I have run into this, the belief has been counter to the teachings of their own faith. I also have had more success, as far as being on the same page, referring patients to talk to the leaders of their faith than I have in referring to other providers.
 
smalltownpsych said:
I guess they are referring to Freud. Not sure how vocal he is these days though seeing as how he has been dead for quite a few decades.
:confused:
Edit: Yep.^^^

I see people from many different ethnicities and religious backgrounds and I am a licensed psychologist. I would never try to talk someone out of any of their beliefs. That is not what we do. Anybody who is a licensed psychologist that attacks someones beliefs is not practicing within the spirit of the ethics code IMO. If their beliefs are contributing to their pathology in some way, it is possible that I might point that out, but usually I will direct them to talk to their minister, bishop, rabbi, priest, shaman, curandero about that issue. The reason being is that everytime I have run into this, the belief has been counter to the teachings of their own faith. I also have had more success, as far as being on the same page, referring patients to talk to the leaders of their faith than I have in referring to other providers.
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Totally agree. Psychologists should not be talking anyone out of their religious beliefs. I'm talking about public perception not my own beliefs. I hope that wasn't implied by my post.
 
corndog56 said:
Totally agree. Psychologists should not be talking anyone out of their religious beliefs. I'm talking about public perception not my own beliefs. I hope that wasn't implied by my post.
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Public perception of our field is all over the map. Sometimes they ascribe us superpowers like mind reading and mind control, too!
 
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WisNeuro said:
So, it's not so much of a "vocal few" psychologists as it is a misunderstanding of what psychology is from some select members of the lay public?
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Yeah...

I apologize if it sounded as if I was saying that the "vocal few" were present day licensed psychologists. For the sake of the argument though, it doesn't necessarily matter who is propagating these ideas. So long as Bobby believes that psychology is the devil, he isn't getting close enough to it to find out that it's not so bad.
 
corndog56 said:
Yeah...

I apologize if it sounded as if I was saying that the "vocal few" were present day licensed psychologists. For the sake of the argument though, it doesn't necessarily matter who is propagating these ideas. So long as Bobby believes that psychology is the devil, he isn't getting close enough to it to find out that it's not so bad.
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That's why in private practice it is a good idea to reach out to local community members including church leaders to let them know that you are not working against them. I haven't really had to do that much though because usually my patients tell them and then the referrals flow my way. Trust me, most churches appreciate the help and I feel the same way right back at them.
 
corndog56 said:
Yeah...

I apologize if it sounded as if I was saying that the "vocal few" were present day licensed psychologists. For the sake of the argument though, it doesn't necessarily matter who is propagating these ideas. So long as Bobby believes that psychology is the devil, he isn't getting close enough to it to find out that it's not so bad.
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I don't know if this is quite the case either. Every place I've worked (VA, university clinic, AMC) psychology had a steady stream of referrals, and usually a waiting list. I imagine a good mix of those were people who identified as christian. Either that, or non-christians seek out psychotherapy at disproportionately large numbers in comparison. And, I'm not aware of any large survey data that suggests christians shun psychotherapy.
 
WisNeuro said:
I don't know if this is quite the case either. Every place I've worked (VA, university clinic, AMC) psychology had a steady stream of referrals, and usually a waiting list. I imagine a good mix of those were people who identified as christian. Either that, or non-christians seek out psychotherapy at disproportionately large numbers in comparison. And, I'm not aware of any large survey data that suggests christians shun psychotherapy.
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I'm not talking about all Christians. What is the point of your argument? I was suggesting that someone who identifies as a Christian psychologist would appeal to this demographic of Christians who do reject psychotherapy. Just like a republican politician who identifies as Christian would likely draw votes from a conservative Christian population.
 
Yeah, the only time I've seen issues with patients' Christianity is related to treatments that incorporate techniques that are associated with Eastern religious practice, like mindfulness.
 
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I'm not even implying that it's a widespread issue, just that there is a market for someone identifying themselves as a Christian psychologist.
 
There are many psychologists who are christians. That is much different than a Christian Psychologist. Erg has been pretty open about his own religious affiliation and background, but I am pretty certain that he practices from a scientific framework, not a theological. One of the key concepts of being an effective clinician is professional boundaries. It is of higher importance in our field because of the interpersonal nature of the treatment and the fact that we deal with more intangible constructs. I was at a practicum site with doctoral students from Biola and I became friends with one. He was very clear about his professional boundaries and personal beliefs and different roles. To me that is an important aspiration for us and it can play out in many other areas. As a psychologist in a small community, I am acutely aware of the importance of maintaining a separation between the personal and the professional because I see my patients around town in different contexts every day.

One more point I want to make is that I don't think there are very many Christian Psychologists. In my own experience, every time I have heard a reference to a Christian therapist, they were not a psychologist. There are many different types of people who could be called Christian Counselors and this Christian website delineates those fairly well: http://www.cbn.com/spirituallife/prayerandcounseling/choosing_a_christian_counselor.aspx
 
smalltownpsych said:
There are many psychologists who are christians. That is much different than a Christian Psychologist. Erg has been pretty open about his own religious affiliation and background, but I am pretty certain that he practices from a scientific framework, not a theological. One of the key concepts of being an effective clinician is professional boundaries. It is of higher importance in our field because of the interpersonal nature of the treatment and the fact that we deal with more intangible constructs. I was at a practicum site with doctoral students from Biola and I became friends with one. He was very clear about his professional boundaries and personal beliefs and different roles. To me that is an important aspiration for us and it can play out in many other areas. As a psychologist in a small community, I am acutely aware of the importance of maintaining a separation between the personal and the professional because I see my patients around town in different contexts every day.

One more point I want to make is that I don't think there are very many Christian Psychologists. In my own experience, every time I have heard a reference to a Christian therapist, they were not a psychologist. There are many different types of people who could be called Christian Counselors and this Christian website delineates those fairly well: http://www.cbn.com/spirituallife/prayerandcounseling/choosing_a_christian_counselor.aspx
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I do not think that Catholics, historically, have let their faith bleed into their careers nearly as much as some of the more, er...evangelical branches.

There was this guy at my internship site(not a psychologist) who would not shut-up about Jesus, what he did for him and daily basis, and what he could DO FOR YOU TOO! I usually just wanted to tell him to put a sock in it and get back to work. Apparently, not even the influence of the Devine Savior himself enabled this guy to schedule my patients correctly in VISTA. Hasbrown#Frustrated!
 
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erg923 said:
I do not think that Catholics, historically, have let their faith bleed into their careers nearly as much as some of the more, er...evangelical branches.

There was this guy at my internship (not a psychologist) site who would not shut-up about Jesus, what he did for him and daily basis, and what he DO FOR YOU TOO! I usually just wanted to tell him to put a sock in it and get back to work. Apparently, not even the influence of the Devine Savior himself enabled this guy to scheule my patient correctly in VISTA. Hasbrown#Frustrated!
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Lol, what would you do if the VA blocked this site sir :p
 
erg923 said:
I do not think that Catholics, historically, have let their faith bleed into their careers nearly as much as some of the more, er...evangelical branches.

There was this guy at my internship site(not a psychologist) who would not shut-up about Jesus, what he did for him and daily basis, and what he could DO FOR YOU TOO! I usually just wanted to tell him to put a sock in it and get back to work. Apparently, not even the influence of the Devine Savior himself enabled this guy to schedule my patients correctly in VISTA. Hasbrown#Frustrated!
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lol That is true what you say about Catholics, at least post-inquistion! I was raised Catholic and had a fine education at the hands of the sometimes loving, always intimidating and ever-vigilant nuns and I have seen the same dynamic. We were instructed more to lead by example than to evangelize.
 
The faculty who completed training at Rosemead were able to work as theologians and/or psychologists. It was so deeply engrained, the emphasis on theology and working for the Church or Christian Mission while having some deemphasis on the psychologist. The split was so intense that some did not desire becoming licensed by the psychology board and preferred working for the Church.

One of the faculty members taught classes and worked in the ministry for his full time job. He did eventually take the EPPP and become licensed about eight years after graduation, but he continued working for the Church in some capacity and advertised as being both a Christian Psychologist and a minister.
 
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I have quite a few psychologist friends who are Christian, and none of them advertise it because they don't want to be associated with the kind of pastoral counseling delivered by untrained and unlicensed people in the community. Their philosophy and approach in therapy is far more similar to mine, the agnostic. Freud is floridly misquoted, misunderstood, and misremembered, but even if everything people believed about him was true, it is 100 years later and psychoanalytic theory has evolved. All the same, I understand why someone might feel more comfortable with a Christian therapist, in the same way someone might prefer a female, or a fellow immigrant, or a gay man.
 
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I always ask about fit if I'm recommending psychotherapy...and fit (for many) includes the spiritual/religious aspect. I think it is important to delineate the difference btw pastoral counseling from something more secular, as many of the lay public group it all together. I generally split out spiritual counseling, skills training, and more traditional therapy. I know it isn't that defined, but it is easier for most patients to understand and (often) accept.
 
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vunx
vunx
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Should I get a Psy.D to enable me to do IMEs for Veterans?
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hemipepsis5p
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