Which clinical rotation is the worst?

[smq123]

God forbid anyone ever get shoved in the OR.

Ypo. - I get that you're into OB/gyn. And that's great. I really like it too, and I am thinking about it as a career. But dismissing people's negative experiences on the rotation is what gets ob/gyns the negative reputation in the first place.

Some people have genuinely crappy experiences on the rotation. Some ob/gyn residents are genuinely terrible people.

Sure, people get shoved in the OR during high stress times. This bothers some students more than it bothers others. (Although, I will point out, that I never got shoved in the OR on my surgery rotation, even during trauma cases. Also never got shoved during OB/gyn - I really feel that there is very little need for a good attending to shove anybody. There is something to be said for grace under fire, which is what characterizes good surgeons and good ob/gyns - all good doctors in general.)

But that attitude behind your remark doesn't make ob/gyns look any better - it just perpetuates the stereotype.

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[persia]

Thanks, Smq.

I did well in surgery and no one ever touched me. The only time people touched me on clinical rotations was sometimes on my arm in a friendly gesture. There was no emergency during the c-section, and I don't know why I was pushed. The stress level in ob is out of this world, and I really have no idea why. As alot of people here have said, some of the work is really interesting but the atmosphere seems unnecessarily harsh.

 

[Ypo.]

Ypo. - I get that you're into OB/gyn. And that's great. I really like it too, and I am thinking about it as a career. But dismissing people's negative experiences on the rotation is what gets ob/gyns the negative reputation in the first place.

Some people have genuinely crappy experiences on the rotation. Some ob/gyn residents are genuinely terrible people.

Hmmm. It sounds like you are truly misunderstanding my position. My comment was not made to stand up for Ob-gyns. I'm not offended by any of the remarks in this thread, whatsoever.

[
Sure, people get jostled in the OR during high stress times. This bothers some students more than it bothers others. (Although, I will point out, that I never got shoved in the OR on my surgery rotation, even during trauma cases. Also never got shoved during OB/gyn - I really feel that there is very little need for a good attending to shove anybody. There is something to be said for grace under fire, which is what characterizes good surgeons and good ob/gyns - all good doctors in general.) .

Some people take getting pushed out of the way (or accidentally pushed as is often the case) way too personally. This happens in both surgery and Ob-gyn.

I think there is a lot to say about giving people the benefit of the doubt, and not reading too much into a particular situation. I'm not asserting that anyone did not have a bad experience in their rotation. Getting "pushed" just because someone wants to be mean is unacceptable, in every case. However, when you are standing in the way of something that is urgent (i was shoved out of the way during a shoulder dystocia for example) I don't understand why a medically trained person would take it personally. Just as you say; grace under fire. It goes both ways.
I don't know the specifics of the situation surrounding Persia's example. But I'm willing to bet that "shoving" someone just for the fun of it in the OR is pretty rare next to pushing someone out of the way because they are unwittingly hindering the operation. Add to that the fact that what one person calls a "shove" another person views as someone accidentally bumping into them. If the students feelings are already hurt (by malignant personalities), then they will be more likely to interpret it as the former. I think we are essentially saying the same thing.

[
But that attitude behind your remark doesn't make ob/gyns look any better - it just perpetuates the stereotype.

My comment does not perpetuate any stereotype about Ob-gyns, as I am only a lowly medical student. I have not decided what I am going to go into, either, so ascribing my comment to any sort of "specialty personality" makes little sense as well. I think you read too far into one comment i made that was aimed at one very specific part of Persia's post. However, my apologies if I offended him/her.

 

[smq123]

Hmmm. It sounds like you are truly misunderstanding my position.

Maybe - always a hazard with internet communication. That's a fair assessment.

Some people take getting pushed out of the way (or accidentally pushed as is often the case) way too personally. This happens in both surgery and Ob-gyn.

However, when you are standing in the way of something that is urgent (i was shoved out of the way during a shoulder dystocia for example) I don't understand why a medically trained person would take it personally.

While I understand what you're saying, I don't know if I agree.

I think I thought that way when I first started third year. But then I did my ob/gyn and surgery rotations.

On ENT, the residents who truly knew what they were doing were always very gracious and polite, even when a vessel started spurting or something unexpected happened. The ones who were never really comfortable in the OR were the ones who started barking at the interns whenever there was a surprise.

On OB/gyn, there was a placental abruption during nightfloat. The resident (who is perhaps one of the most capable people I've met) was obviously stressed, but kept calling out to me, "You hanging in there? Doing okay?"

There was another placental abruption during my L&D day rotation. The attending was firing off orders to everyone, but prefaced each one with "please" and thanked people afterwards. She never lost her cool.

The chair of surgery is definitely not the "warm and fuzzy" type. And he's incredibly busy. But he still takes the time to greet each nurse and even med student by name.

I think that the biggest thing that I learned so far in third year was that just saying "Well, people get shoved in the OR - it happens" isn't really a good response - and I'm not saying this to lecture at you, but I'm saying this remind myself of this fact. No matter how bad the fit hits the shan (to borrow one of Castro Viejo's phrases), you can always find the energy to be polite to everyone around you. And people will judge your competence and skill level based on how you handle the surprises.

 

[SoCuteMD]

I think that the biggest thing that I learned so far in third year was that just saying "Well, people get shoved in the OR - it happens" isn't really a good response - and I'm not saying this to lecture at you, but I'm saying this remind myself of this fact. No matter how bad the fit hits the shan (to borrow one of Castro Viejo's phrases), you can always find the energy to be polite to everyone around you. And people will judge your competence and skill level based on how you handle the surprises.

When you are a surgeon and still have those ideas, can you please work at whatever hospital I'm at?

Kthanxbye!

 

[smq123]

When you are a surgeon and still have those ideas, can you please work at whatever hospital I'm at?

I hope I still I have those ideas 10 years from now! Keeping my fingers tightly crossed....

 

[Ypo.]

I think that the biggest thing that I learned so far in third year was that just saying "Well, people get shoved in the OR - it happens" isn't really a good response - and I'm not saying this to lecture at you, but I'm saying this remind myself of this fact. No matter how bad the fit hits the shan (to borrow one of Castro Viejo's phrases), you can always find the energy to be polite to everyone around you. And people will judge your competence and skill level based on how you handle the surprises.

I just disagree that "no matter how bad" things get, there is no excuse to ever physically push someone else out of the way, or that "politeness trumps all." In my case of being pushed out of the way during a shoulder dystocia, the nurse didn't go, "um, excuse me, medical student; I don't know your name. Would you mind moving out of my way so that I can put the patient knees back." And then wait politely for me to hear her, which may have taken awhile considering that I was completely focused on what was going on in front of me.

I'm not advocating being rude and I agree with you that the virtues of being polite are important for a smoothly working team (especially because if politeness is the rule rather than the exception, people will be less likely to take a shove the wrong way when it does happen). But I think you also need to be able to brush things off, give people the benefit of the doubt, and not hold onto your ego, especially when it involves patient care.

And people will judge your competence and skill level based on how you handle the surprises.

It's true that lay people will often judge a doctor by how "nice" they are, but it doesn't mean that they will be correct. Competence does not necessarily correlate; and stressful situations sometimes do call to put politeness aside. There are incompetent people who are always polite in the OR, just as there are the jerk surgeons/OB-gyns who are unfailingly meticulous in their work.

Anyways, the only real way to settle this is to have a good old fashioned rumble in the OR. You're going down, Smq.

 

[DoctorFunk]

Anyways, the only real way to settle this is to have a good old fashioned rumble in the OR. You're going down, Smq.

Wait, I thought they only let real surgeons into the OR?

*zoom zoom zoom!*

 

[Ypo.]

Wait, I thought they only let real surgeons into the OR?

*zoom zoom zoom!*

Well, obviously I was referring to the imaginary OR that they let the medical students into. You know, the one where they do all the shoving.

 

[DoctorFunk]

Well, obviously I was referring to the imaginary OR that they let the medical students into. You know, the one where they do all the shoving.

Oh, I think you misunderstood. I wasn't referring to med students not being allowed into the OR--I was talking about the truly surgically challenged, the OB-Gyns.

 

[Ypo.]

Oh, I think you misunderstood. I wasn't referring to med students not being allowed into the OR--I was talking about the truly surgically challenged, the OB-Gyns.

*sticks Doctor Funk with a scalpel.*

 

[DoctorFunk]

*sticks Doctor Funk with a scalpel.*

I should probably stop smarting off over here. I don't even have the guts to cut--I'm just a simple wannabe cath-jockey hoping for a chance to get into the angio suite someday.

 

[smq123]

I just disagree that "no matter how bad" things get, there is no excuse to ever physically push someone else out of the way, or that "politeness trumps all." In my case of being pushed out of the way during a shoulder dystocia, the nurse didn't go, "um, excuse me, medical student; I don't know your name. Would you mind moving out of my way so that I can put the patient knees back."

No one is expecting nurses or doctors to use long drawn out courtesies while in emergency situations. But would it have killed the nurse to gently push you out of the way, say "excuse me," and then go about her business? Shoving people out of the way is not necessary, even for a shoulder dystocia.

And this is what I mean by "grace under fire" being a demonstration of competence. No, nobody wants a shoulder dystocia. But it's a pretty bad ob/gyn or nurse who doesn't anticipate one in the back of his/her mind. Shoving you to get at the stool shouldn't be necessary.

It's true that lay people will often judge a doctor by how "nice" they are, but it doesn't mean that they will be correct. Competence does not necessarily correlate; and stressful situations sometimes do call to put politeness aside. There are incompetent people who are always polite in the OR, just as there are the jerk surgeons/OB-gyns who are unfailingly meticulous in their work.

Some of the courteous surgeons (who are meticulous) are still "jerks" in that they're not always warm and friendly - even towards patients. But they ARE always, always civil. And THAT, in my mind, is what distinguishes good surgeons from bad surgeons - are you capable enough that you can handle the unexpected, or are you barely competent enough that the slightest surprise causes a total meltdown? I don't think that that is a "lay" judgement at all. If, as a surgeon or ob/gyn, you don't know what to do if the patient throws you a curveball, then you're not a very good surgeon or ob/gyn.

Anyways, the only real way to settle this is to have a good old fashioned rumble in the OR. You're going down, Smq.

Oh please. I would use my one-handed tying skills to tie your thumbs down before you even got a chance.

Actually, if this were a surgery rotation, the suggestion wouldn't be an old-fashioned rumble in the OR - it would be in a wading pool full of pudding. I think I've been hanging out with surgeons a little too long....

 

[gbwillner]

Just thought I would chime in here since I finished OB/GYN yesterday and take the shelf tomorrow. Having taken all my cores now except for Psych, I can definitely say without a doubt that OB/GYN is the worst rotation with the worst residents with the worst atmosphere. A majority of the residents are apathetic towards medical students. For every great resident that's willing to spend time with you teaching, there are 3 who talk crap about anyone as soon as they leave the door, are disrespectful to the nursing staff, and mistreat the medical students.

I had a particular rough go of it with a few residents who for some reason started spreading false rumors about me, which eventually got reported to attendings, and now I'm in the position where I have to defend myself to the clerkship coordinator. Not to mention that I didn't find out about it until an attending approached me two days before the exam. I would have preferred to be shoved out of the way for a shoulder dystocia.

OB/GYN is so bad I would rather repeat 6 months of surgery than do another week in L&D.

 

[getunconcsious]

Yeah I don't know what's up with the angry OBgyn docs....Some of them were really nice but as you said they are totally outnumbered by the mean ones! I'm hoping surgery won't be this bad. OB/Gyn just seems to attract a real different breed of cat. And wtf is up with all this gossiping that they do? OMG I've never seen such mind games on any other rotations. From what I understand, at least the surgeons let you KNOW what they think! Ugh I can't say enough about how ridiculous this rotation is. I am so glad I got it out of the way first!

 

[Ypo.]

No one is expecting nurses or doctors to use long drawn out courtesies while in emergency situations. But would it have killed the nurse to gently push you out of the way, say "excuse me," and then go about her business? Shoving people out of the way is not necessary, even for a shoulder dystocia.

This is part of the point I was trying to make. What one person calls a shove, another calls a push, and another realizes it for what it is. The nurse was pushing past me to put the patient into McRobert's during a medical emergency; not purposely shoving me to be a bitch.

 

[haveaniceday]

Yeah I don't know what's up with the angry OBgyn docs....Some of them were really nice but as you said they are totally outnumbered by the mean ones! I'm hoping surgery won't be this bad. OB/Gyn just seems to attract a real different breed of cat. And wtf is up with all this gossiping that they do? OMG I've never seen such mind games on any other rotations. From what I understand, at least the surgeons let you KNOW what they think! Ugh I can't say enough about how ridiculous this rotation is. I am so glad I got it out of the way first!

The gossiping is the worst! Don't get me wrong, I do enjoy my fair share of gossip. But not in the workplace, espeically when the ones doing most of the gossiping are the doctors. They have very little concept of who is around and hearing them. Some of it is lighthearted but it also got pretty mean sometimes and was angled towards: their fellow residents, attendings, chair of the department, incoming residents, nurses, crnas, husbands, residents in other programs, I could go on. I can only imagine what was said about med students when we left the room.

It wasn't the stressful situations, it wasn't the long hours, it wasn't the extreme messiness that is ob/gyn, nor the demanding patients...the worst part of the whole experience is the culture. I feel like I just finished a rotation through the sorority house. One attending was actually braiding another attendings hair in clinic one day.

 

[gbwillner]

It wasn't the stressful situations, it wasn't the long hours, it wasn't the extreme messiness that is ob/gyn, nor the demanding patients...the worst part of the whole experience is the culture. I feel like I just finished a rotation through the sorority house. One attending was actually braiding another attendings hair in clinic one day.

Priceless!!!

I found that I actually liked most of the attendings I met. The worst were the 4th year residents, closely followed by the 3rd years. Some of the interns were apparently still human.

I'm all for equality in the workplace, but my experience on OB/GYN makes me wonder why most cultures have been male dominated and not female dominated... just sayin'.

 

[smq123]

I like learning about internal medicine. And my residents have been great. I get to do a lot (done more H&Ps on internal med and put in more orders than I did on other rotations). And I've been learning a lot.

But the social work, trying to find outpatient follow up for homeless patients, the drug seekers (we've had 3 this week on our service - 2 of whom were my patients), and the BS admits are kind of wearing me down.

 

[RockfordWF]

I like learning about internal medicine. And my residents have been great. I get to do a lot (done more H&Ps on internal med and put in more orders than I did on other rotations). And I've been learning a lot.

But the social work, trying to find outpatient follow up for homeless patients, the drug seekers (we've had 3 this week on our service - 2 of whom were my patients), and the BS admits are kind of wearing me down.

I suppose "getting to do alot" is all relative. I think that dictation, H & P's, and progress notes are best left to PA's/NP's. The outpatient follow up is best left to the social workers & case managers. If that excites you, then fine.

I'd rather be inserting a chest tube or central line. Any rotation that doesn't involve procedures is a waste.

 

[smq123]

I suppose "getting to do alot" is all relative. I think that dictation, H & P's, and progress notes are best left to PA's/NP's.

Don't do dictations.

I wanted to be sure that I could do a quick and efficient H&P before I left med school. We didn't do them on ob/gyn or surgery - internal med was kind of my last chance to do it.

The outpatient follow up is best left to the social workers & case managers. If that excites you, then fine.

Which social workers and case managers? Oh, you mean the ones that never answer your pages? The ones that always seem to be MIA or on "lunch breaks"? The social workers who refer you to case management when you call...and then the case managers who refer you right back to social work?

I hate the social work aspect - which is what I said that I hated about internal med. But, unfortunately, I have to do it since I don't have a choice.

 

[RockfordWF]

Don't do dictations.

I wanted to be sure that I could do a quick and efficient H&P before I left med school. We didn't do them on ob/gyn or surgery - internal med was kind of my last chance to do it.



Which social workers and case managers? Oh, you mean the ones that never answer your pages? The ones that always seem to be MIA or on "lunch breaks"? The social workers who refer you to case management when you call...and then the case managers who refer you right back to social work?

I hate the social work aspect - which is what I said that I hated about internal med. But, unfortunately, I have to do it since I don't have a choice.

It sounds like you need to do your rotation at a different hospital. Not all hospitals have useless ancillary staff.

I think that the ability to do an emergency procedure is a much more important skill to have for night call as an intern than an H & P. To each his own.

 

[SoCuteMD]

Any rotation that doesn't involve procedures is a waste.

I'm gonna have to go ahead and disagree with you on that one.

 

[DoctorFunk]

I think that the ability to do an emergency procedure is a much more important skill to have for night call as an intern than an H & P. To each his own.

In the vast majority of residencies you'll do a vast amount of H&Ps for every emergency procedure you get to do while on call.

Even Michael Jordan worked more on practicing layups than he did on half-court shots.

 

[RockfordWF]

In the vast majority of residencies you'll do a vast amount of H&Ps for every emergency procedure you get to do while on call.

Even Michael Jordan worked more on practicing layups than he did on half-court shots.

Although true, you need to do many procedures to be good at them and confident at them.

A monkey can do an H & P. Just get an H & P card and read it as you do it. If your only skill in residency is doing paperwork, you will sink to the bottom of the pack....

 

[DoctorFunk]

Although true, you need to do many procedures to be good at them and confident at them.

A monkey can do an H & P. Just get an H & P card and read it as you do it. If your only skill in residency is doing paperwork, you will sink to the bottom of the pack....

You do realize that part of a good H&P is an honest-to-goodness assessment and plan right? You know, the kind that monkeys certainly can't do and midlevels struggle with?

 

[RockfordWF]

You do realize that part of a good H&P is an honest-to-goodness assessment and plan right? You know, the kind that monkeys certainly can't do and midlevels struggle with?

That's why there are different specialties for different people. Some doctors like to think, others like to do.

You aren't a doer.

 

[DoctorFunk]

That's why there are different specialties for different people. Some doctors like to think, others like to do.

You aren't a doer.

Some have enough sense to do a little of both. That's why I'm going to go into interventional cards.

 

[RockfordWF]

Some have enough sense to do a little of both. That's why I'm going to go into interventional cards.

If you are going into interventional cards, you should probably spend some time in medical school doing procedures, instead of wasting your time with H&P's.

Just about ALL cardiologists have mid-level providers to do rounds for them...

 

[DoctorFunk]

If you are going into interventional cards, you should probably spend some time in medical school doing procedures, instead of wasting your time with H&P's.

Just about ALL cardiologists have mid-level providers to do rounds for them...

I wasn't aware you had access to my schedule. If you had looked a little closer you might have seen that I have already spent 2 months on surgery, a month in IR (mostly working as first assistant), and a month in anesthesia. I also did my inpatient medicine at a VA hospital where ancillary staff expect you to do all of your own work, even blood draws after 4 pm.

Procedures abound, my friend.

 

[Llenroc]

Actually it takes a lot more skill and practice to write a good H&P, and come up with a proper assessment and plan than it does to cut a whole in someone's neck and stick a tube in.

If you honestly think that writing H&P's is something that NP's/PA's do, then you're an idiot. No one in interventional cardiology gives a **** what procedures you did in medical school (actually, that's not even something you go into right out of medical school), but writing good H&P's and formulating plans is something that all residencies expect of medical students.

 

[domer621]

Why the **** are you guys arguing about this? Everyone knows a good H&P is incredibly important, and everyone knows that procedures are important. Both require experience and practice to do well.

 

[the1doc]

my surgery rotation was intense...medicine was intense...but nothing was as painful as ob/gyn. obgyn was PAINFULLY painful...the catty attitude among attendings and residents is pervasive. too much estrogen...even the male attendings seemed to be affected.

that old saying, "you make your bed" seems to have gone over their heads...the job is stressful and messy, but it's not the only specialty that is that way. yet it was by far the most malignant atmosphere i've ever been in, and they continue to perpetuate their problems by advocating this type of behavior in their residents.

 

[Amelia]

I think that Ob/Gyns attitude towards medical students has hurt their profession in the long-run. There are a lot of medical students who had a true interest in advocating for women's health and become excellent ob/gyns who decided they didn't like or couldn't live with the personalities in the field. Is ob/gyn as competitive as dermatology or radiology? or even general surgery? Not right now, so why the self-destructive attitude toward students? Many Ob/Gyns are overly dramatic towards patients and students and enjoy harassing students on the rotation.

I think Ob/Gyn all live in their own little world where when everything goes perfectly you have perfectly healthy women giving birth to perfectly healthy babies, . . . when there is a problem with a delivery or pregnancy the ob/gyn attendings flip-out and attack everybody. This is the opposite of internal medicine where patients generally come to the hospital when they are *sick* to get better. So I think ob/gyns (some at least) have a tendencing to harass and abuse when things are perfect for them. I think a lot of ob/gyns go into the field with the hope that it will be a "happy profession" and they just deliver babies and don't have to deal with sick people and then flip out when things don't work like they wanted.

I think that ob/gyn abrassive attitude has hurt malpractice rates for ob/gyns, i.e. I have ob/gyn attendings who can't really talk to patients or comfort a mother's concern about their unborn child, of course this will lead to more lawsuits . . . concerning lawsuits in general with the known fact that many ob/gyns are hysteric and overly dramatic about the problems in their profession, what is the truth?? Are malpractice rates really too high? or are these just overly entitled ob/gyns complaining more? Considering the level of harassment that goes on in third year, it seems like ob/gyn departments are pretty isolated from the rest of the hospital, a fate they have brought on themselves. The great thing about message boards like this is that you can see there is a national consensus that ob/gyns like to harass students,

 

[jakstat]

I have to say OB/Peds/Family rank together as the worst. Funny b/c they are all interrelated somewhat. OB is filled with grumpy nurses who are lazy and gossip most of the time. Peds is filled with kids who hate anyone in white coats. Family is filled with disgruntled residents who feel inadequate and pimp students over topics I could fall asleep on. Of all my rotations so far, I feel family residents/attendings feel the most underappreciated and vent on the students. I mean, family is the least competitive and most in demand so why make it such a hostile experience to students. Its not like the patients in family have hard differentials. And if they do, they just get referred to a specialist. I see attendings look up treatment options on uptodate all the time and they get all freaked out and upset if I don't know the current guidlines for management of hypertryglycerides...oh well, I don't think I'll be going into family so just have to survive the last 3 wks.

 

[Rogue Synapse]

It's nice to see neurology take its proper place in the poll. What a nice, laid-back, intellectually engaging profession, if I do say so myself.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

For me right now it's peds. Screaming kids drive me crazy, and the people are just a little weird. They act nice, but I get the vibe that they're quite uptight. Hours suck, too, and they load a bunch of calls in a pretty short period of time. Oh yeah, and it's boring. Peds is pretty well hated at my school, so I wonder if it's mainly an institutional thing.

Ob was second. I really liked the residents and the whole women's health angle but wasn't excited by deliveries or surgeries and the attendings were a miserable group of people.

 

[usrael]

I would be interested to see how many of the "OB haters" are female.
We're currently 4 males doing our OB rotation. We have been treated very courteously, and we're all pretty happy. I'm pleasantly surprised since the previous group had a horrible experience with pretty much the same staff. They were all female.

 

[BigRedBeta]

Absolutely hated Psych...thank god the hours were so benign. That was seriously the only saving grace. I absolutely hated the fact that the patients only occasionally got better, that you're always running into compliance issues, and that there's never any immediate result (I'm not that patient of person, I want to go into Peds Critical Care...I like to be able to see my work make a difference, not wait 6 weeks to find out if we have to try something different and then wait another 6 weeks to see if THAT worked).

I tip my hat to all the future psychiatrists out there because they are definitely better people than I am.

 

[JStub]

So far I've really disliked surgery! Being in tha "hot seat" (although you're standing) for so many hours at a time kills me. And my attending liked to pimp on random anatomy that I forgot in first year. I'm on my favorite so far now (FP outpatient). Good luck all 3rd year is almost over!

 

[cdql]

Let me cast a late vote for internal medicine.

-Social work BS. We had 6 patients ready for D/C Friday. None left because, well, you try finding a social worker late Friday afternoon.
-Rounding. I can tolerate this once a day. Bedside rounds twice a day, with the afternoon one starting at 5PM and including a teaching session is outrageous.
-Labs. You're damned if you, damned if you don't. Attendings snap at you for shotgunning labs and retaining them daily. Of course, if you don't have those labs ordered and your patient's health goes downward, the attending immediately asks why we don't have labs on board.
-O2. Why do all patients insist on keeping the nasal canula on? We take it off, try to see how they do on room air, and before you know it, it's right back on and the attending is screaming his balls off about now prepping our patients for discharge.
-The pampering. I had a patient ask me to clean his ears. I gave him a blank stare before walking out of the room. It's a hospital, not a spa. WTF?
-The downtime. Probably not there for an intern but even as a sub-I, there just isn't that much to do if I'm carrying 4 patients. Especially with afternoon rounds starting so late. I'm going down daily to the lounge and napping for an hour. Not exactly what I consider a productive work day.

 

[PeepshowJohnny]

I would be interested to see how many of the "OB haters" are female.
We're currently 4 males doing our OB rotation. We have been treated very courteously, and we're all pretty happy. I'm pleasantly surprised since the previous group had a horrible experience with pretty much the same staff. They were all female.

Totally opposite here. Some of the best/most popular attendings prefer female students here, so they get them (Mostly because they hate having a male medical student sent into the hallway half the time).

Of course, the L&D nurses are awful to everyone.

 

[oldbearprofessor]

For me right now it's peds. Screaming kids drive me crazy, and the people are just a little weird. They act nice, but I get the vibe that they're quite uptight.

Just a little weird?? Come on, we're stranger than that....We talk in baby talk, we like making stupid faces and think we're funny when we do it. We dress oddly (no offense to my female colleagues here.... and of course, we are passionate about defending our little patients against all sorts of perceived evils - like medical students and surgical residents.

BTW, we get used to screaming kids and actually, most kids are fun to interact with even in the hospital setting. If you really don't like screaming kids, then you can just become a neonatologist and intubate them.

I now return this thread to OB bashing.

 

[usrael]

Totally opposite here. Some of the best/most popular attendings prefer female students here, so they get them (Mostly because they hate having a male medical student sent into the hallway half the time).

Of course, the L&D nurses are awful to everyone.

Between the 4 of us (4x males) we've spent a collective ~100hrs in OB/GYN clinics, and have yet to be booted from a room (and the attending always asks). Maybe it's geographical (we're in a liberal state).
I just don't get the whole "OB is the worst rotation" complaint.
ps- I have no interest in OB or GYN, but it has been my most enjoyable rotation so far. To be hanging out in the lounge one moment and then holding new life in your arms a minute later.

 

[medicomel]

am i the only one who has no strong feelings about babies and birth? third year has been rough in so many ways, but i've found something interesting in every specialty. it's a good team that can make even the suckiest rotation bearable.

with that said, i have to echo the sentiment about inpatient IM and the endless social work issues. that and some of the patients act like they're VIPs in a four-star hotel. if i had a nickel for every patient with chest pain and hypertensive urgency who cared more about having been NPO, i'd have paid off a good chunk of my student loans.

 

[LadyWolverine]

Let me cast a late vote for internal medicine.

-Social work BS. We had 6 patients ready for D/C Friday. None left because, well, you try finding a social worker late Friday afternoon.
-Rounding. I can tolerate this once a day. Bedside rounds twice a day, with the afternoon one starting at 5PM and including a teaching session is outrageous.
-Labs. You're damned if you, damned if you don't. Attendings snap at you for shotgunning labs and retaining them daily. Of course, if you don't have those labs ordered and your patient's health goes downward, the attending immediately asks why we don't have labs on board.
-O2. Why do all patients insist on keeping the nasal canula on? We take it off, try to see how they do on room air, and before you know it, it's right back on and the attending is screaming his balls off about now prepping our patients for discharge.
-The pampering. I had a patient ask me to clean his ears. I gave him a blank stare before walking out of the room. It's a hospital, not a spa. WTF?
-The downtime. Probably not there for an intern but even as a sub-I, there just isn't that much to do if I'm carrying 4 patients. Especially with afternoon rounds starting so late. I'm going down daily to the lounge and napping for an hour. Not exactly what I consider a productive work day.

Agreed. I hated my IM rotation for all of these reasons as well. While it had the potential to be good (I mean, on what other rotation do you learn more about medicine??), each of these issues dragged it down for me. Add the fact that the attendings and housestaff, with the execption of one of my experiences, did not have the time or desire to teach you very much. I felt like I was "sitting around" much of the time, waiting for X consult to call back or Y lab result to come in. The other student and I spent a lot of time asking each other MKSAP questions or studying for the shelf. Which was nice, but at the same time, there's nothing that takes the place of learning/being taught first-hand by someone senior to you. I thought that this is what I was paying tuition for - anyone can read a book. Hell, I left this rotation not even sure I could come up with a decent assessment and plan.

 

[cdql]

Agreed. I hated my IM rotation for all of these reasons as well. While it had the potential to be good (I mean, on what other rotation do you learn more about medicine??), each of these issues dragged it down for me. Add the fact that the attendings and housestaff, with the execption of one of my experiences, did not have the time or desire to teach you very much. I felt like I was "sitting around" much of the time, waiting for X consult to call back or Y lab result to come in. The other student and I spent a lot of time asking each other MKSAP questions or studying for the shelf. Which was nice, but at the same time, there's nothing that takes the place of learning/being taught first-hand by someone senior to you. I thought that this is what I was paying tuition for - anyone can read a book. Hell, I left this rotation not even sure I could come up with a decent assessment and plan.

I wish my attending would ignore me. Seems like the old b@st@rd has it out for me.

Fortunately, as a 4th year Sub-I, I only see fit to subject myself to his rounds once a day. I'm going to stop sticking around for afternoon rounds.

What a load of bull I'm going through.

 

[TickleMeElmo]

I wish my attending would ignore me. Seems like the old b@st@rd has it out for me.

Fortunately, as a 4th year Sub-I, I only see fit to subject myself to his rounds once a day. I'm going to stop sticking around for afternoon rounds.

What a load of bull I'm going through.

noticed you are in boston, if at boston university there is a realy mean ob/gyn attending there, in his 70s or 80s, morbidly obese, but very, very mean, his rounds were more harassment than any real learning, i have seen him do a lot of mean things to students and patients as well, he will just be more mean if you don't show up to his bullying sessions, you have my sympathy if this is your attending, get into another rotation as he doesn't know how to act decently to human beings, he should have been fired for making inappropriate comments and inappropriately touching students, but he hasn't been, stay away from him!

 

[cdql]

noticed you are in boston, if at boston university there is a realy mean ob/gyn attending there, in his 70s or 80s, morbidly obese, but very, very mean, his rounds were more harassment than any real learning, i have seen him do a lot of mean things to students and patients as well, he will just be more mean if you don't show up to his bullying sessions, you have my sympathy if this is your attending, get into another rotation as he doesn't know how to act decently to human beings, he should have been fired for making inappropriate comments and inappropriately touching students, but he hasn't been, stay away from him!

eww, fortunately i am not doing my sub-i in obgyn (internal medicine). but that does sound awful. i've already started skipping out (i know, awful in week 1) and my attending hasn't said anything. let's hope it goes smoothly

 

[Doctor Bagel]

Just a little weird?? Come on, we're stranger than that....We talk in baby talk, we like making stupid faces and think we're funny when we do it. We dress oddly (no offense to my female colleagues here.... and of course, we are passionate about defending our little patients against all sorts of perceived evils - like medical students and surgical residents.

BTW, we get used to screaming kids and actually, most kids are fun to interact with even in the hospital setting. If you really don't like screaming kids, then you can just become a neonatologist and intubate them.

I now return this thread to OB bashing.

Yeah, honestly the baby talk and high fives are kinda annoying. My thing is that I like adults -- I like being an adult, and I like being around adults. Being around unhappy kids (and even happy super energetic kids) drains me, and I don't really relate to other people who want to spend most of their time around kids. I know some of you guys just like 'em, but I'm not there.

Now I'm entering my horrible hours part of peds, so I think I'm really going to hate life, but we'll see. And getting back to the weird part, the people in the peds department here are weird in totally non-goofy way. Their wanting to protect kids might explain some of the being uptight, but I think there's something else there.

And last vent, why do kids get all the nice hospitals? Being sick as an adult sucks, too. Why do we get the crap hospitals while the kids get all the neat stuff?