Which specialties are best if you do not want religous colleauges?

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plainfacts

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Hi!
Which specialties would be best to consider if you do not want religious colleauges around? I've found some research on psychiatry and it seems to be a good specialty with low rates of religious physicians - but anyone have any data on the other specialties?

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Hi!
Which specialties would be best to consider if you do not want religious colleauges around? I've found some research on psychiatry and it seems to be a good specialty with low rates of religious physicians - but anyone have any data on the other specialties?

I tend to doubt that -- the psych folks I've worked with seemed comparably religious to folks in other fields. Probably need to know more about religions since religious references/iconography are very common themes seen with some disorders. I'd guess that physicians who go into reproductive health wouldn't be among the most religious given most religions' views on contraception and abortion.
 
I tend to doubt that -- the psych folks I've worked with seemed comparably religious to folks in other fields. Probably need to know more about religions since religious references/iconography are very common themes seen with some disorders. I'd guess that physicians who go into reproductive health wouldn't be among the most religious given most religions' views on contraception and abortion.
Well, since I aspire to be a doctor and thus a scientist my statements are based on facts.

"The relationship between psychiatry and religion among US physicians" Curlin, et al Psychiatric Services, 9/2007


OBJECTIVE: This study compared the religious characteristics of psychiatrists with those of other physicians and explored whether nonpsychiatrist physicians who are religious are less willing than their colleagues to refer patients to psychiatrists and psychologists. METHODS: Surveys were mailed to a stratified random sample of 2,000 practicing U.S. physicians, with an oversampling of psychiatrists. Physicians were queried about their religious characteristics. They also read a brief vignette about a patient with ambiguous psychiatric symptoms and were asked whether they would refer the patient to a clergy member or religious counselor, or to a psychiatrist or a psychologist. RESULTS: A total of 1,144 physicians completed the survey, including 100 psychiatrists. Compared with other physicians, psychiatrists were more likely to be Jewish (29% versus 13%) or without a religious affiliation (17% versus 10%), less likely to be Protestant (27% versus 39%) or Catholic (10% versus 22%), less likely to be religious in general, and more likely to consider themselves spiritual but not religious (33% versus 19%). Nonpsychiatrist physicians who were religious were more willing to refer patients to clergy members or religious counselors (multivariate odds ratios from 2.9 to 5.7) and less willing to refer patients to psychiatrists or psychologists (multivariate odds ratios from .4 to .6). CONCLUSIONS: Psychiatrists are less religious than other physicians, and religious physicians are less willing than nonreligious physicians to refer patients to psychiatrists. These findings suggest that historic tensions between religion and psychiatry continue to shape the care that patients receive for mental health concerns.
 
Looks like you've already made up your mind on this topic. Is there a certain point you want to make? Perhaps you are just trolling here?
 
Hi!
Which specialties would be best to consider if you do not want religious colleauges around? I've found some research on psychiatry and it seems to be a good specialty with low rates of religious physicians - but anyone have any data on the other specialties?

Medicine has lots of religious people, I think the reason for this is that medical training provides a lot of hopelessness, helplessness, uncertainty, fear, debt, confusion and bitterness. Wherever you find these elements in abundance, you will find religion and drug abuse (alcohol mainly the drug of choice for physicians).
 
Looks like you've already made up your mind on this topic. Is there a certain point you want to make? Perhaps you are just trolling here?
I want more info on the topic since I so far only have info on psychiatry. Perhaps you don't like the discussion and are attempting to destroy it?
 
Oncology :D

Basically your colleagues know their patients are going to die, and don't bother praying for a miracle.

I might be wrong but w/e.
 
Hi!
Which specialties would be best to consider if you do not want religious colleauges around? I've found some research on psychiatry and it seems to be a good specialty with low rates of religious physicians - but anyone have any data on the other specialties?

While you are at it can you also look up which specialties have the fewest black colleagues? I mean just can't stand all that jive-talkin'
 
I tend to doubt that -- the psych folks I've worked with seemed comparably religious to folks in other fields. Probably need to know more about religions since religious references/iconography are very common themes seen with some disorders. I'd guess that physicians who go into reproductive health wouldn't be among the most religious given most religions' views on contraception and abortion.

This is very regionally dependent. In the southeast there are tons of religious OBs. Myself being one of them.
 
Hi!
Which specialties would be best to consider if you do not want religious colleauges around? I've found some research on psychiatry and it seems to be a good specialty with low rates of religious physicians - but anyone have any data on the other specialties?

You can't be serious. I don't know too many physicians who don't believe in God and most of the ones I know are either Christians or Jews of varying levels of devoutness, from regular church-goers to infrequent visitors. You may as well quit medicine now if you don't like religion and religious people because very few of your colleagues or patients will be atheistic enough for ya'.

So sorry.
 
You can't be serious. I don't know too many physicians who don't believe in God and most of the ones I know are either Christians or Jews of varying levels of devoutness, from regular church-goers to infrequent visitors. You may as well quit medicine now if you don't like religion and religious people because very few of your colleagues or patients will be atheistic enough for ya'.

So sorry.

The question also encompass the practical implications such as some specialties lending itself to working without colleauges.
 
I think that almost 4 years of medical school finally got to me but I am getting a little bit tired when pre-meds come to these forums in a troll-like, know-it-all, fashion. The reality is: no matter where you go, you'll have to deal with a diversity of people.
 
This is an odd thing to base your specialty choice on.

I would tend to agree though that Psychiatry has a lot of anti-religious types, though this field has produced far more frauds/quacks/self appointed holy men than all religions put together.
 
Medicine has lots of religious people, I think the reason for this is that medical training provides a lot of hopelessness, helplessness, uncertainty, fear, debt, confusion and bitterness. Wherever you find these elements in abundance, you will find religion and drug abuse (alcohol mainly the drug of choice for physicians).

To quote someone relatively well-known: :D
"And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them..."

I'm thinking that plainfacts might be choosing option #3.

BTW, see this thread for his previous exploration of this question with respect to psych.
 
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This is an odd thing to base your specialty choice on.
I don't want to spend the rest of my medical career being miserable. That includes minimizing contact with people I do not like.
 
I don't want to spend the rest of my medical career being miserable. That includes minimizing contact with people I do not like.

Trust me, based on the quote, I can guarantee that you will hate medicine even if you go into pathology or radiology.
 
Trust me, based on the quote, I can guarantee that you will hate medicine even if you go into pathology or radiology.
But I still want to make it as worthwhile as possible.
 
But I still want to make it as worthwhile as possible.

Then don't go into medicine. Consider getting a PhD and do research in a lab. Alone. You'll have to deal with a variety of people in medicine whether as patients, classmates, teachers, staff, nurses, residents, attendings. If you can stand one group of people (in your case, people who are religious) you are short-changing yourself and the medical profession. You don't have to like the people you work with but you sure need to be able to work with them. In your case, you don't even seem to tolerate them.

By the way, I still think you are trolling here so I'm signing off.
 
Then don't go into medicine. Consider getting a PhD and do research in a lab. Alone. You'll have to deal with a variety of people in medicine whether as patients, classmates, teachers, staff, nurses, residents, attendings. If you can stand one group of people (in your case, people who are religious) you are short-changing yourself and the medical profession. You don't have to like the people you work with but you sure need to be able to work with them. In your case, you don't even seem to tolerate them.
I already am in medicine so there is no turning back. Besides my intent is to shape my practice the way I want it and I want to know which specialty is best suited for my preferences. And don't think that I buy the bullsh*t that being religious is somehow a prerequisite for being a physician. Atheist patients need care too and not all of them trusts people who believe in a 2000 year-old book with their life.


Yes it is similar but this thread isn't about psychiatry. I want to know if there are other specialties, OTHER that psychiatry, that suits my preferences.
 
Sigh. I don't know why I'm even wading into this, but...

1. Is it people who are religious that you object to, or people who wear their religion on their sleeves or proselytize? Many physicians, like many people in all walks of life, have private religious convictions, but I have found it very rare that anyone wants to talk about it at work (one med student was an exception, and it was uncomfortable). So if it's just the overt evangelical stuff that bothers you, you'll likely be fine in any specialty. If you for some reason can't stand people for their private convictions (though I don't know how you'd know them), then you'll likely have trouble in all specialties, as well as most other careers.

2. Perhaps you should be worried more about patients than colleagues. I have found that patients are frequently very openly religious - generally due to their powerlessness and suffering. I get God-blessed a dozen times a day, sometimes patients want me to pray with them, and I often have to bite my tongue when patients tell me that "god is working through me" or that god will heal them. Just because I think all that is nonsense doesn't mean that I don't have compassion for the situations that drive them to that position. If you can't control your disdain and judgment for those people, you should probably pick a no-patient-contact specialty, or one like cosmetic surgery where your patients aren't sick.

3. On a tangential topic - I notice your avatar. What must you think of your candidate's running mate??!
 
1. Is it people who are religious that you object to, or people who wear their religion on their sleeves or proselytize? Many physicians, like many people in all walks of life, have private religious convictions, but I have found it very rare that anyone wants to talk about it at work (one med student was an exception, and it was uncomfortable). So if it's just the overt evangelical stuff that bothers you, you'll likely be fine in any specialty. If you for some reason can't stand people for their private convictions (though I don't know how you'd know them), then you'll likely have trouble in all specialties, as well as most other careers.
What you don't know doesn't bother you. But any notion of religion would make me want to puke.

2. Perhaps you should be worried more about patients than colleagues. I have found that patients are frequently very openly religious - generally due to their powerlessness and suffering. I get God-blessed a dozen times a day, sometimes patients want me to pray with them, and I often have to bite my tongue when patients tell me that "god is working through me" or that god will heal them. Just because I think all that is nonsense doesn't mean that I don't have compassion for the situations that drive them to that position. If you can't control your disdain and judgment for those people, you should probably pick a no-patient-contact specialty, or one like cosmetic surgery where your patients aren't sick.
I'd expect some patients to be religious - they're after all patients and pathologies often have psychiatric effects such as depression and religiousness. I would never pray for a patient or with a patient but ignore their religiousness.

My perfect practice would of course be one targeting atheist patients.


3. On a tangential topic - I notice your avatar. What must you think of your candidate's running mate??!
I think she is the reason Obama is leading. If McCain come to his senses and kick her out he can win this election.
 
My perfect practice would of course be one targeting atheist patients.

Dude, all fields of medicine are about taking care of people from all walks of life, all colors, all religions, all problems. Illness doesn't care about the difference, so folks who treat it cannot either. If that's an issue for you, I can almost guarantee you won't find happiness in the healthcare industry.
 
Dude, all fields of medicine are about taking care of people from all walks of life, all colors, all religions, all problems. Illness doesn't care about the difference, so folks who treat it cannot either. If that's an issue for you, I can almost guarantee you won't find happiness in the healthcare industry.

I market myself as a physician for atheists - someone who takes great pride in being a man of science. Atheists will come to me relieved that the person with their life in his hand does not believe in ridiculous bed-time stories. I have several atheist friends who finds it scary that the person with power over their LIFE believes in a religion. Their reasons:

*) If the physician doesn't value science in their private life why would they value it in their professional life?
*) If the physician believes problems can be fixed with prayers how can he be trusted not to attempt fixing my condition with prayers instead of medicine?
*) If they are too stupid to understand that the bible was written by man; how can they possibly comprehend medicine?
*) If the physician believes in God's will why would he attempt to cure disease and interfere with God's will?


I will make bank, $$$.
 
Hi!
Which specialties would be best to consider if you do not want religious colleauges around? I've found some research on psychiatry and it seems to be a good specialty with low rates of religious physicians - but anyone have any data on the other specialties?


You know this is a silly question. Physicians are not different than anyone else. There is going to be religious people everywhere regardless of career choice or specialty choice.

I think you are trolling.
By the way I noticed that on the bottom of the screen you say "vote McCain 2008" . So let's see republican, conservative party with Palin (ultra religious) VP candidate and the backing of most religions.

And you the backer of McCain are asking to be in a non-religious environment? HMMMM. I SMELL A TROLL.
 
You know this is a silly question. Physicians are not different than anyone else. There is going to be religious people everywhere regardless of career choice or specialty choice.

I think you are trolling.
By the way I noticed that on the bottom of the screen you say "vote McCain 2008" . So let's see republican, conservative party with Palin (ultra religious) VP candidate and the backing of most religions.

And you the backer of McCain are asking to be in a non-religious environment? HMMMM. I SMELL A TROLL.

It's not a silly question. I ask what specialty is suitable to either practice in a manner where I don't have to meet colleauges or where colleagues are not religious.

Let's see Obama, christian & communist, Biden, christian & communist vs McCain, christian & non-communist, Palin, christian fundamentalist & complete idiot. Look, Palin is NEVER going to be president. She is simply TOO STUPID to get there. If McCain would die during his term Palin will get impeached for stupidity. And democrats is not an option to get rid of religion. Wealth is a good way to make people less religious and republicans makes us wealthier by taxing us less.

The facts.
 
it seems to me that this question is something that could be raised in any other field of work. Why would medicine be any different? that's life, dealing with people different than you with different life expierences and beliefs.
 
The Red Scare is so 1960's. You sound [fair and] unbalanced, and I regret getting involved in this discussion.

Definitely trolling.
 
it seems to me that this question is something that could be raised in any other field of work. Why would medicine be any different? that's life, dealing with people different than you with different life expierences and beliefs.
Yes and this is how I am dealing with it.

The Red Scare is so 1960's. You sound [fair and] unbalanced, and I regret getting involved in this discussion.
This kind of thinking which will get Obama elected and destroy US. If you're a christian, why vote for Obama when you have Palin on the repub side?
 
Yes and this is how I am dealing with it.


This kind of thinking which will get Obama elected and destroy US. If you're a christian, why vote for Obama when you have Palin on the repub side?

Not all Christians inhabit the right wing of the political spectrum--some might find that the Christian values of justice, mercy, and compassion are better reflected on the left. But I wouldn't expect you to be aware of that, seeing as how your bigotry against religion prevents you from actually listening to those who might express these beliefs.
 
Now I know he is trolling.

Will a moderator please close this post?
 
Not all Christians inhabit the right wing of the political spectrum--some might find that the Christian values of justice, mercy, and compassion are better reflected on the left. But I wouldn't expect you to be aware of that, seeing as how your bigotry against religion prevents you from actually listening to those who might express these beliefs.
At least the christians on the right vote correctly. Being left AND religious is just too much for me to swallow. :(
 
Please keep this topic relevant to residency issues. If it continues to veer off-course it will be moved to All-Students or closed. Thank you.
 
1. physician does not equal scientist.
2. christian does not equal religion. There are a few others out there.
3. the complete denial of god is no more tenable from a 'scientific' perspective than the belief in god.
 
This discussion has degenerated and due to multiple complaints, I'm closing the thread.
 
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