I'll probably regret posting on this thread, but my Radiology rotation is pretty dull today. It might be fun to take that dead horse and dissect it. Maybe we can used it to stay warm. Anyone have a lightsaber?
Full disclosure: I'm now a 4th year student at an osteopathic school. I applied to 5 DO schools, received interview invites from all 5 and was accepted everywhere I interviewed. My premed stats made me uber-competitive for all DO schools and average for mid-tier MD schools; the elite MD schools (Ivy, Mayo, high research oriented state schools) would have been impossible with my decent MCAT and lack of undergraduate research. I had exposure to MDs and DOs before I applied, so I was comfortable with both options. I had MD letters and DO letters. I made the strategic decision to apply only to DO schools for
personal reasons - location, financial and a greater certainty that my applications would be worth the cost to submit them. I made the decision that was right for me. The points I make below are almost entirely my own opinion and based on my experiences, with the rare exception of links to information.
Should you choose an MD over a DO?
You should make the decision that is right for you. This is honestly difficult to determine as a premed, in the same sense that most premeds have no clue about the reality of a given specialty. You may think you are going to be an ENT, but the odds are that will not happen. I'd suggest cautiously using SDN as a resource, but also speaking to your college's premed advisor, shadowing both MDs and DOs and just being honest with yourself. If your decision on degree type is based solely on ego, that is fine. If it is based on a region you want to live in (i.e. applying to all schools in eastern TN, including ETSU and LMU), that is fine. Don't put too much stock in what anyone says on internet forums, including me. At the end of the day, it is your life and your degree and (probably) your money/debt.
Is the COMLEX a crappy exam?
No. The COMLEX is a different exam. It consists of 400 questions in 8 sections, and it has 3 steps plus the physical exam ("fake patient") portion. In that regard, it is just like the USMLE process. Content is predominantly the same medical information. Differences in content include the addition of osteopathic medicine questions in all 3 steps and the addition of some OMM in 3-4 of the "patients" on the PE. Regarding writing quality, yes, I have personally had some very poorly written questions with ridiculous grammar errors. I recall one on Step 2, and three on Step 1. Some of the questions are more vaguely written than USMLE question stems, but that is the nature of the test. COMLEX-specific question banks more than adequately prepare you for this, and any smart DO student uses a COMLEX-specific bank to study (+/- a USMLE bank).
Do DO students have to take the USMLE to match into allopathic residencies?
This depends on the specialty you are applying to and whether or not you are applying to ACGME spots. The overarching answer is no, you do not
have to take the USMLE to match to allopathic spots. Regarding the comments that MD Program Directors do not know what a COMLEX score is, all I have to say is, "Girl, please." They are residency Program Directors
and physicians, not high school gym teachers. Each ACGME program makes it's own decision about whether or not to accept a COMLEX score instead of a comparable USMLE score. This differs by specialty and program. As a general rule, the most elite specialties will need a COMLEX and USMLE score; in addition, certain departments will require COMLEX and USMLE even when most other departments in that same specialty will take COMLEX. I'd suggest contacting residency programs of interest and asking, but remember that this policy can change in the future. All DO students must take all the COMLEX exams and pass them to be licensed - period. If a DO student opts to take one or more of the USMLE steps, it is important to prepare for the USMLE properly (it is not the same as the COMLEX) and do well. An applicant to an ACGME program that accepts COMLEX will fare significantly better with a stellar COMLEX than with any COMLEX and a poor USMLE score. Failures on either exam will hurt the applicant. My overall point: it varies by program and by situation.
Do DOs learn and practice EBM?
Yes. We practice medicine in hospitals and clinics with patients. We read journals. We adjust our practice on patients based on reasonable evidence provided in those journals. Both DO residencies and DOs in MD residencies participate in journal clubs. Medicine is Evidenced Based Medicine. My school began teaching us about the proper way to practice EBM on Day One.
Are the preclinical years crappier at DO schools? Are DO students poorly prepared?
No. Crappy students are crappy students. It's medical school. I don't care where you go, you have an infinite amount of information to learn and a finite number of neurons. It's crazy and somewhat stessful, but a good student will learn it. I don't know if the quality of instructors differs, and neither does anyone else unless they attended two different schools. I had 80% excellent teachers and 20% who were not. I imagine that every school has some less awesome instructors, but I have only attended my med school. Regarding preparation, I felt extremely well prepared for boards and rotations. All of my preceptors commented on that, and as they were mostly MDs who also served as MD student preceptors, I took that to mean that I was doing well.
Do rotations suck more at DO schools?
I think this depends on the school. I can only reasonably speak for my own school and my experiences. I was at a single site for my 3rd year, with the exception of Psych, which was an away. For 4th year, I'm at a single site, with the exception of my audition electives which I have opted to arrange at institutions I'm interested in doing residency at (which is normal for all 4th year students). 90% of my preceptors are MDs. I've had two DO preceptors - one was truly amazing and brilliant, the other seemed to have some kind of personality disorder (craaaaaazy). Neither of the DOs did any OMM at all. My 3rd year site had residents, but my main 4th year site does not. I encountered students on my rotations from 3 other DO schools and 3 MD schools. Among us all, there were very smart students and really stupid students, equally distributed. I learned a lot on all of my rotations, and I do not believe my rotations were in any way sub-par.
OMM...blah, blah, blah,,,chiropractor...blah, blah, blah...
Let me put it this way. I liked OMM labs way more than I liked Nutrition. I'm not likely to use either very much in my residency (going for Psych). My school has a very balanced approach to OMM, and most of the "crunchy granola" stuff was minimal. We had what amounted to a couple hours of cranial lecture in total, while we had about 40-50 hours of lecture and labs devoted to joint exams (which is exactly Sports Med, not some magical aura-sensing thing that premeds think all of OMM is). The thing is, most DOs who want to practice OMM do a fellowship in it (NMM). In the same sense that you cannot perform Surgery on your own after a clerkship, it is well understood that to be proficient at OMM, you need post-graduate training. I thought the labs were fun and liked learning new ideas; I did not buy into some of it, but some people do. That's okay. I think we need a lot more peer reviewed research and EBM applied to that area, but that's a topic for a different sub-forum on SDN. I'm glad I had the chance to check it out. If you really, really, really do not want to learn OMM, please just apply MD. No one will make you use it in the real world if you do not want to do that, but it was really obvious which students were the "applied DO as a backup to MD" ones in lab.
Are research opportunities better at MD schools?
On a whole, I think this is true. There are exceptions, naturally, and there were good options for research at my school, but I find that MD students have easier access and more options. If this is a big priority for you, MD schools are likely better. I have a very odd niche research interest, and there was no good mentor for me at my school; to be fair, my niche is really just a tiny sliver that you need an electron microscope to find, so I would have a hard time finding a solid mentor anywhere. I just put it on hold, focused on med school, and I plan to pick it back up in residency.
Am I limited in international practice rights as a DO?
I will defer to the lovely conversation going on above. There are some good points on both sides in the midst of the, erm, "commentary" surrounding it. If international practice rights are a deal-breaker, maybe MD is a better option. I feel like that is a bit of a silly thing to base your applications on, but to each their own. Keep in mind that MD and DO practice rights shift as country governments change, and if you are particularly interested in an unstable portion of the world, nothing is set in stone.
My family thinks that DOs are inferior to MDs (and similar sentiments)
Family input is more important to some people. Do what is best for you. If you come from a culture that will result in your family thinking less of you for going DO, I'm sorry, and I can understand that being important. However, we are all adults. Make your own decision, as you have to live with it.
The only people in DO schools are those who failed to get into MD schools or who didn't even have the stats to try
I can sum this up by saying
. Yes, there are most certainly students in my class who either failed to get into an MD school in a past application cycle or who applied to DO schools as a backup. It is obvious who they are, and they are not good students. My class has something near 180-185 students, and most of those students fall into one of three categories: (a) DO only applicants with good stats, (b) DO and MD applicants with good stats who picked my school for their own reasons, (c) MD backup/couldn't get into MD school applicants with meh stats. A and B are by far the majority, and C students tend to leave or be held back. DO schools also attract non-traditional applicants like PAs, NPs and EMTs who have been out of school for 5-10 years; they often have somewhat lower MCATs and/or GPAs, but they often score the best on boards
and make excellent doctors.
That's pretty much all I have for now. I'd be happy to talk to anyone via PM who has questions about my school in particular or anything else really. Remember, take everything I say with a grain of salt, and the same goes for the thoughts of anyone who posts on internet message boards.
Most recent match information
http://www.nrmp.org/data/resultsanddata2012.pdf
http://www.nrmp.org/data/resultsbystate2012.pdf
http://www.nrmp.org/data/datatables2012.pdf
