"you are at the top of our list" messages

[playingfrombehind]

This message is mainly for people who have matched in the past:

I have gotten a few messages that said (paraphrasing) "you are at the top of our list, etc." received some nice hand written cards from residents saying that we see you as a good fit, etc. with a gift. I have heard in the past that some programs keep of a list of their preferred candidates and then they regular communicate with those candidates throughout the interview season.

I was wondering if this is something they send to everyone or if this is a clue that you will likely match their if you rank them.

For the record, I am ranking the programs I want to go to regardless of my chances.

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[Doctor4Life1769]

It's all bull**** it doesn't matter what they say. Rank however way you want to rank them

 

[Law2Doc]

Rank the way you would prefer, and don't buy any of this communication, or read anything into it . Most residencies want to get ranked highly by all the people they interview, so that they don't have to go very deep into their rank list. They will still rank however they please, and to them someone they are calling "top of the list" could be 30-40 people deep into their 100 person list.

 

[gutonc]

I'm thinking about consolidating all of the threads of this sort as a sticky and calling it "How the Match DOESN'T Work".

 

[IMPD]

Pretty sure you'd have to sticky the whole forum at this point

If we could convince the NRMP to have rank lists open January 25th, lists certified by Feb 1st and the match happen Feb 8th, there would be less of this.

 

[chronicidal]

If the message is noncommittal and noncoercive (eg, you are at the top of our list, you would be a great fit), it means nothing and you should not feel obligated to respond with any greater level of commitment or enthusiasm (eg, your program is at the top of my list too, I agree I would be a great fit at your program). If the program's message is specific and committal (eg, we are ranking you in our top 8), then be happy, leave it be, your response won't change it. If your program expresses enthusiasm conditional on your commitment (we will rank you in our top 8 if you let us know you really want to come here), that is a Match violation.

 

[akwho]

If we could convince the NRMP to have rank lists open January 25th, lists certified by Feb 1st and the match happen Feb 8th, there would be less of this.

Then you would have to convince ortho and plastics to not interview into February...

 

[NotAProgDirector]

...received some nice hand written cards from residents saying that we see you as a good fit, etc. with a gift.

Wait, they send you a gift? What ever happened to good, old fashioned graft? Shouldn't you be sending me gifts?

What's happened to the world?

#IWantMySwag

 

[CaliAtenza]

Wait, they send you a gift? What ever happened to good, old fashioned graft? Shouldn't you be sending me gifts?

What's happened to the world?

#IWantMySwag

I got a nice tote bag from my last IV, does that count?

 

[playingfrombehind]

I got a nice tote bag from my last IV, does that count?

Most programs I interviewed at gave some sort of parting gift - mug, notepad, and other miscellaneous swag. I'm referring to swag post-interview.

 

[Sushi5]

If the message is noncommittal and noncoercive (eg, you are at the top of our list, you would be a great fit), it means nothing and you should not feel obligated to respond with any greater level of commitment or enthusiasm (eg, your program is at the top of my list too, I agree I would be a great fit at your program). If the program's message is specific and committal (eg, we are ranking you in our top 8), then be happy, leave it be, your response won't change it. If your program expresses enthusiasm conditional on your commitment (we will rank you in our top 8 if you let us know you really want to come here), that is a Match violation.

Does "ranked you to match" mean anything?

 

[playingfrombehind]

Does "ranked you to match" mean anything?

I guess that statement means you are one of their better candidates and you have a shot of matching. That's my take. Its not specific like "you are at the top of our list", etc. Basically you can be assured that you were ranked (and not left off the rank list)

Technically if a program has ranked you that means you have a CHANCE of matching. You may not match if everyone ranked ahead of you chose that program as their #1. The only way were you are guaranteed not to match is if they didn't rank you at all.

 

[downwithDTB]

Would anyone care to comment on *specific* experiences of programs stating that someone is "at the top of their list" and/or "we'd love to have you" vs. the generic comments that "this doesn't mean anything." Of course no one is going to substantially alter their list because someone else wants us to... however, having an understanding of the levels of flattery would be helpful in generating piece of mind. Programs have used very different wordings with me... and hearing some personal experiences, not generic "don't trust anyone," would be nice. This question is solely for restful sleep purposes.

This may be vary by specialty, but I have to imagine that programs who continually mislead applicants as to their standing would, overtime, end up with a publicly bad reputation.

My understanding of "ranked to match" means "you have been ranked high enough that in prior years you would have matched; however, we make no guarantee."

 

[Sushi5]

Would anyone care to comment on *specific* experiences of programs stating that someone is "at the top of their list" and/or "we'd love to have you" vs. the generic comments that "this doesn't mean anything." Of course no one is going to substantially alter their list because someone else wants us to... however, having an understanding of the levels of flattery would be helpful in generating piece of mind. Programs have used very different wordings with me... and hearing some personal experiences, not generic "don't trust anyone," would be nice. This question is solely for restful sleep purposes.

This may be vary by specialty, but I have to imagine that programs who continually mislead applicants as to their standing would, overtime, end up with a publicly bad reputation.

My understanding of "ranked to match" means "you have been ranked high enough that in prior years you would have matched; however, we make no guarantee."

This question is solely for restful sleep purposes.

 

[mcl]

Would anyone care to comment on *specific* experiences of programs stating that someone is "at the top of their list" and/or "we'd love to have you" vs. the generic comments that "this doesn't mean anything." Of course no one is going to substantially alter their list because someone else wants us to... however, having an understanding of the levels of flattery would be helpful in generating piece of mind. Programs have used very different wordings with me... and hearing some personal experiences, not generic "don't trust anyone," would be nice. This question is solely for restful sleep purposes.

This may be vary by specialty, but I have to imagine that programs who continually mislead applicants as to their standing would, overtime, end up with a publicly bad reputation.

My understanding of "ranked to match" means "you have been ranked high enough that in prior years you would have matched; however, we make no guarantee."

There is no response for your question. Not all programs send post-interview communication. Of those that do, there's no magic phrase that means the same thing for every program. If you do receive an email or a phone call, it's not your job to try and find some hidden meaning in the message. Your job at this point is to assess the programs you've visited and make a list of the programs you like in the order you like them, and to submit that list to the NRMP. Then sleep restfully because you have done all you can/should do. In March you will find out where you are going for residency.

 

[IMPD]

There is no response for your question. Not all programs send post-interview communication. Of those that do, there's no magic phrase that means the same thing for every program. If you do receive an email or a phone call, it's not your job to try and find some hidden meaning in the message. Your job at this point is to assess the programs you've visited and make a list of the programs you like in the order you like them, and to submit that list to the NRMP. Then sleep restfully because you have done all you can/should do. In March you will find out where you are going for residency.

Yeah. This goes back to the "reading people's minds" problem that crops up here from time-to-time.

In my still short time as PD, I'm convinced that the Match is superior to a free-for-all, and at the same time, it's anonymity and power combined with the time lag from interview (October) to result (March), plus extreme anxiety equals this never-ending search for predictive tea-leaf reading.

I used to do regional admissions for a selective Ivy in my younger days and one thing I realized quite soon was the somewhat random and arbitrary way matches/acceptances work at pretty much at all levels. There is a small pool of superstars that get accepted everywhere, a significant pool of kids who have no shot and a really large pool of candidates that have >10% and <90% chance of admission. If we ran the same kids through our admission process 100 times, we'd end up with some kids getting admitted everytime and some getting admitted 30, 40, 50, 60, 70 or any kind of other # times. The fact that such randomness exists is existensially frustrating.

 

[downwithDTB]

There is no response for your question. Not all programs send post-interview communication. Of those that do, there's no magic phrase that means the same thing for every program. If you do receive an email or a phone call, it's not your job to try and find some hidden meaning in the message. Your job at this point is to assess the programs you've visited and make a list of the programs you like in the order you like them, and to submit that list to the NRMP. Then sleep restfully because you have done all you can/should do. In March you will find out where you are going for residency.

I didn't ask for an opinion or advice. I was asking for people's *actual* experiences. There is in fact an answer to that question... it's "They said '___' and I did/did not match."

Clearly I know that not all programs send post interview correspondence. I also know that some send the same response to everyone who wasn't a complete jerk, and some probably get people's hopes up unfairly. That said, some programs choose to send different levels of communication and I'd love to hear about people's personal experiences with different responses.

 

[Temeraire]

Ladies and gentlemen, behold the power of anecdote.

Look, some programs lie, some tell the truth, and some do not say anything at all. I don't understand how a stranger's anecdote from a random program in a random specialty will assure you of anything unless they happen to mention a program you ranked.

 

[gutonc]

I didn't ask for an opinion or advice. I was asking for people's *actual* experiences. There is in fact an answer to that question... it's "They said '___' and I did/did not match."

You can listen to an actual PC and a real PD or you can keep on acting like an entitled jerk. Your call bro.

 

[BigTumor]

I would argue that programs should also just rank how they want and skip the emails (as is the constant advice given to students on SDN). The onus is on us to be true to our lists, for sure, but who can argue that post-interview communication initiated by programs with statements about how much they liked you are not an attempt at manipulation. They hope that the flattery will change the way students rank. We are told that our "you're #1 emails mean nothing" (which I believe) but programs do it themselves.

 

[Morzh]

Does "ranked you to match" mean anything?

I got an email that said those words, but it also stated "you are ranked in our top xx" (xx = class size of program, so if I rank them #1 it's a guaranteed match). It was pretty specific and I can't imagine a PD would lie when saying that.

 

[ThoracicGuy]

I didn't ask for an opinion or advice. I was asking for people's *actual* experiences. There is in fact an answer to that question... it's "They said '___' and I did/did not match."

Clearly I know that not all programs send post interview correspondence. I also know that some send the same response to everyone who wasn't a complete jerk, and some probably get people's hopes up unfairly. That said, some programs choose to send different levels of communication and I'd love to hear about people's personal experiences with different responses.

 

[Sea_Bass]

I got an email that said those words, but it also stated "you are ranked in our top xx" (xx = class size of program, so if I rank them #1 it's a guaranteed match). It was pretty specific and I can't imagine a PD would lie when saying that.

I got a similar message and posted about it in a separate thread I made.

 

[rms0821]

You can listen to an actual PC and a real PD or you can keep on acting like an entitled jerk. Your call bro.

ouch! poor guy -

 

[SLC]

Most programs I interviewed at gave some sort of parting gift - mug, notepad, and other miscellaneous swag. I'm referring to swag post-interview.

I got a big (and I mean BIG) gift basket of stuff from one of my lower ranked programs. I took it to be a sign that they generally needed to do that kind of stuff to attract applicants.

Question why the program feels the need more than anything else. A truly solid program doesn't have to rely on those kinds of tactics...

 

[jennashell]

For one of my interview - I got a goodie bag with some useful things for interview season and for second look they gave a even nicer goodie bag with treats. It was nice and thoughtful. I dont think it was desperate move. Its nice to add a personal touch.