BS/MD or Regular Undergrad?

[CollegeKid109]

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[solitarius]

Yes. You should go to Drexel.

 

[lnvictus]

I know people in the BS/MD program and they're having a good time with student life there. I found that there's a fairly decent amount of student life that interacts with the Penn community which is right next door.

Match rates shouldn't be a too concern, since Drexel med is still a solid institution.

Plus UCLA and UCSD apparently have a bad rep in regards to deflation. Although the Californian women...

Edit: note that I do not attend a uc so my opinion shouldn't be taken for granted

 

[armybound]

a bird in hand

 

[Spinach Dip]

Yes. Do it. Then you won't have to worry about applying/re-applying/re-re-applying in the future.

 

[kevinus]

Do it. The MD application process sucks.

 

[deleted445355]

I was in a very similar situation to you, but eventually chose to attend a non-BS/MD program b/c I couldn't see myself being happy in the BS/MD program I got into. And now, I'm a junior in college that gives me a **** ton of merit aid and very happy that I made the decision I did. However, after staying in the same city for the past few years, I have gotten very sick of it and am glad to be moving on to a med school somewhere else (hopefully). At first, the BS/MD idea seemed good, but I realized that it really wasn't for me because I can't imagine staying at a city I eventually became bored off for the next 7-8 yrs of my life. So my suggestion is to take the Drexel offer if it is non-binding and they allow you to apply elsewhere, but to apply to other med schools as well during college if you're the type of person who gets sick of staying in one place for too long. That way, you already have an acceptance at hand to begin with. Good luck.

 

[Lya]

It depends on your motivation, ambition, and professional/academic goals.

If your goal is solely getting into any medical school as quickly and comfortably as you can, then Drexel BS/MD program is your easy choice. Otherwise, I hope you would reconsider your UC schools, especially if you want to take advantage of specific programs that UCLA/UCSD offers.

If I were you, I would have gone to UCLA or UCSD. Since you have great high school stats, I think you can handle UC courses quite well. Grade deflation might be tricky to overcome since you will be competing against many bright individuals. However, if you are one of those who want to aim high, willing to pursue personal growth and maturity as you learn to overcome challenges along the way, then you will probably appreciate UC schools more when you graduate.


Many people might disagree with me. Again, it heavily depends on your ambition and goals.

 

[lnvictus]

Do it. The MD application process sucks.

It's been only two days and I see that I am already famous enough for you to honor me as your custom title 😉

 

[Mt Kilimanjaro]

the usual high school medical activities including research, volunteering, and shadowing.

😱

I think it's scary that people start preparing for medical school during high school. Have you ever had a job?

 

[Narmerguy]

I was in a similar position coming out of high school and chose to go to a normal 4-year program. In fact, at one of my interviews the professor suggested that it would be a waste to do this program and that I would not have any trouble getting into an MD program. I listened to him--one of the best decisions I've ever made. I've since embarked on a journey I couldn't predict that found me taking classes I didn't expect, discovering interests I didn't know I had, pursuing gap year activities that I'm lucky to have--and now I'll be going to medical school next year.

The "guarantee" of admission is not all that valuable. If you're good enough to get into a BS/MD program, you can get in the normal way as well. Don't rush, and leave your options open. College is a beautiful time if you let it.

 

[SilentSoldier]

17 year old me had no freaking clue that he wanted to go into medicine. I couldn't imagine being that set on it so young. Sure, the guarantee of admission into a decent school sounds great, but you'll never know what else you could end up liking if that's all you'll be preparing for. College is fan-freakingtastic and I definitely would advise you to really consider your 4-year schools.

 

[joonage]

As terrible as application is, I honestly think you would be selling yourself short by doing the BS/MD program. Not knocking on Drexel Med or stating that you're a guarantee for med school, but I think someone of your smarts (perfect SAT, almost perfect GPA) would do just fine in college and with MCATs and get into an even better medical school.

 

[ta8901]

I attend a school with a BS/MD program and the people who are in it absolutely love it. All Ivy-league caliber students attending a much lower ranked university with no regrets.

Traditional "college life" is great and all, but the guarantee of being a freakin' doctor is that much better.

 

[Chillbo Baggins]

Also my stats include a 2400 SAT

wut

 

[ta8901]

that kind of SAT/ACT score is "normal" for bs/md

 

[Chillbo Baggins]

that kind of SAT/ACT score is "normal" for bs/md

Good thing I didn't try for those, then.

 

[cookiemonsters]

I guess I'll go against the grain and say do the undergrad route, and then apply to medical school. Unless something catastrophic happens in unedrgrad (EG you suddenly discover a social life) you will probably get into a better school than Drexel. Plus, undergrad in SoCal >>> stuck in Philadelphia for 8 years.

 

[Lya]

I guess I'll go against the grain and say do the undergrad route, and then apply to medical school. Unless something catastrophic happens in unedrgrad (EG you suddenly discover a social life) you will probably get into a better school than Drexel. Plus, undergrad in SoCal >>> stuck in Philadelphia for 8 years.

Glad to hear!

Take advantage of programs and facilities that UC schools offer.

Good luck!

 

[Patros]

Also my stats include a 2400 SAT, 3.93 GPA with relatively hard courses, and the usual high school medical activities including research, volunteering, and shadowing.

Ok, hold up. I was with you until I tripped over this trollbait. Can anyone verify that OP isn't taking us for a ride? 3.93 gpa, 2400SAT and solid ECs makes you a shoe-in for the Ivy leagues. Or for anything! And since when is research "the standard high school activity"?

Oh, and OP's account was made yesterday with exactly 1 post. My BS alarm is going off at full force.

 

[SN12357]

Ok, hold up. I was with you until I tripped over this trollbait. Can anyone verify that OP isn't taking us for a ride? 3.93 gpa, 2400SAT and solid ECs makes you a shoe-in for the Ivy leagues. Or for anything! And since when is research "the standard high school activity"?

Oh, and OP's account was made yesterday with exactly 1 post. My BS alarm is going off at full force.

I don't think it's necessarily bs. That's how these linked programs get better students than they otherwise would; they offer a sure thing over a gamble and attract undergrad students who otherwise would go to higher ranked schools.

In my opinion linked programs are a bad idea unless you are so certain about medicine and so risk averse you'd rather take the middle of the road sure thing over the host of other, frequently better, opportunities out there if you have patience and ambition.

 

[A7X]

Ok, hold up. I was with you until I tripped over this trollbait. Can anyone verify that OP isn't taking us for a ride? 3.93 gpa, 2400SAT and solid ECs makes you a shoe-in for the Ivy leagues. Or for anything! And since when is research "the standard high school activity"?

Oh, and OP's account was made yesterday with exactly 1 post. My BS alarm is going off at full force.

2400/3.93 is actually reasonable for bs/md. The BS/MD at my school has an average SAT of ~2350 and you have to be in the top 5% of your high school class along with the standard med school ec's. Our program has a 1% acceptance rate, and all of the students could have gone to ivies, but chose not to because of the fact that they would be debt free in undergrad and would be done in 7 years.

 

[Patros]

2400/3.93 is actually reasonable for bs/md. The BS/MD at my school has an average SAT of ~2350 and you have to be in the top 5% of your high school class along with the standard med school ec's. Our program has a 1% acceptance rate, and all of the students could have gone to ivies, but chose not to because of the fact that they would be debt free in undergrad and would be done in 7 years.

Ah, I see. Those kinds of stats are astronomical, I'm not sure I agree that this is a good idea for people with that kind of potential.

I don't think it's necessarily bs. That's how these linked programs get better students than they otherwise would; they offer a sure thing over a gamble and attract undergrad students who otherwise would go to higher ranked schools.

In my opinion linked programs are a bad idea unless you are so certain about medicine and so risk averse you'd rather take the middle of the road sure thing over the host of other, frequently better, opportunities out there if you have patience and ambition.

No kidding. If OP seriously has that kind of academic record, there is no way I advise him to sign up for Drexel. Someone who can get a 2400SAT and near 4.0 GPA should be able to massacre the MCAT and excel in college, given a reasonable amount of motivation. You shouldn't join this kind of program unless you are allowed to apply to other medical schools when the time comes.

 

[Ace-Co-A]

that kind of SAT/ACT score is "normal" for bs/md

2400/3.93 is actually reasonable for bs/md. The BS/MD at my school has an average SAT of ~2350 and you have to be in the top 5% of your high school class along with the standard med school ec's. Our program has a 1% acceptance rate, and all of the students could have gone to ivies, but chose not to because of the fact that they would be debt free in undergrad and would be done in 7 years.

No chance the average SAT for the BS/MD kids at my school is 2350. That's insanity. Isn't 2400 perfect?

 

[breakmon]

It's not a bird in hand if you have to score in the 85th percentile on the MCAT.

I dunno about Drexel's program, but I know for UCSD's program you only need to score a 18 on the MCAT.

 

[moop]

that kind of SAT/ACT score is "normal" for bs/md

Truth. Average >=2300

 

[moop]

2350/4.00 back in the day here, turned down 4 BS/MD programs (BU SMED, NW HPME, Rochester REMS, UConn). As said before, anyone pulling into these programs are pretty much Ivy-caliber and could easily handle the traditional pathway with ease as long as study habits don't deteriorate. That being said, idk if Drexel has a comparably intense pool, but I'll assume it wouldn't be far off.

I see 7-year programs as 1) extremely limiting, 2) no bargaining power for fin aid, and 3) not worth it if MCAT still has to be taken. Last but not least, I'm not for shortchanging a year of college. You'll never live another 4 years like it, so best to maximize the time when you can.

Wait a week and see what other options you have at other colleges, OP. If you get into somewhere that has a great rep for feeding into top schools (Ivy, Stanford, etc.), I'd go with that. Much better to keep options open since you've already proven yourself academically capable.

Take it from someone who was very much like you 3 years ago; college ain't that hard, so don't get scared and take the safe way out there's just no need imo

 

[A7X]

No chance the average SAT for the BS/MD kids at my school is 2350. That's insanity. Isn't 2400 perfect?

Yep but to be fair there were only five kids accepted at my program in my year out of 500. And our pre-health advisor told us that they specifically look for high stat applicants because they want to be sure as possible that these students will do well on the MCAT, do well in Ugrad, and in med school.

 

[ducksau5]

I gave up 2 BS/MD programs to go to a good undergrad and I don't regret it at all, I'll be attending med school in the fall. The main reason I gave them up was that they were both expensive schools and I wanted the opportunity to apply to my state schools/prestigious schools when the time came. People will tell you this process sucks but if you are smart enough to get into a program, you can make it through the process if you apply yourself.

 

[Aerus]

I dunno about Drexel's program, but I know for UCSD's program you only need to score a 18 on the MCAT.

UCSD's program doesn't require an MCAT at all. Granted the average BS/MD student has a 2350 and 3.9+ (unweighted) GPA in high school and EVERYONE has research, it's not that insane to believe these students will do fine in med school without taking the MCAT.

 

[Aerus]

OP, come to the UC's. Yes, grading here is harsher and the students are incredibly bright and motivated, but you'll learn and grow so much as a person. Of course Drexel has their own experiences to offer, but I know you'll enjoy it here. 😀

 

[CollegeKid109]

1

 

[armybound]

It's not a bird in hand if you have to score in the 85th percentile on the MCAT.

he'll have to score better to have a decent shot at getting in to medical school otherwise, much less a guaranteed acceptance.

 

[Dwan]

A 3.5/31 are pretty ridiculous requirements for a program that forces you into 1 choice. With those stats, you'd have a solid shot at lower-stat MD schools the normal way, already. Chances are if you worked hard, you'd be able to get higher than that and have more opportunities, including potentially deciding on a career path other than medicine (and that's why Drexel is trying to entice you into this guaranteed program in the first place). If you remain motivated and were capable of a 2400 SAT, you will definitely have much more options in the future. You may even save a lot of money by getting accepted at a school which offers you good aid or scholarships. As the above poster stated, college isn't that hard, and you don't want to have any regrets by limiting yourself.

 

[moop]

I am honestly surprised that this thread got this many responses. I do apologize if my stats seem like I am trolling, but I am not. I actually did apply to the UCSD Medical Scholars Program but didn't get an interview because they only invite 25 people and there were other students at my school with higher stats/ prestigious research awards. I have read everyone's response carefully and will wait to see of I get accepted into any other undergraduate before I make a decision. If you guys want me to update this post with results and where I am going to end up doing, please reply to this post, but I am not sure if it's appropriate given the context of this thread. I hear back from Harvard and Brown plme today so wish me luck!

Ugh PLME..lol. Great school, bad program. (Or maybe I'm just bitter because I didn't get in lol)

 

[487806]

I was rejected from almost every BS/MD program I applied to, but I did get into Drexel/Drexel's 7 year accelerated medical program. My goal was always to become a practicing physician, but I am not sure if I should accept the Drexel/Drexel offer. I got into a couple amazing undergraduate schools including Carleton college, UCLA, UCSD and am expecting to hear back from some privates later this week and next.

So, among the colleges I have been accepted into so far, do you think I should go to Drexel/Drexel, maintain a 3.5 GPA and 31 MCAT, and go to Drexel's med school? Or should I go to UCLA, UCSD, or Carleton instead, do well there, and get into a better med school? Does Drexel's relatively low ranking affect my chances at residencies? Is it worth the extra effort to go through the regular route or is it better to enjoy my undergrad years with a guaranteed acceptance into medical school?

Thanks

Also my stats include a 2400 SAT, 3.93 GPA with relatively hard courses, and the usual high school medical activities including research, volunteering, and shadowing.

I mean, go for it if you're interested. Drexel's program isn't really that great (it's alright, but there are much better programs). But if you want to avoid the thought of applying normally in the massive competition ~4 years from now, it's worth a thought to stay in the program. Sure it gives you free perks, but the program is alright compared to the powerhouse BS/MD programs mentioned previously (not sure if someone mentioned Northwestern).

Personally, I'd recommend to go in a normal path. Unless it's a powerhouse BS/MD program, it really isn't worth your time to finish UG 3 years and head directly to med school. Since you have what it takes, enjoy UG, do fun ECs, form strong relations, annihilate your MCAT etc. and you'll be a free, well-rounded applicant in the long run.

 

[alpharez]

17 year old me had no freaking clue that he wanted to go into medicine. I couldn't imagine being that set on it so young. Sure, the guarantee of admission into a decent school sounds great, but you'll never know what else you could end up liking if that's all you'll be preparing for. College is fan-freakingtastic and I definitely would advise you to really consider your 4-year schools.

I agree with this and would go to UCLA in a heartbeat.

It's not like you'll be abandoning medicine. And you'll probably have a much better undergrad/ maturing experience.

 

[DrHart]

In my opinion, it's better to keep your options open. Unless you are a poor student, which doesn't seem to be the case due to your other acceptances, you shouldn't have a problem getting in to medical school. You'll also work harder in undergrad to be more competitive but that's not a bad thing. There's a reason why a lot of schools have discontinued BS/MD programs. It has a tendency to make lousier premeds. (Not the case all the time but certainly true for some)

 

[darklabel]

Op just realize that if you go to one of the UC's, you be surrounded by people with a great GPA and decent SATs (tho not as high as yours). I'm not knocking you down, but a 3.5 isn't too difficult to achieve, Drexel is a great program and you can still apply elsewhere (I believe, but i'm not are what's on the contract).

Going to a great school with a high premed concentration will make your academic life difficult (unless you're in an Ivy school). You seem like a smart kid, but going to a GPA deflationary school will be difficult, especially if you're surrounded with other smart people.

 

[SN12357]

Op just realize that if you go to one of the UC's, you be surrounded by people with a great GPA and decent SATs (tho not as high as yours). I'm not knocking you down, but a 3.5 isn't too difficult to achieve, Drexel is a great program and you can still apply elsewhere (I believe, but i'm not are what's on the contract).

Going to a great school with a high premed concentration will make your academic life difficult (unless you're in an Ivy school). You seem like a smart kid, but going to a GPA deflationary school will be difficult, especially if you're surrounded with other smart people.

Since when is being surrounded by other smart people a negative? I understand some specific programs are aggressively (sometimes unfairly) grade deflationary and maybe aren't great for someone gunning for top medical schools. But when I went to college I wanted to be surrounded by smart people because being around them made me better and vice versa. Being alone at the top of the class isn't a particularly fun experience.

 

[darklabel]

Since when is being surrounded by other smart people a negative? I understand some specific programs are aggressively (sometimes unfairly) grade deflationary and maybe aren't great for someone gunning for top medical schools. But when I went to college I wanted to be surrounded by smart people because being around them made me better and vice versa. Being alone at the top of the class isn't a particularly fun experience.

My apologies, I couldn't write a well thought out post since I was on mobile and 'preoccupied' at the same time 😳.

I meant that for some of the UCs or other schools known to for being a "feeder" school, you're going to be constantly competing for grades. Also now instead of maintaining a 3.5, OP must maintain as close to 4.0 as possible and you're surrounded by 200+ premeds who are known for being smart in their high school as well and you know only 5-10% of people actually get A's.

Its just pretty darn stressful. As I said, OP is a smart guy and I'm sure he can rise to the challenge, but I'm sure there were many in his shoes who said the same but ultimately ruined their chances.

 

[SN12357]

My apologies, I couldn't write a well thought out post since I was on mobile and 'preoccupied' at the same time 😳.

I meant that for some of the UCs or other schools known to for being a "feeder" school, you're going to be constantly competing for grades. Also now instead of maintaining a 3.5, OP must maintain as close to 4.0 as possible and you're surrounded by 200+ premeds who are known for being smart in their high school as well and you know only 5-10% of people actually get A's.

Its just pretty darn stressful. As I said, OP is a smart guy and I'm sure he can rise to the challenge, but I'm sure there were many in his shoes who said the same but ultimately ruined their chances.

Yeah. I guess my feeling on this is just that that's what you're going to get in medical school regardless. Is it actually better to hit that crucible in medical school instead? Is someone who is capable of getting into the 7 and 8 year programs really going to have the personality type to want to scale back their accomplishments?

This is why I have such a negative view of these programs, because the type of people they're appropriate for is bizarrely narrow. High-achieving enough in high school to make it in in the first place, but not ambitious enough to want to continue aiming for the top for the rest of their career? It's a narrow demographic to say the least. If you have any thought of staying among the elite of the profession and strong evidence that you will be capable of it, you want to be in the undergrad and medical school environments that suit that best and the 7 and 8 year programs are rarely those places. If you start out at the top undergrads and realize that that particular rat race isn't your thing after all, you can always scale back at that point. But if you are a high-achieving high school student who enters a 7 year program at somewhere like Drexel you're making a choice that is weirdly limiting, and you don't necessarily even have the context to understand why.

And in the interests of full disclosure, I did not do an 8 year program but I know many people who did, and my opinion of the programs is informed by seeing the regret and outcomes they had. In addition to what I outline above, the fact that being in these programs means you can't compete for merit scholarships, and you're tied to one city for the entire time. Many people I knew were kind of dispirited going into medical school just on the fact they wanted a change of scenery.

 

[solitarius]

If you get into Harvard, no one would blame you for going. Nearly all their alumni get into medical school, and odds favor you getting into a school better than Drexel.

However, OP posted this thread to consider Drexel vs. UCs vs. Carleton. Can't speak much about Carleton, but UC undergrad is a giant diploma mill. As @darklabel mentioned, there's a ton of premed gunners. If OP encountered unexpected turbulence in college, it wouldn't surprise anyone here as this site is littered with tons of posts from former HS hotshots sweating about their low GPA at some tough school. UC will have enough people just as smart and motivated as OP. Fact. Assuming he does well, applying to UC med school from UCLA/UCSD ain't no thang. The odds of staying in-state are low. The advantage is generally not there if applying to the East Coast schools.

Anyway. Premed sucks balls in ways you cannot even fully appreciate yet. The constant hoop-jumping, the constant ass-kissing for recommendations or positions, the constant pressure to over-extend yourself, the secondaries and app cycle. None of these has even marginal relevance to a strong interest/love of medicine.

So basically, is avoiding all this hassle worth not getting into a Top 5/10/20?

 

[lnvictus]

OP needs to consult students at UCLA and UCSD and ask them of their premed experiences + whether they would have gone BS/MD. I doubt that many people who replied to this question have experienced the academic culture in any of these schools and he/she needs a first person account of their experiences.

 

[deleted547339]

Do whatever will leave you with less debt. This will be very important later in life. I'd also heavily consider the BS alone. No offense, but you're very young and your life goals may change. An extra year to explore some options isn't a terrible idea at your age.

 

[Patros]

If you get into Harvard, no one would blame you for going. Nearly all their alumni get into medical school, and odds favor you getting into a school better than Drexel.

However, OP posted this thread to consider Drexel vs. UCs vs. Carleton. Can't speak much about Carleton, but UC undergrad is a giant diploma mill. As @darklabel mentioned, there's a ton of premed gunners. If OP encountered unexpected turbulence in college, it wouldn't surprise anyone here as this site is littered with tons of posts from former HS hotshots sweating about their low GPA at some tough school. UC will have enough people just as smart and motivated as OP. Fact. Assuming he does well, applying to UC med school from UCLA/UCSD ain't no thang. The odds of staying in-state are low. The advantage is generally not there if applying to the East Coast schools.

Anyway. Premed sucks balls in ways you cannot even fully appreciate yet. The constant hoop-jumping, the constant ass-kissing for recommendations or positions, the constant pressure to over-extend yourself, the secondaries and app cycle. None of these has even marginal relevance to a strong interest/love of medicine.

So basically, is avoiding all this hassle worth not getting into a Top 5/10/20?

Uh, I don't think you know what a diploma mill is. It would be an organization that awards you a worthless degree for very little effort. UCLA is a world famous university and massive research juggernaut, I seriously doubt you can compare it to UPhoenix or KaplanU in any context. And you're saying that the UC's are pretty hard right? That would make it the opposite of a diploma mill.

You're probably right about the difficulty though. I went to a premed-heavy school that isn't even half UCLA's caliber, and it was no fun. That being said, if I can get into multiple medical schools, then I would bet Mr. 2400 can do so too. I suppose in the end, it's just a matter of OP's ambition, and whether or not he's willing to be gunning for those competitive schools for the next 4 years.

 

[nOchemallday]

Ah, I see. Those kinds of stats are astronomical, I'm not sure I agree that this is a good idea for people with that kind of potential.


No kidding. If OP seriously has that kind of academic record, there is no way I advise him to sign up for Drexel. Someone who can get a 2400SAT and near 4.0 GPA should be able to massacre the MCAT and excel in college, given a reasonable amount of motivation. You shouldn't join this kind of program unless you are allowed to apply to other medical schools when the time comes.

I would actually recommend OP consider the 7-year program for the same reasons you've stated. OP would excel in classes (easy 3.5) and destroy the MCAT; why add all the hoops? Even a 45/4.0 doesn't guaruntee acceptance. All the hoops just make it harder to enjoy doing what you want to do anyway.

Biggest pros/cons imo:
Accepting BS/MD route - you risk regretting your decision and think that you "could have done better," but you're a doctor with the exact same opportunities as any other doctor and don't waste an extra year on a useless bio degree.

Normal route - you become a premed drone like the rest of us, jump the hoops and play the game, hope for the best. But you do get an extra year of soul searching and potentially enter a higher tier med school/better fit.

 

[TspCapacity]

I personally wouldn't do it. The idea that 18 year olds know for sure that they want to go into medicine kinda astounds me. If you are brilliant enough to get into a BS/MD program, you are good enough to go to the university of your choosing, have a great time pursuing the major of your choosing, finding your own interests and having a time of self-exploration, and THEN apply (and get in) to the medical schools of your choosing.

 

[mollyguacomole]

FWIW, I was in a BS/MD program, recently left the program, and don't regret anything. I am glad I chose the program because the undergrad the program is attached to is great and I've had a wonderful college experience. I was able to take the MCAT in a stress-free manner, and when I did well, I then got to make the decision of whether to stay in the program or apply out (my program doesn't allow me to apply out while still holding the med school spot though yours may). Overall, whether you stay in the program or not, you'll have a much less stressful, probably more enjoyably, college experience.

From my n=1 experience, if the college seems like somewhere you'd be happy at, I would strongly consider the program.

 

[mollyguacomole]

. sorry double post