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2.6 science at graduation! Any chance of MD?

Discussion in 'What Are My Chances?' started by boggvir, Dec 24, 2008.

  1. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Including a F and a bunch of Cs. No As. It's not pretty. I was not a science major but took a bunch of sciences and got some Bs and Cs and one F (in higher calc).


    I am in a post-bacc program right now, and so far I have a 3.9 (all As, one B+). At the conclusion of this program, I will have a 3.3 sci. GPA. I plan to do another year of undergrad courses after the post-bac, and if I keep my GPA trend up, I will get up to a science GPA between 3.5 and 3.6 (perhaps I can actually reach a 3.6, we'll see).

    My overall was a 3.4 at graduation, and it should also be up to a 3.5 overall GPA after my post-bac year and a 3.6 overall GPA after two years of close-to-full science only workload.

    How much is my undergrad going to hurt? Note: My overall GPA at the end of my sophomore year was a 2.92, and my science at 1.6 or something like that.

    Over the last three years, I have worked very hard and maintained a 3.8 overall and a 3.9 science. But I am afraid of my first two years of many Cs, an F, and no As.

    Unfortunately, after two years, when my overall is a 3.6 and my science is at 3.5-3.6, I will have so many credit hours (around 300), that taking more undergrad courses will not be possible (e.g, no increase in grades).

    I really want to get into a MD school, and would rather not take the risk of a SMP. Is it possible with the horrible start I gave myself or should I be looking at other options?
     
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  3. Mobius1985

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    If you get your undergrad GPA up to a 3.5-3.6 range, you will be competitive with an MCAT of 32+. Don't worry so much about your bad early start. It's clear from looking at your record that you are a completely different person than you were as a teen student, that you've worked hard, and that you really want what you're working toward. You've proven yourself to be med-school worthy. You will not be screened out due to low stats when the time comes. When your transcript is evaluated in-depth, and the steep recent upward grade trend appreciated, you will not be discriminated against. You will be asked about it at interviews, or given an opportunity to explain on secondary essays, so have a good answer which includes what you learned, and how you changed.

    Assuming a compelling personal statement, good Letters of Recommendation, appropriate extracurriculars, and good interview skills, you will get an MD acceptance. Your academic issues will not hold you back.
     
  4. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Thank you for the help. Am I going in the right track, e.g, continuing to take undergrad credits instead of grad work or other options?
     
  5. Mobius1985

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    Yes, you're on the right track, and made the best decision to improve your overall undergrad GPA with a post-bac. The second best choice would be an SMP, which is risky, and which you said you'd prefer to avoid if possible. The next part of your plan's success is to do well on the MCAT.
     
  6. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Thanks! I plan on taking an online prep course, and treating the MCAT like it is my full time job for two months or so from mid march to mid may, and then another month of steadier preparation while I start my summer term (and taking it MCAT in June). I won't take the MCAT until I am scoring at least 32-33 on the practice MCAT, even if it takes me a whole another year. I won't be applying next year as I am doing more undergrad as you can see, unless I somehow ace (36+) the june MCAT (I'm no genius, so it's very unlikely that'll happen unless my backup strategy of picking 'C' succeeds spectacularly), in which case I'll apply while taking more undergrad next year. So assuming I reach my target goal of a 33, and all the things I mentioned above: 3.6 overall, 3.5 science (maybe 3.6 science).

    And average/decent everything else, I should be OK?
     
  7. Mobius1985

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    Given all that, applying early, and applying broadly, I think you'll be OK.
     
  8. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Thank you for your help!
     
  9. HeatherMD

    HeatherMD Queen of Passiveagressiva
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    Honestly, when I read the title of this I LOL'd and was getting ready to type out "no, you have a long way to go" blah blah blah the same thing we all say to those that screwed up early -- but you've already done the legwork, and props to you, you did very very well.

    I think admissions can look past your earlier GPA, because you've proven that you can handle the medical school course load. I think you'll be fine. You have a bit of an uphill battle and some explaining to do, but you're turn-around is so drastic & positive, I'm sure you'll get an acceptance somewhere.
     
  10. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    I spoke to a counselor at my undergrad, and she said she has never seen anyone get into a medical school with an F and my other grades in science classes (referring to the 1.6), and I should perhaps look at other careers.

    I'm glad to see that may not be the case. Going from 1.6 in science (1 F, 3 Cs, some Bs) to a 3.6 isn't easy, but its nice to hear your words of encouragement.

    I appreciate all of your help.
     
  11. Mobius1985

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    You will help students coming after you with a polite note to the undergrad counselor about your admissions success despite a poor academic showing in your early years, so she will leave room for hope along with her cautionary words in the future.
     
  12. ktal4haider2015

    ktal4haider2015 Future UCR/UCLA Student
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    I am part of a pre-medicine community at UC Riverside. Here we receive LOTS of support, advise and stuff to get into med school.. and here they have told us over and over again that as long as you show an upward trend on grades, and you have a good MCAT (30+), then, you should have no problem getting into med school. So there you go.. worry no more.. and just do your BEST on the MCAT..
    I'm kinda in the same boat as you.. low GPA.. but I have 2 more years to go..
    i'll be a super-super-senior by the end of this mess..
    :)
     
  13. RecyclingBinh

    RecyclingBinh Class of 2014 hopeful!
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    yup! very true indeed. I was told that many times as well. I messed up freshmen year, sort of, but my grades have been increasing every semester with no decrease.
     
  14. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Will do :) - after I actually get in. :p
     
  15. Vihsadas

    Vihsadas No summer
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    Your advisor is simply wrong. You absolutely can get into Medical school with an F. I have something like 1 F, 1 D, a few Cs and countless B-s. It's possible...hard, improbable, difficult: yes. But possible.
     
  16. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Well, you did have a 40 MCAT :p. I'm not exactly expecting that, though my GPA will be higher than yours. Although I am not sure how much difference 3.55-3.60 makes from a 3.38 - nowhere near to make up the difference me and you will likely have on the MCAT. :D
     
  17. Vihsadas

    Vihsadas No summer
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    I think you'd be surprised, a 3.5-3.6 is a marked improvement over my GPA. I'm not saying it's likely or should be expected, just that it's possible to get in with some bad grades. Be the outlier. :p
     
  18. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Really? It's .2 at most. I would think even a 2-3 point MCAT improvement (not that I'd get even a 37) would be much highly regarded. If I get a decent score, say 33-34, I think you'd have to be crazy to take me over you. I certainly wouldn't.

    Note to future admission committees: You're not crazy, please forgive me.
     
  19. SourKsRevenge

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    Its nice that you are trying to improve your grades; however, there is a loophole. In fact this is happening to one of my friends right now. You can have a stinky ass gpa in undergrad (well at least a 3.0) and then get a 2 yr masters degree.... the school will actually look more towards that post-graduate gpa. My friend has a 3.24, he is on track for a 3.8 in grad school; however, our school would not take the 3.8 into consideration until the graduate was official.

    It doesn't sound like you are taking that path, but I thought you should know about it if you are really that interested in going med. Honestly, I'd go dental; its harder but you get out earlier and malpractice insurance is much less. I wish that's what I woulda done; in fact, after med school I'm going to dental school.
     
  20. Vihsadas

    Vihsadas No summer
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    I'm just curious where you heard that. At the vast majority of medical schools a graduate GPA will not help you at all. Most medical schools looks very strongly on the Undergraduate GPA, but not the graduate GPA.
    The exception is if you are in an SMP program specifically tailored to improving your med application clout.
     
  21. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Well, part one is done.

    I just finished my post-bac of 39 credits (science only, all prerequisites plus pathology, and physiology) with a 3.95 GPA.

    So at this point, my science GPA is a 3.38, and overall GPA is a 3.54.

    One more year, and my overall will go to a 3.6, and my science to a 3.5 (at this point I will have 250 credits, so further improvement will not be feasible). And I'll also have a second degree.
     
    #20 boggvir, Mar 23, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2009
  22. airca12

    airca12 Thread killer
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    Congratulations on the huge improvement you've made. It's inspirational.

    Did you take the MCAT already? Have you considered applying this cycle to your state school(s) with those stats? It couldn't hurt if the rest of your app is ready, could it?
     
  23. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 chick magnet
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    Are you going to apply this year? Or do another year for sure? I think you'd get in if you got a good MCAT score this year.
     
  24. RoadRunner17

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    You're halfway there. Just destroy the MCAT. I hope you've been keeping up with your volunteer activities and other life experiences, as well. You're in a better position than I was applying to schools this year, GPA-wise.
     
  25. Lokhtar

    Lokhtar Dreaming about the lions
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  26. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Well, I am starting MCAT study now. If I am scoring 33 or above on practice exams, I will take the MCAT. If not, I will keep studying until I am getting that 33+ consistently. If I do take it, and do get a good score, I will apply while still taking courses. If I don't take it, or don't do well, I will keep taking courses and apply the following year. Either way, I think I will take courses. I really want to try to get to that 3.6 overall and 3.5 science. At least that puts me into the 'below average, but within posibility' range.

    Yes, I've been doing research and volunteering every week. I am nontrad so I don't have as much as I'd like, but I will continue doing volunteering and add in some shadowing for the rest of this year, as well as all of next year.
     
  27. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 chick magnet
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    I don't think 3.6/3.5 is below average, I think that's pretty close to the average for applicants. If you get above 32 you'll definitely be above average. I applied with ~3.6 cumulative and did well with the top tier. I had similar postbac performance to you (~53 units @ 4.0) but I was a non-science major so that represented the entirety of my science GPA, which I guess make things a little different (although i dunno why it should matter)
     
  28. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    I think the average was a 3.67 and a 3.6 or something. In any case, I am hoping my 3.9 overall and science over something like the past 100 credits shows that I am not the student I was and hopefully that trend puts me in the average range GPA wise.
     
  29. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 chick magnet
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    I think you'll do better than the average applicant, personally, good luck! :luck:
     
  30. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Thanks. I hope so :).
     
  31. Vihsadas

    Vihsadas No summer
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    Wow, good job man! That's some solid evidence of your improvement. Now you just have to convince them that who you have become is more important than who you used to be! Keep motivated, keep dedicated to some meanigful and worthwhile causes (community, volunteering, whatever you are really interested in contributing to) and kill that MCAT! I'm sure you can do well on the exam. You've got it goin' on now!
     
  32. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Thanks. I did not do well on the KAPLAN MCAT diagnostic I took. I have 86 days to get a high score, and I'll try to study an average of 4 hours per day for that duration. I got VR 13, PS 6, BS 8. I never memorized any of the formulas, so that hurt me a lot, but still, 27 is pretty crappy. I need at least a 33 to be competitive :(.

    I am aiming as high as possible, but it's going to be a tough road.

    So I am freaking out right now. I don't want to have worked hard over the last three years and maintained a 3.9+, and a 3.95 in my pre-reqs in the last year, all to have it crashing down because I can't do well on the MCAT. Argh!
     
    #31 boggvir, Mar 24, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2009
  33. RoadRunner17

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    Wow, you're in good shape. VR is by far the hardest section to actually raise your score in. The science sections are much more malleable, once you have finished reviewing and learned how to think for the test. That requires practice, of which you are just about to start doing, so I think you are in good shape.
     
  34. Vihsadas

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    If you got a 13 on VR on your diagnostic, you should be fine in 86 days lol. Your diag is comparable to mine (8PS 12VR 8BS). Study your butt off, have a solid plan, do all the content review, a massload of practice problems, and a crapload of practice exams and I think you'll be great. :)
     
  35. Sporknife

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    boggvir, you are going to be my model. I am so rooting for you! I had similar #s upon my graduation and now I am about to embark on a post-bacc and then get a 2nd degree in bio (~1 yr).

    your perseverance is inspiring. go boggvir! keep us posted!
     
  36. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Thank you for everyone's help. Took two days off after my post-bac, and my MCAT studies starts tonight! Wish me luck :).
     
  37. Mobius1985

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    I think the Kaplan diagnostic is deliberately difficult so they are less likely to have to honor their guarantee if you don't do better on the real test. Don't be anxious, and instead use it as a spur inspiring you to stick to your study plan.
     
  38. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Yea, that's what I've been reading. So hopefully that was it, and we'll see in a couple months.
     
  39. Mobius1985

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    Work hard. Make us proud! Report back.
     
  40. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    So I couldn't apply last year due to family problems. I got a 33 on my MCAT (all 11s) and my final cGPA and sGPA are now both 3.54 and 3.51 respectively.

    Over the last 90 credits, I have a 3.96 GPA. In my last 50 credits of science, including all post-bac and some upper level science, my GPA is a 3.94. I really can't do much better than that in my GPA, and now I have too many credits for any change to be worth it. If I don't get in - it's Georgetown or other SMP for me.

    But I am about to submit my app and I'm applying broadly. Keeping my fingers crossed and hoping I didn't ruin my dream in the first two years of school :).
     
  41. Catalystik

    Catalystik Platinum
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    Adcomms tend to love a good redemption story, and yours is inspiring. Good luck. Hopefully, your ECs and LORs are everything they'll want to see.
     
  42. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Thanks :).

    Just submitted - I hope I don't have to do a SMP next year :).
     
  43. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Can someone recommend a few schools?
     
  44. Catalystik

    Catalystik Platinum
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    With a 3.54/33, besides appropriate state and regional schools, consider screening these for "fit" with an MSAR:

    ( )=%OOS matriculating

    Loma Linda (49%), Loyola (55%), RFU (53%), UKentucky (30%), Creighton (89%), Albany (62%), SUNY Downstate (18%), Hofstra (new), Jefferson (60%), MCW (~65%)
    UIllinois (27%), Wayne (17%), Buffalo (29%), Toledo (34%), Drexel (71%), Temple (52%), Vermont (72%), VCU (44%), Virginia Tech Carilion (new),
    GWU (96%), FIU (21%), Louisville (25%), Tulane (83%), UNevada (24% from region and [W]WAMI), NYMC (67%), MUSC (22%), SCarolina (18%), EVMS (39%),
    Rush (19%), Michigan State (26%), Oakland (new),
    Commonweath MC (PA) (29%)
     
  45. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Unfortunately I come from a state as bad as California. I'll apply to most of those OOS schools - thank you!
     
  46. Catalystik

    Catalystik Platinum
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    Arizona recently started taking some Californians as they decided to increase their OOS matriculants to as many as 25%.
     
  47. Crisco

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    I'm in a similar boat:

    Freshman: 1.79
    Sophomore: 3.27
    Junior 1st Sem: 1.55
    -Leave-
    Junior 2nd Sem: 4.08
    Senior: 3.70 (3.78 science)

    SMP: 3.91

    MCAT: 38Q

    It is always an inspiration to see others who have gone through what I had to and then pull through. I'm applying now as well and I hope you get into many wonderful places! :)
     
    #46 Crisco, Jul 8, 2010
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2010
  48. Lokhtar

    Lokhtar Dreaming about the lions
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    That SMP GPA and MCAT are both kick ass. You'll have your pick of schools!
     
  49. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Man, SDN and mdapplicants is making me VERY jittery.
     
  50. boggvir

    boggvir Sunny California
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    Assuming I don't get in this year - what would be my next option? SMP?

    My GPA is 3.55c/3.51s, and MCAT 33, so I think my MCAT is OK but my GPA is probably slightly higher than the average SMPer. I don't see that as an issue but I am deathly afraid of spending $50k from loans on an SMP and then not getting in even if I do well. I can't take any more undergrad courses (I have like 300+ cr, moving from 3.5 to 3.6 science would take 40 credits in science of straight As). And undergrad wise, if the last 100 credits worth of 3.9+ is not good enough, I don't think much else would be.

    My last grade lower than a B was in 2003, and my last grade lower than a B+ was in 2005. And since 2005, I've had only two B+ grades, and all of the others have been A- or As.

    So I guess now I have to hope that they look closer at my year-to-year breakdown and not screen me out, I suppose :(.
     
  51. Crisco

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    your GPA is definitely higher than your typical SMPer who probably hovers around a 3.3 or even lower. It is a possible route but I am gonna say it is unnecessary. You should be able to get in with those stats.
     

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