2013-2014 Case Western Reserve University School of Medicine

[Clumpofstuff]

Just noticed this new laptop requirement. Whomp whomp. Do any of the currents students how much the discounts are for the laptops? My wallet is still recovering from interview season.

Here is the price information from last year

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[squidman]

Hi! Has anyone sent an update letter to CCLCM Office of Admissions? I did a couple days ago, but never received a confirmation email. Is that normal?

I sent one back in December, but never received a confirmation e-mail either...So I think it's normal.

 

[jeffs office]

Here is the price information from last year

Hmmm... I don't see anything.

 

[ukae]

http://casemed.case.edu/admin_computing/student/2017/notebook_comp.cfm

I think it's this!

 

[trino]

http://casemed.case.edu/admin_computing/student/2017/notebook_comp.cfm

I think it's this!

This is perfect, thank you!

 

[jeffs office]

http://casemed.case.edu/admin_computing/student/2017/notebook_comp.cfm

I think it's this!

Thanks for sharing. These prices depress me. lol

 

[kimicurtis]

Hi! Has anyone sent an update letter to CCLCM Office of Admissions? I did a couple days ago, but never received a confirmation email. Is that normal?

I sent one back in December, but never received a confirmation e-mail either...So I think it's normal.

I sent an update to the cclcm email and a few days later received an email that said "Update Received". I don't think you should put much thought into it (unless you want to give them a quick call). I think it just varies with how busy they are.

 

[fbtkdrbs]

anyone heard back for university track after being on hold?

 

[masaraksh]

anyone heard back for university track after being on hold?

Nope. I was put on hold But haven't heard anything since.

 

[human101]

Nope. I was put on hold But haven't heard anything since.

Same story here. Put on hold in October.

 

[mariambaby3]

In past years, how many applicants are usually accepted off the High Hold list at CCLCM?

EDIT: And does anyone know how many applicants are placed in the High Hold list?

 

[eggs13]

Thanks for sharing. These prices depress me. lol

If you are able to find a computer that meets their specs elsewhere for cheaper, or if you want one of the macbooks with a solid state drive, etc. then you may purchase the computer yourself. I know multiple classmates who did this. I'm not sure if they were given a hard time by the IT people or not, but as long as it meets the specs then you should be good to go. If you are looking to go this route, then I would call the IT people and let them know just to make sure the computer you are buying will in fact be able to have all the hard-/software installed--It would really suck to buy a ~$1500+ computer and then not be able to use it. If you go this route, you will have to mail them your computer ~1 month before school starts so they can install everything so that it is ready when you arrive in July!

tl;dr--you don't have to buy your computer through the school--you can buy your own computer if you want, but call IT first to make sure it meets there specs

 

[ducksau5]

This is directed at current UT students: What do you guys feel about IQ teams? I know PBL is not for everyone, but do you guys feel that it is a good way to learn the material?

 

[JAbraham]

In past years, how many applicants are usually accepted off the High Hold list at CCLCM?

EDIT: And does anyone know how many applicants are placed in the High Hold list?

Well apparently a couple SDNers from last year were accepted off the High Hold list. For absolutely no other reason than sheer optimism, I'm throwing out 8-10 as a potential range. Similarly, perhaps 8-10 people are placed in the High Hold list originally? Good luck, though! I'm in the same boat. I would jump off said boat with glee into a lake filled with piranha from one of those recent awful B-list horror movies (B-list may be generous) if April 15th (or later) brings good news. I'd still do it if the only land in sight was populated with comically large bull ants...I doubt I'd appreciate their humorous size in the moment.

This post wasn't all that helpful, so here's a humorous aside.

What did the hypochondriac have written on his tombstone?

I told you so.

 

[nobeta]

Hey guys! I'll join the High Hold party as well. Based on the number of people who posted here that they are on High Hold, it seems to me there are many more than 8-10 on the list. No idea how much movement there will be though :/

 

[rainbowbrite76]

Have any hold or high hold cclcm students been invited to second look?

 

[mariambaby3]

Have any hold or high hold cclcm students been invited to second look?

I may be wrong, but I believe only currently-accepted students have been invited.

 

[rainbowbrite76]

I may be wrong, but I believe only currently-accepted students have been invited.

Darn. I was hoping to have another shot at charming them

 

[jeffs office]

If you are able to find a computer that meets their specs elsewhere for cheaper, or if you want one of the macbooks with a solid state drive, etc. then you may purchase the computer yourself. I know multiple classmates who did this. I'm not sure if they were given a hard time by the IT people or not, but as long as it meets the specs then you should be good to go. If you are looking to go this route, then I would call the IT people and let them know just to make sure the computer you are buying will in fact be able to have all the hard-/software installed--It would really suck to buy a ~$1500+ computer and then not be able to use it. If you go this route, you will have to mail them your computer ~1 month before school starts so they can install everything so that it is ready when you arrive in July!

tl;dr--you don't have to buy your computer through the school--you can buy your own computer if you want, but call IT first to make sure it meets there specs

I know they say you pay the school back through a fee. Do students generally pay the school through loans or out of pocket?

 

[eggs13]

I know they say you pay the school back through a fee. Do students generally pay the school through loans or out of pocket?

I paid for the computer via loans and I would assume most others who got their computer through the school did the same, but I'm sure there are some who may have gone the out of pocket route

 

[ukae]

Does anyone know when we can expect financial aid offers? Thank you!

 

[jeffs office]

I paid for the computer via loans and I would assume most others who got their computer through the school did the same, but I'm sure there are some who may have gone the out of pocket route

Cool. Glad to know you can wait until loans come out (I'm still saving up money just for a move, haha). Thanks so much!

 

[vagabondrunning]

I know they say you pay the school back through a fee. Do students generally pay the school through loans or out of pocket?

Is this for UT or CT? I know College Track is given tablets or something, but do we need new laptops, too?

 

[vc7777]

Is this for UT or CT? I know College Track is given tablets or something, but do we need new laptops, too?

CP gives you a laptop

 

[strikerchris]

Is there a Facebook Group for accepted students? Do most people figure out their housing at second look?

 

[happyfeet1292]

Here's the accepted students Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/757398360943936/

It's actually been very active in terms of providing information about housing, etc. In terms of finding roommates, I have no idea since I'm just an accepted student.

 

[Leoz M Jiliums]

If you were accepted into UP, the link to the facebook group is in your acceptance email

Is there a Facebook Group for accepted students? Do most people figure out their housing at second look?

Edit: Or click happyfeet's (happyfeets'?) link above

 

[strikerchris]

Thanks!

 

[Spartan17]

This is directed at current UT students: What do you guys feel about IQ teams? I know PBL is not for everyone, but do you guys feel that it is a good way to learn the material?

For me IQ has really helped build the interpersonal and team-oriented skills that will need to be second nature in the hospital for 3rd year and beyond. It's so much better than lecture and provides daily motivation for coming in prepared to discuss something and learn from(and teach) your classmates that tests weeks and months away could never provide. IQ discussions also really help me remember concepts months, and hopefully years, after I’ve learned them. It's true that IQ isn't for everyone, but at Case it's smoothly integrated into the curriculum and the students and staff are really committed to its success, making it a nice alternative to lectures every day. Hope this helps answer your question. Let me know if you have any more!

 

[vagabondrunning]

If you were accepted into UP, the link to the facebook group is in your acceptance email


Edit: Or click happyfeet's (happyfeets'?) link above

There's also a Facebook page for the CP.

 

[UImom]

Does anyone know how many UT acceptances will come off the hold list? Sorry if this has been asked before, I don't think I can make through the whole thread anytime soon.

 

[CrunchyTeddy]

Can a current CCLCM student comment on evaluations during clinical years? Is it H/P/F, and do portfolio systems continue into Years 3 and 4? Also, is the 5th research year evaluated in any way?

Thanks =)

 

[CCLCMer]

Can a current CCLCM student comment on evaluations during clinical years? Is it H/P/F, and do portfolio systems continue into Years 3 and 4? Also, is the 5th research year evaluated in any way?

Thanks =)

No, the clinical and research years are P/F just like the preclinical years are. CCLCM students never participate in the H/HP/P/F system at any point, while UP students do during the clinical years. In addition, the clinical block exams (they were starting to use NBMEs rather than shelfs when I graduated) are optional for CCLCM, but not UP, students. If you opt to take the exams as a CCLCM student, they will not count toward your rotation eval. You are also not eligible for AOA as a CCLCM student.

Yes, you do still have portfolios during the clinical and research years. Things may have changed a bit over the last few years since I graduated, but I remember having to write three portfolios: one at the end of MS1, one at the end of MS2, and one at the end of MS4. You still get narrative evals all along, both on rotations and from your research adviser. You also have research committee meetings, presentations, etc.

Just to clarify: your fifth year is NOT your research year. My understanding is that students are now required to do the research year either during their third or fourth years. So you'd be doing rotations/electives/interviews as a fifth year, not research.

Hope that helps.

 

[CrunchyTeddy]

No, the clinical and research years are P/F just like the preclinical years are. CCLCM students never participate in the H/HP/P/F system at any point, while UP students do during the clinical years. In addition, the clinical block exams (they were starting to use NBMEs rather than shelfs when I graduated) are optional for CCLCM, but not UP, students. If you opt to take the exams as a CCLCM student, they will not count toward your rotation eval. You are also not eligible for AOA as a CCLCM student.

Yes, you do still have portfolios during the clinical and research years. Things may have changed a bit over the last few years since I graduated, but I remember having to write three portfolios: one at the end of MS1, one at the end of MS2, and one at the end of MS4. You still get narrative evals all along, both on rotations and from your research adviser. You also have research committee meetings, presentations, etc.

Just to clarify: your fifth year is NOT your research year. My understanding is that students are now required to do the research year either during their third or fourth years. So you'd be doing rotations/electives/interviews as a fifth year, not research.

Hope that helps.

Oh wow. Thanks a lot!! Your answers are incredibly helpful

One more question, if you don't mind: Do students feel like the lack of grades puts them at a disadvantage when applying for residency?

 

[vagabondrunning]

CCLCM question: in what format is the material? E-books and pdfs? Textbooks? Etc?

 

[Clumpofstuff]

This is directed at current UT students: What do you guys feel about IQ teams? I know PBL is not for everyone, but do you guys feel that it is a good way to learn the material?

I really like it.
However, I should point out that I like doing my own learning for the most part. This works well with IQ because although they give you some suggested resources in order to do the research for the cases, I use some various resources of my own that I prefer. Additionally, hearing from others is great because they usually will have other resources they used that might explain a concept better.

The bad of this can be sometimes you might spend too much time doing the research, but that's something you have to be able to gauge on your own.

So overall, if you are self-motivated, then IQ is for you.

 

[CCLCMer]

One more question, if you don't mind: Do students feel like the lack of grades puts them at a disadvantage when applying for residency?

In my class at least (and keep in mind that I applied for residency in 2010, so it's been a while), some of us felt like it was an issue, and others didn't think it was a big deal. I was in the second group. I applied for 35 programs, got 32 interview invites. But then, I had a Step 1 score that was well above average for my specialty and a strong Dean's Letter. Some of my classmates who applied for really competitive surgical subspecialties did feel like they were at a disadvantage, especially if they didn't have amazing Step 1 scores. But on the other hand, we come out of CCLCM with much better research experience than the average non-MD/PhD med student does, and probably even more importantly, the faculty is really willing to use their connections to help get us interviews. That can be a big deal. At the residency app level, who you know matters a lot more than it does at the med school app level in terms of getting invites. Dean Young (the Dean of the entire CCLCM med school) made a call on my behalf to a PD that he knew personally, and I got an invite to that program the next day. I know that other well-connected faculty did the same for several of my classmates. And everyone in my class matched, even though we were only the third class and there wasn't much of a track record at that point. Nowadays probably most PDs are aware of CCLCM, and I'm guessing the lack of grades is even less of an issue than it was in the past.

CCLCM question: in what format is the material? E-books and pdfs? Textbooks? Etc?

We mostly used textbooks, many of which are available as e-books. Ask the current students what they're using before you go out and buy a lot of books. In fact, you can probably buy a bunch of books used from the class above you and save some money. Also, at least when I was there, they'd put all the required books on reserve in the library, so you didn't have to buy any of them if you either read them in the library or copied the assigned chapters in the library. (Free copying at CCF too. Woot!)

 

[seeinghowitgoes]

Oh wow. Thanks a lot!! Your answers are incredibly helpful

One more question, if you don't mind: Do students feel like the lack of grades puts them at a disadvantage when applying for residency?

Hey, this is a bit anecdotal from a friend I have at CCLCM, so take it as the hearsay it is, but just to compliment the above sentiment it seems some people worry more than others but in the end it all (most?) works out judging by his impression and the match list/rates.

If you're interested in hearkng more about the grading, this video, which includes a talk from somebody from CCLCM, does a good job explaining the evaluations (at least I think it does - in all fairness I haven't watched it in quite a while). I believe the CCLCM rep even acknowledges the issues with not having grades, so I think the school is aware of potential pitfalls with not having them and attempts to work around them accordingly (including always asking for ways to improve, as the CCLCM rep does at the end).

 

[CrunchyTeddy]

Hey, this is a bit anecdotal from a friend I have at CCLCM, so take it as the hearsay it is, but just to compliment the above sentiment it seems some people worry more than others but in the end it all (most?) works out judging by his impression and the match list/rates.

If you're interested in hearkng more about the grading, this video, which includes a talk from somebody from CCLCM, does a good job explaining the evaluations (at least I think it does - in all fairness I haven't watched it in quite a while). I believe the CCLCM rep even acknowledges the issues with not having grades, so I think the school is aware of potential pitfalls with not having them and attempts to work around them accordingly (including always asking for ways to improve, as the CCLCM rep does at the end).

Wow thanks!

 

[pyrrion89]

I'm sure it's been posted before, but could someone post or message me the CCLCM match lists, preferably for multiple years? Thank you!

 

[seeinghowitgoes]

I'm sure it's been posted before, but could someone post or message me the CCLCM match lists, preferably for multiple years? Thank you!

http://portals.clevelandclinic.org/cclcm/Students/StudentMatch/tabid/7344/Default.aspx

Hopefully that link works, I'm sending from my phone. They have a cool map function so you can actually "see" the match as well haha

 

[wholeheartedly]

And everyone in my class matched, even though we were only the third class and there wasn't much of a track record at that point. Nowadays probably most PDs are aware of CCLCM, and I'm guessing the lack of grades is even less of an issue than it was in the past.

Emphasis mine. I think this is a really important point. The more students that are out in the residency population, I would imagine the more comfortable PDs will become with the lack of grades.

 

[pyrrion89]

CCLCM: Is it possible to use the research year to do a dual degree outside of Cleveland?

 

[vagabondrunning]

CCLCM: Is it possible to use the research year to do a dual degree outside of Cleveland?

Great question! You should also check out Case, though, as they have a lot of great master's degrees (in well-reputed programs, too). I'm looking into bioethics, history of science and medicine, or medical anthropology for mine.

 

[CrunchyTeddy]

Great question! You should also check out Case, though, as they have a lot of great master's degrees (in well-reputed programs, too). I'm looking into bioethics, history of science and medicine, or medical anthropology for mine.

Adding onto Pyrrion's question... Do any CCLCM do their research years at other institutions (outside of Cleveland)?

 

[CCLCMer]

Adding onto Pyrrion's question... Do any CCLCM do their research years at other institutions (outside of Cleveland)?

I'm not sure what the rules are now, but when I was a student, we had several people who did research years at other institutions, especially if they were awarded year-long med student research grants like Doris Duke or HHMI. It would be a good question to ask at second look.

CCLCM: Is it possible to use the research year to do a dual degree outside of Cleveland?

It's unlikely that leaving Cleveland to do an entire grad degree would be possible unless you took a leave of absence from med school. But like vagabondrunning said, there are a lot of MS options through Case. Plus, it's free for CCLCM students to take the MS classes through Case. Why would you want to pay to go do an MS somewhere else?

 

[FluffyRabbit]

I'm not sure what the rules are now, but when I was a student, we had several people who did research years at other institutions, especially if they were awarded year-long med student research grants like Doris Duke or HHMI. It would be a good question to ask at second look.


It's unlikely that leaving Cleveland to do an entire grad degree would be possible unless you took a leave of absence from med school. But like vagabondrunning said, there are a lot of MS options through Case. Plus, it's free for CCLCM students to take the MS classes through Case. Why would you want to pay to go do an MS somewhere else?

The theoretical rules for doing research years away are that you have to prove that it will be a fruitful year. The administration is always cautious because at an outside institution, if things aren't working out for you, they have very limited influence in being able to talk to your PI or helping you. In practice, most people who did research away did it through a year long research grant like the Sarnoff, NIH or the HHMI fellowships, where they are more comfortable with the existing structure and track record of the program. If this is particularly important to you or you have a specific place in mind, I would also recommend asking about it at second look.

Completing a research year and thesis is a requirement for graduation - I do not believe that leaving Cleveland for an entire year to just do coursework is an option.

 

[ducksau5]

Is there a match list up for UT students?

 

[Leoz M Jiliums]

Hey guys, I've got a few questions for people in UP, especially MS3/MS4. I'm deciding between Case and another school:

-Are the fist two years internally ranked?Do MS1/MS2 grades play any role in AOA selection?

-How much flexibility do you get in selecting where you rotate? (ex: doing all or 3/4 of the cores at UH/CCF)

-What is the role of the medical student on the wards? What's a typical day like on surgery or medicine?

- Are the clinical years graded on a curve? I've heard conflicting reports about this. (Student handbook simply says 90+ is Honors, but someone in program says graded on curve)

-What percentage of people usually get honors? Do you feel you had enough time to study for shelfs?

-Ok, so I'm 100% interested in ortho (I know it can change, but work with me here ), and away rotations seem to especially important in getting a leg up in the match. Are there there any limitations on how many aways/rotations I can do in one specialty in MS4?


Thanks all!

 

[TheBoilingPoint]

Hey guys, I've got a few questions for people in UP, especially MS3/MS4. I'm deciding between Case and another school:

-Are the fist two years internally ranked?Do MS1/MS2 grades play any role in AOA selection?

-How much flexibility do you get in selecting where you rotate? (ex: doing all or 3/4 of the cores at UH/CCF)

-What is the role of the medical student on the wards? What's a typical day like on surgery or medicine?

- Are the clinical years graded on a curve? I've heard conflicting reports about this. (Student handbook simply says 90+ is Honors, but someone in program says graded on curve)

-What percentage of people usually get honors? Do you feel you had enough time to study for shelfs?

-Ok, so I'm 100% interested in ortho (I know it can change, but work with me here ), and away rotations seem to especially important in getting a leg up in the match. Are there there any limitations on how many aways/rotations I can do in one specialty in MS4?


Thanks all!

1) No, No

2) I did most of them at 1 location and nobody cared, but you can relatively choose (with some chance of not getting 100% of what you want) in third year and can DEFINITELY get 100% of where you want in 4th year. All of the hospitals are a major part of both the UP and CP. Some people interested in Peds did most of their rotations at Rainbow, people interested in EM did a ton at Metro, and people wanting to do crazy surgical subspecialties did all the rotations at CCF.

3) Depends on which hospital you're at, but for the most part you are treated like an equal member of the team usually carrying 1/3 the patient load of the intern in your 3rd year, and 1/2 in 4th year AIs. Electives in 4th year are entirely what you put into it . I was lazy, so I did nothing. Based on multiple away rotations, it seems like we are treated with a little more autonomy and responsibility than other med schools. Although hard to say based on limited information and the fact I have only attended 1 medical school.

Average days (on average): arrive at 6:30 to pre-round, done around 5:30 on medicine. Some days more, some days less just depends on admitting schedule. On surgery, I was there everyday at 4am and left around 7pm; just the nature of the beast. I did become quite competent in the OR being able to close incisions, tie knots, and generally throw stitches quite well.

4) Grades are random, mainly depended on how well you were liked + shelf score. Some people give out all honors, some give out no honors, really impossible to say.

5) We probably have the easiest, requirement wise, 4th year out there. Theoretically, only 1 month of 4th year actually has to take place in Cleveland. The rest can be wherever you want.