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Discussion in 'Emergency Medicine' started by doggydog, Aug 12, 2016.
You're not alone - many of my classmates are in same boat.
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No love for 3 weeks now. And my advisor just told me I need to scrounge up a few more invites. But how??
I recently got an interview invite after nearly 4 weeks of nothing but a rejection here and there. Is it safe to assume that when programs send out invites this late that you're on the bottom of their rank list?
I understand why you would say that, but why even interview anyone if they've already ranked people based on pre-interview desirability?
As has been discussed at least fifty times on the forum, people match after getting off wait lists every year.
Have not been hearing anything from programs... occasional gtfo rejection here and there
That's exactly the impression that I get from speaking to residents.. that interviews are just a formality to make sure you're normal; that your speed-dating personality is okay enough not to be tanked down the list. Does anyone know if the interview can really help you move up the list significantly?
Do you think that depends on the competitiveness of the program? I suppose programs that are less competitive may match people that are way down on their rank list. So if I just receive an invite from a relatively competitive program, am I much less likely to match there because I'm possibly very low on their list?
BTW jessk2015 and doggydog, thanks for being involved in this thread - it helps when there are people talking instead of just lurkers (like I was). Hope things go well for you both this season.
The competitiveness of the program will definitely affect how far they go down their rank list, but it's just so hard to tell how competitive these programs are. I've heard that even some of the programs deemed competitive by sdn still go down decently far on their rank list. Yes, you are probably less likely to match there if you get off a wait list, but it's not impossible.
I don't know if other people are noticing this on the trail, but people are really weird. Interviews definitely affect rank list with all of the weirdos out there.
Yeah it's really frustrating that we don't have access to the NRMP data characterizing programs instead of just applicants. I'd really like a histogram for each program showing the number of applicants that rank them 1, 2, etc. Though I understand why they can't publish that. I'm curious as to which "sdn competitive" programs you've heard go down far on their list?
I've actually noticed the opposite - I think everyone I'm meeting is pretty cool. It's making me optimistic that I'll like my future co-residents. Hopefully I don't like everyone because I'm the weird one!
I wouldn't go that far. Sure most programs are going to send out their first invites to the "best applicants" - i.e. those with stellar stats (I think we all know good grades and step scores does not mean you'll be a great physician, but that's just the way the system works). I've thought about how much an interview really matters and I think it has the potential to really make a difference. Also don't forget, the big deal with interview days is more how you fit with that program - not only are they interviewing you to see if your personality fits with theirs, but you should be doing the same. It's hard to really understand what it means to "mesh well with a program's personality" but after enough interviews and social dinners, it really starts to make sense.
That's a great point and I'm actually having trouble assessing a program's personality, no resident I've met at a social or otherwise has been willing to say anything but positive things or very small negative things about their program. I agree that to some small degree I've meshed better with certain programs. Some residents are really great and easy to talk to, but I don't want to rank a program based on a limited sample of the people I've met in the program which may or may not have been particularly cool. How can I be sure that my one day there is really representative of the experience I'll have in the program? During my EM rotations I've noticed that the attendings you work with can really make or break your shift, but we don't get a sense of what all the attendings are like to work with over the interview process. I guess I'm having trouble figuring out what to prioritize in choosing a residency outside of geography and whether or not the residents are worked to death.
I feel you. I think when people say personality they also mean it to include your interests. Is the program big on research? Are there regular feedback sessions for residents? Does the PD sound like he really cares about the program and receptive to feedback? One PD literally spent 30 minutes telling us how we shouldn't judge a program on its name or "ranking" while another PD in a different program seemed super excited about all the changes in his program and how involved they are in the community. My personality/interest is getting involved in the community so I really felt I would fit well with that second program and couldn't really find anything that drew me to the first one. Sure most people are going to say they are happy which I think speaks volumes to "most EM programs won't work you to death and at the end you'll feel well prepared as an EM physician." It's just trying to find those small pearls. Hope that makes sense
Can't comment on the sending letters part but congrats on the step jump LovesBikes!
Do you write thank you notes for SLOEs?
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Fair enough, thanks. I have some work to do this weekend then.
Thanks! I was hoping it would help a little more but I think my step 1 is screening me out at a lot of places, also didn't help that my only sloe was just uploaded. Ugh.
Would you write a thank you letter for someone writing you a LOR?
What everyone has to understand is that a thank you letter is NOT going to make an ounce of difference in your application. Thank you letters are like holding the door open for someone - it's a courtesy, nothing more. If you were brought up to write thank you letters and think it's the nice thing to do, then do it. Having said that, thank you letters should be reserved for sincere acts of gratitude; SLOE writing isn't one of them.
Interesting perspective; I may respectfully disagree with some of the comments mentioned above. I agree 100% that it won't affect the application.
However, on a human decency level, it is the right thing to do (as with any virtuous act, it is not the same thing as saying you *must* do it, since compulsion and virtue are nearly always mutually exclusive). The writing of SLOEs is described as something that we are entitled to, which is adamantly not the case. As someone who wrote thousands of letters of recommendation in a prior career, I can assure you that writing a good letter of rec - and there is a BIG difference between a good and a half-assed letter of rec - is something that takes quite a bit of time and effort, and not something that anyone should feel entitled to.
Another thing to consider: EM is a small world, and you are bound to run into many people again at some point in our future careers, perhaps someone that wrote a SLOE. That's obviously no guarantee of having any correspondence like this being remembered or anything coming of it, but again, I'd file it under the "right thing to do" column.
Just sayin' and just my $0.02 worth. Take it with a truckload of salt.
I've never heard of anyone ever being denied a SLOE. It's a required part of the process - you are definitely entitled to one, irrespective of how good or bad it is.
I'm not saying the consequence would be a denial of the SLOE. A thank you letter after someone does something for you is never inappropriate, IMHO.
Never said it was "inappropriate;" just out of place.
Point taken; I apologize if I (inadvertently) put words in your mouth. (I'll stop posting about this before someone tells us both to STFU.)
No one else is talking - might as well keep the forum alive
Is it typical to go to your own institution's social event?
I think so. I went to my institute's social and all the other people in my class were there as well.
Yes (free beer)
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Thanks! Also, is it better to send a thank you note late (like 2-3 weeks after the interview) or not at all?
Sending a thank you letter early, late, or not at all will have the same implications on your application. When I interviewed, the resident told us after we finished our tour that we could send thank you notes if we wanted to but the PD and other staff were upstairs already figuring out where we all go in their rank list.
Anyway, sending a thank you note 2-3 weeks late just doesn't make any sense. No one is going to remember who you were. Besides, telling someone thank you 3 weeks late may come off as disingenuous.
I have an FAU interview Feb 2 and am interested in moving it earlier. If anyone with an FAU interview earlier would prefer at 2/2 date (due to their course schedule or otherwise) feel free to send me a PM and perhaps we could contact the PC regarding a swap
Hope interview season is treating you all well! I have a shot in the dark favor if anyone's willing...have an interview overlap for Dartmouth and New Mexico, looking to swap for one of them:
Dartmouth: swap your January 3, January 9, or 10 to my January 4?
New Mexico: swap your January 6 or 12 (19 or 20 less preferable but I'd do it) to my January 5?
I would be super grateful. Thank you!!!
I'll say this... We certainly notice if you DONT go.
Anyone who interviewed at U Penn know what time the day is finished?
Anyone have any informing about Mount Sinai Miami beach or kendall regional? any students who rotated through or anyone interviewed as yet?
Seriously what is up with programs holding the social the evening after the interview?!
They do realize we now have to pay for another night of a hotel in order to attend don't they.
Page 17 of the Osteopathic EM thread.
The places I have seen do this are putting the social on the night between interview days (ex: interview on Monday and Tuesday, have the event Monday night). This is obviously more efficient for them, but I feel your pain.
Heya. I also have a long-shot request to see if anyone would be kind/willing/able enough to swap some interview dates.
Henry Ford: I'm scheduled for 1/13, would love to switch to your 1/4 or 1/6.
Arizona-South: I'm scheduled for 1/18, would love to switch to your 12/14.
If you can swap, let me know what you want on Amazon and I'll send you an Interview Season gift. Thanks.
Hi - Does anyone know of any programs that specifically require Step 2 CS from USMGs to be in by the time they do rank list? Is that even an issue or is that only for FMGs? Taking it in January (so should be back sometime in March) and there's nothing sooner.
Almost every program I asked just needed it prior to starting intern year. I think only UCSF had a university wide policy that said you needed it prior to ranking, but have pushed people through in the last who didn't have it. I would ask your top choices just to be sure though.
I heard from two programs that they need it to rank because they have almost been burned by residents in the past two were unable to pass; their institutions don't allow them to hire people without completed CS/CK and they would have then had to be in violation of the match to match with those applicants and then not hire them
In case any applicants only check the application/interview/rejection threads,
I really encourage everyone to fill out the anonymous away rotation survey. We all know how hit or miss these away rotations are and how important they end up being toward our competitiveness in this speciality. A great application can be significantly hindered by a bad rotation leading to a bad letter and the best way to combat this is through increasing the general knowledge about these rotations. I know some people are hesitant to post even an anonymous review for fear of someone finding out who there are, but with the dozens of rotators these places get, it's really not possible.
Here is the survey link:
is there a place where people can see what people posted
They get posted here:
Hi, I have a question for everyone here. I just found out that I won't be able to do an EM sub-i until August and my school doesn't have a home program. My plan is to do 3 EM sub-i: August, Sept, and Oct. The problem here is that I may not have a SLOE letter by Sept. 15th. Did this happen to anyone? What should I do in this situation?
Thanks for your time
This is fine.
The majority of programs will send invites with 1 SLOE and rank with 2.
Most programs start looking at applications after 10/1 (Dean's Letter). Your August SLOE should be in by then. You may be at a disadvantage at a limited number of programs that require 2 SLOEs for interviews or if they start looking 9/15. However, this is a minority of programs.
does anyone know if Southern illinois U. does 12s or 10s or 8s for shift hours
I believe 10s.