[2017-2018] Official Interview Thread; Emergency Medicine

[mangodroplet]

u were 4 points away from >240, def within the realm of dreaming..

haha but yet I didn't break it! Never broke 240 on practice exams. Not complaining here, just trying to quell the whole "step 1 is everything" feelings. Fine, I'll say wouldn't dream of >250 then

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[theSmurfette]

Whelp. Looking at # of invites vs scores, I'm gonna say that I'm living proof that EC's and SLOES can be just as important as step scores. There's hope for us folk who would never dream of scoring >240 on step 1!

Also as much as this process sucks, it definitely is going 1000000% better for me than med school apps did...I only had 2 invites then. ouch.

Well, y’all fuss at him talking about his step being not low enough. Mine IS low, both Step 1 & 2.

I’m sitting at 9 interviews. Granted, 3 are community programs that don’t have a trauma designation. And only 3 are in my “region”. I’m sitting at 95% chance of match right now, based on 2016 data. Just saying that there is more to them offering invites than Step scores.

I was legitimately afraid of not getting more than 2 (Home & away) and having to apply for a backup specialty. I have been very surprised.


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[mangodroplet]

Well, y’all fuss at him talking about his step being not low enough. Mine IS low, both Step 1 & 2.

I’m sitting at 9 interviews. Granted, 3 are community programs that don’t have a trauma designation. And only 3 are in my “region”. I’m sitting at 95% chance of match right now, based on 2016 data. Just saying that there is more to them offering invites than Step scores.

I was legitimately afraid of not getting more than 2 (Home & away) and having to apply for a backup specialty. I have been very surprised.


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That's awesome!!!!! Best of luck to ya on your interviews

 

[DoximityRocks]

Quick question you guys. I have 3 interviews in the same city with one of them not lining up with the other two to save me a four hour drive each way. They do have an interview date that lines up but it has been full (and I have been on the wait-list for this date on interview broker for about 2 weeks now). Could I possibly contact the program outside of interview broker to see if they can squeeze me in on a full day? and If so who do I send the email out to? The coordinator?

 

[surely]

Quick question you guys. I have 3 interviews in the same city with one of them not lining up with the other two to save me a four hour drive each way. They do have an interview date that lines up but it has been full (and I have been on the wait-list for this date on interview broker for about 2 weeks now). Could I possibly contact the program outside of interview broker to see if they can squeeze me in on a full day? and If so who do I send the email out to? The coordinator?

For this kind of request, calling the coordinator is probably better than emailing. Eliminates time-consuming back-and-forth and can be resolved quickly.

 

[injuriesherbs]

Hey guys, needing a little direction here. US MD 250s/240s/CS pending, AOA, MSPE w/ only positive comments and ~2/3 honors, interesting ECs, SVI 20, no red flags, have applied to ~120 programs (about half of which were sometime within the last 10 days) and gotten 1 interview from a top-tier program, 3 waitlists from top-tiers, 9 rejections, and completed my away interviews while on them. Upon discussions I am now realizing that I have to have at least one SLOE that is not favorable... simply no other explanation. Has this happened to anyone and/or does anyone have advice on how to move forward? Received great written and verbal feedback from attendings/residents on all my rotations, always tried to be courteous to patients/staff, be friendly w/ residents, and always put 110% effort in the ED, so truly feeling blindsided. Can't see myself doing anything else than EM in medicine. Should I apply to more? LOIs to those I applied to? Consider transitional? Have an EM doc reach out to programs on my behalf? Anything helps. Thanks so much everyone.

 

[jw3600]

Hey guys, needing a little direction here. US MD 250s/240s/CS pending, AOA, MSPE w/ only positive comments and ~2/3 honors, interesting ECs, SVI 20, no red flags, have applied to ~120 programs (about half of which were sometime within the last 10 days) and gotten 1 interview from a top-tier program, 3 waitlists from top-tiers, 9 rejections, and completed my away interviews while on them. Upon discussions I am now realizing that I have to have at least one SLOE that is not favorable... simply no other explanation. Has this happened to anyone and/or does anyone have advice on how to move forward? Received great written and verbal feedback from attendings/residents on all my rotations, always tried to be courteous to patients/staff, be friendly w/ residents, and always put 110% effort in the ED, so truly feeling blindsided. Can't see myself doing anything else than EM in medicine. Should I apply to more? LOIs to those I applied to? Consider transitional? Have an EM doc reach out to programs on my behalf? Anything helps. Thanks so much everyone.

So I've seen a dozen of your posts and I understand your panic. Is your third SLOE high pass? Or is it something worse? Why have you settled on this SLOE as the reason?

 

[injuriesherbs]

So I've seen a dozen of your posts and I understand your panic. Is your third SLOE high pass? Or is it something worse? Why have you settled on this SLOE as the reason?

haha hey now don't think it's been a dozen yet. Anyway I don't know which is bad, but does it matter at this point which one it is since they're all sent out? I have HP/HP/S, but an email from the S rotation 3 paragraphs long about why it was still strong and not to worry... what's done is done I guess, just wanting to do something to try and help the situation.

 

[jw3600]

haha hey now don't think it's been a dozen yet. Anyway I don't know which is bad, but does it matter at this point which one it is since they're all sent out? I have HP/HP/S, but an email from the S rotation 3 paragraphs long about why it was still strong and not to worry... what's done is done I guess, just wanting to do something to try and help the situation.

Agreed. What's done is done. But how can an honors SLOE sink you this bad (assuming it wasn't the S one as they assured you). It's gotta be something else in my opinion.

 

[injuriesherbs]

Agreed. What's done is done. But how can an honors SLOE sink you this bad (assuming it wasn't the S one as they assured you). It's gotta be something else in my opinion.

Sorry for the confusion! Where I train, HP is high pass, H is honors

 

[jw3600]

HP is high pass, H is honors

Duh. Sorry.

Edit: I thought "2/3 honors" means 2/3 SLOEs were honors.

 

[Status Sciaticus]

Per a few PDs, they dont really care about Honors, HP, P so much as they do the comments and where you place on the Likert Scale.
For example, if you have 10 AOA/260s/260s all on point, atleast 1/3 are getting bottom 1/3 regardless of how well they did. If your SLOE is strong, then the bottom third designation shouldnt matter as much.

 

[Devassa]

Hey guys, needing a little direction here. US MD 250s/240s/CS pending, AOA, MSPE w/ only positive comments and ~2/3 honors, interesting ECs, SVI 20, no red flags, have applied to ~120 programs (about half of which were sometime within the last 10 days) and gotten 1 interview from a top-tier program, 3 waitlists from top-tiers, 9 rejections, and completed my away interviews while on them. Upon discussions I am now realizing that I have to have at least one SLOE that is not favorable... simply no other explanation. Has this happened to anyone and/or does anyone have advice on how to move forward? Received great written and verbal feedback from attendings/residents on all my rotations, always tried to be courteous to patients/staff, be friendly w/ residents, and always put 110% effort in the ED, so truly feeling blindsided. Can't see myself doing anything else than EM in medicine. Should I apply to more? LOIs to those I applied to? Consider transitional? Have an EM doc reach out to programs on my behalf? Anything helps. Thanks so much everyone.

Do you have an advisor or a faculty member at your home instirution that can pull your SLOEs and tell you if there's anything damaging in there? They can't let you read them, but they could suggest whether or not you have one that's bad. You'll need to be ready to answer that question on the interviews you do get, and it would help to know which SLOE it is so you can figure out what went wrong. They could also help you figure out how to proceed from here. Personally, I think that if you applied to 150 programs and only heard back from 10, then you're still being considered for 140 programs. However, I'm going through this process for the first time this year too, and I really don't know what to expect. I would reach out to someone who has seen interview season and match day several times before, either faculty or even a Dean at your school.

 

[surely]

Per a few PDs, they dont really care about Honors, HP, P so much as they do the comments and where you place on the Likert Scale.
For example, if you have 10 AOA/260s/260s all on point, atleast 1/3 are getting bottom 1/3 regardless of how well they did. If your SLOE is strong, then the bottom third designation shouldnt matter as much.

Not sure I follow you, oh great wizard. 1/3 of *all* applicants get bottom 1/3 SLOEs, but I wouldn't say that 1/3 of applicants with AOA/260/260 get bottom 1/3 SLOEs. Maybe the same attributes that allowed them to accomplish AOA/260/260 make them less likely to end up in the bottom third.

Anyway, OP, I think you're doing a great job trying to make the most of this scary situation. If I were in your shoes, I would be sending letters of interest to newer EM programs who are selecting their first/second/third classes, talking about how you like the idea of shaping a new program and oh by the way just wanted to let them know you got AOA. Letters of interest are likely most effective when they're went to programs that you're competitive for from a numbers perspective, and there's no doubt that newer programs struggle to attract perfect candidates.

Also, your school should strongly consider moving AOA elections so they take place before ERAS opens instead of a month afterwards! Not being able to check that box last month probably hurt you.

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[Status Sciaticus]

Not sure I follow you, oh great wizard. 1/3 of *all* applicants get bottom 1/3 SLOEs, but I wouldn't say that 1/3 of applicants with AOA/260/260 get bottom 1/3 SLOEs. Maybe the same attributes that allowed them to accomplish AOA/260/260 make them less likely to end up in the bottom third.

Anyway, OP, I think you're doing a great job trying to make the most of this scary situation. If I were in your shoes, I would be sending letters of interest to newer EM programs who are selecting their first/second/third classes, talking about how you like the idea of shaping a new program and oh by the way just wanted to let them know you got AOA. Letters of interest are likely most effective when they're went to programs that you're competitive for from a numbers perspective, and there's no doubt that newer programs struggle to attract perfect candidates.

Also, your school should strongly consider moving AOA elections so they take place before ERAS opens instead of a month afterwards! Not being able to check that box last month probably hurt you.

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Let's look at an example. Say that 10 great people apply and are accepted at an away. When the committee is writing the sloe, they're not going to give all 10 people top 1/3 remarks because statistically that would be illogical. Since those people are compared amongst their peers that are also rotating/rotated tge previous year, who are also superstars, SOMEONE has to end up in the lower 1/3 bracket.

 

[surely]

Let's look at an example. Say that 10 great people apply and are accepted at an away. When the committee is writing the sloe, they're not going to give all 10 people top 1/3 remarks because statistically that would be illogical. Since those people are compared amongst their peers that are also rotating/rotated tge previous year, who are also superstars, SOMEONE has to end up in the lower 1/3 bracket.

I see what you're saying, but programs have many home students in addition to the visitors. On my aways this summer, the visitors were outnumbered by the home students at least 3:1.

 

[Status Sciaticus]

I see what you're saying too. At the end of the day, we won't know exactly what the reasoning is for his lower 1/3. I doubt it's his academics. It's funny that they claim the SLOE is objective, however it's honestly a big popularity contest.

 

[doggydog]

It's funny that they claim the SLOE is objective, however it's honestly a big popularity contest.

Sounds like all of the clinical years of medical school. Medical school is the worst.

 

[Status Sciaticus]

Sounds like all of the clinical years of medical school. Medical school is the worst.

How's residency compared to it?

 

[jw3600]

How's residency compared to it?

The same. It's called life.

 

[gamerEMdoc]

I see what you're saying too. At the end of the day, we won't know exactly what the reasoning is for his lower 1/3. I doubt it's his academics. It's funny that they claim the SLOE is objective, however it's honestly a big popularity contest.

Totally disagree, other than the fact the being really good at your job makes you more popular. I write every SLOE at my shop, and base it on a good bit of data. The people that I write a “bad” sloe on, there is generally some significant concern, not because someone didnt fit in.

There is some truth that the more competitive place you rotate, the more you are at risk for a mid to lower sloe if you are a good student. I think thats common sense. A pretty good but not all star student is still likely to be in the mid to lower aspect of the top tier programs lists.

 

[Status Sciaticus]

Totally disagree, other than the fact the being really good at your job makes you more popular. I write every SLOE at my shop, and base it on a good bit of data. The people that I write a “bad” sloe on, there is generally some significant concern, not because someone didnt fit in.

There is some truth that the more competitive place you rotate, the more you are at risk for a mid to lower sloe if you are a good student. I think thats common sense. A pretty good but not all star student is still likely to be in the mid to lower aspect of the top tier programs lists.

Not everyone may be as objective as you . Plus you're an APD.
Im more referring to the individual evals that are done by some R2s and R3s at program, specifically. But my experience is obviously anecdotal.

 

[gamerEMdoc]

Not everyone may be as objective as you . Plus you're an APD.
Im more referring to the individual evals that are done by some R2s and R3s at program, specifically. But my experience is obviously anecdotal.

I use end of shift cards as part of my eval process, and they can be done by a resident. I evaluated students as a resident. When I was a resident I helped interview and learned how to score candidates applications. Honestly almost all of the stuff I use now for candidate application scoring is stuff I adapted from my residency. Just because someone is a resident doesnt mean they shouldnt have input. In fact, I would argue from a PD side, resident input may be the most important. If they are working with students the closest, they often see better than anyone who is a great student. And residency cohesiveness is very very important. You dont want to have a big group of people who all hate working with eachother.

Are the resident evaluations always on point? Of course not. But neither all the faculty. That’s why you get a big sample size, and when you do, a clear trend is always there. There are always going to be tough and easy graders, But those will be outliers and balance eachother out.

 

[BigGAC1]

Aroundabout when do interviews stop getting sent out? I still have a late SLOE set to come in that I'm hoping can resurrect (what I'm assuming are) a couple mediocre SLOEs. Am I good like into late November/early December?

 

[medmedman]

Aroundabout when do interviews stop getting sent out? I still have a late SLOE set to come in that I'm hoping can resurrect (what I'm assuming are) a couple mediocre SLOEs. Am I good like into late November/early December?

A few programs will extend invites into very early January but yes, for the most part late Nov/early Dec is when the last wave comes. If you're on the waitlist, well then you can get an invite pretty much at any time

 

[Frisky Crouton]

When people speak of a new "waves," do they mean a huge new round of invites? Wouldn't all the invites after the first wave for an individual program just be rolling invites that are sent out as students decline interviews?

 

[LostinLift]

When people speak of a new "waves," do they mean a huge new round of invites? Wouldn't all the invites after the first wave for an individual program just be rolling invites that are sent out as students decline interviews?

Some places don't send all their invites out right away and do a group of IVs together. Some wait for a bunch of cancellations to look again, some have a ranked waitlist and invite in order after cancellations. This is what I've heard from APD and a PD at diff places, I'm sure there are other methods as well.

 

[Dana Lee]

Does anybody know if OHSU or Utah have sent out interview invites. I hadn't seen this posted, but just curious if anyone knew?

 

[doggydog]

Does anybody know if OHSU or Utah have sent out interview invites. I hadn't seen this posted, but just curious if anyone knew?

Spreadsheet says yes.

 

[Dana Lee]

Spreadsheet says yes.

Would you mind posting the most recent version? I tried looking through but seems like it has been quite a while since somebody posted it, and I cannot find the one that says anything about OHSU or Utah.

 

[doggydog]

Would you mind posting the most recent version? I tried looking through but seems like it has been quite a while since somebody posted it, and I cannot find the one that says anything about OHSU or Utah.

Linked on the first page of this thread.

 

[Whoswatchingthewatchers]

So im sitting at 4 interviews right now all from places i rotated. Should i be worried? I honored my last em rotation this month and sent the sloe today. Otherwise competitive DO applicant.

 

[JustADudeEM]

So im sitting at 4 interviews right now all from places i rotated. Should i be worried? I honored my last em rotation this month and sent the sloe today. Otherwise competitive DO applicant.

Feeling the same way bud. Only interviews at places I've rotated plus 1 at non rotated place. DO applicant as well. Honors in all EM rotations except a high pass in one. no red flags, >240 step scores 1 and 2. Who knows....

 

[rexabanit]

What's the etiquette for emailing about declining invites when the program uses an automated system like Interview Broker? Do I need to personally email the coordinator (and/or PD?) or is just declining on Interview Broker sufficient?

Obviously this is for declining interviews well in-advance, 2 weeks - 1 month or more. I'm going to do a bunch of cancellations right now, so wondering if I need to send each program an email.

 

[gamerEMdoc]

I don't think you need to decline invites by email if you are declining in interview broker.

 

[Keladry]

What's the etiquette for emailing about declining invites when the program uses an automated system like Interview Broker? Do I need to personally email the coordinator (and/or PD?) or is just declining on Interview Broker sufficient?

Obviously this is for declining interviews well in-advance, 2 weeks - 1 month or more. I'm going to do a bunch of cancellations right now, so wondering if I need to send each program an email.

I've been emailing the coordinator just in case, not sure if it's necessary but figured it can't hurt.

 

[em20178]

Bro me too man. I have 3 EM IV's, only one from a non-rotator site. I think I'm gonna get one more from a previously rotated site. I think this is showing the negativity of the merger that is happening. I think the DO at the end of our last names seems to hurt the application no matter how good the rest of the app is.

Feeling the same way bud. Only interviews at places I've rotated plus 1 at non rotated place. DO applicant as well. Honors in all EM rotations except a high pass in one. no red flags, >240 step scores 1 and 2. Who knows....

 

[The O.R. Light]

Sitting on 3, and I have been in contact with the programs on my list. Most are "we are still reviewing." Some rejections have trickled in, one wait list.

I hear everything from "it's too late, you won't match" to "it's too early, wait until November / December." Everything in between.

It's almost end of October, panic?

No one who wants to heal should suffer like this.

 

[Whoswatchingthewatchers]

Sitting on 3, and I have been in contact with the programs on my list. Most are "we are still reviewing." Some rejections have trickled in, one wait list.

I hear everything from "it's too late, you won't match" to "it's too early, wait until November / December." Everything in between.

It's almost end of October, panic?

No one who wants to heal should suffer like this.

I just got one today. Maybe the trickle of interviews will start coming in.

 

[JustADudeEM]

Bro me too man. I have 3 EM IV's, only one from a non-rotator site. I think I'm gonna get one more from a previously rotated site. I think this is showing the negativity of the merger that is happening. I think the DO at the end of our last names seems to hurt the application no matter how good the rest of the app is.

I don't know if its due to the merger necessarily. I think the field has just gotten pretty competitive and that there is some randomness associated with it as well. I mean don't get me wrong, there are definitely known programs out there that have never taken a DO and will likely not take a DO this year, and probably won't for a few years. But for the most part I think its just the competition of the field this year and the random factor. At least that's what I'm telling myself...

 

[surely]

@Dr.McNinja , I think it's time we go ahead and lock this thread in an effort to consolidate all the conversation over at the Official Application Thread. You don't need to merge the two threads, or anything. We did things a little differently this year, reporting invites primarily on a Google spreadsheet rather than posting them individually here. With few people posting them here, and with most programs having given out their initial invites at this point, I can't see any reason to keep future discussion of invites separate from the Application Thread. Would you mind locking this up?

Thanks!

 

[deleted109597]

Sure thing. Locked on request by the girl with an IUD for an avatar.