3.2 GPA (3.1 sGPA) 28 MCAT MD Chance?

[Medfreak]

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[patrickmbyrne]

Google MCAT and GPA grid it is from AAMC. Based only on a better MCAT (30-32) and your GPA the table says you have a 39.1% chance if you are white and better if you are URM. It will also vary by state and school! Goodluck!

 

[gyngyn]

Hve you calculated your AAMC gpa's? Are you a MA resident? Citizen? Green card?

 

[Oso]

Unfortunately, your GPA's and MCAT are too low for MD. For accepted MD students, the average GPA is about 3.65 and MCAT is about 31. Also, the rule of thumb around here is that you want at least an 8 on each section, so the 5 in VR is too low. A 28 MCAT is not terrible, but the 5 VR makes it worse and you need your score to be higher if pairing with a low GPA. If you want to have a decent shot at MD, you will need to bring up the GPA's and score much better on the MCAT (like 33+ to try to make up for GPA). If you were to do those things, then you could apply broadly to low-tier MD schools.

I know you said you wanted MD, but I highly encourage you to consider DO because they will do grade replacement (if you failed and retook a class, they will only consider the second class) which will improve your GPA, and they have lower average MCAT and GPA's. For now, focus on improving the grades and MCAT and perhaps you can apply to a mix of MD/DO schools.

Your extracurricular activities are fine, but do you have any physician shadowing?

 

[gyngyn]

Google MCAT and GPA grid it is from AAMC. Based only on a better MCAT (30-32) and your GPA the table says you have a 39.1% chance if you are white and better if you are URM. It will also vary by state and school! Goodluck!

There aren't any Eastern European UIM's...

 

[Medfreak]

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[Goro]

Your background, alas, is not going to make up for a weak GPA and MCAT, with a VR that's in the toilet. SMP is strongly suggested.

Hi guys,

Thank you for your feedback so far. I am a US citizen and yes I live in Mass. I agree that I don't have shadowing experience, but I have asked a physician who works at the hospital I currently work at, and he has agreed to it. I will put in two weeks of it. I do agree that MD is a long shot, but I hope that my background compells them a bit. I also must clarify that I understand I'm not considered URM, but I definitely fit the description for economically disadvantaged ( I have Fee Assistance Program approval). I would appreciate more input on this. Also, DO is not necessarily 100% out of the question, but I really,really want MD. I'm wondering whether taking those couple of classes might help? Also, I was thinking of a post-bac program, but as it stands I don't have the budget and would probably need to wait until next year.

 

[gyngyn]

I must agree with Prof. Goro. It's very hard to recommend an MD application with your current stats and situation.

 

[patrickmbyrne]

There aren't any Eastern European UIM's...

Could be a black Russian?

 

[Medfreak]

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[MedPhys2MD]

Could be a black Russian?

I was going to write the same comment. Eastern European is their nationality. Ethnicity was still up in the air (I know they've already commented that they're not an URM)

 

[chemguy79]

Yes, the VR is in the toilet, but like I said, this was a fluke. I can definitely bring it up to at least an 8, because in practice exams I've been able to score up to 11. I also am hoping that my strong sciences will give them something to look at (12PS is no joke, and 11BS isn't either); I know VR is important but USMLEs only have science and of course one of the major criteria to accept someone is whether they think you can handle the rigorous courseload and pass the standardized tests. As for GPA, I plan on taking 3 science classes to boost it a bit. I'm deciding against a post-bac because I do not have the means right now. I'm surprised, though, that you seem adamant in saying my background won't make up for a weak GPA. Please remember that I've had to work and contribute income to my family every since I stepped foot here, and I had no English background whatsoever. I wanted to contextualize my situation here, so obviously looking at the numbers alone might not sound strong enough. The GPA may sound weak, but the institution I graduated from is notorious for deflation, and what's more, I graduated as a double major and took difficult courses and challenged myself (like I said, diff eq, discrete math, calc III, econometrics on top of the cutthroat premed and other science courses). These aren't necessarily GPA boosters like Spanish or Community health or gospel choir are. I love academics and perhaps I did spread myself a bit too thin when taking courses and could have been smarter (or rather, rational) about not taking 2 science courses and 2 math courses in the same semester several times. This is all not meant to say that I think you are wrong, but I think your comment embodies a larger trend around here of discouraging people without really looking at the picture in its entirety. This was also the reason I was hesitant to post on here in the first place. I have spoken with my premed advisor, with professors, and with several doctors, and they all have said that my "distance traveled" is definitely not something to be overlooked. Of course, I don't have high expectations, but ruling MD out so definitively doesn't sound to me like good advice.

With your CURRENT stats, it is good advice. You have an interesting story, but an interesting story is not going to dispute concrete facts. You may not like the information that you have been given, but with a 5 VR score, acceptance to an MD school is not going to happen. You may have solid reasons, but emphasizing grade deflation and being an ESL student does not excuse those facts. Furthermore, there are numerous students who have taken cutthroat premed and other science courses and they have been highly successful.

Finally, casting off advice that you don't like to hear isn't a great way to introduce yourself to the SDN community.

 

[MedPhys2MD]

Yes, the VR is in the toilet, but like I said, this was a fluke. I can definitely bring it up to at least an 8, because in practice exams I've been able to score up to 11. I also am hoping that my strong sciences will give them something to look at (12PS is no joke, and 11BS isn't either); I know VR is important but USMLEs only have science and of course one of the major criteria to accept someone is whether they think you can handle the rigorous courseload and pass the standardized tests. As for GPA, I plan on taking 3 science classes to boost it a bit. I'm deciding against a post-bac because I do not have the means right now. I'm surprised, though, that you seem adamant in saying my background won't make up for a weak GPA. Please remember that I've had to work and contribute income to my family every since I stepped foot here, and I had no English background whatsoever. I wanted to contextualize my situation here, so obviously looking at the numbers alone might not sound strong enough. The GPA may sound weak, but the institution I graduated from is notorious for deflation, and what's more, I graduated as a double major and took difficult courses and challenged myself (like I said, diff eq, discrete math, calc III, econometrics on top of the cutthroat premed and other science courses). These aren't necessarily GPA boosters like Spanish or Community health or gospel choir are. I love academics and perhaps I did spread myself a bit too thin when taking courses and could have been smarter (or rather, rational) about not taking 2 science courses and 2 math courses in the same semester several times. This is all not meant to say that I think you are wrong, but I think your comment embodies a larger trend around here of discouraging people without really looking at the picture in its entirety. This was also the reason I was hesitant to post on here in the first place. I have spoken with my premed advisor, with professors, and with several doctors, and they all have said that my "distance traveled" is definitely not something to be overlooked. Of course, I don't have high expectations, but ruling MD out so definitively doesn't sound to me like good advice.

I don't know if it's completely out of the question (as others have said the 5 - not the total score - is what will hold you back). There might be a 1 in a 10,000 chance (very gross estimation), but the odds are very very low. If it was me, I wouldn't rush it. I too wanted to rush things, but as I'm going along now, I'm so glad I read that advice on here - to take things slow.

I would take more than just the extra one or two classes - perhaps a year or two worth. I know finances are an issue, but look at some local community colleges. Though some will say they're not preferred by schools, other will tell you that the school understands why it was necessary for you to go to a less expensive place.

 

[Medfreak]

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[candbgirl]

Yes, the VR is in the toilet, but like I said, this was a fluke. I can definitely bring it up to at least an 8, because in practice exams I've been able to score up to 11. I also am hoping that my strong sciences will give them something to look at (12PS is no joke, and 11BS isn't either); I know VR is important but USMLEs only have science and of course one of the major criteria to accept someone is whether they think you can handle the rigorous courseload and pass the standardized tests. As for GPA, I plan on taking 3 science classes to boost it a bit. I'm deciding against a post-bac because I do not have the means right now. I'm surprised, though, that you seem adamant in saying my background won't make up for a weak GPA. Please remember that I've had to work and contribute income to my family every since I stepped foot here, and I had no English background whatsoever. I wanted to contextualize my situation here, so obviously looking at the numbers alone might not sound strong enough. The GPA may sound weak, but the institution I graduated from is notorious for deflation, and what's more, I graduated as a double major and took difficult courses and challenged myself (like I said, diff eq, discrete math, calc III, econometrics on top of the cutthroat premed and other science courses). These aren't necessarily GPA boosters like Spanish or Community health or gospel choir are. I love academics and perhaps I did spread myself a bit too thin when taking courses and could have been smarter (or rather, rational) about not taking 2 science courses and 2 math courses in the same semester several times. This is all not meant to say that I think you are wrong, but I think your comment embodies a larger trend around here of discouraging people without really looking at the picture in its entirety. This was also the reason I was hesitant to post on here in the first place. I have spoken with my premed advisor, with professors, and with several doctors, and they all have said that my "distance traveled" is definitely not something to be overlooked. Of course, I don't have high expectations, but ruling MD out so definitively doesn't sound to me like good advice.

You asked for advice so don't be so quick to disregard the excellent advice people have given you. I know it isn't what you wanted to hear but it is very truthful and realistic. Oh and Goro and gyngyn are adcoms at their schools so what they contribute is based on their experiences in the field.

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[Goro]

The problem you face is that it's a seller's market for MD schools. With so many qualified applicants, they can afford to turn away tons of them. DO programs like mine will cut you some more slack, but that VR5 does need to be erased. And yes, I agree that the MCAT VR is perverse, given your strong PS and Bio performance. But, we're stuck with it.

I'm not impressed by the reasoning of "I've had a hard life but managed to maintain a B avg." If it were "I've had a hard life and managed to maintain an B+/A avg", then AdComs at MD schools might be more sympathetic. I agree that everyone loves a come-from-behind/underdog story.

The road you've traveled is worth. looking at, but that works more at the interview and the AdCom meeting deciding your fate, rather than with the person deciding among the 5000 apps as to who to invite for interview.

I'm surprised, though, that you seem adamant in saying my background won't make up for a weak GPA. Please remember that I've had to work and contribute income to my family every since I stepped foot here, and I had no English background whatsoever. I wanted to contextualize my situation here, so obviously looking at the numbers alone might not sound strong enough. I have spoken with my premed advisor, with professors, and with several doctors, and they all have said that my "distance traveled" is definitely not something to be overlooked.[/quote]


I think the trouble is that the doctors who tell you these encouraging things have no idea what med school admissions is like these days, and pre-med advisors, well, the less said, the better.

With a significant rising trend (like, all As in your last 1-2 years, and a strong MCAT (mid-30s), then there probably are some schools that will show you some love, like Tulane, your state school, and some of the newest schools. Get your cGPA to 3.4 and then you'll be really competitive given your story.

I apologize if I seemed like I don't appreciate the advice on here, because I do. Also it's not me questioning advice I don't like, I'm pointing out that there is a discrepancy between what people have said here and what other doctors around me and my premedical committee have said to me. I realize that my verbal score is really low, but I have mentioned this was a fluke. I tend to average 8 or 9 in general, but I'm not sure why I panicked in the exam. I realize that with my CURRENT stats I can't, but that was not my question. Realistically speaking, I'm confident I can raise MCAT to at least a 32 and I'm taking it in 3 months. My question was, if I manage to realize that along with an improved GPA of 3.3, do I have a shot given the background and rigorous school?

 

[chondroblast]

3.1 sGPA will look bad.

 

[dorocker]

Honestly speaking, you still have a good chance and should apply. I have a similar background as yours and the advice and suggestions recommended here could be deceiving. Your Science scores are excellent and have great story/background and experience. Your poor verbal score should be most def be considered by any medical school reviewing your app. I would say that if you have it lower than 4, then you would no chance at all. I know an immigrant friend ( who has lived in US for about 10 yrs) who had a 6 and got accepted into school taking 30+ only. His science scores were as good as yours. So don't give up and go ahead with the application. Good Luck!

 

[chondroblast]

nrocks, stop being unrealistic. 3.1 sGPA is terrible, and a 12 and 11 on the science MCAT sections is good, not "excellent"...it certainly won't make up for the terrible GPA.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

I say you'd be a good candidate for the newer Osteopathic schools. MD programs are not going to happen unless you get at least an 8 in that section. You can clamor fluke all you want, but what's reflected on paper is what matters. You might also need an SMP for an MD school.