3 Undergrad Degrees/Low GPA for Med School

[fragilewindows]

I am a 27-year-old recent graduate with 3 degrees:

School 1: Communications (BA), GPA 3.125

School 2: Architecture (BS), Information Technology (BS) GPA 2.96
(failed Calculus II, twice, including my last semester)

In Spring 2013, I will be starting a Masters in Bioinformatics, where I would take all the remaining medical school requirements that I didn't take in college: Biology I, II, Chemistry I, II, and Organic Chemistry I, II.

Questions:

1) Is getting a Masters in Bioinformatics a good route to take for M.D. or D.O program since Bioinformatics is related to my I.T. degree?

2) How will my undergraduate degrees affect my acceptance into M.D. or D.O program? (Particularly since they are such diverse focuses and unrelated to medicine)

I know there's a lot that I have to do to get into medical school: health-related volunteering, shadowing, letters of recommendations, etc. I don't plan to start medical school for 3-4 years. But I feel that besides my GPA, my degrees, especially in architecture, will definitely be a weak point in my application process.

Thank you for any insight.

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[LifeTake2]

I am a 27-year-old recent graduate with 3 degrees:

School 1: Communications (BA), GPA 3.125

School 2: Architecture (BS), Information Technology (BS) GPA 2.96
(failed Calculus II, twice, including my last semester)

In Spring 2013, I will be starting a Masters in Bioinformatics, where I would take all the remaining medical school requirements that I didn't take in college: Biology I, II, Chemistry I, II, and Organic Chemistry I, II.

Questions:

1) Is getting a Masters in Bioinformatics a good route to take for M.D. or D.O program since Bioinformatics is related to my I.T. degree?

2) How will my undergraduate degrees affect my acceptance into M.D. or D.O program? (Particularly since they are such diverse focuses and unrelated to medicine)

I know there's a lot that I have to do to get into medical school: health-related volunteering, shadowing, letters of recommendations, etc. I don't plan to start medical school for 3-4 years. But I feel that besides my GPA, my degrees, especially in architecture, will definitely be a weak point in my application process.

Thank you for any insight.

1) Without fixing your undergrad GPA a Masters is going to have limited impact. If you can complete with a 3.8+ then it will show you are capable which after 3 degrees is not evidenced by your grades. I am NOT judging just drawing the same conclusion anyone looking at your GPA will.

2) The GPA in three different fields implies you have something going on that impacts your grades. Having 3 non-science degrees itself is not an issue other than it will raise questions why a 27 year old has 3 bachelors and based upon your age little to know experience.

It is possible to get into medicine but you need to research how to fix your GPA and start focusing on EC's as well. Likewise you need to understand that most 30 yr old applicants that succeed have a 'story' and you will need to be able to explain why medicine vs all the other paths you have tried.

One last note, please update your profile to show premed. You are a f
good decade away from being a fellow and it will just confuse people. Thanks

 

[fragilewindows]

Thanks for your advice. I didn't even notice my status, but I have updated it to pre-health. So thanks for pointing that out.

I'm a computer technician in an architecture company, I don't have any health experience, and you're definitely right that my degrees do not show my capability of handling any M.D. or D.O. program.

::sigh:: At some point, even when I want this very badly, I will have to be realistic about my situation.

I've thought of being a P.A., physical therapist, or occupational therapist instead (more realistic goals), but none of those will make me happy. I've even thought of getting an education in the Caribbeans or in another country (Europe or Philippines - if they even look at my application), but I don't want the risk of not receiving an internship afterward.

I can only blame myself for whatever has happened, regardless of circumstances and situations. I welcome any other advice and opinions.

 

[LifeTake2]

Thanks for your advice. I didn't even notice my status, but I have updated it to pre-health. So thanks for pointing that out.

I'm a computer technician in an architecture company, I don't have any health experience, and you're definitely right that my degrees do not show my capability of handling any M.D. or D.O. program.

::sigh:: At some point, even when I want this very badly, I will have to be realistic about my situation.

I've thought of being a P.A., physical therapist, or occupational therapist instead (more realistic goals), but none of those will make me happy. I've even thought of getting an education in the Caribbeans or in another country (Europe or Philippines - if they even look at my application), but I don't want the risk of not receiving an internship afterward.

I can only blame myself for whatever has happened, regardless of circumstances and situations. I welcome any other advice and opinions.

Realistic is important, but don't just give up because I'm brutally honest.

I proved anything is possible (Allo acceptances with a sub-3.0 GPA): but the one thing I will tell you is examine your life. If you can find something else you would be happy doing---do it, otherwise set your goals, map out a plan and give it 110% and go into medicine and don't look back.

 

[Jas1360]

I disagree about the masters having limited impact. I know many people who had low GPAs as an undergrad and they went on to graduate school where they did well an got accepted to medical school. At some point it's hard to raise your undergraduate GPA no matter how many classes you take.

Some medical schools admissions offices will meet with you and get you advice specific to your situation. Also, you should look at the AMCAS and AACOMAS websites because DO and MD programs calculate GPA slightly differently. Your GPA is based on all the coursework you have taken and not within one particular school.

The DO calculations are more relaxed because it only counts your best attempt at a class. So I you failed Calc. II and then retook it and got a B it would only count your B.

Please don't be discouraged there are many people who have slipped up at one point or another with their grades but they make improvement and go on to Medical School. However, you will want to make sure you are really prepared for the MCAT and do well in graduate school.

 

[phant0m0o0o]

Texas A&M specifically told me they do take weight of the graduate degree. You might want to contact each school on a case to case basis. One of the admissions officers basically gave a navy officers son advice while I was standing around for interview and discussed a pathway that looked like this

post-bacc ----> very high mcat -----> SMP/graduate degree(with more weight on SMP)

Basically if you do average in one category move to the next but you destroy the category attempt to apply. Just one school but thought I'd chime in.

 

[fragilewindows]

Realistic is important, but don't just give up because I'm brutally honest.

I proved anything is possible (Allo acceptances with a sub-3.0 GPA): but the one thing I will tell you is examine your life. If you can find something else you would be happy doing---do it, otherwise set your goals, map out a plan and give it 110% and go into medicine and don't look back.

Not throwing in the towel till I have to. Your brutal honesty is well appreciated. I took some notes down and reexamined my roadmap to med school, my 4-5 year plan.

My extracurricular activities right now are:

Alpha Phi Omega, service fraternity (6 years active service), 1 term as service coordinator
Architecture Print Room volunteer (4 years)
Innovation Acceleration Club (2 years)
Resident Assistant for 1 semester (will not be including that in application)

I've been considering becoming a volunteer EMT for awhile now because I want to be involved in disaster/emergency management and trauma, and being an EMT will let me get a feel for that.

I'll definitely have a million more things to do to prove myself and I hope to have a great story to post on this site in the future.

 

[fragilewindows]

I disagree about the masters having limited impact. I know many people who had low GPAs as an undergrad and they went on to graduate school where they did well an got accepted to medical school. At some point it's hard to raise your undergraduate GPA no matter how many classes you take.

Some medical schools admissions offices will meet with you and get you advice specific to your situation. Also, you should look at the AMCAS and AACOMAS websites because DO and MD programs calculate GPA slightly differently. Your GPA is based on all the coursework you have taken and not within one particular school.

The DO calculations are more relaxed because it only counts your best attempt at a class. So I you failed Calc. II and then retook it and got a B it would only count your B.

Please don't be discouraged there are many people who have slipped up at one point or another with their grades but they make improvement and go on to Medical School. However, you will want to make sure you are really prepared for the MCAT and do well in graduate school.

MCAT preparation is very important. I know that it's going to be an intense process.

I have 3 Fs for 2 classes: calculus II and a lower level physics ( which is weird because I was able to do better in 2 higher level physics classes with C+ and A) Maybe retaking those 2 classes would be helpful and maybe retaking the C+ physics for a B. Retaking my entire undergrad for As and Bs doesn't make sense financially or logistically. But making sure my science GPA is great, is all I can do now.

As suggested, I'll contact admission departments and see what would be best for my situation.

 

[Jas1360]

One more piece of advise for when you get ready to apply.

Submit your AMCAS and AACOMAS applications the first day you can. AMCAS gives you a month to fill out the application before they allow you to submit. Use that month wisely and fill it out and submit all your transcripts right away. That way you can submit your application that day and you will be verified right away.

This insures that you will be near the top of the list for receiving secondary applications. Once again fill them out carefully but quickly.

This paid off for me and I know that is why I got one of my interviews so quickly.

To go along with that, you will probably want to take your MCAT by April of the summer you apply. That way you'll have your score in May. However, if you are not ready in April than just wait and take it in July or August at the very latest.

I have been shocked hearing people around my school who talk about not submitting their AMCAS until Aug. or Sept. and so they are still waiting to get verified. That means most of them still haven't received any secondaries yet. They will be lucky to get an interview by March.

The most common reason I have heard for these people who procrastinated is they were afraid they weren't a strong candidate or they wanted their MCAT score first. Neither reason is good and it is only going to hurt their chances.

 

[HopefulCanadian]

OP I read your post. I want to say a few things. I have a similar situation but not completely to you. I did ONE undergrad and I have marks that currently make my application noncompetitive.

I decided I wanted to be a doctor a while ago but I had already begun a different undergraduate path and thought it wasn't possible. I did learn it is possible. My degree is a math based one. I won't go into the numbers but they are around 75% GPA. I will say this before I continue. You apply to med school with a personal statement. You need to know and explain why medicine above the other endeavors you have pursued. Not only for admissions but for yourself. You need to know why you want this so bad. If the reasons honestly aren't monetary then I wish you all the luck and like me you should continue on. I say this because realistically you are looking at potentially doing another degree plus medicine just to make up for your GPA.


Now with that out of the way I also want to make a few comments. These aren't criticisms just comments. You have a low GPA and 3 degrees none of which are medically inclined. Aside from volunteering in your frat you don't have much volunteer experience. Volunteering doesn't have to necessarily be medical just make sure its quality and consistent type of volunteer experience. For example running fundraising initiatives for certain things. I know this because I have been speaking to admissions officers at several universities. For example I ran a non-profit business that helped students out for 3 years. This makes my application unique, it was consistent, while providing quality volunteer and leadership opportunities.


You need to not only decide if you really want this you need to decide the additional things:
-How important is having an MD -DO may be equivalent in the states but it prohibits you to the states. (I am Canadian)
-How much is this really worth in terms of time and money

Depending on which university you apply at Masters grades don't always count. Some Canadian universities are like that. I would assume some US schools are the same. DO schools are lax in terms of the required GPA however you still need a 3.3-3.4 minimum to realistically have a strong chance. If you have an MCAT that is above 30 on the old MCAT scale.... whatever that is translated to on the new MCAT then you have a good shot.

You mentioned doing an undergrad is too lengthy and costly. The problem is if you apply to the Caribbean schools realistically you want to go to one of the top schools because of their extensive alumni programs, quality of the education is better within the top schools, and you want the best chance of getting a residency. When you do your calculations though redoing your classes and getting into a stateside school is much cheaper. Especially if its only a 2 year post-bacc program, which is what I personally am opting to do. You need to show upward trends in your grades during this. Remember to get into the top Caribbean schools you need to have a 3.1-3.3 to get in. I am not advocating one way or another. I am just saying you may have to do undergrad courses whether you like it or not. Remember the top schools like St. George University (SGU) has tuition costs of over $268 000 USD not including housing, flights, food, and other costs incurred during your clinical rotations. After doing my own calculations most other schools have costs of $130 000 for tuition. On average you will have to add an additional $50-70k in expenses on top of that. Domestically you tuition would be a lot cheaper even if you add a few years of undergrad that you probably have to do anyways. For most people just looking at costs alone domestic options make sense.

I am lucky that I haven't taken science courses. My math courses I have completed were decent not great but decent. But back to you. I strongly suggest again thinking how much do you want this and why have you not pursued it in your last not 1, or 2, but 3 degrees. Additionally, you will have to figure out why you didn't succeed before academically. For me I was running my non-profit while in school. This time doing less will give me greater focus. You will need to determine what is the factor for you that will allow you to achieve your goals and dreams.


People on here and everywhere will tell you to give up. Maybe you should, maybe you shouldn't. You need to decide how important this is for you because you are going to make a great sacrifice to make it happen. Some people have to sacrifice more (woman did med school as a single mother with 2 kids).


So I would really focus on perhaps dabbling in some research or shadowing, but more importantly find a way to bump up those grades. Remember your masters has to show improvement if it will count but may limit you because of your undergraduate courses. Bioinfomatics is a great subject area and will lead you to a great career, but you still need to show you have potential with your foundations of science.


You will have a long road ahead. We are actually the same age. I am just saving up to do the program I mentioned. Personally I will be attending a Caribbean school because I want the option in the future to practice in Canada even if I have to do residency in the states. That path isn't for everyone. Again I would really consider undergrad courses to strengthen your application for domestic schools FIRST. Apply and if you don't get in apply to the Caribbean schools as they typically have 3 intake semesters (September, Jan, May).


Additionally, the top Caribbean schools do have their clinical rotations in the states. So after your step 1 you are really no different then other medical students with regards to education. Again I don't want this to turn into a domestic vs Caribbean thing. Domestic options are ALWAYS better. The international schools, Caribbean/Ireland/Australia are an option.


Same with DO vs MD. We don't need to have this discussion in this thread. DO is an option. Doesn't work for everyone like Canadians for example but it is an option and a valid one at that.

One last time make sure this is absolutely what you want to do. As in you can't imagine yourself doing anything else for 25-30 years of work. I had a brief stint at a "Twitter" type start up (they had a ton of funding). The start of a career that almost guaranteed me to be working at Google in the next 5 years. I still wanted to do medicine. I didn't like the idea of sitting in front of a screen all day. I wanted to make a difference. I also worked in a doctors office previously and have family members who are in the field, although don't push me towards it at all. Those are just some of my reasons, but you get the point.

Anyways I also hope that you do have a success story. I know I will have one too. I hope this helps.

 

[Goro]

Nice four year necrobump.

 

[HopefulCanadian]

Nice four year necrobump.

yeah sorry i realized after.