33 year old mom, needs honest opinions

[tentative at best]

Where to start??

I'm a 33 year old mom that has really, really got her heart set on becoming a doctor.

My drawbacks: GPA! Not sure of the exact number, but can assure you it's not grand. I went to college straight out of high school, made mostly A's with a few B's - then dropped out. Only problem, I didn't withdraw. All F's. Cut to a few years later and repeat same scenario. All A's, few B's failure to withdraw, F's. Majored in special ed the first time, business the second.

Started back a year ago as a fine arts major. Making straight A's, but these are art classes.

Strengths: Believe it or not, I am actually pretty intelligent. I have always harbored a secret desire to be a doc, but med students always seemed like they were right next to perfect. Never partied, dropped classes (let alone FAILED to drop classes), had their lifes pointed directly at med school at age 12 (and all that med school entails), usually with an MD parent there to guide them.

Now that I have a few years on me, I see the world a bit differently. My road may be different, but I really think I can do it. I have a four year old son that has some chronic health issues that has brought my desire right back up to the forefront of my thoughts. I know I would make a great doctor, especially long term care such as peds, ob/gyn, or family.

I have worked the past 10 years at a hospice that is owned by my family. Mainly office work, but I could change to have more direct patient care if I want to. I currently am volunteer coordiantor and that entails some patient contact.

I should also add that my husband is 100% supportive and very hands on as a father.

I am currently working towards a Bachelor's of Fine Arts, do I need to change majors? I am going to have to add quite a few math and science classes that I wouldn't otherwise be taking.

Will a 35-36 year old mom with a history of dropping out be considered?

Is the fact that I work for family going to negate my health care experience?

And any other pointers you care to share with me I will take with great appreciation.

And I should add, the mere thought of an interview scares me to death!

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[CoffeeCat]

From what I've heard on SDN...there are a bunch of schools out there who want older students with more life experience like U of Colorado and UC San Francisco to name two. I'd stay away from schools who like a younger-fresh-out-of-college applicant. When you apply to med school, I would really talk about your life experience because that's what will make you stand out from other applicants.

I think your hospice work is a great experience for med school (I don't think that it's family would hurt at all) and that you could really tie that in with your son's cronic health problems to drive home your desire to be a doctor.

No, you don't have to change your major. Some schools like a more well-rounded applicant. Just make sure you take the required pre-med courses - physics, ochem, gchem, and bio (and some calculus). Get good grades in these classes and kill the MCAT and I think you'd have a good chance!

I think this board proves that while there are driven non-human students out there, that there are also med school applicants who are human and still make it into med school.

Keep in mind that you're hearing advice from a future applicant (not a med-schooler or admissions committee member. Good luck!

 

[eagle26]

First of all, let me commend you for following your dreams of becoming a physician and going back to school. It's a difficult step after being in the work force for a while. I don't think the grades or the dropping out will adversely affect you since you've been working in the hospice field for a while. I think your maturity and strength of character, as well as your experience will be a terrific asset. Med schools like to "increase the diversity" of their class. They like older candidates (no offense, I'm older than those fresh out of college, too) with work experience as you have.

Second, I don't think you need to change majors, but you definitely need to take pre-medical courses. These include a year of general chemistry, organic chemistry, physics, and biochemistry is helpful.

I also think that your desire to be a doctor when you have a child is admirable. It takes quite a committment and would impress admission committees.

And remember, it's never too early to start studying for MCATS. If you do really well, grades won't matter "too" much. Hope this helps.

Joe

 

[Retro]

Stay away from UCSF... they are very arrogant.

 

[CoffeeCat]

Retro - why do you say that?

 

[tentative at best]

Thanks for all the encouraging words thus far.

I meant to add, I live in Texas, and was hoping to stay in state. Does Texas look favorably on (cough, sputter) older applicants. Any suggestions on that front?

 

[Retro]

Anacapa, well... I was a product of the UC and was once interviewed at UCSF for graduate school some years ago, and although I was accepted into one of their graduate program, I turned it down and went elsewhere because UCSF impressed me with their arrogance in interview questions, i.e. "what's this thing with community college?" "Oh, it was a high school course taken in college, jee, I thought you were a JC transfer... I don't think those people are prepared for academic programs of UCSF's caliber. (laugh, laugh)" Things of that sort... Despite my credential, they didn't even dignify me with a secondary, their computer screened me out before knowing my life experiences. They are looking for a specific diverse population of applicants, and they can afford to be arrogant because the tuition is very low and reputation is high, they can compete with Harvard and Hopkins. I know MSTP students from top med schools telling me to stay away from the UCs, especially UCSF, because they developed some weird complex. The 33-yr old Mom should consider primary care schools like University of Washington and Georgetown or other state schools in rural area like Nebraska, etc. But UCSF is not a good choice.

 

[SocialistMD]

Originally posted by tentative, at best:
•Does Texas look favorably on (cough, sputter) older applicants. Any suggestions on that front?•••

I go to UT-Houston and I have several classmates who are in their 30's. From what I hear, UTMB is even more known for taking older applicants than are we. I do not know the exact life history of all of the older students in my class (a few with whom I hang out are ex-military or former paramedics/nurses) but I would still encourage you to continue your application. At my school, the admissions committees are very forgiving of past "mistakes" as they understand we are all human. Stay a fine arts major (there is at least one in my class right now). As long as you take the <a href="http://dpweb1.dp.utexas.edu/mdac/ACADEM.htm" target="_blank">prescribed courses</a> it really doesn't matter in what you majored.
Best of luck, and if you have any more questions, feel free to ask.

 

[YBee]

HI - I too am an older student (29) who had no thoughts of being a doctor when I was young or even when I was in college.

I'd recommend, in addition to applying to med schools that have a slightly older average student age, to also apply to some D.O. schools. Their Gpa average is lower than than of med schools, but what is more important, they traditionally have embraced older students from non-medical first careers (whereas m.d. schools have just decided in the last few years that mature doctors might be a good thing!) Although the d.o. degree is not as well known, as a d.o. student you will take the exact same licensing exams as m.d. students and can apply to the same residencies.

Also, I have heard (although I haven't independently verified it) that in California a D.O. may call legally describe himself an M.D. (which seems reasonable to me considering the board exams are the same for both.) Texas may be the same way.

I applied to a few d.o. schools myself (there are only 19 or 20 of them in the country vs. the 120+ m.d. schools)

And I second Joseph's advice: good MCAT scores, you will get in somewhere as long as you apply strategically.

 

[Teufelhunden]

Why would a D.O. want to call him or herself an M.D.? Whatever path you choose, you should be proud of your degree...if you're not, maybe you chose the wrong path.

Just the thoughts of a future, proud D.O.!

 

[EarlGrey]

I'm an "older" applicant too (35) which means I was about your age when I went back to school to take my premed classes. My advice is just go for it!

What I mean by that is to start taking the math and science classes and see how you like them, see how you do. Especially if you're already in school, it's easy enough to just start taking the classes.

I was also very tentative at first and had a lot of the same qualms that you have, but I found that by dipping my toe in the water and starting to take classes, it increased my confidence and commitment to going to med school. I was an Anthropology major as an undergrad and it had been 15 years since I had taken a science course. O Chem is the one you always hear horror stories about and frankly that's what kept me from going back to school for so long, but I found that I actually liked it (!) and ended up with the top score in my class. I'm not trying to toot my own horn, I'm just trying to suggest that you really just have to try it out for yourself and see how it goes. Taking the premed classes is not committing yourself to going to med school, but it is the first and necessary step and a good indicator of how you might do and how you actually feel about studying the sciences.

As far as previous bad grades go, what the schools are going to be most interested in is your most recent grades, and especially how you do in your science classes. So be sure to do well in those classes! And do well on the MCAT. While schools will certainly notice F's on your transcripts and ask you about them, if you can show them all A's in your science classes and a 36 on the MCAT, you can show them that you're serious about med school and will be able to succeed.

Statistics I've seen about older applicants show that a smaller percentage get admitted than the younger groups. BUT, the explanation I've seen for that is that older applicants tend to have lower grades and test scores -- again, do well in your science classes and the MCAT.

I realize I'm talking a lot about grades and scores, when that's really only part of the picture. Your strength as an older applicant comes from the life perspective, skills and maturity you already have, those intangibles that can be measured or scored. These are the things they'll see when you come in for an interview, but it'll be much harder to get that interview if you don't have the numbers to get you in the door.

Ok, I've gone on long enough. My final bit of advice is to seek out a premed advisor on your home campus. He/she can really help you figure out all the nitty-gritty of what you need to do and when you need to do it to go through the long hoop-jumping process of preparing for/applying to med school. Really, it goes by much faster than you think!

Best of luck to you!!

 

[YBee]

Why would a d.o. want to call himself an m.d.?

I think (I can't say for sure not being a d.o.) that d.o.s might want to call themselves m.d.s b/c a lot of people have no idea what a d.o. is. Also it is less competitive to get into d.o. schools and the scores of the average matriculating student at a d.o. school are much lower than at an m.d. school, thus the general perception of the public (or at least those who know what d.o.s are) might be that d.o.s are not as bright/competent etc.

As for "choosing a path" - that sound a little melodramatic to me There are not any strong differences between the curricula of the two types of schools. They are essentially the same thing. And since d.o.s apply for the same residency programs as m.d.s, they end up learning/practicing the same things and adopting the same behaviors as m.ds.

 

[The Falconer]

Tentative...get your pre-reqs done as others have suggested and do well on the MCAT. Your support system is in order and for an older student that is 1/2 the battle. Do things that will set yourself apart from the crowd.

I am a 34 yr old with a wife and three kids who will be going into med school at 35. I had never been to college until I was 31 so needless to say it was a bit of a shock. I harbored the same dream of being a doctor that you do and decided that I would not resent not trying to attain that dream. You can do it if you want to!

 

[tidy_kiwi]

I commend your desire and motivation to enter into medicine and truly hope you do well, but based upon your post I had a couple of thoughts that you may want to consider in terms of how you approach your application:

I am currently working towards a Bachelor's of Fine Arts, do I need to change majors? I am going to have to add quite a few math and science classes that I wouldn't otherwise be taking. ••

I would definitely not even consider this!!! You didn't say why you dropped out of college (twice) - but you are going to have to explain this to any med school you apply to - changing majors midstream may make it seem like you had the problem of running out of motivation/giving up later on in the courses......I would stick to your current programme and just add the required pre-med classes.

Is the fact that I work for family going to negate my health care experience? ••

Shouldn't do - but I would try to get some other experiences under your belt as well (I know this may be harder for a parent) - everything helps!

And I should add, the mere thought of an interview scares me to death! ••

If you get through college pre-med courses and the MCAT, the interview will be the easy bit!

Good Luck!

 

[CoffeeCat]

Off topic but thanks Retro for posting your experience.

 

[lilninja]

I think you can do it, but it'll be tough - first of all, one things that could really help your case is a stunning MCAT score... it takes a lot of organization and dedication to study for and do well on that exam, so if you can do that (all the while be a mom and work at the hospice), it'll show that you have really changed (it was a long time ago that you dropped out, but you'll probably still need to explain it), and that you can handle a medical school workload. If you haven't taken the pre-req classes, you may have to - check with some schools you are interested in. It sounds like you have the motivation, but you need to show those adcoms that you believe in yourself, and they should too. Good luck!

 

[choker]

never ever ever sell yourself short. if you want something GO OUT AND GET IT!!!

it is definitely possible, albeit difficult, for you to go back and get into med school.
you'll regret it for the rest of your life if you don't, and if you do, it'll be the best decision you've ever made.
it's never too late to do anything.
good luck!

 

[Leotigers]

Hey YBee,

The University of California at Irvine began as an osteopathic medical school that granted the DO degree. If you go to the home page for the college of medicine, it will also provide information about the history of osteopathic medicine in California. Here's the link:

<a href="http://www.com.uci.edu/Hypertext/history.html" target="_blank">http://www.com.uci.edu/Hypertext/history.html</a>

I'm guessing you are a UC graduate. Consider applying to TUCOM, about 40% of our class went to a UC for their Bachelor's degree. For some reason, UC students tend to share a lot of things in common. Best of luck in the application process.

<a href="http://209.209.34.25/webdocs/admissions/tucominfo.htm" target="_blank">http://209.209.34.25/webdocs/admissions/tucominfo.htm</a>

 

[gonnabeadoc]

Hello Tentative,
A helpful site for moms and women wishing to pursue a career in medicine is at www. mommd.com . Hopefully this will help you out.

 

[YBee]

ER,

thanks for that info - I didn't know that about UCI's history - v. interesting.

I am not a UC grad although I live in California now (that's why I have that CA d.o. info).

Is TUCOM that relatively new D.O. school in San Francisco? A friend of mine knows someone who teaches (taught?) there and mentioned it to me before.

 

[Leotigers]

YBee,

TUCOM is about five years old now. We graduated our first class last year but we did well in both the allopathic and osteopathic match despite being new. The school moved about 35 miles north of San Francisco to Mare Island about 2 1/2 years ago. We are closer to the East Bay now. Let me know if you have any other questions about the school.

 

[Tweetie_bird]

Hi Tentative,
Just wanted to add a quick note: I used to be an officer for a premed society, and I have seen TONS of older, mature people applying in the years I was involved with the society. Don't let age be a deterrant. You keep doing what you have to do to get in, and let THEM say "no" to you. Just don't sell yourself short.

From an outside opinion, you seem like a mature, determined person battling with a medical problem in the family. Being a caregiver to a sick child, or any family is NOT an easy job. Furthermore, the value and lessons you have learned from ten (!!!) years of hospice work outweigh any amount of bad grades you may have received years ago. Work in the present, shoot far into the future, and don't look back!! You will make it, if it's meant to be. I wish you good luck and all the success.

Tweetie.
PS: I know a grandmother in her fifties who applied, I believe she got in too.

 

[tentative at best]

Does anyone have any ideas as to how Texas Tech and/or Southwestern look upon older aplicants? I know, I am jumping WAY ahead of myself.

Thanks again for all of your kind words.

 

[oldmedgirl]

I am also an older pre-med applicant in Texas. As far as I know Texas Tech and UT Southwestern both tend to have a younger group of students but they do accept a few older students as well. UT Health Science Center-San Antonio, UTMB, and TCOM have more older students. I am currently residing in the DFW area so I am seriously considering attending either TCOM or UTSouthwestern but I have family near San Antonio so I may end up going there. I also think Texas Tech would be a good school to go to if you want to get away from the city environments of these other schools. Have you checked out the OldPremed Group on yahoo? <a href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/OldPreMeds/" target="_blank">OldPreMed Group on Yahoo</a>
There is a lot of good advice on their message board with quite a few members from Texas.
Good luck with your pursuit of medical school.

 

[chemgrl]

Dear tenative,
Some schools will allow what they call a retroactive withdrawl. This means that you may be able to change those F's to withdrawls. Check with an advisor at the school because all you will have to do it write a letter explaining the circumstance and a committee will review it.

 

[lamyers]

Hi Tentative, I am living proof. I was the opposite though, with a great GPA and avg. MCAT. I start in August.
Falconer, we are the same... I am 34 with three kids, except I am the wife. At my school, all three of my interviewers said they love nontrads. I got lucky!

 

[EarlGrey]

oldmedgirl,

How do you access the groups on Yahoo? Is it through the chat rooms? I'd love to check out the OldPremed group, but visited the Yahoo homepage and couldn't figure out how.

 

[tentative at best]

I joined the OldPreMed group. It's been very informative to read all of the posts.

To join, I think they had a "join this group" link. Just click on that and follow the prompts.

 

[racergirl]

Hi Tentative,

Just to let you know, my record is almost EXACTLY like yours, and for the same reasons! I have 9 Fs on my Ugrad record, because years ago I repeatedly stopped going to school but didn't bother dropping classes (WHAT were we thinking???)

Anyway, I went back to school three years ago, worked my ass off, and got good grades (and didn't drop any classes!). I took the MCAT last April, and scored well.

Today, here I sit. I'm 33, headed to Med School in the fall! So far I've been accepted to two schools, and have another interview upcoming next month. People (including some advisors) will tell you again and again that you have no chance--DON'T LISTEN! All you need to do is really shine in your coursework NOW (and no, don't switch majors), do WELL on the MCAT, and continue your hospice work (what an awesome experience).

I truly hope you decide to persue your dream. After all, you have nothing to lose and EVERYTHING to gain. GOOD LUCK!!

 

[praying4MD]

Tentative: SocialistMD hit the nail on the head. I live in Texas and would be happy to answer any other questions you have about the match system, etc. Feel free to private message me with any concerns.

Good luck and keep us updated on the developments.

 

[tentative at best]

Originally posted by racergirl:
[QB]Hi Tentative,

I have 9 Fs on my Ugrad record, because years ago I repeatedly stopped going to school but didn't bother dropping classes (WHAT were we thinking???)

Anyway, I went back to school three years ago, worked my ass off, and got good grades (and didn't drop any classes!). I took the MCAT last April, and scored well.

Today, here I sit. I'm 33, headed to Med School in the fall! So far I've been accepted to two schools, and have another interview upcoming next month. People (including some advisors) will tell you again and again that you have no chance--DON'T LISTEN! All you need to do is really shine in your coursework NOW (and no, don't switch majors), do WELL on the MCAT, and continue your hospice work (what an awesome experience).

QB]••

I have no idea what I was thinking! It takes all of...what 20 minutes to drop classes??

Do you mind me asking what schools you have been accepted to? I'm trying to figure out what schools are more "accepting" of our types. (bad joke, I know.....

 

[tentative at best]

Originally posted by praying4MD:
•Tentative: SocialistMD hit the nail on the head. I live in Texas and would be happy to answer any other questions you have about the match system, etc. Feel free to private message me with any concerns.

Good luck and keep us updated on the developments. •••

I hate to admit it, but I have no idea what you mean by match system. Do you mean the residency match program?

 

[mdmom]

tentative

Texas also has legislation for returning, older students. It is called "Academic Fresh Start." It will void EVERYTHING 10 years and older from your GPA and transcripts. It is a permanent part of your record, so be very careful with your decision. If there are things voided that you need for med school requirements, you will have to take them again. Check with admissions at your university to see if it is still a possibility. The TMDSAS will ask if you have this, but if you do well on the rest of your pre-med work you will prove your capabilities to the med schools.

Good Luck!

 

[james72681]

i'm a first year at baylor, and there's a 39 year old former actor in our class. so keep ur chin up.its possible

 

[OlderThanDirt]

Originally posted by tentative, at best:
•

I hate to admit it, but I have no idea what you mean by match system. Do you mean the residency match program?•••

All 8 med schools in Texas participate in a match. You list your top choices, in order, from the list of schools you interviewed with. Then, if you receive multiple acceptances, the school highest on your list gets you. It works out best for all. You get to go to the school you prefer out of the list of acceptances, and the school gets a student who really wanted to go there.

Good luck

 

[Doc Oc]

At least 15 of my classmates at UNECOM are 30 or older. We have 5 or so over 40. I don't know the exact number because I really don't care, and neither does anyone else, we're all in the same boat now. I think two people in my class are from Texas. So if there is flexibility in where you can attend medical school, I think UNECOM would be a good choice, since they show a preference for older applicants.

A D.O. might want to be called an M.D. because people don't know what a D.O. is? There's tons of threads about the MD vs DO debate, but this comment reminded me of a story a resident told me.

He did his residency at some hospital somewhere where there was an overwhelming presence of MDs (I know there are more MDs period, but I just mean not in a state like Michigan or a place near a D.O. school), in a state where people probably had the same issue you describe: Not knowing what a D.O. is. One day, he was at the hospital, and the group of residents were watching a case presentation. In these presentations, the MD residents used to tease him, and say "Hey Rich, what do you think that guy's problem was? T4, T5?" They'd all laugh, and he'd laugh too, because they weren't trying to be mean, they were just cracking jokes. However, invariably, after every meeting, as he was gathering up his things, he'd notice one of them hanging around, waiting till everyone else had left. When they were nearly alone, the MD resident would look around, then approach Rich and say quietly, "I've been having this pain in my back, you think you can help me with it?"

 

[tentative at best]

Originally posted by Doc Oc:
• So if there is flexibility in where you can attend medical school, I think UNECOM would be a good choice, since they show a preference for older applicant.

•••

I hate to admit it, but what does UNECOM stand for?