7-Figure Anesthesia Salaries?

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Is that a surprise?
Work hard, multiply your potential by supervising 4:1, take fewer vacation days, and reap the rewards.
One of my navy pals used to make more than 100k/yr just picking up weekend OB shifts out in town. All that money went to toys. Lol.

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Everyone is giving anecdotes... Can an attending categorically say that he/she makes 700k+/year?

No anecdotes... and others in my old group made more by only taking 5 weeks. I always took btw 10 and 12.
 
So yeah it is possible... but you usually are working hard when working and are sacrificing something (location in my circumstance).

Do it for 5-6 years and then you can sacrifice income on your next job for a chance to live where others Vacation.

Anesthesia is da bomb. It still has potential if you play your cards right.
 
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That's the only way it can be done, kids.

I take 12 weeks vacation a year. And every physician in our practice is an equal partner. And I average < 50 hrs per week.
 
I take 12 weeks vacation a year. And every physician in our practice is an equal partner. And I average < 50 hrs per week.

But do you make $700k per annum?
 
Just an FYI to all the youngsters out there: Mman's situation is extraordinarily unique....I'd say less than 5% of anesthesiologists are in his/her situation.
 
Physician only practice in a notoriously low reimbursement area of the country. But I work hard, a lot of weekends and take only 3weeks off/yr. I'm >90 percentile MGMA region 9 but I work harder than 95% of my peers.

I imagine a supervision practice in a good payer mix area could realistically yield over $1mil.
 
Physician only practice in a notoriously low reimbursement area of the country. But I work hard, a lot of weekends and take only 3weeks off/yr. I'm >90 percentile MGMA region 9 but I work harder than 95% of my peers.

I imagine a supervision practice in a good payer mix area could realistically yield over $1mil.

Well, there's 3 things I don't want to do.
 
Just an FYI to all the youngsters out there: Mman's situation is extraordinarily unique....I'd say less than 5% of anesthesiologists are in his/her situation.

I'd agree. It's probably 2% or less based on MGMA data. But there are jobs out there. They just require efficient ACT models combined with some fast surgeons that can get stuff done. Our payer mix isn't even that good and I know of other groups out there making more than us.
 
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I'd agree. It's probably 2% or less based on MGMA data. But there are jobs out there. They just require efficient ACT models combined with some fast surgeons that can get stuff done. Our payer mix isn't even that good and I know of other groups out there making more than us.

very impressive # of weeks off and income.. do you work in a good location? or middle of no where?
 
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I'd agree. It's probably 2% or less based on MGMA data. But there are jobs out there. They just require efficient ACT models combined with some fast surgeons that can get stuff done. Our payer mix isn't even that good and I know of other groups out there making more than us.

Which state do you live in, if you don't mind answering?
Red
 
There was a group that offered me an administrative position where the partners were working 1:4 supervision at two very busy hospitals, in a strong payor mix city, with good reimbursement. Partners were grossing well over 1mm each.10 weeks vacation, 1 weekend every month in-house call.
 
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Graduating CA3. Landed a job in BFE (my home). Act model. Small group, works hard but 14 weeks off a year.

Two year partnership

Im hoping that they make 7 figures while I'm buying in :)
 
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very impressive # of weeks off and income.. do you work in a good location? or middle of no where?

I work in relative BFE in the southeast. There is really nothing special about our group. Everybody is an equal partner. We employ the CRNAs/AAs (so we can bill for their services). We have a pain division that is < 10% of our income. We bring in most of our money from a busy hospital and ambulatory practice with a majority of the cases done by private surgeons. We only get about 40% of our patients with commercial insurance which is obviously nothing special. Only real bonus that many places might not have is that private surgeons can do cases faster which means we get more done in a given day. You just gotta be efficient in your operations (low overhead) and successful at collecting what you bill.
 
I work in relative BFE in the southeast. There is really nothing special about our group. Everybody is an equal partner. We employ the CRNAs/AAs (so we can bill for their services). We have a pain division that is < 10% of our income. We bring in most of our money from a busy hospital and ambulatory practice with a majority of the cases done by private surgeons. We only get about 40% of our patients with commercial insurance which is obviously nothing special. Only real bonus that many places might not have is that private surgeons can do cases faster which means we get more done in a given day. You just gotta be efficient in your operations (low overhead) and successful at collecting what you bill.
Sounds similar to the setup I saw in Tifton, GA. 4 attendings covering pain and eat what you kill...they made a ton.
 
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Anesthesiology suddenly became my top choice specialty :greedy:

Why? I'm not going to be making that salary 5 years from now. We are just trying to hold on as long as possible. You are probably more likely to make 250K a year than 750K a year.

The dollars gradually get sucked out every year.
 
Why? I'm not going to be making that salary 5 years from now. We are just trying to hold on as long as possible. You are probably more likely to make 250K a year than 750K a year.

The dollars gradually get sucked out every year.
If I can make 250k (in today's dollar value) after 5 years of residency and fellowship doing the job I love, I will be very grateful!
 
If I can make 250k (in today's dollar value) after 5 years of residency and fellowship doing the job I love, I will be very grateful!

Then why does my current salary (which is on the way down) make it your #1 specialty choice? You can make 250K+ doing all sorts of things. Basically anything that isn't primary care peds. I'm being honest about my salary for the sake of honesty. Though you really don't need me to tell you what is possible as MGMA data is available that will support my assertion.

I just don't want people making judgments of their future income based off what my current income is. Because I'm planning on making less money in the future. And if I'm making less money as a full partner in a successful group, you are certainly making less money as a newbie with zero experience looking for a job down the road.
 
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Then why does my current salary (which is on the way down) make it your #1 specialty choice? You can make 250K+ doing all sorts of things. Basically anything that isn't primary care peds. I'm being honest about my salary for the sake of honesty. Though you really don't need me to tell you what is possible as MGMA data is available that will support my assertion.

I just don't want people making judgments of their future income based off what my current income is. Because I'm planning on making less money in the future. And if I'm making less money as a full partner in a successful group, you are certainly making less money as a newbie with zero experience looking for a job down the road.

I think you are getting too worked up by my comment. It was meant to be funny nothing more.

I'm not sure what field I will be pursuing yet and, despite how important money is to me, I won't be basing my decision purely on financial and lifestyle aspects. With that said, a career in anesthesia is very appealing to me as it allows one to perform very cool procedures and take care of very ill patients. However, I still need to wait until I start rotation in order to find out where my true passion lies.

I apologize for derailing the thread.
 
Long time poster here under a different name, but here is an example of doing well:

I currently do very well for myself as an anesthesia attending. Two years ago I wasnt partner till most of the way through. Made 940 taxable income from the hospital. Last year will be better but dont have final numbers. Income at our group has been on the rise for the past 14 years. I firmly believe we have reached a peak for our income last year. Next year projected is >10% lower.

We take 9 weeks vacation, do 12-14 weekends per year. Payers is 45% commercial. Work ~65 hours a week average, some weeks 30, some weeks 100.

Beyond that, investment has been very good to me with a ~2-3 mil investment portfolio at 3.5 years out of residency. I honestly am waiting for a shoe to drop somewhere in my life.

Job was basically handed to me by an attending during training, with minimal to no effort, unlike the options I found when looking for myself of the following:

Hospital employee: Start and all future years hovering around 375, better hours, same vacation
Private group, more BFE: Start 280, 2 years to partner progressing to 450-550 partner depending on amount worked.
Private group urban: Start 180, 3 years to partner, progressing to 700 or so.
Private group urban: Start 225, 5 years to partner, progressing to 550 or so.
Private group urban: Every year 400.
Academic, clinician path: 350-370

A good friend in all MD model urban environment was making 750, group replaced by AMC 2 years ago with same docs having same job (now plus CRNAs) with the addition of more in house call and 2/3 the vacation for 350 MAX (earned a percent of max compensation based on very hard to meet metrics) I should note that he, and almost all the other good anesthesiologists left that practice. He was begged to come back by admin and AMC at a much better rate, but still not anywhere close to what he left. He stayed away. That hospital continues with the AMC, despite surgeons who at least tell me they are unhappy with anesthesia. Who knows what they say when I am not around.

I am doing my best to make hay while the sun is shining, and invest heavily during this point in my life. My family of 4 lives off <100k per year including debt repayment (delayed for aggressive investments) and insurances. Income is already showing signs it will begin a decline for my group, and within 5 years I expect my compensation to be 1/2 current, and that is without us being replaced by an AMC or anything like that. I do far better than any of my residency classmates financially, but also work more hours and work harder when I am there. If my comp was lower I would unequivocally work less, life is much more than money in the bank. I am stressed at work and feel wiped out when I get home many days. If I didnt love my job I would be a very miserable rich guy.

So yes, salaries have been very high in the past, and are currently very good IF you make certain sacrifices. Many are not willing to make those sacrifices. Even so, I expect the income to decline across the board at varying rates to a point where salaries are in the 2-450 range for most people. Still a great income, but not 7 figures. Most in America would actually kill for this type of salary, and I see guys complain about their low salaries or difficulty living on that, and I want to punch them.
Please do not forget that you are a very privileged person, and all these discussions about pay will only make others jealous when they find out someone has it better than them, and make the "public" who reads this forum only resent anesthesiologists more for reading it.

Oh, and on that note, the neurosurgeons I work with make as much as my total compensation in call stipends yearly, even if they never do a case ;)
 
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Beyond that, investment has been very good to me with a ~2-3 mil investment portfolio at 3.5 years out of residency. I honestly am waiting for a shoe to drop somewhere in my life.

The only part of your long post I don't get is that part. You must've had a sizeable chunk of that money invested before finishing residency. Why? Because most of what you'd be investing (if you invest a ton) is after tax money. And in 3.5 years to amass nearly 3M (even assuming 20% annual return for that time) you'd have to invest in the neighborhood of 600-700K per year. At a gross salary of 940K per year your take home pay is probably "only" about 500K per year and if you live in 100K that means 400K is what's left over. Investing 400K per year to get near 3M you probably need a return of >60% per year.

But like I said, the rest of your post is easy to believe. I just don't get the math on investing unless a) you had a bunch invested before finishing residency or b) you were in crazy risky investments which would seem odd for a physician to even bother with such a high amount of their income.
 
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Long time poster here under a different name, but here is an example of doing well:

I currently do very well for myself as an anesthesia attending. Two years ago I wasnt partner till most of the way through. Made 940 taxable income from the hospital. Last year will be better but dont have final numbers. Income at our group has been on the rise for the past 14 years. I firmly believe we have reached a peak for our income last year. Next year projected is >10% lower.

We take 9 weeks vacation, do 12-14 weekends per year. Payers is 45% commercial. Work ~65 hours a week average, some weeks 30, some weeks 100.

Beyond that, investment has been very good to me with a ~2-3 mil investment portfolio at 3.5 years out of residency. I honestly am waiting for a shoe to drop somewhere in my life.

Job was basically handed to me by an attending during training, with minimal to no effort, unlike the options I found when looking for myself of the following:

Hospital employee: Start and all future years hovering around 375, better hours, same vacation
Private group, more BFE: Start 280, 2 years to partner progressing to 450-550 partner depending on amount worked.
Private group urban: Start 180, 3 years to partner, progressing to 700 or so.
Private group urban: Start 225, 5 years to partner, progressing to 550 or so.
Private group urban: Every year 400.
Academic, clinician path: 350-370

A good friend in all MD model urban environment was making 750, group replaced by AMC 2 years ago with same docs having same job (now plus CRNAs) with the addition of more in house call and 2/3 the vacation for 350 MAX (earned a percent of max compensation based on very hard to meet metrics) I should note that he, and almost all the other good anesthesiologists left that practice. He was begged to come back by admin and AMC at a much better rate, but still not anywhere close to what he left. He stayed away. That hospital continues with the AMC, despite surgeons who at least tell me they are unhappy with anesthesia. Who knows what they say when I am not around.

I am doing my best to make hay while the sun is shining, and invest heavily during this point in my life. My family of 4 lives off <100k per year including debt repayment (delayed for aggressive investments) and insurances. Income is already showing signs it will begin a decline for my group, and within 5 years I expect my compensation to be 1/2 current, and that is without us being replaced by an AMC or anything like that. I do far better than any of my residency classmates financially, but also work more hours and work harder when I am there. If my comp was lower I would unequivocally work less, life is much more than money in the bank. I am stressed at work and feel wiped out when I get home many days. If I didnt love my job I would be a very miserable rich guy.

So yes, salaries have been very high in the past, and are currently very good IF you make certain sacrifices. Many are not willing to make those sacrifices. Even so, I expect the income to decline across the board at varying rates to a point where salaries are in the 2-450 range for most people. Still a great income, but not 7 figures. Most in America would actually kill for this type of salary, and I see guys complain about their low salaries or difficulty living on that, and I want to punch them.
Please do not forget that you are a very privileged person, and all these discussions about pay will only make others jealous when they find out someone has it better than them, and make the "public" who reads this forum only resent anesthesiologists more for reading it.

Oh, and on that note, the neurosurgeons I work with make as much as my total compensation in call stipends yearly, even if they never do a case ;)
You were making $940,000 immediately out of residency???
This sounds too good to be true!
 
The only part of your long post I don't get is that part. You must've had a sizeable chunk of that money invested before finishing residency. Why? Because most of what you'd be investing (if you invest a ton) is after tax money. And in 3.5 years to amass nearly 3M (even assuming 20% annual return for that time) you'd have to invest in the neighborhood of 600-700K per year. At a gross salary of 940K per year your take home pay is probably "only" about 500K per year and if you live in 100K that means 400K is what's left over. Investing 400K per year to get near 3M you probably need a return of >60% per year.

But like I said, the rest of your post is easy to believe. I just don't get the math on investing unless a) you had a bunch invested before finishing residency or b) you were in crazy risky investments which would seem odd for a physician to even bother with such a high amount of their income.

That tax... Sigh.
 
The only part of your long post I don't get is that part. You must've had a sizeable chunk of that money invested before finishing residency. Why? Because most of what you'd be investing (if you invest a ton) is after tax money. And in 3.5 years to amass nearly 3M (even assuming 20% annual return for that time) you'd have to invest in the neighborhood of 600-700K per year. At a gross salary of 940K per year your take home pay is probably "only" about 500K per year and if you live in 100K that means 400K is what's left over. Investing 400K per year to get near 3M you probably need a return of >60% per year.

But like I said, the rest of your post is easy to believe. I just don't get the math on investing unless a) you had a bunch invested before finishing residency or b) you were in crazy risky investments which would seem odd for a physician to even bother with such a high amount of their income.
He's prolly including the spouse
 
The only part of your long post I don't get is that part. You must've had a sizeable chunk of that money invested before finishing residency. Why? Because most of what you'd be investing (if you invest a ton) is after tax money. And in 3.5 years to amass nearly 3M (even assuming 20% annual return for that time) you'd have to invest in the neighborhood of 600-700K per year. At a gross salary of 940K per year your take home pay is probably "only" about 500K per year and if you live in 100K that means 400K is what's left over. Investing 400K per year to get near 3M you probably need a return of >60% per year.

But like I said, the rest of your post is easy to believe. I just don't get the math on investing unless a) you had a bunch invested before finishing residency or b) you were in crazy risky investments which would seem odd for a physician to even bother with such a high amount of their income.

Residency investments were present with an end amount of ~100 invested outside of retirement. Spouse and myself each with retirement accounts currently valued ~90 each. ~50 each year at my current job for retirement. Spouse no longer working. Added 250 first year to other investment. Presently that 350 has paid out 500 with current portfolio value at 1.25. Yes, that was a very risky investment category, however I feel the risk of this particular was lower. I figured it I went big and went bust I was out a year of salary, or I could be in the position I am in currently. There is stress associated with this aggressive of investment. Added the rest over the next few years to a few different more "standard" investments with returns ~12% posttax. I have been far more blessed than I deserve in my investments and life. My hope is that by the time my salary drops significantly or when I am like sevo and want to more to desirable area I can have investments fund investments and not have too much increase in lifestyle. My very optimistic goal is 10 mil in 10 years but I would be fine either way. Honestly, I am elated that I am where I am at currently.

The goal of that post was to tell residents that great jobs are out there, but are very hard to find unless you are lucky and get in good with the right attending at the right time, that they require sacrifice frequently, and that even these higher earning jobs expect to decline.
 
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Residency investments were present with an end amount of ~100 invested outside of retirement. Spouse and myself each with retirement accounts currently valued ~90 each. ~50 each year at my current job for retirement. Spouse no longer working. Added 250 first year to other investment. Presently that 350 has paid out 500 with current portfolio value at 1.25. Yes, that was a very risky investment category, however I feel the risk of this particular was lower. I figured it I went big and went bust I was out a year of salary, or I could be in the position I am in currently. There is stress associated with this aggressive of investment. Added the rest over the next few years to a few different more "standard" investments with returns ~12% posttax. I have been far more blessed than I deserve in my investments and life. My hope is that by the time my salary drops significantly or when I am like sevo and want to more to desirable area I can have investments fund investments and not have too much increase in lifestyle. My very optimistic goal is 10 mil in 10 years but I would be fine either way. Honestly, I am elated that I am where I am at currently.

The goal of that post was to tell residents that great jobs are out there, but are very hard to find unless you are lucky and get in good with the right attending at the right time, that they require sacrifice frequently, and that even these higher earning jobs expect to decline.


Great posts. You are working hard and making hay while the sun shines. YOur example of saving that big nest egg will allow you many options by the time you reach 50-55. I congratulate you on the effort and the sacrifices of living on $100K instead of $300K like many would do in your situation.
 
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Great posts. You are working hard and making hay while the sun shines. YOur example of saving that big nest egg will allow you many options by the time you reach 50-55. I congratulate you on the effort and the sacrifices of living on $100K instead of $300K like many would do in your situation.

at my residency interviews last week, had some CA3s talk about how offers were ~250k with 4-5 yr partner tracks, and other residents were like thats awesome. haha, from reading SDN so much, i feel like its awful
 
at my residency interviews last week, had some CA3s talk about how offers were ~250k with 4-5 yr partner tracks, and other residents were like thats awesome. haha, from reading SDN so much, i feel like its awful


Based on the offers I've had in "real life" that is pretty terrible. I actually don't know anyone who's signed with a group with a partnership track longer than 2 years. Most I've personally seen are 1-2 years.
 
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at my residency interviews last week, had some CA3s talk about how offers were ~250k with 4-5 yr partner tracks, and other residents were like thats awesome. haha, from reading SDN so much, i feel like its awful
It is. That's not a partnership track, that's a rat race track.
 
GOOD partnership tracks with equal shares and thus equal partnerships are indeed hard to find. New grads who are interested in this type of practice may very well not be able to find it in their "back yard". However, if you can be even somewhat mobile, you can still find some nice practices and some good offers combined with nice practice settings. I did, and I'm nothing special (though my mom disagrees).
 
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How does partnership work? Is it something that is offered in other specialities like IM/FM/Psych etc...? What are the pros and cons?
 
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at my residency interviews last week, had some CA3s talk about how offers were ~250k with 4-5 yr partner tracks, and other residents were like thats awesome. haha, from reading SDN so much, i feel like its awful
That's terrible. $250K may be a fair rate for some very competitive or "desirable" markets.

Anyone who signs up for a 4-5 year partner track today is crazy.
 
That's terrible. $250K may be a fair rate for some very competitive or "desirable" markets.

Anyone who signs up for a 4-5 year partner track today is crazy.

Good job offers are very hard to find these days compared to even 5 years ago. Even finding a partnership offer is probably 10x less likely than it was. The overwhelming majority of private groups have stopped even offering them. Parternship offers that are still there are almost uniformly longer than they were 5-10 years ago.

With all the sellouts to AMCs, remaining private groups are in a "seller's" market since there is very little supply of good jobs to go around. Lots of buyers out there to choose from so they can set their "price" high.

Like it or not, fair or not, that's pretty much the deal in today's market.
 
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Good job offers are very hard to find these days compared to even 5 years ago. Even finding a partnership offer is probably 10x less likely than it was. The overwhelming majority of private groups have stopped even offering them. Parternship offers that are still there are almost uniformly longer than they were 5-10 years ago.

With all the sellouts to AMCs, remaining private groups are in a "seller's" market since there is very little supply of good jobs to go around. Lots of buyers out there to choose from so they can set their "price" high.

Like it or not, fair or not, that's pretty much the deal in today's market.
In other words. Private practice partners today can take money that you earn and since they can get away with it they mostly will. It's like opportunistic theft. If you leave your bike unlocked it doesn't give anyone a right to steal it and some people won't, but some people, even if they didn't plan on stealing a bike today, will when the opportunity presents itself. Anesthesiologists it seems are mostly (but not all) bad people who will happily rob you just because the opportunity presents itself.
 
In other words. Private practice partners today can take money that you earn and since they can get away with it they mostly will. It's like opportunistic theft. If you leave your bike unlocked it doesn't give anyone a right to steal it and some people won't, but some people, even if they didn't plan on stealing a bike today, will when the opportunity presents itself. Anesthesiologists it seems are mostly (but not all) bad people who will happily rob you just because the opportunity presents itself.

No offense, but if you take a job as an employee, who is stealing from you? You voluntarily sign a contract that lets them bill for your services. You can't steal something from someone that willingly hands it to you.

Beggars can't be choosers.
 
Those private practice partners own the contract they have with the facilities they serve, and at some point they made decisions and took risks to get there.

We can argue about how much risk they actually took during the golden years and how lucky they were - and what that contract is really worth - but a new guy doesn't magically get a piece of a group from day one just because he shows up with a license and a residency certificate, willing to work. The partners' motivation to pay well and offer a piece of ownership is that good pay and a short track allows them to pick better applicants. They're not morally obligated to do anything, including making good business decisions.

Calling it "opportunistic theft" isn't right, unless they lie to you or act in bad faith when it comes time to finish the partner track.
 
Those private practice partners own the contract they have with the facilities they serve, and at some point they made decisions and took risks to get there.

We can argue about how much risk they actually took during the golden years and how lucky they were - and what that contract is really worth - but a new guy doesn't magically get a piece of a group from day one just because he shows up with a license and a residency certificate, willing to work. The partners' motivation to pay well and offer a piece of ownership is that good pay and a short track allows them to pick better applicants. They're not morally obligated to do anything, including making good business decisions.

Calling it "opportunistic theft" isn't right, unless they lie to you or act in bad faith when it comes time to finish the partner track.
Maybe you're right... Extorsion then not 'theft'.
They force you to give up some or most of your income in exchange for not being uneployed. Actually keeping what you earn, after a fair management fee and partnership track, would be offered by good people.
 
Maybe you're right... Extorsion then not 'theft'.
They force you to give up some or most of your income in exchange for not being uneployed. Actually keeping what you earn, after a fair management fee and partnership track, would be offered by good people.

I'm sorry, but how can they "force you to give up some or most of your income in exchange for not being unemployed"? They don't hold a gun to your head. You are free to take any other job. If you willing sign a contract then don't blame the employer for holding to their terms of it.
 
I'm sorry, but how can they "force you to give up some or most of your income in exchange for not being unemployed"? They don't hold a gun to your head. You are free to take any other job. If you willing sign a contract then don't blame the employer for holding to their terms of it.
That is a very convenient and limited view if one is an employer, and it's true only in a market where it's easy to find a decent job.
 
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I'm sorry, but how can they "force you to give up some or most of your income in exchange for not being unemployed"? They don't hold a gun to your head. You are free to take any other job. If you willing sign a contract then don't blame the employer for holding to their terms of it.

That would be true if alternative jobs didn't offer the same rip off.

These partners in crime would have a much different view of what's fair and appropriate if THEY were the ones getting the short end of the stick.
 
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That is a very convenient and limited view if one is an employer, and it's true only in a market where it's easy to find a decent job.

It's also a convenient view if you aren't a communist.

I don't believe anybody is entitled to anything when it comes to a job. If you go looking for a job, you go looking. You will hopefully get some interviews and some job offers and then decide which is best for you. Bitching about what you get offered is just stupid IMHO. A job offer is a take it or leave it proposition. If you choose to accept the offer, don't go whining that the employer is stealing from you.


And keep in mind, I'm in a group where everybody is a partner. We don't even have anybody on a partnership track since we haven't hired anybody in years. I'm more likely to be looking for a job in the future than I am to be hiring a non partner. But if I took a job somewhere else as an employee or on a prolonged partnership track, I sure wouldn't have animosity towards my bosses so long as they treated me fairly according to my contract.

I also agree that what you get offered depends on the job market. That's the whole point. As a physician, you are essentially a commodity. Your value may go up or down over time. If you need a job when your value is at a low point, don't complain about what the going rate is.
 
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