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A word of advice for some people

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by wonderguy2, Jun 25, 2002.

  1. wonderguy2

    wonderguy2 Junior Member 7+ Year Member

    Jun 22, 2002
    hi peeps, here is a word of advice.

    i called ucsd admission office and inquire about my academic creditials and my prospect for the school. even though i did great in graduate school, they pretty much said they DON'T CONSIDER GRADUATE SCHOOL GRADES TO BE IMPORTANT EVEN IF THEY ARE EXCELLENT. i guess this really confirm the inflation theory. crap.
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  3. sendwich

    sendwich you rock! 10+ Year Member

    May 2, 2002
    hey wonderguy,
    i posted you a msg on your other post, but this is soemthing that i've been looking into. i'm graduating this year with a meager gpa of ~2.7 but would like to pursue medschool. what is your advice? any help would be much appreciated!!
  4. Flack Pinku

    Flack Pinku U lookin at my glasses?? 7+ Year Member

    Jun 5, 2002

    Are you serious? Only undergraduate GPA counts? Can someone else verify this?

    Even if the applicant is non-traditional?

    If this is true, the system is so weird... why couldn't Grad school GPA count a lot?

    Why do so many people do Post-bacc programs then?
  5. vyc

    vyc Senior Member 7+ Year Member

    Jan 20, 2002
    i'm sure it's different for each school but i don't think they completely disregard your graduate school grades.

    maybe UCSD was just making the point that the undergraduate GPA is the more important one because that's what everyone has. it's one thing to do well in college and it's another to do well in graduate school.

    don't despair quite yet. you can't change the past. an undergraduate GPA that's low can't be changed or undone. just do better in graduate school and hope for the best.
  6. moo

    moo 1K Member 10+ Year Member

    Jul 4, 2000
    graduate gpa's count just not as much. Most schools know about the rampant grade inflation that occurs in grad school. Case in point: my friend took a graduate course in topology (mathematics) last semester. Out of two assignments and one final, he completed one assignment and half of the final. He ended up with an A+. How? The prof said that she didn't believe in grades for grad school and that everybody gets an A+. In some ways this is true b/c most people who are in grad school are in it for the pure love of the subject and hence do not feel the need to compete. YOu get what you put into it. post bacc is different b/c you are taking undergrad courses and hence grade inflation should be nonexistent
  7. jot


    but grad schools and post bac are completely diff (the latter taken more seriously of course) - so there are still ways.
  8. banannie

    banannie Senior Member 7+ Year Member

    Apr 19, 2002
    Durham, NC
    Why is this "inflation" such a surprise to everyone? Haven't you noticed that every time someone posts their grad GPA on SDN, it's like 3.9+? I bet if we did a poll of undergrad GPA vs grad GPA, the average grad GPA would be way higher. And I doubt it's because everyone suddenly became brilliant once they got to grad school.
  9. relatively prime

    relatively prime post happy member 7+ Year Member

    Apr 28, 2002
    Guys, please, this is just ONE school. Like someone else said, I think that everyone should call the schools they are applying to and ask about it. I'm sure it's different for each school.

    Most people I've talk to say that it's easier to get good grades in grad school than in undergrad. Maybe that's why they don't consider them that important. However, I seriously doubt that any school just completely disregards them.
  10. Toejam

    Toejam Terminal Student 7+ Year Member

    May 12, 2002
    35 miles from Pomona
    I know that professional school gpa is not counted into the total gpa
  11. lola

    lola Bovine Member 7+ Year Member

    Mar 22, 2002
    It does seem strange graduate gpa wouldn't be counted at all. I can understand that undergraduate gpa is much more important in terms of comparing you to others. Even if graduate gpa doesn't count, I have a hard time believing they wouldn't at least look a little more favorably on someone who went to graduate school and did well compared to someone with similar stats who didn't go to grad school.
  12. Batman_formerly lamd

    Batman_formerly lamd Member 7+ Year Member

    Mar 26, 2002
    Los Angeles
    What exactly is a post bac??

    do you just take extension courses? I am assuming that one has already graduated when doing a post bac right?

    thanks all
  13. none

    none 1K Member 10+ Year Member

    Jul 27, 2001
    I'm sure if you failed all your graduate classes, someone on the adcom would pay attention. :)
  14. GuitarMan

    GuitarMan Guitarman for President 7+ Year Member

    May 21, 2002
    Graduate GPA does count for something. . . but only if it's bad. It counts against you. That doesn't mean a graduate degree won't be considered in your favor.

    Graduate GPA's are inflated for the same reason most med students graduate from medical school. Many graduate schools accept a very small percentage of their applicants. Those accepted are from the top of the applicant pool. Graduate classes are usually really small. For instance, I went to a Ph.D. program in Clinical Psychology. There were only eight people in my class. It wouldn't make sense to grade classes on a curve. Everybody performs at about the same level. Somebody that is not performing as well as the rest of the group will get a lower grade, or have to repeat a course. Repeatedly low performance gets your kicked out.

    Adcoms probably consider the quality of the grad programs more than the grades.
  15. geneman

    geneman The Transgenic Hobo 7+ Year Member

    May 5, 2002
    In a Molecular Biology/Biochemistry class I took, it was a joint undergraduate and graduate student class.

    On the exams, the undergrads and grads were scaled separately. The mean for undergraduates was counted as a C. The mean for graduates was counted as a B.

    The prof justified it by saying something about the grads having to be able graduate... <img border="0" alt="[Laughy]" title="" src="graemlins/laughy.gif" />
  16. CD

    CD Senior Member 10+ Year Member

    Jan 10, 2002
    Whoa, I posted this on another thread but it bears repeating. Not all grad programs are created equal and not all med schools view them the same way. At my school grad students take the same classes with the undergrad students and compete under the same system for the same grades. The only difference is the grad students are sometimes required to to additional work etc. BEleive me there is NO grade inflation here. Med schools differ in the way they view these grades too. Although I'm not sure the weight placed on grad grades, when I called and asked our state med school what I needed as a non traditional student I was told that I needed to show ability to still handle university course work. They didn't care if that was at the undergrad or graduate level. (Perhaps they are aware of the graduate system in our state?). Best advice is to CALL the med schools that you are interested in and ASK.
  17. neofight

    neofight Senior Member 7+ Year Member

    Feb 22, 2003
    Bay Area
    It really depends on the school your going to. I posted this before in a previous thread but for most schools, graduate courses tend to be more easier (and more enjoyable) than undergraduate courses - except at schools that have best, most reputable programs. If you think about it, how "good" could the program be if the graduate courses are easier than the undergraduate courses?

    Still, for those doing a Masters to make up for a subpar undergraduate sux that some schools don't take your grad GPA seriously.
  18. darkdude

    darkdude Junior Member 7+ Year Member

    Mar 16, 2003
    A place that rocks
    Man, what BS. Sucks to hear if it's true. I have friends who are doing Masters to help get into medical school. Hopefully, it's not a waste of their time. :rolleyes:
  19. Adcadet

    Adcadet Long way from Gate 27 10+ Year Member

    I just finished up my master's (MPH in epidemiology), partly to help get into med school. But I did it more for the extra experience and extra knowledge in a field related to medicine. I've heard mixed things about how to compare grad vs. undergrad GPAs. But bad grad GPAs are definitely a very negative sign. What the director of admissions at one school suggested is that I take the occasional upper level undergrad course that was clearly "pre-med" in nature to give my undergrad GPA a boost and to show that I could compete against the more traditional pre-meds. So I took a few courses that fit in nicely with my public health coursework (and they counted as my grad elective credits). yeah, grad school to improve your GPA isn't a good idea unless you can take upper level undergrad classes in addition to your regular grad classes.
  20. Blanch

    Blanch Member 7+ Year Member

    May 14, 2003
    Have you looked through some of the older applicant's profiles on the Applicant Profiles part of this site? There are tons of examples of people who had mediocre undergrad GPAs and did well in graduate school or a post-bacc, and many of them are getting into really good schools. They sometimes appear to have more trouble getting to the interview stage at a lot of schools, but the ones that apply to enough schools seem to be doing just fine. If they get the interviews, they likely have years more solid experience than the typical applicant (not to mention publications), which gives them an edge I would imagine.
  21. Samoa

    Samoa Physician Pharmacist 10+ Year Member

    Feb 14, 2002
    I spoke to someone on the admissions staff at Baylor, and they basically told me that a good graduate GPA does NOT offset a low undergrad GPA. I had gone to them asking whether to do post-bacc classes (which were easier in content and cheaper) or a graduate program (which would have helped my current career far more in the event I never got in). They said they preferred to see post-bacc classes, because it was the undergraduate GPA that I was seeking to remediate.
  22. Andrew_Doan

    Andrew_Doan Doc, Author, Entrepreneur Physician Moderator Emeritus Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 15+ Year Member

    Oct 1, 2002
    San Diego, CA
    Yes, this is true that Graduate courses do not count much.

    The non-traditional student will take Post-bacc courses which are considered to be UNDERGRADUATE course work. For instance, if you're a non-traditional student, then you'll likely need to still complete most of the science and math requirements. This would require you to take undergraduate level physics, biology, chem, o-chem, etc...

    If this is true, the system is so weird... why couldn't Grad school GPA count a lot?

    It's too difficult to compare Graduate school GPA with applicants who have only undergraduate GPAs. Many graduate school courses do not "flunk" their grad students. You would have to be a total slacker to flunk a grad school course. Medical schools have their pick of applicants and don't really want to bother with people who have demonstrated low undergraduate GPAs. It's just the nature of the game.
  23. Samoa

    Samoa Physician Pharmacist 10+ Year Member

    Feb 14, 2002
    Which totally sucks if you happened to attend one where you can bust your @ss and still flunk at the professor's whim, because either no grades are assigned, or the grading is so subjective that external scrutiny of the grading process is useless.

    But I'm not bitter or anything. :D :laugh:
  24. ironey

    ironey Senior Member 7+ Year Member

    Apr 11, 2003
    Upper Valley
    Post-bac means that you've already graduated with a bachelor's degree and are taking more courses without a declared degree. In my case, I did most of my pre-med requirements after I received my bachelor's.

    Grad school is very different from what I did. My courses were all "undergrad" level - biology, Ochem, physics, etc. And I really don't think those grades were inflated as I was in the same classes as many other pre-meds who hadn't graduated yet.

    Post bac can be done two ways: as grad level courses (which fall under the "inflation" suspicion), or as undergrad level courses (which are viewed as-is).

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