- Joined
- Dec 7, 2004
- Messages
- 32
- Reaction score
- 0
To all the people who are going to be interviewed or have interviewed: What do you think about abortion and what are you views on it?
Shredder said:I personally don't like the idea of unwanted children.
Medikit said:I think it's important to state your beliefs but I also think it's important to show that you can understand the opposing viewpoint.
Of my three interviews I was only asked an abortion question once. They asked me what I would do as a physician if a pregnant woman were to come to me asking for an abortion.
Zomo33 said:To all the people who are going to be interviewed or have interviewed: What do you think about abortion and what are you views on it?
Shredder said:I personally don't like the idea of unwanted children.
Medikit said:I think it's important to state your beliefs but I also think it's important to show that you can understand the opposing viewpoint.
Of my three interviews I was only asked an abortion question once. They asked me what I would do as a physician if a pregnant woman were to come to me asking for an abortion.
Medikit said:Of my three interviews I was only asked an abortion question once. They asked me what I would do as a physician if a pregnant woman were to come to me asking for an abortion.
PsychoDoc said:I'm curious as to what you said.
tinkerbelle said:What else would you say besides either:
1) i would preform the abortion
2) i would refer my patient to someone who would preform the abortion
docjolly said:I am very much against abortion. In my point of view, abortion takes away the opportunity for unborn children to live. In my opinion, it's nothing shy of murder. I don't think that I will ever be able to understand why we, as human beings, feel as though we have the right to take another's life away...No, I don't think I'll ever really understand...
As a future physician, I honestly struggle with an answer to the question about patients seeking abortions...
medic170 said:I hope this does not turn into another flame war. The abortion issue can never be completely solved, there will always be people with opposing views.
Now, to the OP, I am going to give you the benfit of the doubt and assume you are not a Troll.
Someone said the ADCOMS want to see if you appreciate the shades of gray, and that is exactly right.
Some of my interviewers asked about a woman coming to me to request an abortion. Now, I personally do not believe in abortions. I gave an honest answer. I said I would not perform the abortion. However, I also said "it is not my place to judge this patient, and I would not. I said I would explain the alternatives to the patient, and then I would simply refer the patient to another doctor that wouild be willing to entertain the abortion option. I would even assist the patient in setting up the appointment" like it ir not, abortion is, at this time, legal. By answering the way I did, I maintain my own morals, I still helped the patient, I educated the patient about other options (like adoption) and helped the patient get set up with another doc so she could make her decision without my bias. Her decisdion will be between her, the doc, and God. I did my job and the patient will ultimatly get the care she wants, which I helped her with.
Conversely, for those who do believe in abortions, I think the best thing to do is still offer all the alternatives, tell the patient to take some time to be sure of her decision, and then perform the procedure if she so chooses.
On the side, messing with people's personal decisions is NOT the way for anti-abortionist like myself to change people's views. like it or not, abortion is legal. Most anti-abortionists are Christians, and rather than posting pictires of aborted fetuses on billboards, I think it is better to remember that the Bible tells us NOT to judge individuals, because that is the job of God alone. Educating people the best you can about alternatives and the gravity of what an abortion is would be the best way to change things. Also, we must RESPECT the decisions of those who's mind we cannot change rather than judging them as "bad people".
Psycho Doctor said:you could also offer to send the patient to someone to counsel her so she is prepared for the horrific feelings afterwards
Zomo33 said:iwhat is a troll.
tinkerbelle said:Yeah, that's a good idea too Although you're assuming all women will feel badly after having an abortion, which is untrue. Some women feel like it is their only choice and that it needs to be done. They feel nothing but relief afterwards.
Psycho Doctor said:Yes, I know but from what i've heard (and it's been a lot thru various organizations i've been involved with) many are devastated whether immediately or years later, especially if they had no counseling and weren't prepared for any emotional attachment or regret or mixed feelings; many wished someone had warned them.
tinkerbelle said:What else would you say besides either:
1) i would preform the abortion
2) i would refer my patient to someone who would preform the abortion
Panda Bear said:3) My religious and/or moral beliefs do not allow me to either perform, refer for, or in any way assist you in obtaining an elective abortion. In fact, most states, if not all, have a "conscience clause" in their laws which allows physicians, without legal jeapordy, to opt out of any involvement whatsoever with abortion. Additionally, at many public hospitals, it is against hospital policy and state law to discuss elective abortion with a patient.
The OP is a troll. I guarantee my comments are going to generate a lot of hissy fits and self-righteous posturing from our liberal friends on SDN who can not accept first that a "conscience clause" exists and second that a physician is allowed to exercise his personal morality.
anonymous1 said:i had an abortion a few years ago. i felt very sad about it (and still do when i think about it now), but it was certainly the right decision for me. i have no regrets and no feeling of horror. in fact, what i do have is a deep gratitude for the availability of safe, respectfully provided abortions. i also have a lot of empathy for others going through that experience.
as a doc, i will certainly never push an abortion on anyone, and i would want to have a thoughtful conversation with any woman asking for one to make sure she's really clear about her options and comfortable about her choice. i plan to get trained to do abortions myself so i can offer them when appropriate.
two parts of my experience that interested and moved me:
- i had my abortion at planned parenthood. they did offer me counseling, during which they didn't push me to make any particular decision--i really felt they presented me with options. this counseling was standard for all patients, i think. i was incredibly impressed with the compassion, dedication, kindness, and professionalism of the staff, both during the counseling and during the actual abortion.
- i didn't tell a huge number of people about my abortion (and i want to stay anonymous here) but i found that when i did tell other women, an amazing number (3 out of 7) had abortion stories of their own. these included my mom as well as a good friend of mine who i would've thought would have told me that before. i was struck that each of these women was really at peace with her decision. none had made her decision lightly. two out of three had done some grieving, but over the loss of a potential child and not over her choice. i was also struck that abortion is an incredibly private topic. i'm not sure why i had never heard these stories before. i'm pretty sure it wasn't shame, but maybe fear of judgement?
i'm certain there are women out there who have deeply felt regrets-even horror-about having had abortions. but i can attest that there are some--perhaps even a majority?--who feel that abortion was a good and moral choice, even if a sad one. i do.
here is how i think about the whole "is-it-murder?" question: i feel very clear that i caused a potential human to die when i decided to have an abortion. however, i also feel very clear that it wasn't a person with any current or past self-awareness who could experience a desire to live. nor was it ever a person with the kind of social identity that most fetuses acquire as delievery nears--for examples, no one ever named my embryo or spent time imagining it taking its place in a family or dreaming about its future. my personal belief is that embryos or fetuses should be respected as potential people, not thought of as "clumps of tissue"; therefore, one should never have an abortion lightly (and CERTAINLY not as birth control). however, i don't think killing them is murder when one can be certain they have no self-awareness and when they haven't acquired a social identity.
p.s. i like "safe, legal, and rare"
Panda Bear said:Additionally, at many public hospitals, it is against hospital policy and state law to discuss elective abortion with a patient.
mercaptovizadeh said:Thank you Panda Bear. I am sickened by the thought that the law could force you to refer a woman to a willing baby-killer. This really works against my consience. Good to know that we have not yet descended to that level.
mercaptovizadeh said:Thank you anonymous. I am really against abortion, regardless of circumstances, but I certainly respect you very much for discussing it on this forum, albeit anonymously. It is, no doubt, a difficult thing to discuss, and I respect you for your courage. I, too, have noticed that it is a taboo topic. What is particularly surprising to me is when married people do it.
Psycho Doctor said:I'm curious as to what you said.
tinkerbelle said:What the rational behind that?
anonymous1 said:here is how i think about the whole "is-it-murder?" question: i feel very clear that i caused a potential human to die when i decided to have an abortion. however, i also feel very clear that it wasn't a person with any current or past self-awareness who could experience a desire to live. nor was it ever a person with the kind of social identity that most fetuses acquire as delievery nears--for examples, no one ever named my embryo or spent time imagining it taking its place in a family or dreaming about its future. my personal belief is that embryos or fetuses should be respected as potential people, not thought of as "clumps of tissue"; therefore, one should never have an abortion lightly (and CERTAINLY not as birth control). however, i don't think killing them is murder when one can be certain they have no self-awareness and when they haven't acquired a social identity.
p.s. i like "safe, legal, and rare"
Jezzielin said:If I had to answer this question in an interview or what not I would have to say that I do not think abortion is right, for my religious views. Sure there are great circumstances to where there might be an exception - but I am not getting into that much detail. However, if it came to my patients or even a friend, I would be in total support of their choice, for the pure and simple reason that just because I hold these beliefs for myself - who am I to push my beliefs on other people? Not everyone is my religion, or has the same views.
I just think that I can hold these beliefs for myself and only myself, and not push my beliefs on other people, they have their own. This way of thinking really helps me to see that if I was put in this situation as a physician, I would have a much easier dealing with it.
Panda Bear said:Besides, as the OP troll knows, questions about abortion are almost never asked during an interview. It's like asking an applicant if they are a Republican or a Democrat. It's just not done.
.
Aristotle said:I think its a pretty unfair question to be asked during the interview, but if a patient came to me requesting an abortion, I'd probably not perform it because I am against abortions. However, as a doctor, I'd feel obligated to refer the patient to a doctor who would perform the abortion. I still think its sad that some people want an abortion because they do not want a child, many people would be willing to adopt a baby. But no matter what I would not attempt to impose my views concerning abortion on a patient. Also thanks for sharing your story anonymous.
Mistress S said:Panda Bear, I've already had this discussion with you a long time ago (re: the abundance of elective procedures in medical care, making this argument against abortion irrelevant; see http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=43682&highlight=abortion to refresh your memory). Why are you still bringing up the same arguments? Just let this thread die. No one is going to say anything that hasn't already been said a million times before. I've come to realize the sheer pointlessness of threads like this for provoking any worthwhile discussion; no one changes their views or learns anything new.
Panda Bear said:Pro-choice or pro-life, agree or disagree with the law, it is the law and it is the pro-choice physician in a pubic hospital in Louisiana who is breaking the law and acting unethically if he refers a woman for an elective abortion. His professionalism is shoddy and it is his license which is in jeapordy, not mine.
Panda Bear said:Just a side note, I was kind of pulling your leg. Patient "convenience" is a poor indication for any procedure.
Panda Bear said:What is it about it that disgusts you just enough where you won't scrape the products of conception out yourself but not enough where you won't refer to someone who will?
Panda Bear said:See, I don't understand why many who are pro-choice are so friggin' squeamish about scraping out a lifeless, souless, blob of inanimate matter.
At least the rabid, foam at the mouth pro-choice people who make a religion of abortion are intellectually consistent when they state that it is not a baby until its feet scrape the labia major on the way out.
leechy said:I just re-read some of your earlier posts, panda, which clarified the Louisiana situation. Thanks for providing that information.
zpdoc said:Scientologists don't believe in using any psychiatric medications at all, including prozac, etc. for religious reasons. Yet, somehow I don't think a "conscience clause" would bail them out in court if they refused to refer their patients w/MDD to a doctor who would prescribe them, and then the patient committed suicide.