Academic medicine goals and lower MCAT

[lacunae]

Sorry for posting another chances thread. I did a search, but I could not find answers to my question.

I am interested in academic medicine (patient care, translational research, and teaching). I have some clinical and teaching experiences. I have ~5 years of research, including 3years post-graduation for a big name PI. I will have good recs in support of my ability to succeed in academic medicine. For career purposes, I need to attend at least a mid-level research-orientated medical school (Pit/ UNC level).

Unfortunately my stats are not great. I have a 3.7 from an unknown LAC. I took the MCAT 3x and I received a 29P (8V, 10PS, 11BS) this last time. Due to my career goals, I will not get any love from my state school-UWash. Do I have a shot at any reputable research orientated schools with a sub-30 MCAT? What schools might consider my application favorably despite my MCAT scores?

No hard feelings if my chances are not good now. If my chances are slim, I plan to complete my PhD at a top school (have an acceptance) and then I would probably apply to med school. I would then be applying in a state with several reputable research orientated med schools that have mcat averages ~30. (I do want a PhD).

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[dd128]

This is just my little 'ol opinion, but it seems like a Ph.D. is a looooong way to go if your ultimate goal is going to be med school. I've heard of people with Ph.D's switching careers and going to med school, but it doesn't seem like a great idea to have that as a back up plan if you're sure you want to become a physician.

 

[physicsnerd42]

I am interested in academic medicine (patient care, translational research, and teaching). I have some clinical and teaching experiences. I have ~5 years of research, including 3years post-graduation for a big name PI. I will have good recs in support of my ability to succeed in academic medicine. For career purposes, I need to attend at least a mid-level research-orientated medical school (Pit/ UNC level).

Granted, I'm only a med student, but my impression has always been that the institutions farther along in your training are the ones that determine pedigree/chances for academics. What I mean is: if you go to some random med school and then do a residency in IM at MGH and a fellowship in Heme/Onc at MD-Anderson, no one will give a damn where you did med school and your residency/fellowship training will give you the connections and "pedigree" for academics. Granted, it'll be slightly harder to get an academic residency if you went to some random med school no one's ever heard of, but every allopathic school sends some people to top/academic residencies every year. So, going to a "low-tier" (whatever that means) med school isn't necessarily going to kill your chances of getting an academic faculty spot.

Doing an MD/PhD program will also help your chances of getting an academic residency spot. With your stats, however, it might be pretty challenging to get any MD/PhD interviews so if you decided to go that way, apply very widely.

 

[physicsnerd42]

Doing a PhD at a "top" place isn't going to help you very much when applying to med school. Your MCAT score and your undergrad grades are what med schools will care most about. A PhD won't erase/make up for your MCAT score. So, you'll end up going to the same kind of med school whether you do a PhD or whether you apply right now. The only difference is that if you do a PhD now and MD later, you'll be several years older and you'll have MANY (7+) years in between when you finish your PhD and have a chance to do significant research again. So, you'll lose the mindset/skills you will have picked up during your PhD.

 

[lacunae]

This is just my little 'ol opinion, but it seems like a Ph.D. is a looooong way to go if your ultimate goal is going to be med school. I've heard of people with Ph.D's switching careers and going to med school, but it doesn't seem like a great idea to have that as a back up plan if you're sure you want to become a physician.

I should clarify that I want both a PhD and a MD. I want to do primarily research (but also have some clinical responsibilities). I am not competitive for MD/PhD programs due to the MCAT. If I started out in an MD program, I would try to pick up the PhD during med school or residency. If I think that I could get into a reputable MD program next year, I would do this and hopefully try to pick up the PhD while I am in med school there. I may also consider trying to just do research as an MD only, if I went the MD only route initially.

I know the PhD route may not be the best idea, but I really love research and I currently want that degree too. Due to my love for the school and the high quality of training in the program (its in the top10 so I will be set for a research career), I definately will have a hard time turning them down.

Again if any one knows of any reputable research orientated MD programs that will strongly consider an applicant with a sub 30 mcat, please let me know.

 

[lacunae]

Doing a PhD at a "top" place isn't going to help you very much when applying to med school. Your MCAT score and your undergrad grades are what med schools will care most about. A PhD won't erase/make up for your MCAT score. So, you'll end up going to the same kind of med school whether you do a PhD or whether you apply right now. The only difference is that if you do a PhD now and MD later, you'll be several years older and you'll have MANY (7+) years in between when you finish your PhD and have a chance to do significant research again. So, you'll lose the mindset/skills you will have picked up during your PhD.

I know that the PhD will not help me for MD admissions, but I would have a new state of residency which will help. Currently my state school UWash will not consider me due to my interest in a physician scientist career (they want primary caregivers). After completing a PhD, I would have a different state of residency. Research careers are supported by the reputable state med school in this other state and my MCAT score is not too far from their current average of ~30. This state also has several other med schools. Hence, I would probably have a better chance of getting into med school applying from this other state.

 

[spreebee]

Sorry for posting another chances thread. I did a search, but I could not find answers to my question.

I am interested in academic medicine (patient care, translational research, and teaching). I have some clinical and teaching experiences. I have ~5 years of research, including 3years post-graduation for a big name PI. I will have good recs in support of my ability to succeed in academic medicine. For career purposes, I need to attend at least a mid-level research-orientated medical school (Pit/ UNC level).

Unfortunately my stats are not great. I have a 3.7 from an unknown LAC. I took the MCAT 3x and I received a 29P (8V, 10PS, 11BS) this last time. Due to my career goals, I will not get any love from my state school-UWash. Do I have a shot at any reputable research orientated schools with a sub-30 MCAT? What schools might consider my application favorably despite my MCAT scores?

No hard feelings if my chances are not good now. If my chances are slim, I plan to complete my PhD at a top school (have an acceptance) and then I would probably apply to med school. I would then be applying in a state with several reputable research orientated med schools that have mcat averages ~30. (I do want a PhD).

OK, Kill two birds with one stone... At St. George's university you can do an MD/PHD in 5 years and they also conduct research... You may even get a scholarship with your grades...Also, I think you can opt to go to Cambridge for a year while enrolled in this program to enhance your studies...

 

[Gut Shot]

I know the PhD route may not be the best idea,

I'll second that. You can spend a loooooooong time spinning your wheels in pursuit of those three letters. With an MD under your belt from any school you can postdoc or choose a research intensive residency/fellowship. That will get you to your goal much faster.

I'm PhD -> MD, which took me ten years and $144,000 in debt. It's much easier to be cavalier about the length of your training when you're in your 20's. It's not so fun later on, when expediency becomes a higher priority.

 

[Gut Shot]

I know that the PhD will not help me for MD admissions, but I would have a new state of residency which will help.

Be careful with that assumption. Texas would not consider me a resident even though I lived there for almost six years. The fact that I was enrolled in graduate school exempted me from accruing time towards state residency (which normally takes 12 months).

 

[TheRealMD]

Be careful with that assumption. Texas would not consider me a resident even though I lived there for almost six years. The fact that I was enrolled in graduate school exempted me from accruing time towards state residency (which normally takes 12 months).

Yep, usually most states require you to be working somewhere for a year or longer and NOT going to school before they grant you state residency.

 

[enigma85]

It will probably be difficult to land a MSTP spot initially. It will probably also be tough to transfer into MSTP even after finishing a year of med school. I think it's relatively easy at places like Hopkins, HMS, Stanford, etc. b/c they have a lot of funding and are willing to let a student tranfer into the MSTP program if they have had a change of heart and realize they truly desire to do basic science research, as many of their MD-only students have done significant amounts of research anyway.

Other options include getting a PhD during residency, though you would still have to pay for med school, I think. Or, just forget the PhD, get the MD, and do research anyway. There are plenty of MDs who devote the majority of their efforts to translational research. I would suggest you consider this route. There is a need for academic clinicians and if you're motivated, bright, and hard-working, it should not be a problem to get an academic faculty position, even if you don't go to somewhere like Pitt or UNC.

MD programs to consider: Drexel, SLU, VCU, Tulane, Cincinnati, Toledo, Temple, the SUNYs, MCW, Loyola, Jefferson, Creighton, NYMC, RFU

In fact, may of the faculty at these schools are alumni of the same schools. Furthermore, many residencies, including many General Surgery programs, have 1-3 years of research built into the residency. For example, WashU has a top 10 General Surgery residency program--their current residents include graduates of U of Louisville, MCW, Wayne State, UF, Temple, etc. alongside the ones from UCSF, Duke, Columbia, Pritzker, etc. Excel in med school and you should be fine.