Accepted Caribbean M.D. Schools

[Amirr]

Does anyone have a list of accepted/non-accepted Caribbean schools? I would like to read about them, and another thread I saw had out-dated links (dead links). Thanks.

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[cubssox2000]

Anyone on this site will tell you that Caribbean is the last option.

In answer to your question, Ross is generally considered the best of the bunch.

 

[vman51]

Anyone on this site will tell you that Caribbean is the last option.

In answer to your question, Ross is generally considered the best of the bunch.

Well, I believe the consensus is that:
US Allo > US Osteo > Caribbean > other foreign institutions

And I think Ross is considered to be 3rd..
From what I understand, SGU > AUC > Ross

and what do you mean accepted/non-accepted Caribbean schools?

 

[schrizto]

Yeah, I don't get what the OP is asking. Does he mean that he is looking for something like an MDApps for Caribbean schools?

Well, I believe the consensus is that:
US Allo > US Osteo > Caribbean > other foreign institutions

I think you're generalizing foreign institutions together here. If you're talking about foreign institutions like Oxford and Cambridge they would be more well regarded than DO and Caribbean. If you're talking about help with preparation for the USMLE, then you're probably right.

 

[7starmantis]

I don't know, I did allot of research on the Caribbean schools last year. I was accepted to what I consider the top three (the only ones I applied to) but decided to defer and stay here another year...good thing to.

In my mind SGU is by far the best with the smoothest track to licensure in the US. Its the only one that was even listed by the Texas Medical Board as an equivalent school and is also accepted by California's medical board (the two toughest states). I would consider Ross second and AUC third. I have some friends from undergrad at AUC and they love it but as I understand it may sometimes be a struggle to make sure your clinicals are in blue book hospitals.

I think its a personal decision, but one not to take lightly. Its much tougher going that route, if at all possible stay in the US. However, I'm not sure I would go the DO route in the US over SGU. Just a personal thing, but wanting to do medical mission work some countries dont recognize the DO degree but an MD is recognized everywhere. I know several FMG's that are doing great in their practice, but it is harder.

 

[aggie08]

There is an international forum.

 

[sassilysweet]

Yeah, I don't get what the OP is asking. Does he mean that he is looking for something like an MDApps for Caribbean schools?

I think he is looking for Carib schools that are "accepted" in that you can continue on to residency in the U.S. Aren't some of them non-accredited or you have to do your residency elsewhere?

 

[7starmantis]

Yeah, Aggie has a point, maybe this should be in the international forum. Probably allot more knowledge about the issues there.

sassilysweet, you can do your residency anywhere you get accepted, its just, who is going to accept you especially if you did your clinical rotations in Bolivia. The "top three" Caribbean schools are "accredited" by the US Department of Education but that means little more than being able to take out federal loans while in school there.

 

[J ROD]

There are the "Big 3": [all have Fed loans]; accepted in all 50 states

SGU - most expensive; but has the best clinical sites
Ross - in the middle
AUC - less expensive, but does not have the clinical sites needed or you have to find them (struggle basically), most developed island


SABA is the newer option - cheapest, no fed loans, least developed island, not as accepted


The others aren't worth mention.....

 

[Lokhtar]

I would definitely say that if you're going to go to the Caribbean, try to go to SGU if at all possible.

 

[rkaz]

Just a personal thing, but wanting to do medical mission work some countries dont recognize the DO degree but an MD is recognized everywhere.

Currently a DO degree is recognized for licensing purposes in more countries than an MD degree from Grenada (where SGU is). The reason I know this is because I had to make the decision last year between going to a DO school and SGU - so I did the research. Unless there is a specific country you want to practice in after graduation that doesn't accept the US DO degree, then that is the only reason to consider getting a Caribbean MD. As far as mission or volunteer work in a foreign country, you will have plenty of options for that with a DO degree.

Don't confuse public recognition of a degree with foreign government recognition allowing one to get licensed. Just because more people know what an MD is (as compared to a DO) doesn't mean you can go to any country with an MD degree and expect to be licensed there. Even a US MD will often have many hurdles to go through to practice medicine in another country (such as having to take their licensing exams, etc). Especially if you have an MD degree from a country like Grenada, don't expect yourself to have the same world-wide opportunities to be licensed in as many countries as someone holding a US MD degree.

 

[BrettKS]

Currently a DO degree is recognized for licensing purposes in more countries than an MD degree from Grenada (where SGU is). The reason I know this is because I had to make the decision last year between going to a DO school and SGU - so I did the research. Unless there is a specific country you want to practice in after graduation that doesn't accept the US DO degree, then that is the only reason to consider getting a Caribbean MD. As far as mission or volunteer work in a foreign country, you will have plenty of options for that with a DO degree.

Don't confuse public recognition of a degree with foreign government recognition allowing one to get licensed. Just because more people know what an MD is (as compared to a DO) doesn't mean you can go to any country with an MD degree and expect to be licensed there. Even a US MD will often have many hurdles to go through to practice medicine in another country (such as having to take their licensing exams, etc). Especially if you have an MD degree from a country like Grenada, don't expect yourself to have the same world-wide opportunities to be licensed in as many countries as someone holding a US MD degree.

I don't know how accurate this info is, but (from wikipedia):

Professional advantages for MD qualified physicians

MD qualification training is the most widely available and recognized type of medical training. Like the DO, it gives the option to practice in any of the medical specialties, but unlike the DO, the MD is internationally recognized as a medical degree. Thus, when practicing overseas, the MD is easier to negotiate with than is the DO, where the DO degree isn't always understood or recognized. Because they are a minority in American medicine, DOs are more likely than their MD counterparts to have to explain or even defend their training. [42] In the United States, ACGME-accredited residency training programs are generally considered more prestigious and offer higher reimbursement salaries.[43] The majority of US osteopathic medical students attend ACGME-accredited residency programs. Based on a 2004 publication, the most common reason given by osteopathic medical students choosing an ACGME residency is the perception among osteopathic graduates that ACGME programs offer superior training.[44]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_MD_and_DO_in_the_United_States

 

[7starmantis]

Currently a DO degree is recognized for licensing purposes in more countries than an MD degree from Grenada (where SGU is). The reason I know this is because I had to make the decision last year between going to a DO school and SGU - so I did the research. Unless there is a specific country you want to practice in after graduation that doesn't accept the US DO degree, then that is the only reason to consider getting a Caribbean MD. As far as mission or volunteer work in a foreign country, you will have plenty of options for that with a DO degree.

Don't confuse public recognition of a degree with foreign government recognition allowing one to get licensed. Just because more people know what an MD is (as compared to a DO) doesn't mean you can go to any country with an MD degree and expect to be licensed there. Even a US MD will often have many hurdles to go through to practice medicine in another country (such as having to take their licensing exams, etc). Especially if you have an MD degree from a country like Grenada, don't expect yourself to have the same world-wide opportunities to be licensed in as many countries as someone holding a US MD degree.

Yeah I had a long talk about this with my interviewer from SGU, he is a neurosurgery resident at UT Southwestern here in Dallas. He was really nice but kept stressing how much better it is to go to a US school over and over. Then he said except maybe a DO school. He was interested in doing allot of medical mission work as well and had looked into it. We talked for a while about the whole idea and your right, as far as getting licensed in another country everyone is going to have to go through the red tape.

That being said I just found that since the MD degree is recognized internationally and the DO is really an American degree, it makes things easier. Also I honestly don't think an MD from SGU is looked at differently than an MD from Hopkins if your a licensed practicing physician looking to do medical work. Again, its not social recognition we are talking about.

I dont think a DO degree stops you from doing medical mission work, just for me (again just my personal preference and maybe a bit of a feeling I got from my DO interview for that specific school) I choose the MD route. I think we are basically at a point where we should just combine the degrees or something, but I understand DO's really like their differences. Anyway, just my opinion and the choices I made for myself. I don't think a DO degree is really going to "hurt" you, I just chose MD.

 

[J ROD]

Internationally, I would pick the MD. If you are staying in the US, then DO.

US MD....enough said!!

 

[rkaz]

I understand where you are coming from, but again you are referring to public recognition not government recognition for licensing purposes. There IS a big difference. For example, take Sweden. Sweden allows US trained DOs to be licensed, but does not currently allow Grenada trained MDs (e.g. SGU grads). Thus even if the general population in Sweden has a better grasp of what an MD is versus a DO, you'd actually be much better off having a DO degree if you wanted to live there and practice - as you wouldn't be able to get licensed there with your Caribbean MD degree. Does this make sense?

If you were comparing US MD versus US DO degree for having a medical practice overseas (as opposed to a short-term medical mission), then your point would certainly be valid. A US MD degree would very likely open up more doors for overseas practice than a US DO. However, if you are comparing a Caribbean MD to a US DO then the argument no longer holds true, as a lot less countries allow you to get licensed with a Caribbean MD.

 

[rkaz]

Tkim is a medical resident who often posts on this very topic on the osteopathic forums. Here are some great posts from him, which helped me last year when I was asking the very same questions:

You are asking mutliple questions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_of_Osteopathic_Medicine#International_practice_rights

There's a difference between "working" in a different country and doing a medical mission there. Medical missions such as Doctors Without Borders have international participants, so their missions are granted provisional status for the length of the mission. DO's participate in those missions without restriction.

http://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/volunteer/field/faq.cfm#osteo

Working in another country is a different animal entirely. There is no definitive list of what countries USMD and Carib MDs can practice in. One would presume that the practice rights for USMDs is greater than USDOs simply because of the relative 'youth' of the USDO. What no one knows is how much greater the international practice rights are.

For Carib MD, I have no idea. But here's SGU's site:

http://www.sgu.edu/website/sguwebsite.nsf/about-sgu/recognition-standards.html

Finally, there's always a poster every couple of weeks who talks about practicing abroad. Realistically, there are few and far between the number of people who up and move their practice abroad. Very few. It's a royal pain in the ass simply applying for a license in another state much less another country. Using international practice rights as a criterion for choosing medical school should be petty low on the list.

Here's another post of his, though I can't copy this one since the thread was closed:

"Like others have pointed out, mission work is treated separately - as medical teams may have people from all over the world.

Telling people that the "MD is universally recognized" is a falsehood. Most of the time people tout the USMD as being the universal medical degree. We're not even talking about the USMD, we're talking Carib MD.

I once posted a link to the SGU website that listed the countries SGU grads can obtain licenses. Somewhere about 40-50 countries. DO's have practice rights at a handful more.

But let's be honest. There are a small percentage of people who will want to practice in a foreign country, and very few automatically grant you a license based on your med school diploma's origin."

http://www.sgu.edu/website/SGUWebSite.nsf/about-sgu/recognition-standards.html

Total: 38

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osteopathic_physician#International_practice_rights

Total: 45

You got a leg up on us for Israel, but we have Sweden. Glaringly missing from both sites are France, Ireland, Spain, and Scotland.

These posts were written September 2008, so I'm assuming the country lists are currently the same. My point is the currently you can actually be licensed in MORE countries as a US trained DO than a Caribbean MD. Obviously this only matters though if the specific country you want to be licensed in is on your list.

Edit: I noticed that tkim's link on SGU no longer works. Here's a page that currently lists the countries that are licensed with the MD program: http://www.sgu.edu/about-sgu/accreditations-and-approvals.html

 

[brooklynblunder]

not to be a complete douchebag, but i am

so i think you should worry more about paying back the immense amount of loans that you will be taking out, and that would be much easier with a DO than a carribean MD. Mission work will fall into your career if thats something you really want to do, loans, however, will not

 

[rkaz]

That being said I just found that since the MD degree is recognized internationally and the DO is really an American degree, it makes things easier. Also I honestly don't think an MD from SGU is looked at differently than an MD from Hopkins if your a licensed practicing physician looking to do medical work. Again, its not social recognition we are talking about.

I dont think a DO degree stops you from doing medical mission work, just for me (again just my personal preference and maybe a bit of a feeling I got from my DO interview for that specific school) I choose the MD route. I think we are basically at a point where we should just combine the degrees or something, but I understand DO's really like their differences. Anyway, just my opinion and the choices I made for myself. I don't think a DO degree is really going to "hurt" you, I just chose MD.

Sorry, I didn't address these comments you made in my earlier post. That is perfectly fine if you'd rather do an MD degree over a DO. I don't have any issues with that, and I certainly do understand you wanting to choose a degree that is more publicly recognized. That was actually one of my own concerns initially when I was thinking to apply to DO schools. I get that. The only reason I posted tkim's comments above is just to correct the fallacy that going to SGU will open up the possibility for you to be licensed in more countries should you choose to move there someday. It won't. If you choose a US MD school over a US DO school - I could understand that. But I just don't want you to go choosing SGU over a DO school thinking that you'll have more international opportunities, because you won't. Unless you specifically want to work in a country that doesn't currently license DOs (like Israel, I think), then that would be the only real good reason to choose SGU over a DO school. However, one might also make the argument that if someone wanted to move to Israel to practice someday then that person would just be better off getting their medical degree in Israel in the first place. But for someone wanting to remain in the US and just do medical missions abroad, having a DO won't prevent you from doing that. If you still choose to go to SGU, that is up to you, but I at least wanted you to be making a decision based on accurate information. And yes, I agree with you that the DO degree should be merged with the MD. But due to the politics of the situation, that may or may not happen.

*Edit: I was wrong about Israel not licensing DOs. They can be licensed in Israel, as long as the doctor obtains nationality first.

 

[7starmantis]

Sorry, I didn't address these comments you made in my earlier post.

You have obviously done more research on the subject than either myself or the resident I interviewed with. I was obviously wrong, although there was some issue with the Ukraine (which is where I was looking at going) but I don't remember it now. No matter, thanks for your research and information, its a great help. I don't have the time or inclination to figure out what I was thinking. It was something about already having a license in two states here...who knows. I'm planning on attending a Texas MD school this year (fingers crossed), so hopefully none of this really comes into play in my own personal decisions.

As to those trying to determine where to go, its a very personal decision. Staying in the US is what I would recommend even if it means staying and applying again, but some of the Caribbean schools are a great choice if you dont get in here. SGU has the clearest path to licensure I think especially in hard states but I know doctors from many international schools that have very successful practices. My mentor always said its harder for a FMG but what doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

 

[Amirr]

My original post meant to say: "Which U.S. states/hospitals recognize an M.D. from the Caribbean?"

That's my question, sorry for the confusion.