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Accepted in U.S, but medical school in Canada?

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by MGoBlue13, Nov 14, 2002.

  1. MGoBlue13

    MGoBlue13 Grizzled Member
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    I have a question about canadian medical schools, specifically McGill.... I know that they accept a lot of american applicants. My question is, how well do they do in residency placements at american hospitals? What tier school could McGill be compared to in the U.S.?

    I've been accepted to Umich, but I'm looking seriously at McGill, and any help would be much appreciated. Am I being stupid?
     
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  3. laviddee

    laviddee Senior Member
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    hey mgoblue,

    can i ask why you're looking at mcgill? as opposed to going to a med school here in the us?
     
  4. MGoBlue13

    MGoBlue13 Grizzled Member
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    I'm looking at McGill just as an option to consider. I think Montreal is a hell of a city, I am a native speaker of French, and I would like the opportunity to study in a completely different environment. But only if it doesn't screw me over when it comes to the residency match
     
  5. laviddee

    laviddee Senior Member
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    well, i think that if you do awesome at school and have great board scores - you won't have to worry about residency.

    but if you do awesome at michigan and have great board scores on top of that. You can do anything you want.

    You want to go to McGill b/c you love Montreal and to speak french???

    I mean, it may not be right (well i think it's somewhat deserved)- but THERE IS a stigma to going to med schools outside of this country. That's just the way it is.. just like going to a community college is not viewed as respectable as a full 4 year top 25 college.

    I also agree that, passing over Michigan for McGill- a School I had never heard of until today, would be on paper- a COLOSSAL mistake. But this is your life, and your life to be lived.
    If i'm a residency director, and i have two students before me, similar board scores and one is from michigan and one is from mcgill. TO BE HONEST- i take the one from michigan, and I think you would too.
     
  6. tkim

    tkim 10 cc's cordrazine
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    From the 2003-2004 MSAR:

    "The faculty of medicine is accredited by the Liason Committee of Medical Education of the AAMC and the AMA. Studying at McGill is identical to studying medicine in a U.S. medical school. U.S. Students studying at McGill write the USLME exams in the same way and at the same time as U.S. medical students studying in U.S. medical schools. There students return automatically to the United States for residency.

    U.S. prgoram directors recognize the the high caliber of McGill graduates, and the McGill students are very competetive in U.S. residency applications."

    "The language of instruction is in English."

    "U.S. students are normally eligible for funding from Subsidized Stafford Loans, Unsub Stafford loans,and TERI/PEP loans."

    Tuition for U.S. & International students: $21,031 CDN = ~$13,356 USD

    It's in *Montreal* which is an awesome city - my wife and I visited there years ago - beautiful!

    What's not to like?

    I say go for it!

    - Tae
     
  7. MGoBlue13

    MGoBlue13 Grizzled Member
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    Anyone know where I can find a U.S. residency list for McGill?
     
  8. Miss B

    Miss B Junior Member
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    I know a 3rd year at McGill. He got accepted to US schools, but chose McGill for some of the same reasons you stated. According to him, US residency directors think very highly of McGill grads, particularly because they are usually better trained clinically, due to the fact that Canada is less worried about med students working on patients as the US is. If you want to learn more about McGill, PM me, and I'll pass you the guy's contact info.
     
  9. GCS:3

    GCS:3 Allegheny grad
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    Last year (2002 match), McGill grads got spots at Harvard Urology and Derm, UNC Surgery, Duke Int Med, and Hopkins Emergency, among others.

    The list is usually quite impressive. Here's some of the list from '97, I know it's old, but I actually have it here...
    Internal Med - Boston U., Cedars Sinai CA, UCLA,
    Psych - UCLA, UNC, UCSF
    Surgery - Hopkins
    Anesth - Tulane
    Patho - Beth Israel MA

    Not exactly shabby, if you ask me.
     
  10. GCS:3

    GCS:3 Allegheny grad
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    Yes, you're right, Michigan is a better school than McGill, in some aspects (research $, etc). But that doesn't make Michigan grads better overall. You're far from being a program director, so I wouldn't start comparing students just yet. The only reason you haven't heard of McGill is that they don't play American college sports, you don't attend research conferences, and you haven't been around academia long enough. I know a Michigan grad who came HERE for residency training, and is now off to an Onco fellowship at MD Anderson (as top tier for Onc as you can get). Obviously somebody important knows McGill. I have a feeling you'll learn the name soon enough.
     
  11. Lara

    Lara Senior Member
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    You can also add Harvard derm, according to this website:
    http://mywebpages.comcast.net/longk/DermMatch2002.htm

    Try to find a full match list to confirm and compare with Michigan, but obtaining good residencies shouldn't be a problem (especially in the Northeast). :) McGill has a good enough reputation in the US.

    However, I wouldn't go if I was interested in research and/or placed a premium on awesome facilities. Finally be aware that Montreal's main four hospitals are slated to be closed down and merged into one around the time you'd be on clinical rotations (but that may be delayed). You'll have to put up with a fair amount of bureaucratic/political crap and the health care system's in poor shape...but I certainly couldn't say (at least yet) whether dealing with HMO's and insurance companies is any better.

    And yes, Montreal is :love: plus the weather's comparable to Michigan anyway. :D Honestly, I'd just apply and see what happens. If you interview and truly think you'd be happiest there, by all means go since you're bound to get an excellent education...but you do want to be "sure" and have done your research moreso than if you were deciding between American schools.

    Good luck and congrats!
     
  12. nuclearrabbit77

    nuclearrabbit77 commercial sex worker
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    i've definetly heard of mcgill. it's a great school. but so is michigan. i'm sure you'll be fine either way. go with your gut feeling.


    nuclearrabbit

    northwestern - 2006
     
  13. SM-UCLA tech

    SM-UCLA tech CCOM MS4 soon OB/Gyn PGY1
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    McGill is an outstanding medical school. It would easily be ranked in the top 20 if it were to be considered with the U.S. schools.

    And I say this as a person who is not crazy about french canada!:D hehehe
     
  14. chopsuey

    chopsuey miss independent
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    Hey....I'm applying to McGill. MGoBlue...the only thing is that the application is due today! let me know if you're applying, though....I'd love to have another American to go through the process with! :)

    p.s. residency-wise...definitely not screwed. I forget the exact numbers, though. I remember being happy about them...

    http://www.medcor.mcgill.ca/~mss/

    go to the "Unofficial Guide for International Applicants"

    a little outdated, but it's still very helpful :)
     
  15. MGoBlue13

    MGoBlue13 Grizzled Member
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    oh crap, is the deadline today? Are all documents due in today, or postmarked by today???
     
  16. chopsuey

    chopsuey miss independent
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    let me check...

    it just says "submitted by"

    call the admissions office, i guess?
     
  17. Thewonderer

    Thewonderer Senior Member
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    It is a little too early talk about all these. Just wait until you visit the school and see how much you like it.

    When I visited the school a few years ago, a couple americans did say that they turned down Yale and Columbia to go to McGill. I am sure that when you interview at McGill, you will have plenty of chances to get your questions answered by the american students and the director of admissions there.

    Montreal is an awesome city. People who never been there cannot appreciate that fact. It might even have a student per capita ratio that is higher than Boston due to the fact that all the major Canadian universities in Montreal and its surrounding areas have over 20,000+ students EACH!!!

    McGill also has an awesome rep. I am not sure that U of Michigan med would have a better reputation than McGill med in the US. Medicine is what has driven McGill's reputation for many decades (Sir William Osler graduated from McGill and from then on became the most famous physician in english-speaking countries, after having taught at McGill, Hopkins, Penn and Oxford). The university as a whole has had to face government cutbacks. So facility and research will "definitely" be not up to par as at U of Michigan. But of course, you have other factors (city, students, reputation, clinical training, etc.) to consider. Some say that due to the lack of money flowing around, canadian med students are relied by the team to carry more workload, be more independent and gain better clinical experience than med students in the US. Of course, that might be a rumor for all I know.
     
  18. MGoBlue13

    MGoBlue13 Grizzled Member
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    Hey, thanks for all of your help. I missed the application deadline, but I wrote to see if they could possibly extend the deadline... we'll see what happens.

    Sounds like an awesome school, and I agree, Montreal is an incredible city.

    I think that in general American students consider schools in Canada to be lesser schools.... as if students north of us cannot possibly be as smart. But there's schools like McGill, UT, and UBC, all of which future premeds should look at.
     
  19. Thewonderer

    Thewonderer Senior Member
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    I discuss this issue on another thread before....

    http://www.studentdoctor.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=43279

    McGill and Memorial in Newfoundland actually welcome Americans. That's not the case for most Canadian med schools. U of Toronto and MacMaster's might have opened up a bit. But UBC, Western Ontario, Queen's, Alberta, etc. are still very very strict with "no international students including Americans." For those schools that actually accept Americans, I think it is definitely more than worth the time and application fee to give it a try!
     
  20. chopsuey

    chopsuey miss independent
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    just to add one more incentive to apply...the application fee is only $60 (Canadian)...which translates to about $38 US!!!!! :eek: :eek:

    made my day...

    also, i'm in the same boat as you...with an acceptance already, so it's not like mcgill is last resort. it's actually one of my top choices! if anyone, not just MGoBlue13, wants to know why i like it so much, just PM me... i could easily see being really happy there.
    good luck!
     
  21. chopsuey ur pms are full!!!
     
  22. drake.ramoray

    drake.ramoray Member
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    In fact, an American student has a greater chance of gaining admission at McGill than a Canadian student that does not reside in Quebec (out-of-province students).
     
  23. chopsuey

    chopsuey miss independent
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    immediatespring...oops! ok, i cleaned out my box :) send away!
     
  24. Surfer75

    Surfer75 Senior Member
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    For the record in terms of # of Americans / class:

    Class 1999 = 5
    Class 2000 = 15
    Class 2001 = 15
    Class 2002 = 15
    Class 2003 = 9
    Class 2004 = 7
    Class 2005 = 5
    Class 2006 = 5

    Or thereabouts... they used to accept 15 / yr, but when a new agreement was struck with New Brunswick, they cut back the # American seats.
     
  25. MGoBlue13

    MGoBlue13 Grizzled Member
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    Wow. they made it seem like they accepted more Americans. I don't blame them though.....not too many med schools in Canada. Did you know that if you are an out-of-province student there, that they make you sign a form agreeing to work in an underserved community if you in fact remain in Quebec? Crazy, eh?
     
  26. Surfer75

    Surfer75 Senior Member
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    because I'm MSIV at MUN and haven't heard of that stipulation...

    :D :p :D
     
  27. Thewonderer

    Thewonderer Senior Member
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    The above figure spewed out by surfer75 refers to MUN's American student population in each class.

    By contrast, McGill's American student population per class should still be in the 15-20 range.

    Yes, if you are out-of-province and go to McGill, they make you sign a form to go to underserved community in Quebec IF you want to practice in Quebec "after" graduation from medical school and "full post-graduate training" (AKA, residency). However, most out-of-province grads do not stay in Quebec to practice (you are allowed to stay at McGill for residency; there is no restriction on that). Furthermore, if you really really want to stay in Montreal to practice as an out-of-province grad, you can pay the government a "sum" of money.... (probably a huge sum of money.... :cool: )
     
  28. Thewonderer

    Thewonderer Senior Member
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    Also, if you really are concerned about McGill's reputation in the US and have urgent questions about the school, you can go read the "Unofficial Guide for International Applicants" mentioned by chopsuey.

    It can be access directly by clicking below....

    http://www.medcor.mcgill.ca/~mss/guides/interview_handbook/mcgill_interview_handbook.doc

    In the introduction, there should be e-mails to a couple med students from the US (georgetown/oxford and princeton) in class of 2003.
     
  29. Surfer75

    Surfer75 Senior Member
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    Nice... :cool:
     
  30. Thewonderer

    Thewonderer Senior Member
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    how did your mcgill application turn out in the end? where do you plan to matriculate?
     
  31. MGoBlue13

    MGoBlue13 Grizzled Member
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    Hey Wonderer-

    Thanks for the interest... I ended up getting my application in about a week after the deadline, and was offered an interview that I could not attend for a number of reasons. It's a shame, because McGill has about every advantage in my book.

    So it looks like I'm staying here in the states. Penn, here I come!!! Enjoy Montreal for me.
     
  32. Thewonderer

    Thewonderer Senior Member
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    Cool, Penn treats its students pretty well. A couple of friends there have lived at Samson Place (graduate housing) for a couple years already (for convenience). Just don't room with other med students; you will stress each other out one way or the other :p
     

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